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Greyshadow

So, what do we think of the new Contrast paints?

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Fingers crossed that you are right. I just know that over the years I've seen lots of people hit a table-top ready level of painting and then sit back and say "Whew! I did it! I'm there!" then stagnate. Almost like once all the primer was covered by paint, they felt like they there "done" growing. This paint feels like it might get them to that level faster, which is cool that they are getting models painted, but worrisome that they may opt to paint the next unit to that level, and the next, and the next, but never go any further.

And to be clear, like I said, getting more paint and less exposed plastic in a table is wonderful. Truly. I am just saying that is I'd feel bad for those who don't take that next step and feel the joy.

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If others purchase the contrast paint and are comfortable with it as a once and done solution, does it really matter? For some, the option to have a relatively quick painting process is enough. I can see it being beneficial for beginners and competitive players alike, as painted armies are often  a requirement for tournament play. There are people in the hobby that already prefer a three color and it's done approach. Others commission their models to be painted. Some folks only focus on elites and send out battle lines for commission services.

For some folks, painting is a chore and an added expense. While I am not one of them and enjoy improving on my own, having the option for speed is beneficial. Those that want to improve techniques after using contrast paints can and probably will do so. For others, just having colored models is enough.

Different (brush) strokes for different folks.

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I'm very happy with what they're trying to achieve. It takes the first 2 or 3 steps if a normal painting job in one go.

 

Personally think they need washing and or drybrushing afterwards to bring them back to a normal colour

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I'll buy the whole range the day it's released. I love Hexwraith Flame and it's just more of that. They might also be better airbrush paints than their airbrush range.

I doubt I would paint "a whole army" with just that, but I welcome the addition of new painting tools. Can't wait to see how it performs over zenithal priming.

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I'm very skeptical about this.  We've been using the normal method of painting for quite some time and with practice, can achieve a well defined look and "feel" to the model.  I'm unsure if this is the next step in painting technology, or if it's just marketing.

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Posted (edited)
On 5/11/2019 at 12:54 PM, the_master288 said:

I'm very skeptical about this.  We've been using the normal method of painting for quite some time and with practice, can achieve a well defined look and "feel" to the model.  I'm unsure if this is the next step in painting technology, or if it's just marketing.

Likely marketing.  They saw a big opening in the market: between the number of players who perpetually put off ever painting the factions they buy,  and those who buy paint from competitors.  This was the in they saw, but it seems the actual effect of the paint looks negligible.

Edited by Zanzou
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Well, the paints are great. Althrough I don´t know at what project to apply them, one will come for sure.

Despite of having a new tool to utilize while painting, I also really really like the tough about seeing more painted armies at out LGS. Also beginner may feel much faster driven in as the bareer for painting models up got much smaller now. I mean this is such a great way to get rid of grey models fast. I wish I had this at hand some month´s ago. I´d could imagine using this just to delete my backlog faster
 

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While I can't necessarily blame anyone for worrying about how these products might change the hobby, I really don't think it's a useful, or really fair idea to think that it's bad for the hobby to cater to bad painters. I think I reject the idea that everyone interested in painting has to be invested in being a Very Good Painter. Like, yeah, what I'm doing might amount of a fancy colouring book, but people use colouring books for a ton of reasons, and very little of that is becoming a good illustrator.

If this keeps people as bad painters, that's fine. I think it's more important for people to enjoy painting and their results over necessarily trying to make everyone invested in painting for competition or what have you.

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Posted (edited)

Most of us of fit and able bodies have the potential to paint to Golden Demon standard. 

 

However the majority will not invest that much time and money and not all will have the right mentors/teachers/resources/knowhow to study to reach that level. And that's ok - many of us will reach a point we are happy with based on our investment in time and money and that's really all we need do. Sure we all have the potential to reach greater heights, but its not the target we all choose to rise too. For it takes many hours of practice to reach those heights and we all have different desires and interests.

 

Edited by Overread
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9 minutes ago, Overread said:

Most of us of fit and able bodies have the potential to paint to Golden Demon standard. 

 

However the majority will not invest that much time and money and not all will have the right mentors/teachers/resources/knowhow to study to reach that level. And that's ok - many of us will reach a point we are happy with based on our investment in time and money and that's really all we need do. Sure we all have the potential to reach greater heights, but its not the target we all choose to rise too. For it takes many hours of practice to reach those heights and we all have different desires and interests.

