New FAQ Discussion Thread (27.08)

[AaronWilson]

4 minutes ago, Nizrah said:

To be fair the FAQ does state what you can or can't take it's quite clear, just a bizarre and questionable choice. 

[Nizrah]

2 minutes ago, AaronWilson said:

To be fair the FAQ does state what you can or can't take it's quite clear, just a bizarre and questionable choice. 

laugh through tears

[Kadeton]

So we know how abilities that trigger "when" allocating a wound interact with wards. How about abilities that trigger "each time" you allocate a wound, like Stone Skeleton? Does "each time" happen "before" or "when"?

Edited August 27, 2021 by Kadeton
Toning down unnecessary grumpiness

[PUFNSTUF]

O look loreseeker being unique is still in there, as expected...

[Gaz Taylor]

+++ Mod Hat On +++

Just a nudge but can we keep on track with things being constructive?
 

We all know it can take GW a few goes to get a FAQ right and I usually suspect it’s because they get distracted by anything new they are working on (Maybe a new DoT book?) but there is no need to be grumpy about things. Anything that doesn’t make sense or doesn’t work, let GW know. But keep the feed back constructive as moaning and being negative is a right turn off if you want somebody to look at something!

 

[Neverchosen]

20 minutes ago, Gaz Taylor said:

Anything that doesn’t make sense or doesn’t work, let GW know. 

 

In addition it is important to actually try out the rules. I often find people are very reactionary to reading rules but then when it is tried in practice things do not end up as bad. But I am often naively optimistic and don't play competitively so I could be wrong.

[The Wah]

Sons of Behemat can now step over any other model, regardless of wounds and over any terrain size with Longshanks. My mega-gargants simply ignore everything smaller than them.

This makes me very happy.

*stomp* *stomp* *stomp*

[PJetski]

Notwards - Stack with Wards & Other Notwards

ORDER

• Cities of Sigmar

  • Anvilgard - Drakescale Cloak (5+)

  • Luminark of Hysh - Aura of Protection (6+)

  • Runelord - Ancestral Shield (6+) 

  • Anointed - Witness to Destiny (4+)

  • Frostheart Phoenix - Witness to Destiny (4+)

  • Flamespyre Phoenix - Witness to Destiny (4+)

  • Misthavn - Wily Foe (6+)

  • Settler’s Gain - Stone-spirit Amour (6+, 5+ spell)

  • Settler’s Gain - Shield of Light (6+)

  • Galen & Doralia Ven Denst - Grim Resolve (5+)

• Daughters of Khaine

  • Battle Trait - Fanatical Faith (6+)

  • Artefact - Amulet of Dark Fire (4+ spell)

  • Artefact - Thousand and One Dark Blessings (5+)

  • Hagg Nar - Devoted Disciple (5+ wound)

• Fyreslayers

  • Artefact - Salamander Cloak (5+)

  • Lofnir - Igneous Battle-throne (6+)

  • Fjul-Grimnir - Grimnir’s Blessing (5+)

  • Grimwrath Berzerker - “I will not be stopped” (6+/5+)

  • Auric Hearthguard - Sworn Protectors (4+)

  • Hearthguard Berzerkers - Duty Unto Death (6+/4+)

• Idoneth Deepkin

  • Artefact - Sanguine Pearl (5+)

  • Artefact - Black Pearl (6+)

  • Artefact - Steelshell Pearl (5+ missile)

  • Artefact - Arcane Pearl (5+ mortal)

  • Eidolon of Mathlann - Stormshoal (5+)

  • Lotann - Writhing Tentacle (5+)

• Kharadron Overlords

  • Artefact - Masterwrought Armour (6+)

  • Grundstok Gunhauler - Escort Vessel (6+)

• Lumineth Realmlords

  • Artefact - Buffeting Aspiragillum (5+)

  • Artefact - Heartstone Amulet (5+)

  • Spell - Protection of Hysh (5+)

  • Ymetrica - Mountain’s Gift (6+, 5+ spell)

  • Zaitrec - Gift of Celennar (6+/4+)

  • Teclis - Protection of Teclis (5+)

  • Vanari Starshard Ballistas - Warding Lanterns (6+)

  • Ellania and Ellathor - Salvation of Hysh (5+)

  • Sevireth - Into the Gale (5+)

  • Hurakan Spirit of the Wind - Into the Gale (5+)

• Seraphon

  • Saurus Astrolith Bearer - Revivifying Energies (6+)

• Stormcast Eternals 

  • Command Trait - Shielded by Faith (5+ mortal)

  • Artefact - Armour of Destiny (6+)

  • Mount Trait - Steel Pinions (6+)

  • Hammers of Sigmar - We Cannot Fail (6+)

