The Rumour Thread

[Chikout]

The Broken Realms Alarielle rumour is something I don't believe. It's possible that when they were first planning the books a couple of years ago, they considered doing 5 books including Alarielle but they eventually settled on 4. That's not cutting though as they  would never have written the book. 

Taking 2 books, rewriting the story to fit in half the number of pages, re-editing everything, redoing the page layouts, cutting a bunch of art etc, etc.  This is a lot of work, almost as much as doing a book from scratch. 

The short story subscriptions are always done in runs of 5 because there are 5 week days. It's as simple as that.  Commissioning one extra piece of art is trivial compared to what the conspiracy theorists are suggesting.

This is definitely an Occam's razor situation. 

To get back to actual rumours. With the Sisters book this weekend and the range being a two week release, it seems highly likely that Dominion will go on pre-order on June 19th and release on July 3rd. 

It's annoying but when gw talks out dates it's always pre-order and not release. 

I'm hoping for a long run of daily articles running up to launch and was slightly surprised to see nothing yesterday. 

[Marius au]

As for books after dominion, after the SCE and KB I think it will be the books that got new scrolls in BR.  Simply because those will probably be gone from general sale in a year or so and GW will want to have those rules (other than battalions) available in a book.  So that would leave Idoneth, Nighthaunt, Nurgle, Fyreslayers, Khardron, Beasts, Gits, Sylvaneth and Skaven.  Probably Nurgle and Nighthaunt first.

[Clan's Cynic]

3 hours ago, Public Universal Duardin said:

See, this is exactly what I am expecting (as much as I'd want Chorfs for the holidays!). Leaks next year, maybe get them in January 2023 after a year of leaks and 'leaks' by James Workshop's marketing department, kinda how we all 'knew' of Sons of Behemat long before they were announced. I'm betting on Malerion by Xmas, no matter what he's probably coming out before we see any duardin - be it the right, bull-worshipping kind or the more...eww...orderly kind (I kid I kid, ALL duardin are loved!).

2023 seems too far to me.

With how tight-lipped GW typically are about anything that's coming, hints alone already feel like they're a lot closer than that. I don't think Adam and Eddie would've been outright teasing Chaos Dwarfs, scripted and not a slip of the tongue, if they were anymore than a year out - Covid permitting, of course.

The way these leaks go, the closer you are to launch, the more likely a leak is going to slip out because there's gradually more people who actually are in the know and the odds of said mole being discovered lessen. It's a lot easier to leak if you're working in a warehouse than directly designing something, because list of suspects widens dramatically and there's a lot more on the line for a career designer than a warehouse driver.

When has there ever been a legitimate leak of something that wasn't anymore than maybe six to eight months away? Even the Sons cards were seen on the shipping manifesto only what, three months before the official announcement? Anything longer tends to just be educated guesses from people who're otherwise unreliable and eventually something sticks. 

If the Chaos Dwarf rumours are true, I'd guesstimate around January-April 2022, maybe with a Gloomspite-esq Christmas reveal if we're lucky.

Edited June 1, 2021 by Clan's Cynic

[Chikout]

I think it's highly likely that we see the Chaos Dwarves or whatever they end up being called within the first year. I wonder if the hobgrots will end up being useable in that book too. It would be a good way to tempt players into the army. 

[Shankelton]

Don't mind waiting for the Dominion preorder honestly. I have enough to work on before heaping on a box of plastic even if I plan to sell the stormcast half.

But I would greatly appreciate some lore information for these new Orruks. Aesthetics wise they are banging on all cylinders, but I am anxious to see their character in the story. How does this change the orc hierarchy between clans/ factions, considering how different these are aesthetically and anatomically from the orc design we've been conditioned too expect.

Not to mention the glaring, weird case of Kragnos. Who well I agree can slot into destruction, certainly is an oddity at first, naked glance. I dunno, I want the deets! No need to spoil all the rules bits, just give us some real cool Warhammer community releases introducing us to the faction in the lore.

 

[FFJump]

1 hour ago, Clan's Cynic said:

When has there ever been a legitimate leak of something that wasn't anymore than maybe six to eight months away? Even the Sons cards were seen on the shipping manifesto only what, three months before the official announcement? Anything longer tends to just be educated guesses from people who're otherwise unreliable and eventually something sticks. 

I believe the last time we got a long-lasting rumor for AoS was from Hastings when he talked about Idoneth Deepkin, calling them Cthulu elves at the time. Those rumors started like early 2017, and I think Idoneth were revealed in early 2018? About a year out. Looking over at 40K though, Atia had spoken about Enforcers saying that'd it be a few years before we got them in 2016~ and we didn't see them until mid-2019. Though it is true the leaks have been getting closer and closer to the release date since then. The Kruelboyz rumors only started a few months ago after all.

[PJetski]

2 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

2023 seems too far to me.

With how tight-lipped GW typically are about anything that's coming, hints alone already feel like they're a lot closer than that. I don't think Adam and Eddie would've been outright teasing Chaos Dwarfs, scripted and not a slip of the tongue, if they were anymore than a year out - Covid permitting, of course.

The way these leaks go, the closer you are to launch, the more likely a leak is going to slip out because there's gradually more people who actually are in the know and the odds of said mole being discovered lessen. It's a lot easier to leak if you're working in a warehouse than directly designing something, because list of suspects widens dramatically and there's a lot more on the line for a career designer than a warehouse driver.

When has there ever been a legitimate leak of something that wasn't anymore than maybe six to eight months away? Even the Sons cards were seen on the shipping manifesto only what, three months before the official announcement? Anything longer tends to just be educated guesses from people who're otherwise unreliable and eventually something sticks. 

If the Chaos Dwarf rumours are true, I'd guesstimate around January-April 2022, maybe with a Gloomspite-esq Christmas reveal if we're lucky.

GW really likes to release a new army in late Q3 in time for the holiday sales, so theres a good chance we see chorfs in October

[cofaxest]

14 hours ago, zilberfrid said:

Chaos dwarves vs Valaya dwarves!

I think that Chaos dwarfs will be connected to united duardin tome so at best we could get duardins vs chaos dwarfs box with 1-2 new units for duardins(Grombrindal model?). And later (at the end of 3ed?) duardins could actually get new faction(like Kruleboyz for warclans).

[zilberfrid]

1 hour ago, cofaxest said:

I think that Chaos dwarfs will be connected to united duardin tome so at best we could get duardins vs chaos dwarfs box with 1-2 new units for duardins(Grombrindal model?). And later (at the end of 3ed?) duardins could actually get new faction(like Kruleboyz for warclans).

I just will always jam a spark of hope for female dwarves sets in a conversation if it halfway fits. I don't actually think GW will make them in the next few years.

Atlantis miniatures does, as do several digital designers, Scribor and even my big box of Blacklist minis has several.

[Deakz28]

3 hours ago, PJetski said:

GW really likes to release a new army in late Q3 in time for the holiday sales, so theres a good chance we see chorfs in October

This is true, but I am on the bench where I think chaos dwarves won’t be an instant release, after all I don’t think nighthaunt and OBR released consecutively, and with these two armies being related also seems they won’t be that way, they could however be a summer release, and the new army in Q3/4 could be something different maybe more Elves or some other order, but then I’m think dwarves are chaos and a different faction so maybe they could be and a different army in summer next year... too much to hope for 😂😂😂

[Deakz28]

2 hours ago, cofaxest said:

I think that Chaos dwarfs will be connected to united duardin tome so at best we could get duardins vs chaos dwarfs box with 1-2 new units for duardins(Grombrindal model?). And later (at the end of 3ed?) duardins could actually get new faction(like Kruleboyz for warclans).

Unfortunately I think a dwarf vs dwarf box won’t happen, it’s so niche and only appeals to people who like dwarves, I’d love it myself, but GW wouldn’t take this route for the sake of not enough people who’d don’t like fwarves would buy it  

[Public Universal Duardin]

5 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

2023 seems too far to me.

With how tight-lipped GW typically are about anything that's coming, hints alone already feel like they're a lot closer than that. I don't think Adam and Eddie would've been outright teasing Chaos Dwarfs, scripted and not a slip of the tongue, if they were anymore than a year out - Covid permitting, of course.

The way these leaks go, the closer you are to launch, the more likely a leak is going to slip out because there's gradually more people who actually are in the know and the odds of said mole being discovered lessen. It's a lot easier to leak if you're working in a warehouse than directly designing something, because list of suspects widens dramatically and there's a lot more on the line for a career designer than a warehouse driver.

When has there ever been a legitimate leak of something that wasn't anymore than maybe six to eight months away? Even the Sons cards were seen on the shipping manifesto only what, three months before the official announcement? Anything longer tends to just be educated guesses from people who're otherwise unreliable and eventually something sticks. 

If the Chaos Dwarf rumours are true, I'd guesstimate around January-April 2022, maybe with a Gloomspite-esq Christmas reveal if we're lucky.

"Chaos Duardin release date" is a topic I'm more than glad being proven wrong about. In fact, I challenge GW to TOTALLY own me. Like, to annihiliate me and destroy my reputation. To on Twitter @ me and force me to delete my account out of sheer embarrassment over making such a late guess. All this by completely humiliating me by posting my last speculative comment next Sunday on WarCom and under it a picture of one (1) new Chaos Duardin, all painted up and ready to release, with the text "🤣🤣🤣😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣Does this look like 2023 to you 🤣🤣🤣😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣" under it.

