The Rumour Thread

[Jamopower]

1 hour ago, DantePQ said:

Why everyone is so into argument that Order got more then Death it's true but Dwarf player wasn't interested in Sylvaneth etc. Order is huge and will get more models then other factions but there are hardly any Order players usually.This argument is flawed. There are number of factions that unlike Death have dated minis and didn't get anything in years. Death got Shadespire (which could be used in AoS) got new hero and are getting huge BT soon that's a lot combined with their great and quite new range. 

 

I have been wondering this as well. It's not like that the Kharadron Overlord players are now rubbing their hands because they can include some medusas in their lists. Even for mixed order armies, which seem to be quite rare, the Daughters seem to be bit of a miss, as if it works anything like currently, the power is in the buffs that they get from other units and not so much of the good units in vacuum. Although of course the javelin harpies or bow medusas can be good units on their own as well. I wouldn't mind having similar book like Legion of Nagash for my mixed Order army. It's basically a new General's handbook, but just for Death.

[Starlight]

2 hours ago, Thomas Lyons said:

Possibly new terrain in the Aelf video?

Isn't that the Lord of the Rings ruins set though? Not sure, but it looks similar at least.

[AthlorianStoners]

Lol at when In December they release Battletome Fishmen and we all thought it was a joke.

Edited January 26, 2018 by AthlorianStoners

[Elmir]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/01/26/february-white-dwarf-preview/

This has me worried... Not even a mention of LoN, despite the cat being out of the bag due to the Aussie AoS app leaks. 

[Burf]

Yunno, whenever talk of GAs getting too many releases come up, it's interesting that no one ever really acknowledges that Chaos has actually gotten, kit for kit, more new releases than order has in the past year and change(heh, pun). If anyone needs to take a backseat it's chaos.

[Envyus]

14 minutes ago, Burf said:

Yunno, whenever talk of GAs getting too many releases come up, it's interesting that no one ever really acknowledges that Chaos has actually gotten, kit for kit, more new releases than order has in the past year and change(heh, pun). If anyone needs to take a backseat it's chaos.

Order needs it too I would say. 

[NurglesFirstChosen]

Chaos, death and order all have a new battletome (or an imminent release). Destruction will have one before the summer, mark my words. 

[Turgol]

My main armies in both WH and AoS have been destruction related (large collection of orcs and goblins, now a complete Ironjaws one as well). I would recommend any destruction and death player to get used to the fact of order and chaos super over representation. It will never go away.

[Let's 'ere it for da boyz!]

5 hours ago, Rogue Explorator said:

Order continues its march of overshadowing all other GAs in large strides, getting another awesome release, after being the biggest GA to begin with, getting the best supported posterboy faction and then getting the greatest amount of non Stormcast releases. The gap in support between GAs is a jawning chasm by now. Yes, aelves where due, but at this point I really hope Tyrion and Malerion are actually part of the same faction, so GW can just let Order fall back for a bit after putting them out and let the other GAs at least catch up a little.

I agree with most of what you said, but this paragraph sticks in my craw a bit.  

Firstly, I would argue that Chaos, not Order has seen the most support from GW ‘recently’.  AoS releases all but dried up as 40k 8th got the spotlight.  But before they did, over the last year, the releases have been:  Nurgle, Kharadron, Blades of Khorne, SCE Vanguard and Tzeentch.  

Second, there is definitely a disparity in support between the alliances as illustrated above.  However, Order vs Chaos is the main conflict in the Mortal Realms and -quite frankly - those are the models that sell.  GW would be stupid not to continue developing and selling models in those ranges.  

I dislike how there always seems to be a significant chunk of the fan base that complains about how they didn’t get what they wanted whenever a new release pops up.    

“Ugh...MORE Stormcast.”  ?

Choose a new faction to collect that IS actively supported rather than whinging about what you might not/probably won’t ever have.

Edited January 26, 2018 by Let's 'ere it for da boyz!

[Tiger]

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/2711

Scrolls for the new characters (shared from dakka).

 

 

Edited January 26, 2018 by Tiger

[Infeston]

24 minutes ago, Let's 'ere it for da boyz! said:

I dislike how there always seems to be a significant chunk of the fan base that complains about how they didn’t get what they wanted whenever a new release pops up.    