  • Gardus Steel Soul - Aura of Purity (5+ mortal)

• Sylvaneth 

  • Command Trait - Radiant Spirit (4+ spell)

  • Artefact - Glamourweave (5+ mortal)

  • Oakenbrow - Dawnflask (6+)

  • Gnarlroot - The Earth Defends (6+)

  • Warsong Revenant - Arboreal Cloak (4+)

DEATH

• Flesh-eater Courts

  • Battle Trait - Deathless Courtiers (6+)

  • Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist - Unholy Vitality (5+)

• Soulblight Gravelords

  • Battle Trait - Deathless Minions (6+)

  • Nagash - Morikhane (4+ mortal)

  • Lady Annika - Supernatural Speed (4+)

  • Torgillius the Chamberlain - Mastery of the Grave-sand (4+)

  • Vyrkos Blood-born - Shadowfast (5+)

  • Vargskyr - Gnarled Hide (5+)

  • Kosargi Nightguard - Deathly Vigour (5+)

• Nighthaunt

  • Battle Trait - Deathless Spirits (6+)

  • Artefact - Cloak of the Waxing Moon (5+)

  • Lord-Executioner - Disembodied Skulls (5+ mortal)

• Ossiarch Bonereapers

  • Battle Trait - Deathless Warriors (6+)

  • Command Trait - Immortal Ruler (5+)

  • Artefact - Lode of Saturation (5+)

  • Artefact - Guardian Reavesoul (5+)

  • Spell - Protection of Nagash (5+)

  • Spell - Reinforce Battle-shields (5+ mortal)

  • Morghast Archai - Ebon-wrought Armour (5+ mortal)

DESTRUCTION

• Gloomspite Gitz

  • Artefact - Loonstone Talisman (5+ mortal)

  • Artefact - Shiny Wotnot (6+ spell)

  • Artefact - Glowy Howzit (4+)

  • Skragrott - Loonking’s Crown (4+)

  • Fungoid Cave Shaman - Spore Squig (4+)

  • Rockgut Troggoths - Stony Skin (5+)

  • Webspinner Shaman - Touched by the Spider God (5+)

  • Glogg’s Megamob - Aetherquartz-studded Hide (5+ mortal)

• Ogre Mawtribes

  • Artefact of Power - Flask of Stonehorn Blood (4+)

  • Artefact - Shrunken Priest Head (5+)

  • Ogre Gluttons - LOOKOUT GNOBLAR (6+ missile)

  • Stonehorn - Stone Skeleton (5+)

• Orruk Warclans

  • Artefact - Daubing of Mork (6+)

  • Battle Trait - Warpaint (6+)

  • Battle Trait - Waaagh! Power - Laugh at ‘Em (6+)

  • Ironskull’s Boyz - Dead ‘Ard (6+/5+)

  • Orruk Ardboyz - Orruk-forged Shields (6+)

• Sons of Behemat

  • Artefact - Enchanted Portcullis (6+)

CHAOS

• Beasts of Chaos

  • Artefact - Blackened Armour of Chaos (4+ mortal)

  • Tzaangors - Arcanite Shields (6+)

• Blades of Khorne

  • Command Trait - Berserker Lord (5+)

  • Artefact - Blood-forged Armour (5+ mortal)

  • Artefact - Brazen Rune (2+ spell)

  • Artefact - Armour of Scorn (6+, 4+ spell)

  • Lord of Khorne - Brass-clad Shield (5+ spell)

  • Exalted Deathbringer - Runemarked Shield (2+ spell)

• Disciples of Tzeentch

  • The Eyes of the Nine - Arcanite Shield (6+)

  • Kairic Acolytes - Arcanite Shields (6+)

  • Tzaangors - Arcanite Shield (6+)

• Hedonites of Slaanesh

  • Keeper of Secrets - Shining Aegis (6+)

  • Shalaxi Helbane - Shining Aegis (6+)

  • The Contorted Epitome - Swallow Energy (2+ mortal)

  • The Maque - Inhuman Reflexes (4+)

  • Viceleader - Lightning Reflexes (5+)

  • Glutes Orscollion - Priestess Dolece (5+)

  • Lord of Pain - Share the Pain (5+)

  • Sigvald - The Mirror Shield (4+)

  • Symbaresh Twinsouls - Fiendish Reflexes (5+)

  • The Dread Pageant - Art of the Myrmidesh (4+)

• Maggotkin of Nurgle

  • Command Trait - Resilient (6+)

  • Artefact - The Splithorn Helm (6+)

  • Rotigus - Blubber and Bile (5+)

  • Great Unclean One - Blubber and Bile (5+)

  • Various - Disgustingly Resilient (5+)

