The Rumour Thread

[DoctorPerils]

Hoping that Hedonites get a bit of a buff (equally hopefully not enough they become overpowered!) - reading how out of whack they were at release really took the wind out of my sails for AoS, but hopefully this'll reel me back in

[Neverchosen]

On the one hand these dragons do not fit my initial list... on the other hand a friend gave me a bunch of second hand Stormcast stuff so now my planned 2000 point army is now a thing of the past and I should just go all in on dragons!

But in less selfish terms, I think once again this could have been seen from a mile away. The two responses for the dragons were to raise their points or lower the points of everything else to have them be more competitive. As power creep slowly takes place over the edition I expect to see the dragons slowly climb their way back down and maybe I can fit more of my new Stormcast into my lists.

Edited November 19, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Enoby]

2 minutes ago, DoctorPerils said:

Hoping that Hedonites get a bit of a buff (equally hopefully not enough they become overpowered!) - reading how out of whack they were at release really took the wind out of my sails for AoS, but hopefully this'll reel me back in

Yeah, while Hedonites are not the weakest army, they are the army I've seen the most complaints and disappointment about. So many people saying "would have played this army, the models are beautiful but the rules just suck". 

While I don't necessarily agree the rules are that bad, I do understand people's complaints and I can imagine it would have cost a considerable number of sales.

[Clan's Cynic]

3 hours ago, Feii said:

But I gotta meme a little bit. 

Would that make it the first Chaos Primaris?

;^)

Edited November 19, 2021 by Clan's Cynic

[DoctorPerils]

5 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Yeah, while Hedonites are not the weakest army, they are the army I've seen the most complaints and disappointment about. So many people saying "would have played this army, the models are beautiful but the rules just suck". 

While I don't necessarily agree the rules are that bad, I do understand people's complaints and I can imagine it would have cost a considerable number of sales.

Yeah, from what I've understood they aren't bad per se, however they are overly complex for someone new to AoS... Like me XD

[Feii]

26 minutes ago, Enoby said:

Yeah, while Hedonites are not the weakest army, they are the army I've seen the most complaints and disappointment about. So many people saying "would have played this army, the models are beautiful but the rules just suck". 

While I don't necessarily agree the rules are that bad, I do understand people's complaints and I can imagine it would have cost a considerable number of sales.

The thing is Slaanesh is already an unpopular army. Is it true that Skaven or Gitz might have a worse winrate but they have so much bigger general appeal and players who just love them/buy them no matter what. 

Writing bad and impotent rules doesn't help anybody. It doesn't help new player acquisition and model sales. They will be just forgotten.


Also the hedonites battletome and warscrolls are probably the worst/weakest book they have written in modern GW times. 

And yes I am biased and I am very happy for the battlebox but at the same time it feels they really didn't sell good. 



  (my lgs shop regarding the new battleforce box)

[Neverchosen]

35 minutes ago, Feii said:

The thing is Slaanesh is already an unpopular army. Is it true that Skaven or Gitz might have a worse winrate but they have so much bigger general appeal and players who just love them/buy them no matter what. 

Writing bad and impotent rules doesn't help anybody. It doesn't help new player acquisition and model sales. They will be just forgotten.


Also the hedonites battletome and warscrolls are probably the worst/weakest book they have written in modern GW times. 

And yes I am biased and I am very happy for the battlebox but at the same time it feels they really didn't sell good. 



  (my lgs shop regarding the new battleforce box)

I have never quite understood how the God of sex, drugs and rock and roll is less popular than the Gods of nerds, flus, or being angry all the time? Of course I prefer undivided as I like to mix and match my narrative elements and motivations, but if I were to choose a god the one offering pleasure would be the obvious forerunner... Tzeentch is a close runner up but I do not know if I would enjoy having feathery mutations and strange tentacles. 

