The Rumour Thread

[sandlemad]

Interesting feature of Yndrasta's background is how it mentions Doombreed, the daemon prince who until now (I think) has only been mentioned in 40k. Normally it goes the other way, with daemon characters like Be'Lakor or Rotigus introduced in WHFB/AoS and then slotted into 40k later on.

[Skreech Verminking]

2 minutes ago, Scurvydog said:

Many armies wont get that much smaller with battalions no longer eating up any points though. It was not that rare to have 200ish points dedicated to a battalion and/or +1 CP, with these point costs gone, the army sizes probably wont change all that much all in all.

Actually, the skaven are going up quite a bit. Never having good battalions, basically meant, they were forced to not taking them, and currently with their old points, a hordy skaven army with 120-140 clanrats goes up a significant amount of points with the loss of horde discount.

now I’m not saying that this is bad in anyway, it just chances the way skaven were played in a fluffy aspect of the game a bit (although I do have to say that this never stopped me from playing almost 200bodies on events)

[Neverchosen]

Just now, Scurvydog said:

Many armies wont get that much smaller with battalions no longer eating up any points though. It was not that rare to have 200ish points dedicated to a battalion and/or +1 CP, with these point costs gone, the army sizes probably wont change all that much all in all.

That's true but I rarely considered battalions when list building or purchasing an army. Mostly because they were the most fungible part of every army. I did run them but usually in response to what I owned not as something to be purchased around.

[Ganigumo]

3 minutes ago, SunStorm said:

Because not all of us care about min/maxing? 

In my eyes the brutes are the best looking of the battleline units available.

Points and rules will change, having a force that makes me feel good when I lay it all out is more important to me.

 

 

Its true, but internal balance is actually really important. Bad internal balance can make players feel like they're being punished for playing what they want.

[Malakithe]

4 minutes ago, PowerLevel said:

Meh, even when playing "for fun", having a beautiful unit that cost a lot and don't do much is so frustrating. Here we're not talking about min/maxing but about being just decent and playable. +40% for brutes would pass them from barely decent to puuuure trash.

If that 'rumor' is true then Brutes at 180pts put them back to their original release points cost and people used them a lot

[SunStorm]

Just now, PowerLevel said:

Meh, even when playing "for fun", having a beautiful unit that cost a lot and don't do much is so frustrating. Here we're not talking about min/maxing but about being just decent and playable. +40% for brutes would pass them from barely decent to puuuure trash.

Just to clarify that this is a hobby which includes more than the competitive/matched play side of things. 

[Ganigumo]

1 minute ago, Malakithe said:

If that 'rumor' is true then Brutes at 180pts put them back to their original release points cost and people used them a lot

 The 180 point cost was for the older warscrolls. Nobody used them when 'Ardboyz were 90 and Brutes were 140 (50 point difference) now its 120 and 180 (60 point difference), plus heavy pig lists have been becoming way more common, and rumor has pigs at only 10 more points.

I can see where brutes are hurt the least from the edition change but these points are definitely feel off if true. 10 points more for pigs is a no brainer when commands are locked to 1 a turn and you can only do 1 hero phase move per turn.

[whispersofblood]

55 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

Why would you ever run brutes with those changes? They were already weaker than pigs/ardboyz. Maybe thats the tax for not getting wrecked by the coherency changes?

Common misconception Brutes aren't weaker they are slightly like 5% less killy, this will change as due to the coherency rules. Predominantly its, less bodies on objectives, and lower bravery and no charge no us that makes Ardboyz *slightly* more favourable.

But, if units are getting smaller and monsters more prevalent Brutes get a lot of benefit. Including having 2" reach, which means they may get more attacks into units than comparable points of Ardboyz. And, bonuses to hit against models with 4+ wounds. 

[Neverchosen]

Just now, SunStorm said:

Just to clarify that this is a hobby which includes more than the competitive/matched play side of things. 

Yeah I love the game, but that is just a way of sharing my time and hard work of hobbying with my friends who are doing the same. 

We meet up and know that the most recently released tome will likely dominate. None of us have the resources to be meta chasers we are just a group of friends playing with toys and admiring the work that we put into the hobby. If we find things unbalanced we develop our own little house rules to compensate. Also fun takes precedence, some people in my group are more competitive than others but they will adapt when playing agains those of us who are more chill. Namely some of my friends run optimized and sub optimized lists to win or have fun. They usually enjoy winning more with their sub optimized lists to be honest but like the idea of breaking out the optimized list against each other. Within my group I am the geeky kid that wants to make things more narratively driven, so I have been hyping the new Path to Glory rules to my friends... they all like my narrative suggestions especially as I do not turn it into a massive lore discussion but rather tie things more into mythology and fairytales while not contradicting the games shared lore. 