I also dislike that there is always a huge chunk of people telling the complainers to shut up. Even though the conflict is Chaos vs Order it doesn't have to mean that all other factions are completely neglected. I don't understand why people always have to tell people that they should stop whining or that they are too whiney. It is always the same:

People complain about the lack of releases and after that there are people complaining about the complainers. And after that there are people that are like me, who complain about people who complain about the complaining of others. And the circle goes on. 

Why not share a little empathy with the frustration of some people? I totally understand why some people who are collecting Death and Destruction feel bad. And their voices should be heard. 

 

If you look at the aelves release video, the video starts with "You wanted aelves", which means GW clearly heard the complaints about aelves and reacted to it. So it does mean that all the complaints had an effect!

I think we should be empathic to the people complainig and stand together as a community. And this also means standing up for the people and saying: "You know what, man. I know it is hard and you wished for something more and I can totally understand your frustration". And not instead tell the people they are a whiney bunch and should stop complaining that their faction didn't get any love. We as players should stick together and not take the side of the company when customers are complaining about something. 

[Rogue Explorator]

3 hours ago, DantePQ said:

Why everyone is so into argument that Order got more then Death it's true but Dwarf player wasn't interested in Sylvaneth etc. Order is huge and will get more models then other factions but there are hardly any Order players usually.This argument is flawed. There are number of factions that unlike Death have dated minis and didn't get anything in years. Death got Shadespire (which could be used in AoS) got new hero and are getting huge BT soon that's a lot combined with their great and quite new range. 

 

Because the GAs are not just army, but also a collective of similar style, appeal and place in the lore. If what you want is a "people" faction you are absolutely spoiled for choices with the wide range of miniatures order inherited from the World-That-Was and the many releases the GA has gotten.

 

Now, all those are wonderful miniatures and releases, but they do not hit the "spot" a Destruction or Death release would.

 

I can only speak for myself here, but when I truly discovered AoS (I have been a long time in and out of the hobby, but it took some time before I gave AoS a proper look) I fell in love with the overall style and  the creative work GW is pouring into each new release. Looking over the existing range and what came with End times, I actually quite quickly knew Death would be "my" GA. But I wanted an AoS army and to this day almost everything in AoS Death is really still just one Warhammer Fantasy army.

That was in late 2016. I thought then that Death may still be over a year away, so I tried busying myself with Tzeentch, knowing it was reasonably close, but in the end just was not really "feeling" it. Quite early in 2017 we got the first teaser for Malign Portents, along with the info about the Knight of Shrouds (then likely the first "pure" AoS mini) and a rough timescale.

So I prepared myself for a proper Death release would soonest be late 2017 just before MP.

As 2017 reached its close, we got the realization that there would be no Death that year, but at the end of 2017 the MP teasers gave a silver lining. Then came the Nurgle announcement, telling us that new Death would come earliest some time after the MP announcement. Then, as MP starts to pick up some steam narratively, we get the first Morathi teasers and an elf release. And just in line with that, some new rumormongers get confirmed that do not have any Death on their screen until summer. So already not expecting any Death at all before Q2, it is propably now a good idea to redjust that further to Q3 2018.

And all the while GW is teasing Death, via Shadespire lore, via Malign Portents teasers (that, remember, saw their first appearance quite early in 2017).

 

Really, I am still full of praise for what GW has been doing with AoS so far, but I think it is understandable that those of us who have their heart set on Death are a bit ruffled by now.

 

27 minutes ago, Let's 'ere it for da boyz! said:

I agree with most of what you said, but this paragraph sticks in my craw a bit. 

I am afraid the sticking in the craw is mutual, so I am taking a step-by-step in my answers. Hopefully we can clear the air a bit.

29 minutes ago, Let's 'ere it for da boyz! said:

Firstly, I would argue that Chaos, not Order has seen the most support from GW ‘recently’.  AoS releases all but dried up as 40k 8th got the spotlight.  But before they did, over the last year, the releases have been:  Nurgle, Kharadron, Blades of Khorne, SCE Vanguard and Tzeentch. 

This one really only works when talking about 40k as well. I am talking AoS specifically (for 40k, lets just consider how long Chaos has been on the backburner in that setting). Talking actual new miniatures released for AoS, nobody has gotten as much and particularly as much variety as Order.

33 minutes ago, Let's 'ere it for da boyz! said:

Second, there is definitely a disparity in support between the alliances as illustrated above.  However, Order vs Chaos is the main conflict in the Mortal Realms and -quite frankly - those are the models that sell.  GW would be stupid not to continue developing and selling models in those ranges. 