Your move, GW.

[KingBrodd]

5 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

2023 seems too far to me.

With how tight-lipped GW typically are about anything that's coming, hints alone already feel like they're a lot closer than that. I don't think Adam and Eddie would've been outright teasing Chaos Dwarfs, scripted and not a slip of the tongue, if they were anymore than a year out - Covid permitting, of course.

The way these leaks go, the closer you are to launch, the more likely a leak is going to slip out because there's gradually more people who actually are in the know and the odds of said mole being discovered lessen. It's a lot easier to leak if you're working in a warehouse than directly designing something, because list of suspects widens dramatically and there's a lot more on the line for a career designer than a warehouse driver.

When has there ever been a legitimate leak of something that wasn't anymore than maybe six to eight months away? Even the Sons cards were seen on the shipping manifesto only what, three months before the official announcement? Anything longer tends to just be educated guesses from people who're otherwise unreliable and eventually something sticks. 

If the Chaos Dwarf rumours are true, I'd guesstimate around January-April 2022, maybe with a Gloomspite-esq Christmas reveal if we're lucky.

I agree mate. I'm guessing more hints will come around November and then the Christmas reveal with a Q1 2022 release.

I expect to see the Rumour Engine ramping up to be Chaos releases as well.

[Souleater]

Ah...2022 seems so far away. ☹

 

I am sure they will be worth the wait, however.

[zilberfrid]

10 hours ago, Neverchosen said:

Hamlet: What a piece of work is a man! How noble in reason, how infinite in faculty! In form and moving how express and admirable! In action how like an angel, in apprehension how like a god!

@zilberfrid Nah, it is just the form part... 😁

I think the relative humanity of Stormcast is a really fun ontological question, what about them is human and in each reforging what is lost. I think it is more than memories but also a certain level of autonomy. But this gives a strange reason to fight and move forward. There is something Sisyphean in their task but also unlike Camus' reading of the story it is a task that is highly alienating. I feel like the Stormcast that wishes to keep their humanity will struggle to fight and survive but one that has experienced enough reforging will have lost that desire. I think there is something fascinating in that notion and maybe a battle weary Stormcast hero may sacrifice them self to save a comrade in arms from losing more of themselves. But after a certain point would they still make that choice or simply work by Sigmar's will?

As for a Vampire what they sacrifice is not their bodily humanity but their 'soul'. A Stormcast may not remember who they were but retain a sense of morality or personality, whereas a Vampire has given into hunger. A vampire becomes something other than their true self, losing what we might colloquially refer to as their 'humanity'. Maybe instead of humanity we could define this in terms of soul or personhood?

Tying this back to rumours, I saw the suggestion that the new Stormcast units were not a new chamber but from existing ones. This checks out for the units we have seen before, but do we have any information on which chamber the new models will belong to? I am less up to date on lore as many of you here and I am particularly ignorant of the various Chambers and Stormhosts so I apologize if it is super obvious. 

Well, it's not just the form. 

Stormcast are lightning golems fueled by the souls of fallen heroes, that lose more and more of them the more Stormcast the become.

So while some Hamlet statements become more true, others degrade.

The definition of what a human is, is quite central to whether or not a Stormcast (or vampire) is still human.

I would say that losing the body, as well as abrasion of free will damages the entity's adherance to the definition of humans.

On the other hand, when vampires are just pawns to Nagash, said free will is also gone. They lose different parts of themselves in the process.

I think the ability to have free will is the most central thing to being a human. Losing that strips humanity from the entity.

In short: Stay away from gods.

[DoctorPerils]

3 hours ago, PJetski said:

GW really likes to release a new army in late Q3 in time for the holiday sales, so theres a good chance we see chorfs in October

I'd personally gamble on Grungnids for this October, though what I'd really love is a grungnid Vs Skaven box set in the vein of Shadowspear, with completely new minis for each of the two factions, which I can't see happening before 2022

[zilberfrid]

1 hour ago, DoctorPerils said:

I'd personally gamble on Grungnids for this October, though what I'd really love is a grungnid Vs Skaven box set in the vein of Shadowspear, with completely new minis for each of the two factions, which I can't see happening before 2022

Skaven are quite popular in WH: TW (or at least, I'd hope so, because half of the DLC's are rats), so there may be a tie in there to refresh the line.

[cofaxest]

1 hour ago, DoctorPerils said:

I'd personally gamble on Grungnids for this October, though what I'd really love is a grungnid Vs Skaven box set in the vein of Shadowspear, with completely new minis for each of the two factions, which I can't see happening before 2022

This sounds quite possible because Grungni is returning and he probably will decide to return his forge that was infested by skavens in realm of metal. 