[Chikout]

Ko and Fyreslayers each have their own section on the new homepage. The various Orruk warclans do not. If we're getting soup Duardin, it isn't happening soon. 

Edited June 17, 2021 by Chikout

[Kaleb Daark]

2 hours ago, RuneBrush said:

In truth I think the same approach will be taken as has been over the years.  GW event/venue - make sure the model identifies as GW using GW parts.  Outside a GW event/venue, fill your boots!  If you do chose to use off the shelf 3d printed stuff and take them to WHW or somewhere, just be prepared to be asked to take them off the board.

much like the water themed demon army at throne of skulls 🤣

[Neverchosen]

28 minutes ago, Chikout said:

Ko and Fyreslayers each have their own section on the new homepage. The various Orruk warclans do not. If we're getting soup Duardin, it isn't happening soon. 

I can still see Dwarf soup being on the menu, but I am just curious if Kharadron will be an ingredient. I could see Dispossessed and Fyreslayers sharing a tome with 1/4 units being KO. Then KO could have a stand alone book and be featured in a unified Duardin soup. This can also create some interesting narrative tension as some Kharadron see the ones following Grimnir as traitors. 

Chaos Dwarves are also appear to be on the horizon, but will they join the Perpetual stew of Slaves to Darkness or stand alone?

Edited June 17, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Erdemo86]

3 hours ago, zamerion said:

Special Live show tonight 20:00 UK time on youtube! General's Handbook 2021 show!

 

From facehammer

Is it on twitch? And where is that information from? No announcement on community site.

[HollowHills]

Just a guess but most armies will see point increases across the board.

They did it for 9th ed 40k.

My theory is that it's to compensate for model costs being higher, make the game faster and to make 2k as standard have a slightly lower model count.

[Gothmaug]

30 minutes ago, whispersofblood said:

Common misconception Brutes aren't weaker they are slightly like 5% less killy, this will change as due to the coherency rules. Predominantly its, less bodies on objectives, and lower bravery and no charge no us that makes Ardboyz *slightly* more favourable.

But, if units are getting smaller and monsters more prevalent Brutes get a lot of benefit. Including having 2" reach, which means they may get more attacks into units than comparable points of Ardboyz. And, bonuses to hit against models with 4+ wounds. 

Its also highly likely that brutes will get a warscroll change in an Orruk Warclans book shortly after the Dominion set release. Perhaps they got a bit of a buff to bring them back to a true 180pt unit. They're supposed to be heavy armed and armored super-orruks, it would be nice if their stats reflected it. 

 

 

[Doko]

I dont know if im wrong,but forgeworld units dont appear in general handbook so if the rumor speak about rogue idol new points seems fake

[zamerion]

5 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said:

Is it on twitch? And where is that information from? No announcement on community site.

Because isnt from GW?

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClDXi0PJh7ZUqDaocp4eY0g

[Clan's Cynic]

47 minutes ago, Chikout said:

Ko and Fyreslayers each have their own section on the new homepage. The various Orruk warclans do not. If we're getting soup Duardin, it isn't happening soon. 

The 2.0 AoS site used the then-current names for armies as well (and thorough AoS 2, it was never updated), I wouldn't read too much into it. GW don't like showing their hand early, even if a soup 'Tome for the Dawi is coming soon.

22 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

I can still see Dwarf soup being on the menu, but I am just curious if Kharadron will be an ingredient. I could see Dispossessed and Fyreslayers sharing a tome with 1/4 units being KO. Then KO could have a stand alone book and be featured in a unified Duardin soup. This can also create some interesting narrative tension as some Kharadron see the ones following Grimnir as traitors. 

Chaos Dwarves are also appear to be on the horizon, but will they join the Perpetual stew of Slaves to Darkness or stand alone?

Dispossessed are currently souped into Cities of Sigmar. Seems a bit redundant to take ingredients from one soup, make another soup from two Dawi armies but not the third, especially when Kharadron have more in common culturally, genetically and visually with the Dispossessed.