 

Indeed - for someone like me with inferior eyesight, shaky hands and a miniscule amount of time to paint (and forecast looking even worse), "mediocre" is the best I could ever hope for. Thus, for me these paints seem great if they work as advertised.

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Vince Venturella was at the seminar and took notes. I've linked into the place in the video where he starts talking about the paint:

The important detail is that you don't need any special primer for it, should be perfect for a zenithal undercoat.

I'm looking forward to trying the new paint, but I won't use it on my BoC army for consistency reasons. Probably a nice tool to have, doubt it will revolutionise my painting style. We'll see.

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I was at the fest today and used the paints quite extensively, my thoughts are as follows...

In general I think it's a fantastic product. I work in a technical role for an ink manufacturer so the marketing stuff won't really wash (🙄 with me. Make no mistake, what these paints basically are are washes with more pigment, so when you put a red contrast paint over a white undercoat it won't just tint the white to a pink, it will make the whole thing red. One of the guys on the stand was trying to tell me certain things like don't use a palette, don't water it down, just throw down as much as you can in one go. If you do that you will get poor results, just like you would if you used washes like that. 

Interestingly, I also watched a demo with an 'Eavy Metal painter, where he demonstrated using the contrast paints over the current range as glazes and washes essentially. 

When it came to using the paints themselves, the range they had for use was somewhat limited and didn't necessarily fit the models provided, so I just tried to use the more interesting colours to get a feel for what they looked like. All colours are just one coat over the base primer, which is indeed one of the new contrast ones. Here are some pictures of the results I got...

20190511_215121.jpg.1dbd0c4a62cd9c84c65acd36f986a3ef.jpg

The flesh looks really great in my opinion. The blue is a really nice colour but looks a little sloppy in places. Probably my own fault.

20190511_215126.jpg.8b2775958251f00b3c401299f58bd934.jpg

The black gives a pretty good grey to be honest, and I was really interested in these 3 brown colours for options of painting things like leather. I think they look good but maybe not much better than simply painting mournfang brown + agrax earthshade or similar. My favourite here was the glove colour which is called Gore Grunta Fur.

20190511_215130.jpg.acd9abb5264bb3a9a79bf09c0e2ddaa1.jpg

This I thought was a pretty cool cloth colour.

20190511_215133.jpg.a975d7bc817b3c3d3975b9e3f1081830.jpg

Example of a red and yellow.

It's pretty obvious from the pictures above that they're not going to make your models look professional with a single coat, but I do think it'll be a fantastic tool to paint some things very quickly. Already I'm thinking about things I'd like to use them on like painting large numbers of grots, orcs, free people soldiers, sylvaneth etc.

There were also some examples of finished models that had been supposedly painted exclusively with the contrast paint.

20190511_153912.jpg.80841d8688a4f80b83c9bba636e52492.jpg20190511_153935.jpg.1501a3d59c0cf23bb575ca997c887249.jpg

All in all I think it's going to be a very useful product to add to the painters' arsenal and it'll help me paint quicker, particularly with units. I'm a little nervous on what the price is going to be but I guess time will tell...

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It looks more or less like what can be achieved with 2-3 consecutive washes, sacrificing extra control for reduced amount of work. I see some use for it and probably 40k Tyranid players will rejoice as it seems almost custom made for them. ; )

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I assumed the new primer was part of the chemistry. Like perhaps slightly hydrophilic to draw the paint away from the edges? Maybe it is just a nice tone for the contrast colours to sit upon?

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So if I'm understanding correctly, the only step this new paint skips is washing right? Because that's not really why my painting is super super super slow. Or is basecoating with contrast paints significantly faster as well? That would really help.

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So, basically it combines basecoating, shading and highlighting into one step. With how they formulated the pigment, it's going to collect in recesses, but also stretch across high points and flat areas. So instead of using three different paints to base, wash, then highlight, you just use one.

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2 hours ago, jaebird said:

While I can't necessarily blame anyone for worrying about how these products might change the hobby, I really don't think it's a useful, or really fair idea to think that it's bad for the hobby to cater to bad painters. I think I reject the idea that everyone interested in painting has to be invested in being a Very Good Painter. Like, yeah, what I'm doing might amount of a fancy colouring book, but people use colouring books for a ton of reasons, and very little of that is becoming a good illustrator.