It has been the main conflict so far, and (propably not) concidentially it is the conflict between the two GAs that went into AoS with the biggest range to start with. And lets not forget that almost everything released up till nearly now has gone into developement before GW even found out what actually sells in AoS. Most factions released for AoS so far did not even exist before, I really do not see how the "biggest seller" argument can be brought up here. Meanwhile, judging by release frequenzy, Dark Elves, High Elves, Skaven, Vampire Counts and Empire where some of Fantasys biggest sellers, yet none of them saw support in the infancy of AoS. The argument does not even hold water for Extremis Chamber and Vanguard Chamber, those must have started developementment before AoS even hit the stores.

We also do know some big AoS sellers that will not see developement anytime soon, GW publicised allegiance abilities for popular (i.e. selling) factions in GHB 2017. They include Nighthaunt and Soulblight.

50 minutes ago, Let's 'ere it for da boyz! said:

I dislike how there always seems to be a significant chunk of the fan base that complains about how they didn’t get what they wanted whenever a new release pops up.    

“Ugh...MORE Stormcast.”  ?

Which is not really the issue we are talking about here. You could even say I am complaining that GW is releasing something I want with DoK, all the while teasing something I want even more, because I could not possibly afford both in the same year.

50 minutes ago, Let's 'ere it for da boyz! said:

Choose a new faction to collect that IS actively supported rather than whinging about what you might not/probably won’t ever have.

I did, picked up Tzeentch. It did not work out for me. Meanwhile, it is not like we do not know Death factions are coming.

 

I hope this helps explain my (and maybe some others) perspective.

[Still-young]

2 hours ago, Elmir said:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/01/26/february-white-dwarf-preview/

This has me worried... Not even a mention of LoN, despite the cat being out of the bag due to the Aussie AoS app leaks. 

Just means it might be the 2nd half of Feb - they don’t always show everything coming in the next month in WD. 

[AthlorianStoners]

I feel like the people complaining are doing so in a fair, reasonable and quality manner. 

Its not “oh GW sucks they’re the devil etc etc” it’s more “damn DoK are cool, I wish the stuff I like got cool stuff”. The caption at the start indicates GW are listening, so people making noise about what they want seems to be a good way to go.

[Let's 'ere it for da boyz!]

45 minutes ago, Infeston said:

People complain about the lack of releases and after that there are people complaining about the complainers. And after that there are people that are like me, who complain about people who complain about the complaining of others. And the circle goes on. 

Hahaha.  Fair play and point taken.

[Ryan Taylor]

Ok so I did a bit of analysis based on current battletomes comparing it to 8th edition (or WHFB) here is the breakdown. (this is not taking into considerations of the 3 battletomes that were released and then replaced.)

WHFB

Chaos - 27%

Order - 47%

Death - 13%

Destruction - 13%

AoS*

Chaos - 35%

Order - 35%

Death - 7%

Destruction - 21%

Not including the new DoK 

 

So if anything Order needs more books, Death needs a little more and Destruction should not see a book for a while, Chaos is almost spot on. 

 

We notice it more in this game that's 2.5 years old than we ever did in WHFB. 

 

 

[RuneBrush]

5 hours ago, Elmir said:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/01/26/february-white-dwarf-preview/

This has me worried... Not even a mention of LoN, despite the cat being out of the bag due to the Aussie AoS app leaks. 

I have a feeling that the whole MP/LoN/DoK has been brought forward in scheduling for some reason.  WD is written 3 months in advance so even bringing something 1 month ahead would mean it's missed out of WD.  At least that's what I'm rationalising to myself!

[Infeston]

@Ryan Taylor You can't compare it this way. Before there were no alliances and there were just single armies. Also it does look different if you compare factors such as unit sizes etc.

But now GW has decided to divide the forces in 4 alliances, which all take part in the campaigns and affect the outcomes of the battle. It is a different state the game is in now.

The optimal ratio would be 25% for every grand alliance. 

Also what excatly did you compare? Did you compare how many books the alliances had? Or how many units?

Edited January 26, 2018 by Infeston

[KillagoreFaceslasha]

2 hours ago, Still-young said:

Just means it might be the 2nd half of Feb - they don’t always show everything coming in the next month in WD. 

I think it means it's coming out at the very beginning of this month and it's a fairly short release window. Me thinks.

[Captain Marius]

Last year we saw kharadrons early on but they werent all released til May. Id expect the same with DoK.

