Warhammer - The Old World

[Morglum StormBasha]

So mixed feelings about the orcs and goblins reveal.

one the one hand I am ecstatic about a made to order of the marauder giant and the shaman on wyvern…

on the other hand I am disappointed that the rumoured plastic wyvern kit doesn’t exist. 
 

— got my rulebooks today and the timeline and lore sections have given huge prominence to Cathay. I’d be hugely suprised if Cathay, Kislev and Norse done make factions 10-12 in the long run… (eg next 5 years)

 

the rulebooks are beautiful 

also very happy that my Troll Hag and forgeworld units are getting rules. 

[Baz]

Any info on when the legacy army pdfs are going to be released? 

[Clan's Cynic]

19 minutes ago, Baz said:

Any info on when the legacy army pdfs are going to be released? 

I would guess Monday, since WarCom usually only drops PDFs on weekdays and they seem to have Monday as the TOW day (as opposed to Thursday for Heresy).

We know influencers have them already, so I can't imagine we'll be waiting long now the game is officially out.

Edited January 20 by Clan's Cynic

[Whitefang back me up]

On 1/14/2024 at 8:26 PM, Ejecutor said:

It can be just a little tease to start building hype around the next factions. Also, this is not @Whitefang, but @Whitefang back me up. He still has to prove himself as rumour rumour-monger.

We’ll we’ll we’ll

orks and goblins 

avatar of the rat god is coming. 

[Ejecutor]

Just now, Whitefang back me up said:

We’ll we’ll we’ll

orks and goblins 

avatar of the rat god is coming. 

Just change yourself the name to credit you if that happens 😄

[Ogregut]

I've missed writing army lists like this!! 

[Tonhel]

1 hour ago, Gareth 🍄 said:

Drew a larger crowd than the launch of 10th edition 40K apparently.

Loved Darren his painting vids. He is also a great sculptor. It's exciting to hear that everything is pointing to a huge succes! 

[Hollow]

1 hour ago, