When will GW expand the smaller armies?

[Barkanaut]

I know KO is getting a single new model and many have but it's simply not enough to get excited about. With some armies being small like ours, IDK, Fyreslayers, and many more when will GW get to wave 2 on all these small armies with much bigger updates that expand the ranges? I feel like even the best rules changes in the world simply won't make up for having small and limited rosters to collect. 

Edited December 26, 2019 by Barkanaut

[Aegisgrimm]

Yeah, I always felt that Fyreslayers needed some options that weren't just "more Fyreslayers".  It always seemed to be cool to me if they got some sort of rune/stone golems the size of Ogors or trolls.

To add flavor to my skirmish games I had been thinking of painting up a pair of Runewars Rune Golems to use with Kurnoth stats, or even just some repainted Sylvaneth as charred wood.

Edited December 26, 2019 by Aegisgrimm

[Evangelist of Cinders]

It's hard to say; I'm sure a lot of people at GW would like to go crazy with these factions but the practical side of both business and  operational may limit this. Part of the process is that design and rules are working more separately then in the past of the hobby so there isn't a big picture plan towards armies and would make a limited quota a efficient means of organizing project development.

You also have to keep in mind production; you cant just design a mini and produce enough to make up costs and distribute them well in different markets. GW is starting a new facility this will greatly change things . the question is will this be for more variety or more production of all ready existing range, to meet demand/enter new markets. This will be a big change for the business side of the hobby; and is a large endeavor that will need to find a way to make up for its costs. it may be used to expand variety to entice new purchases from new and existing players or it will be used to produce more of the ever popular space marines to increase revenue so less profitable parts of the business can stick around for long term success. the lone heroes and terrain  models(or in the case of cities of sigmar reusing old molds) will probably be kept a bit longer until any long term plans for AoS are fully in motion. It gives old customers something new and doesn't risk much of your finite production capacity going to waste.

Edited December 26, 2019 by Evangelist of Cinders

[Kasper]

After Q1 2020 all armies will have their 2.0 book (you can argue some of the first “2.0 books” arent up to par) and Im hoping they will spend 2020 updating/expanding current armies

[Overread]

It's impossible to guess. I think that early on in AoS lifespan it was clear that GW then was going to make lots of small armies that each fit into the grand alliances, with the likely view that any army which didn't sell would just get retired and that GW could keep releasing new armies with only halfdozen or so models released to launch them.

 

Today its very different, but I think that many of the small armies might still have a while to wait before they get expanded upon. To GW's credit they've balanced the game out well so that those small forces don't feel weak compared to larger ones. Plus the AoS system has fewer "hard counter" requirements within it so a smaller army which ahs less models and options, isn't disadvantaged against larger and more diverse armies. 

 

I'd love to see many of the smaller factions expand, even those I don't collect like Flesheaters - I'd love to see them expand and get more unique and interesting sculpts. Alongside there's forces like Seraphon and Skaven. 

[SaJeel]

So all the armies that got new models haven't really had a release of the new model, it was only a bundled product, with two exceptions, realm of chaos, karnack, the hounds, and the infernal enrapturess and fiends who both a larger expanded release when they're kits were sold outside of realm of chaos.  

I think looking at that is a good indicator of what they will do in future especially how they did khorne, a box set with new kits followed by a release of new kits along with more new kits, only this time this release won't accompany a new battletome.

You also have all this staff and writers dedicated to battletomes, theyve been cranking them out at a crazy pace so once all the times are out they must have something they want to shift the writing staff to, maybe furthering the lore of the world in other ways than just battle times ala malign portents perhaps  

This makes slot of business sense imo

Edited December 26, 2019 by SaJeel

[Fairbanks]

FEC and Ironjawz are low in the number of unique models, but IMO they feel very complete, minus terrain/Spells for IJ, and an actual Archregeant clampack for FEC (though with an extra Crypt Horror Sprue, you can build a pretty badass looking one).

Other smaller armies have other issues. IDK don’t have a limited selection, they have the issue that there are only one/two good choices (****ing eels). KO got FAQ’d into uselessness very early.

Big armies have issues too. Gloomspite and Nurgle both feel like they are just several armies with no synergy under a single banner. You don’t do anything, you are just going to pick the best of each option.

Fyreslayers are a glaring outlier. The models are overpriced ($, not points), and you need droves of them to field an army. At a minimum they needed at least one completely different looking unit (not another set of dudes with axes, or a Magmadroth hero), like fire-Dwarves riding Salamanders, or dudes literally on fire, or Golden golems. Anything but fire-Dorfs and Magmadroths.

[Clan's Cynic]

Hmm, so what you're all saying is... we need another Knight-Questor or two?

[Chikout]

Well you’re probably not going to like the answer but it’s about every 5 or 6 years. There will be about another 10 new factions of the next decade which will bring us up to 32 battletomes. Recently gw has been doing about 5 major AOS releases each year plus a few minor releases. By that math KO will get a major update in about 2022. 

[Galas]

Normally armies need minimun two waves to feel like complete armies. You have the example of Genestealer Cults in 40k. They where very much limited before the second wave. Now they totally feell like a complete army. A little overcrown with characters but thats something nu-GW loves to make. 

 

Armies like Ironjawz that are literally 3 units become boring very fast. Flesh Eaters, and others examples really need a second wave with 2-3 new units and a bunch of new heroes.

[Overread]

6 minutes ago, Chikout said:

Well you’re probably not going to like the answer but it’s about every 5 or 6 years. There will be about another 10 new factions of the next decade which will bring us up to 32 battletomes. Recently gw has been doing about 5 major AOS releases each year plus a few minor releases. By that math KO will get a major update in about 2022. 

I'm not sure about adding 10 more factions to the game - that's a LOT of armies and way above what GW has ever done before. Even in 40K they've nothing like that volume of new content. Or at least they've done big additions, but often as not they were evolutions on themes already present and many have been retired over the years. Things like world themed Imperial Guard legions. 

Thing is those at least all fit one army; if you retire an alternate guard force you can just roll them into a current one as some flavourful units. I think AoS originally was a high volume army releasing game, but I can't see GW maintaining it with 10 more armies and Battletomes. 

 

There's certainly no lore to limit GW, but practicalities of model marketing and product sale might eventually curb the "new army " hype mania. 

[Carnelian]

I'd love to see existing factions get more but I'd also just love to see new stuff

If existing factions get something new, I don't want it to be something similar to what they already have but stuff that really expand their ranges imaginatively 

[Forrix]

My personal tinfoil hat theory/hopeful wishing is we are going to see 2nd waves for all the factions with unreleased box set heroes this year. So come Feburaryish we'll get the long awaited warlock Bombardier  release  and plastic acolytes to go along with him. FEC will get the Arch-Regent clampack and some proper plastic courtier models.

[Kasper]

12 minutes ago, Galas said:

Armies like Ironjawz that are literally 3 units become boring very fast. Flesh Eaters, and others examples really need a second wave with 2-3 new units and a bunch of new heroes.

I don't have this feel at all with Ironjawz. Sure in a lot of other armies you have the illusion of choice, unless you just want fluffy army lists. But if you want to play with competitive lists, the majority of armies might as well only have 3-5 warscrolls because you wont touch the other ones.

[kenshin620]

Maybe if everything wasn't plastic...

 

I think there would be at least 30 additional Special Characters alone if metal/resin was still a thing.

[Overread]

Metal and resins are traditionally much cheaper to cast with. However finecast was a disaster material that just didn't work for mass production; whilst regular metal and resin production is more time consuming and labour intensive compared to plastic casting - something GW has to keep in mind as they produce in house in the UK and also are producing for a massive world market. 

 

In addition metal was mostly dropped because whilst its a great material, its price kept going up and down which made budget forecasting for GW a very difficult thing; esp with the volumes of material they required it would result in big actual changes in the costs for them to do business. There's also the issue that the world market for it is very competitive so th price often keeps creeping up. 

[kenshin620]

Well yes I know metal is extremely volatile price wise, especially as Lead became "too dangerous" to use for miniatures so people had to switch to the more expensive Tin.  I was mainly commenting that Metal/Resin was the principle material of choice for Leaders/Characters due to the general economics of "people need 80 space marines, but only 2 chaplains". 

One example of this is Necrons, they have 7 special characters alone. Compare that to many AoS factions that have very few (outside of the big story factions), not counting Underworld Warbands.

I'm not saying "everyone needs more special characters!" but I'm pretty sure if metal/resin was still something GW did, each faction would guarantee have 2-3 more characters whether generic or not.

Edited December 26, 2019 by kenshin620

[SleeperAgent]

2019 was updating books for most armies. 2020 NEEDS to be adding models to the armies that desperately need them. AND selling all the box set heroes.

[TheCovenLord]

Some armies need a few new different looking minis (fyreslayers, Ironjawz, Bonesplitterz desperately needs a centerpiece model, updates for seraphon range etc.). However as strange as it sounds I think stormcast needs some housekeeping (dramatically reduce the redundant units in the army) and a new update and release. For being the poster children the army is a bit of a mess with a few competitive coherent bits and the rest is jank that is cool but never seen. 

Edited December 27, 2019 by TheCovenLord

[Skreech Verminking]

I actually think that the combining pf the three forces of orruks gave the Ironjaws and bonesplittaz  a pretty good looking unit roster.

what the Ironjaws always meeded were some cheap orruk meatshield option, which they got with the remaining but probably soon gone greenskinz, and some good unit options with the bonesplittaz.

I don’t really think that Ironjaws are really in a need for new units, at least not for the next couple of years.

 

[novakai]

39 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

I actually think that the combining pf the three forces of orruks gave the Ironjaws and bonesplittaz  a pretty good looking unit roster.

what the Ironjaws always meeded were some cheap orruk meatshield option, which they got with the remaining but probably soon gone greenskinz, and some good unit options with the bonesplittaz.

I don’t really think that Ironjaws are really in a need for new units, at least not for the next couple of years.

 

i disagree and be disappointed if that was the case that we have to wait years for more Ironjawz model, I felt that Warclans was a cheap way to fix the problem of both ranges being so poor (IJ needed models and Bonesplitterz needed a proper plastic model) . and the release it self was lackluster compare to the other tome release because of the lack of endless spell and terrain.  even a separate box hero would have been ok but Orks got straight up shafted.

 

Edited December 27, 2019 by novakai

[Greyshadow]

This might be a bit of a dissenting view but I like the splash release model. The Kharadron and Indoneth both seem complete to me and I love them both. (I’ve bought an Overlords warband I plan to play in Skirmish). The old model of having a few factions with waves years sometimes nearly decades apart was problematic. The other advantage of the new model is that it is possible to see totally new mind blowing stuff like the Deepkin, Bonereapers and Ironjawz.

I do like the idea of updating books though with a new miniature or two to keep your collection fresh.

Edited December 27, 2019 by Greyshadow

[The_Yellow_Sign]

18 hours ago, Fairbanks said:

KO got FAQ’d into uselessness very early

KO has poor internal balance, but they are actually in a good place competitively. They have a higher winrate than many AoS 2.0 armies (e.g,. almost 10% higher than Beasts of Chaos).

 

[wayniac]

Given that models are seemingly designed first without input/concern for what a faction needs, it's anyone's guess if it will ever happen.  Hard to tell since there's little to no real transparency with how things operate other than bits and pieces gleaned from articles but as crazy as it sounds it appears like there isn't communication between the model designers and the game designers.

[#SteveJames]

I would love to see the Fyreslayers get mini Magnadroths in units of three and maybe some kind of war machines. 

With the Khadaron Overlord some zany new craft and a few more battleline. They're not to bad a book. 

Deepkin nautical themed endless spells ghost ship or shoal of fish and a Sharknado cus why not.