The Rumour Thread

[Noserenda]

20 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

I think there are the reasons novakai above gave as well as piracy issues. If people didn't pirate the books I think they would still be selling the digital copies on their own. 

Except, not selling digital copies does absolutely nothing to stop piracy, all it does is change the pdf to scan and waste one dudes afternoon. Well, that and punish all the legitimate customers obviously.

29 minutes ago, novakai said:

I think the point is that doing both doesn’t make the rules get release faster since they both are release at the same time anyway.

the digital version is not gone but you have to buy the physical version to gain access of the digital. Now the reason of them doing this is a bit mift but it probably attribute that Amazon and Apple taking too much of a big cut on their e-reader service and of course them maximizing profit. 

but I do think it’s an incentive problem because a lot of people buy the tomes physically still so there no reason to stop doing it or switch to another less profitable format, much like EA and every sport games they put out every year.

1. You dont need to tie the digital release to the physical one if thats delayed, hell, that might even boost sales if some FOMO types end up buying both.

2, The digital version IS gone, the app does not contain the full content, not is useable on a PC. Its not an equivalent product.

3. You are also assuming digital customers will switch back to books, which is a pretty flawed assumption, every digital primary customer i know for example, (flawed methodology i know but its what ive got) just stopped buying the books entirely or limited themselves to specific armies rather than grabbing everything just in case.

The margin on no sale is 0  


Its just so self destructive, and the knock ons mean less enthusiasm for the game in general if we arent spending some of our time between games reading up on stuff.

[Marcvs]

30 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

piracy issues.

n°1 source of "piracy": the entire battletomes were shown on camera, at a perfectly readable angle by those to whom GW sends books for free. Through this medium and a bunch of screenshots I (and everyone who wanted to) had access to all the rules two weeks before I could get my hands on the physical battletome (I buy in a different language than the country I live in, so I need to wait longer). I'd argue that the piracy argument is not convincing.

As for the argument "amazon/apple/other platforms" were taking a cut: what this boils down to is that my experience as a customer had to be downgraded in order to increase the (already large) profit margins. So, it's a convincing argument, but it's also a good reason to be dissatisfied and complain at every occasion I am reminded of this step backwards

[novakai]

While I am not arguing against Digital format, people still buy the physical copy in droves despite what the internet want the narrative to be. 

that why I put EA and FIFA as an example, despite my desire for EA to crash and burn clearly there a large uncaring consumer market that keep buying their stuff every year and put up with their anti consumer policies

I feel many people vastly like the physical copies and Randos on the internet greatly underestimate it appeals

 

[Kaleb Daark]

11 minutes ago, novakai said:

While I am not arguing against Digital format, people still buy the physical copy in droves despite what the internet want the narrative to be. 

that why I put EA and FIFA as an example, despite my desire for EA to crash and burn clearly there a large uncaring consumer market that keep buying their stuff every year and put up with their anti consumer policies

I feel many people vastly like the physical copies and Randos on the internet greatly underestimate it appeals

 

totally agree.

There's still something really nice about thumbing through a really good quality book - FW heresy black books being a good example and the only books I've kept from 8th edition fantasy are Tamurkhan and Monstrous Arcanum for that reason.

 

[yukishiro1]

On the topic of digital rules, I have recently been getting into SW: Legion, and I just want to say what a massive difference it makes to have all the rules freely available online - and, even better, they have a forum where you can post questions that they answer with official answers from the developers. Like a rolling FAQ that you don't have to wait months for; often the responses come within just a day or two. 

GW is really missing such a massive trick here sticking with this medieval print approach. 

 

 

[Kronos]

@novakai Thanks for the update, had my eye ff the ball on warhammer for a bit and don’t my head from aelf these days. 😂👍

 

This digital talk has me convinced of something. Rules should be entirley digital, often updated, and FAQ and open forum questions. They basically do it with model teasers, hell I get replies from GW staff on Social Media for saying which is my favourite Primarch, or who’s the most powerful mount, which I’m not bashing I’m just highlight how awesome that level of interaction is with the fanbase.

What I am ever more cnvnced of though is that I want a return of Lore books for armies, ram backed with Art, concepts, random stories, heraldrly. I Want AoS Liber Chaotica, Loathsome Ratmen - for Lumineth, for Fyreslayers, Destruction etc. I’d buy so many of those even for armies I don’t collect.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Kronos

[Neverchosen]

I feel like the printed tomes should be a limited time collectors item... I went into a hobby store today and there were so many outdated tomes. Just do a limited edition run with a second printing on demand and idiots like myself who still like physical copies can pick one up. But even for me, I would only get the Slaves to Darkness tomes and get the rest of my armies digitally because even I think it is cumbersome and wasteful... even if I like pretty artwork. 

Also I hate that my books are so outdated in like two months... but again there is a market for these collectors and GW can do their favourite thing ever which is make it a collectors item and jack up the prices.  