If this keeps people as bad painters, that's fine. I think it's more important for people to enjoy painting and their results over necessarily trying to make everyone invested in painting for competition or what have you.

I have no issue with having more tools in the arsenal, and speaking for myself, painting is an area where I need all the help I can get.  I am more worried that it's being hyped up as the "end all be all" for painting instead of just being advertised as another tool for the tool belt.

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Just now, the_master288 said:

I have no issue with having more tools in the arsenal, and speaking for myself, painting is an area where I need all the help I can get.  I am more worried that it's being hyped up as the "end all be all" for painting instead of just being advertised as another tool for the tool belt.

I dunno, people have been developing stunning painting techniques for years despite drybrushing. I wouldn't worry that some how high end painters will suddenly disappear because there's a good paint for painting minis.

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35 minutes ago, Blightzkrieg said:

So if I'm understanding correctly, the only step this new paint skips is washing right? Because that's not really why my painting is super super super slow. Or is basecoating with contrast paints significantly faster as well? That would really help.

Highlights as well, since it leaves sharper edges lighter. It's going to be a huge boon to horde armies where you don't necessarily want to fiddle with every bit of detail, but still want the basic job done.

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Hey guys! 

Just back from Warhammer Fest today where I had some great fun getting stuck into the new paints. I went to the "Science of Paint" seminar, and they spoke all about these paints and what went into making them - some fun stories involving kettles in spray hoods and 12 Space Marine chapters...

Anyway, I decided to compile all I learned (and experienced) here. Hope it is useful!

https://the-art-of-caesura.blogspot.com/2019/05/citadel-colour-contrast-paints-first.html

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Maybe be strange but im more hyped for the new bone spray than the paints.

 

I love paint on white primer,i hate black because it is hard to see details,i changued to vallejo grey but for projects as fyreslayers painted with shades i need white primer.

And white primer is veeeeeery bad,it goes frosty or eat details easy.

 

If this new spray can be used as replace for white primer and work fine i gonna be very happy

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2 hours ago, prochuvi said:

Maybe be strange but im more hyped for the new bone spray than the paints.

 

I love paint on white primer,i hate black because it is hard to see details,i changued to vallejo grey but for projects as fyreslayers painted with shades i need white primer.

And white primer is veeeeeery bad,it goes frosty or eat details easy.

 

If this new spray can be used as replace for white primer and work fine i gonna be very happy

Eh, if you have not tried zenithal priming you havem’t lived. I also hate black primer because my eyesight is poor, but the zenithal white makes everything clear and also allows you to place shadows correctly. 

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I don’t see myself picking these up - the output looks really messy for the stuff GW has painted and if I had to spend time glazing over it again I think I mght as well have just done sketch style to begin with. However, I don’t play the games that much anyway, so can’t say I’m the target audience.

I think this will be good for the community; its a much lower barrier to entry compared to the current base/shade/layer/highlight approach and folks who want to go further can always learn. I also recall from my first painting class ever (with the awesome Matt DiPietro) that he expected most folks would need to unlearn base/shade/layer/highlight if they wanted to compete (I’m paraphrasing here based on my recollection) and switch to thinking about volume/contrast anyway, so I don’t know that adding this new methodology will be pulling the legs out from under all the new folks starting out painting.

Now what I’d really like would be for them to throw out the current bottle design and switch to dropper bottles so I don’t knock out half my agrax shade in one go.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, The Art of Caesura said:

Hey guys! 

Just back from Warhammer Fest today where I had some great fun getting stuck into the new paints. I went to the "Science of Paint" seminar, and they spoke all about these paints and what went into making them - some fun stories involving kettles in spray hoods and 12 Space Marine chapters...

Anyway, I decided to compile all I learned (and experienced) here. Hope it is useful!

https://the-art-of-caesura.blogspot.com/2019/05/citadel-colour-contrast-paints-first.html

Thanks for the wright up, this is the information I wanted to know. So the models will need to be varnished? They have been very quite about that then, makes me wonder how well other paints will adhere to the new contrast paints if you can not handle the miniatures. I hate the look of varnished models so I have gone from buying the whole range to just getting a few.

Edited by Soolong
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