  • Harbinger of Decay - Morbid Vigour (5+)

• Skaven

  • Artefact - Suspicious Stone (5+)

  • Various - Protection of the Horned Rat (5+)

  • Spiteclaw’s Swarm - Aversion to Death (5+)

• Slaves to Darkness

  • Battle Trait - Aura of Chaos Undivided (6+)

  • Battle Trait - Eye of the Gods (5+)

  • Ravagers - Blasphemous Cuirass (5+ mortal)

  • Despoilers - Sacrilegous Might (5+)

  • Archaon - The Armour of Morkar (4+ mortal)

  • Various - Chaos Runeshield (5+ mortal)

  • Chaos Lord on Karkadrak - Rune-etched Plating (5+ mortal)

  • Exalted Hero of Chaos - Dark Blessings (5+ mortal)

  • Darkoath Warqueen - Infernal Runeshield (6+) 

  • Chaos Warshrine - Protection of the Dark Gods (6+)

  • Legion of the First Prince - Infernal Realmwalkers (6+)

Do not stack with Wards

ORDER

• Cities of Sigmar

  • Battle Trait - Loyal Shields (4+ bodyguard)

• Daughters of Khaine

  • The Blade-Coven - Zealots of the First Temple (2+ bodyguard)

• Fyreslayers

  • Grimwrath Berzerker - “I will guard them with my life!” (2+ bodyguard)

• Kharadron Overlords

  • Arkanaut Admiral - Protect the Admiral! (5+ bodyguard)

• Lumineth Bladelords

  • Vanari Bladelords - Guardians (2+ bodyguard)

  • Myari’s Purifiers - Guardians (2+ bodyguard)

• Seraphon

  • Saurus Eternity Warden - Selfless Protectors (2+ bodyguard)

  • Saurus Guard - Selfless Protectors (2+ bodyguard)

DEATH

• Soulblight Gravelords

  • Belladamma Volga - First of the Vyrkos (3+ bodyguard)

  • Radukar the Wolf - Loyal to the Last (2+ bodyguard)

  • Gorslav the Gravekeeper - Keeper of the Corpse-gardens (4+ bodyguard)

  • Necromancer - Undead Minions (3+ bodyguard)

• Nighthaunt

  • Emerald Host - Knights of Regret (2+ bodyguard)

• Ossiarch Bonereapers

  • Immortis Guard - Soulbound Protectors (2+ bodyguard)

CHAOS

• Disciples of Tzeentch

  • Spell - Treacherous Bond (3+ bodyguard)

• Skaven 

  • Command Trait - Verminous Valour (4+ bodyguard)

• Slaves to Darkness

  • Legion of the First Prince - First-damned Prince (4+ bodyguard)

Edited August 27, 2021 by PJetski

[HollowHills]

Let's be real we're all banning ward stacking at events.

[Sleepa]

26 minutes ago, PJetski said:

Do not stack with Wards

ORDER

• Cities of Sigmar

  • Battle Trait - Loyal Shields (4+ bodyguard)

• Daughters of Khaine

  • The Blade-Coven - Zealots of the First Temple (2+ bodyguard)

• Fyreslayers

  • Grimwrath Berzerker - “I will guard them with my life!” (2+ bodyguard)

• Kharadron Overlords

  • Arkanaut Admiral - Protect the Admiral! (5+ bodyguard)

• Lumineth Bladelords

  • Vanari Bladelords - Guardians (2+ bodyguard)

  • Myari’s Purifiers - Guardians (2+ bodyguard)

• Seraphon

  • Saurus Eternity Warden - Selfless Protectors (2+ bodyguard)

  • Saurus Guard - Selfless Protectors (2+ bodyguard)

Add Stormcast Praetors to that

[PJetski]

3 minutes ago, Sleepa said:

Add Stormcast Praetors to that

I only listed units/abilities that are legal in matched play

[ChaosUndivided]

Chaos Warshrine protection doesn't stack as of previous errata and pretty sure Archaons armor of mork is both wounds and mortals.

Can someone explain the deal with body guards and how they factor into this?

[Sleepa]

Just now, PJetski said:

I only listed units/abilities that are legal in matched play

Hahaha Touche sir!

[Scurvydog]

35 minutes ago, The Wah said:

Sons of Behemat can now step over any other model, regardless of wounds and over any terrain size with Longshanks. My mega-gargants simply ignore everything smaller than them.

This makes me very happy.

*stomp* *stomp* *stomp*

It is nice not to deal with that, it does come at a cost compared to before, that it is now normal move, run and retreat, before it was just "a move" so charges are not included anymore, while before you could potentially charge over things like a flyer can.