Edited November 17, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Tervindar]

37 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

I feel like the printed tomes should be a limited time collectors item... I went into a hobby store today and there were so many outdated tomes. Just do a limited edition run with a second printing on demand and idiots like myself who still like physical copies can pick one up. But even for me, I would only get the Slaves to Darkness tomes and get the rest of my armies digitally because even I think it is cumbersome and wasteful... even if I like pretty artwork. 

Also I hate that my books are so outdated in like two months... but again there is a market for these collectors and GW can do their favourite thing ever which is make it a collectors item and jack up the prices.  

I agree, IMO, tomes should be moved into a lore & collectors edition sort of item, and just provide the rules, traits, etc. on a PDF online. I would think a move like this would greatly allow for more folks to jump into the game too. Keeping rules to battle tomes that are outdated often and quickly is just an arbitrary and antiquated strategy. 

A "living" rules PDF for factions that are updated often online and can just be printed out for reference, would be so good. Other systems do this really good, Conquest, OPR, SW:L, etc. 

[Maogrim]

7 hours ago, yukishiro1 said:

On the topic of digital rules, I have recently been getting into SW: Legion, and I just want to say what a massive difference it makes to have all the rules freely available online - and, even better, they have a forum where you can post questions that they answer with official answers from the developers. Like a rolling FAQ that you don't have to wait months for; often the responses come within just a day or two. 

GW is really missing such a massive trick here sticking with this medieval print approach. 

 

 

It's the same with Malifaux. Free rules, free cards via free app, and official forum (also free) with rules section. There are printed books fpr factions and expansions that contain the rules for the models as well, but you don't  need them to play and can completely rely on the digital support. And what makes it a litlle better: has nothing to do with Star Wars.

I do like battletomes, though I wouldn't mind if they were focussing on lore, artwork and painting only. But as it stands right now batgletomes are an important source of income because every player has to get them, even for army projects that are finished hobby-wise in order to keep them playable. That reliable income is probably also what is used to commission the artists etc. 

[yukishiro1]

Are they really, though? I obviously don't know for sure, but I'd be surprised if battletomes and codexes make up a significant portion of GW's income, and even more surprised if that income wouldn't largely be replaced by people buying more plastic instead if they didn't have to spend that money on paper. 

 

 

Edited November 17, 2021 by yukishiro1

[Beliman]

Maybe I'm wrong but a lot if not all new wargames/skirmish games are using free digital files or something similar:

• Malifaux: Malifaux Resources (all "warscrolls") and a 100% free App with everything in it (army builder included). Fans can buy their own LoreBooks or campaign Books for their own faction, but that's all.
• Asoiaf: All FAQs, rules and Books (even old editions) are free and updated regularly in CMON webpage. When you buy a box, it comes with the warscrolls from that edition or the rulebook if it's battlebox. Btw, Asoiaf Builder has all cards from the current edition too.
• Conquest: All FAQs and rules are free for their wargame and the skimish version. Only LoreBooks are 100% behind a paywall.
• Elder Scrolls VI. Skyrim, the Adventure Game: Rules are completely free.
• WarmaHordes: Their rules are free too, since (I think) 2019. 
• Infinity: Their side has a Download Resources with all their rules, faqs and even campaigns. (btw, I don't play this game, so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong).
• KOW: Their Core Rules can be bought online in their oficial store for 0 €, with basic rules and Dwarfs+Orcs. Note: Their 3d edition book is behind a paywall.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Beliman

[JackStreicher]

5 hours ago, Kronos said:

What I am ever more cnvnced of though is that I want a return of Lore books for armies, ram backed with Art, concepts, random stories, heraldrly.

Same!

I still remember the „colors of the Empire“ book - very inspiring stuff

(Unpopular opinion): I really love the End Times books: One book with lots of Lore, images etc. and one small book with rules, stats etc. - End times Nagash bundle is the only WHF Book(s) I kept.

Edited November 17, 2021 by JackStreicher

[Gitzdee]

36 minutes ago, Beliman said:

Maybe I'm wrong but a lot if not all new wargames/skirmish games are using free digital files or something similar:

• Malifaux: Malifaux Resources (all "warscrolls") and a 100% free App with everything in it (army builder included). Fans can buy their own LoreBooks or campaign Books for their own faction, but that's all.
• Asoiaf: All FAQs, rules and Books (even old editions) are free and updated regularly in CMON webpage. When you buy a box, it comes with the warscrolls from that edition or the rulebook if it's battlebox. Btw, Asoiaf Builder has all cards from the current edition too.
• Conquest: All FAQs and rules are free for their wargame and the skimish version. Only LoreBooks are 100% behind a paywall.
• Elder Scrolls VI. Skyrim, the Adventure Game: Rules are completely free.
• WarmaHordes: Their rules are free too, since (I think) 2019. 
• Infinity: Their side has a Download Resources with all their rules, faqs and even campaigns. (btw, I don't play this game, so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong).
• KOW: Their Core Rules can be bought online in their oficial store for 0 €, with basic rules and Dwarfs+Orcs. Note: Their 3d edition book is behind a paywall.