But I like Chaos to be a transgressive rejection of social norms, particularly within the diegetic settings of the game. Within the grimdark of the 401st millennium there is only one God that knows how to Party! In the annals of the Old World only one god was punk rock enough to have both Dark Elves and Chaos Warriors worship them! In AoS there is only one God who even when bound in chains is a greater threat to civilization than almost all other threats combined simply by offering what is most wanted. Slaanesh is one of the few evil gods whose worship actually makes sense... Slaanesh provides an opportunity to possibly reject at least a part of these cold dark worlds, but at the price of losing yourself in your own excess and pride. 

I feel like Brad Goodman would be a great champion of Slaanesh and Little Rudiger here would make a fine Demon Prince:

Edited November 19, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Howdyhedberg]

3 hours ago, Feii said:

I like playing as the badies. (without needing to relate directly to anything IRL as a regime or a historical period etc.) There is not a lot of gaming stuff about being the baddie and trying to win. 

I play lumineth, they are the badies to a lot of people (we got sentinels, teclis and that fox that ive heard never dies).

 

1 hour ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

Will we see the end of save stacking in this update? Place your bets now! (We won't.)

Can you explain what this is? I thought you could only do 1 ward save?

 

2 hours ago, Gaz Taylor said:

I think the problem is for some people you have to state it. One of the reasons why pop bottle tops have “open by hand” on them. 

My favorite thing when I lived in the US, they had a warning on a bag of peanuts "Warning, contain peanuts".

______

Have anyone heard if GW will release the AOS app to the amazon android app store? Windows 11 will support that store and it would be neat to see your rules on a surface pro/windows tablet...

[PrimeElectrid]

So where exactly did GW get the data from for this SCE points update for these unreleased models?

[boyadventurer]

7 minutes ago, Howdyhedberg said:

Can you explain what this is? I thought you could only do 1 ward save?

It's about when you can add on as many +1 to save buffs on a unit as you have access to. The save itself can never be increased beyond +1, but any extras you add on will negate rend. So like a unit of Libs (4+ save) with shields (+1 save) with all out defense (+1 save) ends up as a 3+ save, ignoring 1 point of rend.

[Mutton]

2 hours ago, Chikout said:

Faq aimed to boost weaker units coming in December. 

So the entire Gloomspite range.

[pnkdth]

Clearly it is going to be all Chorfs.

[Overread]

53 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

I have never quite understood how the God of sex, drugs and rock and roll is less popular than the Gods of nerds, flus, or being angry all the time? Of course I prefer undivided as I like to mix and match my narrative elements and motivations, but if I were to choose a god the one offering pleasure would be the obvious forerunner... Tzeentch is a close runner up but I do not know if I would enjoy having feathery mutations and strange tentacles. 
 

Slaanesh was less popular, esp for a lot of newerish fans, because around End Times through to the start of AoS, Slaanesh basically had no mode releases. In 40K they'd not had any Noise Marines or such either, so both sides of the coin Slaanesh had been left adrift for a fairly long while compared to the other 3 Chaos Gods. When through End Times to AoS starting up we saw the 4 Gods split into different armies and yet whilst the others got some stuff, Slaanesh still lagged. They didn't even get a new Keeper until very late compared to the others. 

Wargames are laso long term investments for gamers and an army that hasn't had anything in a long while whilst its comparable kind have kind of sends a "maybe this army is going to vanish/be removed/be merged" so that discourages people. And it can often go hand in hand with less powerful/interesting rules. 

 

 

So I'm not surprised Slaanesh had drifted into being less and less popular. 

However after that its hard to judge army popularity because most wargamers go on what's local to them and what wins/attends tournaments. So its fully possible for an army that isn't perhaps top tier at events, to actually be popular in model sales but for people not to realise. Just because its not popular where they are and because its not placing nor appearing much at events. 

[Chaos Shepard]

For that December balance patch, one simple fix that I would like to see them implement would be to drop all mandatory artifacts and command traits from sub factions.