[mojojojo101]

My totally baseless speculation is that we will see a range refresh (Seraphon, Skaven, BoC or Mawtribes) in October, then Nurgle (because its a relatively easy book to update) alongside something else in January, then a new army (Chorfs?) in approx March/April.

I expect most of this summer will be focused on Kruelboyz / new Stormcast stuff as well as new starter sets and what  not.

[Bluesummers]

16 hours ago, CommissarRotke said:

Stormcast are a human faction... many, many Stormhosts retain their human empathy and morality. The ones who don't may have lost it over dozens of reforgings, or may not have been a shining example of morality when they were mortal. Stormcast have platonic and romantic relationships, both with each other and mortals. There's even stories where if they had kids before they were reforged, the Stormcast will take leave to visit their kids.

Just because they are the Fantasy Poster-faction, does not mean they are equivalent to Space Marines beyond that. GW did a really good thing making Stormcast into immortal humans that fight endlessly to defend mortal humans.

They are more like a Golem faction (not even human sized) marketed around the space marine business model which is hideous. The aesthetic was so bad that they have released almost the same units 3 times trying to fix the outlook. We could have new armies instead of this needless refresh at the dawn of every edition.

That's what i am trying to say, they are forced into the themed box because they "have to be stormcasts" in there and most people can see through the marketing that it feels inorganic.

Some people will defend SCs because they are fans and that's ok, everyone has a different taste.

[JustAsPlanned]

I mean... now we’ve got Dominion to complete the trifecta of Order v Chaos, Order v Death, and Order v Destruction starter sets, logically the next step would be Order v Order - maybe there’d be no Stormcast in that one? Granted, that’s 4e which is at least 3 years off and we haven’t had had 3e yet, but still.

Edited June 1, 2021 by JustAsPlanned

[Rachmani]

16 hours ago, ZaelART said:

They suffer from the same problem as space marines, they should be powerful and rare. Awe inspiring. Whispered about in myths and legends. But that doesn't translate well to tabletop.

I disagree. What you describe is a Space Marine. SCE aren‘t SMs. They get reborn at the cost of their humanity, that’s their inherent tragedy but otherwise they’re the last help that actually comes to the rescue. People have seen them. They’re awe inspiring through sacrifice not myths. 
Inagine talking to a guy you know has dies for you before.

[Greybeard86]

12 minutes ago, Rachmani said:

I disagree. What you describe is a Space Marine. SCE aren‘t SMs. They get reborn at the cost of their humanity, that’s their inherent tragedy but otherwise they’re the last help that actually comes to the rescue. People have seen them. They’re awe inspiring through sacrifice not myths. 
Inagine talking to a guy you know has dies for you before.

What is truly awe inspiring is the number of warscrolls they have. Do we need another "generic fantasy figurine with mega armor"?

Sorry to hate on them, but I took a look recently and I was shocked.

[Scurvydog]

13 minutes ago, Greybeard86 said:

What is truly awe inspiring is the number of warscrolls they have. Do we need another "generic fantasy figurine with mega armor"?

Sorry to hate on them, but I took a look recently and I was shocked.

Even more surprising that nearly all these warscrolls are terrible and rarely see any use.

A huge amount of insignificant heroes and named characters, usually from multi kits (named + regular), this bloats their hero roster a LOT, while in reality leaving far fewer unique choices and even less actually viable ones for any kind of matched play.

They have a kit building 3 variants of paladins, nobody uses them. They have a kit for building 4 different kinds of dracoth cavalry, yet hardly anyone uses them and so on and so on. 

Also 30+ warscroll battalions, that nobody uses...

In reality it is easy for them to make many kits, as it is the same basic dudes being copy pasted with slight variations in equipment and only very few are viable for even half competitive matches right now. This leaves other armies with more actual meaningful choices when building an army, with more visual diversity and more interesting gameplay mechanics as well, yet the "quantity envy" still goes strong.

Envy quality, not quantity  (that said the new Stormcast models sure are quality imo, so rules will be less of an issue for sales)

[PrimeElectrid]

16 minutes ago, Greybeard86 said:

What is truly awe inspiring is the number of warscrolls they have. Do we need another "generic fantasy figurine with mega armor"?

Sorry to hate on them, but I took a look recently and I was shocked.

What’s even more inspiring is how most of those warscrolls (and all *40* of the battalions) are garbage. You would have thought that simple variation alone would have produced some gold, but even the best stuff is pretty much average relative to other books. You really have to put the effort in to make all 52 warscrolls that bad. 

In any case I don’t think anyone could look at 1st and 2nd gen SCE models and say that they represent the best that Gw can do. Sacrosanct were definitely a step up and it looks like Thunderclast go one step further.

Yes, other armies are in desperate need of a visual update too - but they aren’t the flagship line that GW use to show off their skills and capabilities and plaster all over their marketing. I know it sucks for those armies but that’s just how business is.