Maybe i'll try infinity some day if all the rules are free :). I like the xcom vibe that game has going on. 

Edited November 17, 2021 by Iksdee

[Gaz Taylor]

+++ MOD HAT ON!!! +++
Folks, back to rumours please!!!!!

 

[Sonnenspeer]

No rumors about battleforce boxes? 🤔

[rattila]

29 minutes ago, Sonnenspeer said:

No rumors about battleforce boxes? 🤔

Well we are gonna discover them tomorrow, so…

[EntMan]

48 minutes ago, Sonnenspeer said:

No rumors about battleforce boxes? 🤔

If by "rumours" you mean "totally unrealistic dreaming that definitely won't happen" then I'm looking forward to the Living Cities battleforce box that includes a Steamtank, Wild Riders, a Treelord, some Kurnoth Hunters and all the other things I'm saving up for!

Edited November 17, 2021 by EntMan

[Yondaime]

Someone knows when the winter faqs will be released?

 

Some things are really busted atm 

[Kramig]

1 hour ago, Sonnenspeer said:

No rumors about battleforce boxes? 🤔

I was told they should be announced tomorrow. 

[Gitzdee]

Has gw said anything over the duration of this edition or 40k? Do we expect a longer edition with all the delays? Logic suggests we will get a longer edition. My experience with gw suggests they dont really care about things like that sometimes.

[Feii]

17 hours ago, Marcvs said:

n°1 source of "piracy": the entire battletomes were shown on camera, at a perfectly readable angle by those to whom GW sends books for free. Through this medium and a bunch of screenshots I (and everyone who wanted to) had access to all the rules two weeks before I could get my hands on the physical battletome (I buy in a different language than the country I live in, so I need to wait longer). I'd argue that the piracy argument is not convincing.

As for the argument "amazon/apple/other platforms" were taking a cut: what this boils down to is that my experience as a customer had to be downgraded in order to increase the (already large) profit margins. So, it's a convincing argument, but it's also a good reason to be dissatisfied and complain at every occasion I am reminded of this step backwards

Piracy is such a moot point. Piracy destroying your favourite thing/hobby/brand is a public myth perpetrated by the brands trying to make you immoral and compliant. (Yes I am feeling edgy today I am sorry)  

[Mattrulesok]

1 hour ago, Feii said:

Piracy is such a moot point. Piracy destroying your favourite thing/hobby/brand is a public myth perpetrated by the brands trying to make you immoral and compliant. (Yes I am feeling edgy today I am sorry)  

When the mods send you to forum prison please know I'll forever hold you in my heart.

[Neverchosen]

As someone that does not subscribe to Warhammer+ does Loremasters tie into releases at all? I know that Chaos Space Marines are on the Horizon, but if this indicated anything about AOS or Slaves to Darkness that would be pretty cool.

What would be the best possible scenario for me would be if this was a tie in for a Legion of the First Prince battleforce. Although I doubt they'd ever make something that was equally such a great deal for both 40k and AOS as I think it would disappear immediately. 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/11/17/which-chaos-god-does-belakor-really-serve/

Edited November 17, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Kempak]

3 hours ago, Iksdee said:

Has gw said anything over the duration of this edition or 40k? Do we expect a longer edition with all the delays? Logic suggests we will get a longer edition. My experience with gw suggests they dont really care about things like that sometimes.

 

I would think the cycle would stay the same covid won't last forever. But as said gw don't care to much as long as =£ profit I'd expect 3 years till 4th but hopefully not that long for malerion 😓

[Gaz Taylor]

+++ Mod Hat On +++
 

2 hours ago, Feii said:

Piracy is such a moot point. Piracy destroying your favourite thing/hobby/brand is a public myth perpetrated by the brands trying to make you immoral and compliant. (Yes I am feeling edgy today I am sorry)  

Ive issued a temporary point because this ignored my nudge to get back into topic of rumours and is talking about piracy which is against the rules. 
 

++ Mod Hat Off ++

3 hours ago, Iksdee said:

Has gw said anything over the duration of this edition or 40k? Do we expect a longer edition with all the delays? Logic suggests we will get a longer edition. My experience with gw suggests they dont really care about things like that sometimes.

As far as I know they have never mentioned anything (even in end of year reports). I’m hoping with the delays, we see things shuffled around rather than being shoehorned in but we won’t know until next year.

5 hours ago, Yondaime said:

Someone knows when the winter faqs will be released?

 

Some things are really busted atm 

Nothing yet but guessing about the generally positive reaction the the 40K update, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a AOS one at some point.