[Sorrow]

I have been in WHFB/40K for almost 18 years. Chaos player first and foremost. Managed to gather pretty much every Chaos lore book out there.  It is very clear that Slaanesh has never been GW favorite god, so to speak. Nurgle and Tzeentch have a coherent philosophy and I would even use word theology for them. Khorne is relatively straightforward. Of all Chaos gods, Slaanesh is the only one of infinite possibilities, which is quite paradoxical given how Slaanesh has been treated in WHFB/40K/AOS.  That is to say, Slaanesh has been the neglected one since day one. Over the years, I read and saw explorations of Slaanesh by various fans and while most were below average, some were excellent. That is the thing with Slaanesh, a good dosage of creativity is required to truly make Slaanesh shine.

I did not pull that perfume/fragrance idea out of nothing. Years ago, I read a blog where one woman was writing a incredible lore for existing but also completely new daemons and mortals, with accompanying artwork for each hero, unit and monster. In her own words, she took a concept, in this case, the olfactory sense, and explored it in context of Slaanesh. I curse myself for not saving her lore and art, for she deleted he r blog and I was never able to find it again. Slaanesh is a deity of everything, for everything can be taken to excess. 

But to give a example that all of you can read right now. 

A Slaaneshi Kurnoth: http://hgpowell.blogspot.com/2014/05/the-woods-of-bloody-thorns-slaaneshs.html

[micahaphone]

I'm not a stormcast player, but that dragon points change seems good? Like, now an "oops all dragons" list will now be solely for the big dragon lovers, not also the competitive focused. But mixing 1-3 dragons into a normal stormcast list? That could still be p good.

 

 

Also we can all be excited for GW to do balance adjustments pre-release instead of a month after release

[PJetski]

10 minutes ago, micahaphone said:

I'm not a stormcast player, but that dragon points change seems good? Like, now an "oops all dragons" list will now be solely for the big dragon lovers, not also the competitive focused. But mixing 1-3 dragons into a normal stormcast list? That could still be p good.

 

 

Also we can all be excited for GW to do balance adjustments pre-release instead of a month after release

Ironically this makes dragons much less useful in regular "mixed arms" stormcast tournament lists and doesn't do much to reduce their power in dragon spam lists. Classic GW blunder 

I would prefer if GW did balance adjustments before releasing their books, so they wouldn't have to make changes 3 weeks later. 

[Doko]

Mathammer showed as fulminators had 20% more damage in raw numbers than dragons and with old points had 50% more damage per points.

Now with this nerf there arent any reason to play dragons in place of fulminators as single unit.

Now only gonna be playable as a big unit of 6 with the double shooting of the hero.

So as allways gw nerf them due to spam,and result?spam isnt nerfed but now they arent competitive as single unit because other unit in the same tome is better doing the same job and for 100 less points.

 

Im so glad that i couldnt buy my one box of dragons before this knejerk overnerf.

A good nerf would have been a change to the hero ca of a double shooting to only a reroll 1 hit or something as that

[Bosskelot]

4 hours ago, DoctorPerils said:

Yeah, from what I've understood they aren't bad per se, however they are overly complex for someone new to AoS... Like me XD

They're just very bland and boring. While Lumineth are perhaps overly complex, they're at least flavourful and many of their units sell the fantasy they're trying to represent. The Hurakan actually act like you'd expect horse-archer type units to act; hit-and-run parthian style tactics. The Blissbarb Seekers on the other hand do not. They have nothing going for them. No interesting mechanic to make the concept come to life. They go really fast and can shoot.

That's the issue with the Slaanesh book.

[The Brotherhood of Necros]

Beautiful models, well worth the wait. As someone who collects the figures that they love the look of and plays friendly games for fun, I can’t wait to get a few and bring some dragons to the tabletop! 

[yukishiro1]

You can't easily fix the Slaanesh book, the whole thing is built around the fundamentally badly designed but very strong summoning ability that informs all the other choices made. The summoning needs to be nerfed and everything else scaled up, but that means basically doing a rewrite of the whole thing. 

[Benkei]

6 hours ago, Doko said:

Only saying as spanish,this happened in a spanish tournament but it is something supported only for the tournament organizers and that dude team,every spanish people is against this and is the reason that many players refused to play against this dude.