I dont get this idea that the 4 GAs should be equal in any way either, theyve not been since they were made up.

I do think GW should give each faction their own goals in any global campaign, as saying eg SE and DoK want the same thing is lazy, even if they are grouped in the same GA.

I also dont like the constant reference to Death players or Order players etc. We're all warhammer players, we're not entitled to anything based on whatever random alliance of factions weve chosen. Just enjoy the release ride! 

Or, if GW dont release any AoS battletomes for 8 months straight like last year, causing games to dry up in your area like they have in mine, have a moan that their overall release schedule has opportunities for improvement!

My view: all new stuff is good, at regular intervals bring it on!

[SeanMaguire1991]

Sure is a lot of complaining here as opposed to you know rumours

[Sleboda]

5 hours ago, Infeston said:

I also dislike that there is always a huge chunk of people telling the complainers to shut up. Even though the conflict is Chaos vs Order it doesn't have to mean that all other factions are completely neglected. I don't understand why people always have to tell people that they should stop whining or that they are too whiney.

QFT.

[Sleboda]

2 hours ago, Infeston said:

The optimal ratio would be 25% for every grand alliance. 

Out of curiosity, why?

I mean, other than it's a neat and even break down, what makes this optimal?

 

BTW - I would combine my quotes/replies into one if there were SOME sort of forum usage instructions on how to do this.  Awesome place to be, here, but a lot of assuming that we know how to use this particular piece of software.

Edited January 27, 2018 by Sleboda

[VBS]

3 hours ago, Ryan Taylor said:

Ok so I did a bit of analysis based on current battletomes comparing it to 8th edition (or WHFB) here is the breakdown. (this is not taking into considerations of the 3 battletomes that were released and then replaced.)

WHFB

Chaos - 27%

Order - 47%

Death - 13%

Destruction - 13%

AoS*

Chaos - 35%

Order - 35%

Death - 7%

Destruction - 21%

Not including the new DoK 

 

So if anything Order needs more books, Death needs a little more and Destruction should not see a book for a while, Chaos is almost spot on. 

 

We notice it more in this game that's 2.5 years old than we ever did in WHFB. 

 

 

Different games with a very different way of organizing armies. Why should this be taken as a reference? 

Moreover, the analysis doesn't seem to take into account that WHFB did not have the concept of Alliances, and that some armies in a certain "alliance category in WHFB" (if that even existed) does not translate into AoS (like Dark Elves, as a sort of example) or armies that simply don't exist anymore (like Bretonnia). On top of that, AoS breaks down into several battletomes the equivalent of some single WHFB armies (chaos or orcs), keep others under a single tome (seraphon) or adds new ones (KO). AoS is also still under expansion and will continue to do so, whereas WHFB is a finished product, making the comparison even more random throughout time.   

I don't see the point or how can a reasonable comparison be drawn between both. Also join Sleboda on the comment about the 25% ratio... are all GA supposed to be equal in terms of numbers? Did hear GW say anything about that...

I have the impression they just update armies according to a mix of whatever the studio wants to do (as it was the case before), model-line update/expansion requirement and studio fluff-direction-requirement, without taking into account an hypothetical equality between GA, sooooo the imbalance in terms of numbers is likely gonna be there forever.

[Ryan Taylor]

I did not say this was perfect. I did not say it was in depth analysis. Just analysis. If you look at the breakdown of armies vs allegiances you get a nice look at how GW saw these races over the years. Now they have changed I had you that. The game is changed but to assume that each grand alliance is going to be fair is naive at best. GW is going to sell what is popular. They are going to experiment within the  confines of what they want to and what they think will sell. They are a publicly traded company so the only way they get to take a gamble is if they are sure they can recoup the costs. Does this mean they wont have a flop? I am sure they will at some point. (Not sure where.)

Is it fair that most of the battletomes released have been Order? Chaos? Death being left rotting? Destruction who? TBH I think GW doesn't give a second thought which grand alliance they belong to. Can they create a marketable product that they are passionate about, and will it make them money and be IP covered? Yes? Then proceed.   

Allies were part of the 8th edition rules. Just no one used them.

So I would love to be wrong but I can guess we will see this disparity for a long time. There will be people with genuine gripes about all the compendium stuff going away and then different races not being supported 15 years down the line but trying to get everyone a participation award will lead to less product that sells and that just removes the game from our hands (in 30 years or so) and replaces it with a new game for the cycle to begin.