Slaves to Darkness is just a Battletome made up of soup. I don't see Chaos Dwarfs being anything but their own faction. If GW thought 'too many armies' was a problem they'd likely not make them at all, or just release the Hellcannon again with a Chaos Dwarf crew as a nod to the old model.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Clan's Cynic

[Jagged Red Lines]

10 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Dispossessed are currently souped into Cities of Sigmar. Seems a bit redundant to take ingredients from one soup, make another soup from two Dawi armies but not the third, especially when Kharadron have more in common culturally, genetically and visually with the Dispossessed.

Yeah I'm almost certain Cities will get replaced by 'Dawnbringer Crusades', which primarily has the human freeguild stuff and maybe some new knights of azyr.

Can see some parts of the range being broken up then, dwarf soup, some wanderers to kurnothi/sylvaneth and very possibly dark elves to umbraneth.

[Neverchosen]

32 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Dispossessed are currently souped into Cities of Sigmar. Seems a bit redundant to take ingredients from one soup, make another soup from two Dawi armies but not the third, especially when Kharadron have more in common culturally, genetically and visually with the Dispossessed.

I meant Dispossessed as a catch all for Grungni's currently unnamed followers, not specifically referring to the ones in CoS. I see now why that would be confusing... kind of like how prior to Lumineth's proper reveal when people would sometimes refer to the upcoming army as High Elves and things would often get confusing (hence why the marketing reveal of 'pointy elves' was so effective). 

I also think you bring up some very good points but the reason I see KO standing apart is purely from their popularity, although I do think the same could have been said about IronJawz relative to Bonesplitterz. So just ignore my post. 😅

Edited June 17, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Dankboss]

13 minutes ago, Jagged Red Lines said:

Yeah I'm almost certain Cities will get replaced by 'Dawnbringer Crusades', which primarily has the human freeguild stuff and maybe some new knights of azyr.

Can see some parts of the range being broken up then, dwarf soup, some wanderers to kurnothi/sylvaneth and very possibly dark elves to umbraneth.

Yndrasta specifically interacts with CoS, so I doubt they'd get rebranded. If anything I expect Dawnbringer Crusade to be a supplement to CoS, like Stormkeeps were.

[Kaleb Daark]

24 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

I meant Dispossessed as a catch all for Grungni's currently unnamed followers, not specifically referring to the ones in CoS. I see now why that would be confusing... kind of like how prior to Lumineth's proper reveal when people would sometimes refer to the upcoming army as High Elves and things would often get confusing (hence why the marketing reveal of 'pointy elves' was so effective). 

I also think you bring up some very good points but the reason I see KO standing apart is purely from their popularity, although I do think the same could have been said about IronJawz relative to Bonesplitterz. So just ignore my post. 😅

totally.

I'm not scared of tin can dwarfs, floaty dwarfs and skinny dip dwarfs getting a united book to be honest.  I'd bet that it would be as thick as the stormcast battletome as it pulls in all of the options from the other books, and the thought of a frigate dropping off a unit of iron drakes or hammerers makes me happy.

Once they hand over my pyromaniac angry dwarfs it's all going to be good in the nerdosphere.

Anyway.. now that we got sigvalkia, surely a plastic valkia is on her way, my money is on the pose being identical apart from the shield, and the spear pointing the other way.  I mean, old love my reflection pretty boy got an upgrade and he's done nothing in ten millennia other than get trapped in a piece of glass, and now spends his time getting wound up by a food critic.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Kaleb Daark

[Greybeard86]

2 hours ago, Ganigumo said:

Its true, but internal balance is actually really important. Bad internal balance can make players feel like they're being punished for playing what they want.

What I do not understand is why narrative players engage in balance discussions. Just because you don't care, it doesn't mean others don't care either. Besides, if you don't care about balance, why do you care if others do?

[CommissarRotke]

15 minutes ago, Greybeard86 said:

What I do not understand is why narrative players engage in balance discussions. Just because you don't care, it doesn't mean others don't care either. Besides, if you don't care about balance, why do you care if others do?

why would narrative players not care *at all* about internal balance..? I don't plan on playing competitively, but even for casual/narrative games I'd like to see rules that feel good.

Some people ignoring points changes for narrative play doesn't mean those people also want to ignore warscroll/ability balance and it's wild to say certain players can't engage in mechanical-balance discussions

[DinoJon]

Looks like Dominion numbers were halved for all independent retailers. Something with the boxes being held in customs. The rest will be in stores August 7th.

 

Other products like GHB2021 and such are unaffected.