Many of us gave our opinion against this in their social media but these organizers are a little special(i dont call them the word that start with r and end with d). Per example in this tournament they had rules against piracy.......and they didnt let players use these copys(some players played with 500\1000 less points in their army). This is fine and are rules that people must follow,but the problem was that many other players could play with his pirate minis because they were bougth to a store that was a supporter of the tournament,so many players with pirated minis couldnt played but if you had pirated minis bougth in the "gante" store that was a support of the tournament then even if the rules says that you cant use pirated minis in the tournament you could do with zero problems.

So these organizers were the fault and it isnt a "spanish" tournament,is fault of the people of "invasion talavera" and "cobrador del wagg" who were the organizers of this disaster of tournament.

Ohh btw this same tournament where people paid 60€ to play had some tables without tapet and only playing in a table in the bar with almost no ligth where many old peoples coulnt play because they cant see,but these organizers wanted be the proud(as they have been stating in every social media) organizers of the biggest warhammer tournament even if people paid to play in tables with no ligth and with (im not joking) painttables or even foodcans!!! As scenary and withput even a tapet

Except the minis sold by the associated store were NOT allowed neither, so don't spread misinformation and hate pretending you are against hate. 

Edited November 19, 2021 by Benkei

[zilberfrid]

8 hours ago, Neverchosen said:

Thank you for sharing, it was important for Games Workshop to make this statement in light of recent events. But more broadly I think it is clear that Games Workshop needs to make this statement more apparent in general, as the messaging is often lost in their fiction and on their fandom.

Satire at it's most polemical often carries the largest burden. From Johnathan Swift's A Modest Proposal to The Colbert Report, there is always the possibility that people cannot differentiate satire from reality. I cannot understand how hate groups feel so utterly vindicated by a story and narrative designed specifically to criticize their specific beliefs, yet here we are. But I also think that burden falls on GW with things like the over representation and romanticism of Space Marines and the Imperium in their marketing, narratives and also within their actual releases.  But this is truly endemic to so many other fan cultures and geek spaces, but seems to be a larger issue within the Warhammer community than most.

Also a huge thanks to the mods on this site for being such lovely, positive and accepting people. They have really made this community a positive one and I am happy to be a part of it.

Wow this is amazing although I must confess I was thinking of simply starting one of those 40K armies for the sake of learning a new system and was being a little tongue in cheek. But if I had half your kitbash abilities, I would quickly grab the Ossiarch and Necron boxes and create Bone Construct Necrons and Chamon themed Ossiarchs... 

Thanks, your ideas are always a major source of inspiration and I truly love hearing more of your developing narrative. I am still planing on doing a more formal post on the narrative board about my own armies. But I am also trying to develop some overarching narrative for the surrounding regions alongside my friends. Namely I do not want my little narrative to feel like it exists entirely within a vacuum. Working right now on developing my friend's Tzeentch army and the idea of the Mortal Leader being a chronomancer as he uses a converted thousand sons lord as his general. 

It's good that they reminded themselves and their players Space Marines are also supposed to be satire. That isn't in the recent depictions of them, making them just a glorification of space fascists.

As for the kitbash, one model is never a problem, it's doing that 40 times.

[Copywolf]

So take this with a bucket of salt but I saw on reddit a comment about a 4chan leak for some AoS future releases. I took a couple screenshots from Reddit.  Am I able to post those?

Edit: Read the rules and it seems to be okay? Mods, let me know if this is not okay.

 

 

Edited November 19, 2021 by Copywolf
Adding screenshots for reference

[Doko]

50 minutes ago, Benkei said:

Except the minis sold by the associated store were NOT allowed neither, so don't spread misinformation and hate pretending you are against hate. 

Im sorry but you are who is liying,but this is a rumour tread,so if people want find who is liying only look im the web for "gante" "gt talavera" and read opinions of people to find it

 

Edited November 19, 2021 by Doko