[Sleepa]

Just now, ChaosUndivided said:

Chaos Warshrine protection doesn't stack as of previous errata and pretty sure Archaons armor of mork is both wounds and mortals.

Can someone explain the deal with body guards and how they factor into this?

Bodyguard rules (which state they take place BEFORE the wound is allocated) do not stack with Ward saves, as wards officially also take place in that timing window. But all after-save abilities that state they take place AS (or when) wounds are allocated, do stack.

[Skreech Verminking]

2 hours ago, Scurvydog said:

Why oh why is there a nerf to Archaon but not to Gotrek 😛

B’cause he beats ‘im, fair and square.

Also (real) dwarfs are much cooler than that guy.

 

2 hours ago, Scurvydog said:

But abilities like deathless minions for death armies is when you allocate, so a Vampire lord on ZD with amulet of destiny would then have 5+ ward, then 6+ deathless for example, which is a big deal for any books with this wording that is clearly meant to be wards, but are not right now. 

This goes for DoK and their 6+ and also StD with undivided marks, as those 6s to ignore allocated wounds now take place after wards

My comment:”so If a guy playing the belakor allegiancec takes a greater unclean one has his general, gives him that aura ability of a 5+ not ward save, takes the amulet of destiny, would that basically meam, that there would be a model with a 4+ save 5+ ward save and three other non wardsaving saves of a roll of 5+?”

yeah can’t wait to see this happening😂

25 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

Let's be real we're all banning ward stacking at events.

Same thought

Edited August 27, 2021 by Skreech Verminking

[Nezzhil]

[frostyeel]

If every allegiance ability needs a definition of what coalition units are, maybe they just should've been defined in the core rules? Previously it seemed like coalition units could be battleline in open play but not matched play, which was a bizarre difference in list building rules between the two, but that's now been clarified. At least now with the coalition definition and extra errata on what can or can't be included the system seems to mostly work.

[The Red King]

11 minutes ago, Nezzhil said:

We need a FAQ FAQ that comes 2 weeks after the FAQ.

[Ragest]

3 minutes ago, The Red King said:

We need a FAQ FAQ that comes 2 weeks after the FAQ.

This one is so big that needs to be faqed in days. Both fnp stacks and sylvaneth allegiances

[Skreech Verminking]

18 minutes ago, Nezzhil said:

That is a quite welcoming response,

but just to be bold, have you guys noticed how great giant rats have become??.

they are amazing in their small msu size now.

 

[mystycalchemy]

59 minutes ago, PJetski said:

I only listed units/abilities that are legal in matched play

Counterpoint, Praetors have a Pitched Battle Profile in the General's Handbook, and as all units must have a warscroll, the only usable warscroll is the Dominion one. Thus, they are legal.

Unrelated to that, Sam Pearson (rules writer for AoS) has been made aware of the After save stacking and 'will discuss it with the team ASAP'

Twitter Link to Sam's Response

Edited August 27, 2021 by mystycalchemy

[Beliman]

Imho, only the old Save after save that trigger "when you allocate..." or "each time you allocate..." (or any other wording that happens after "before you allocate...") are the real problem here.

Bodyguards rules seems ok to me:

1.  If your Hero has a Ward save and is near a unit with bodyguard, you can chose wich hability you are going to use.
2. If the bodyguard recieve the wound, if they have any Ward save, you still can use it.

After that, I think we shouldn't have any more abilities to negate wounds.

[yukishiro1]

Restoring ward stacking is pretty obviously just a massive snafu - not GW's first, not the last. No serious tournament is going to allow it, and it is going to be fixed almost immediately. I wouldn't even bother adjusting your lists, it is never, ever going to survive, it's completely game-breaking. 

The very fact that the Chaos Warshrine 6+ got FAQed from a "ward save but not ward save" to be a ward save because they were making changes to it anyway shows you that GW's intent is that all these things are ward saves, they just haven't bothered to actually do the hard work of changing them.

Disappointing to see that GW still can't manage to avoid breaking its game in fundamental ways, and what it says about their FAQ process that something like this could slip through without anyone noticing it, but it is what it is I suppose. At least they've already acknowledged it's an issue and promised a consult ASAP, I guess that's progress. 

Edited August 27, 2021 by yukishiro1

[Zappgrot]

6 hours ago, PrimeElectrid said:

They almost did.

Because when you kill a horror it doesn’t count as slain. Therefore, you can’t continue to allocate wounds to the unit.

Look GW how many goes do you need to make horrors work? Just bin them and be done with it. 

Not really beeing slain and not counting as beeing slain are a bit different in the rules most of the time.  And to not count as slain and split. The model needs to be slain in the first place so that will trigger the next wound to be allocated.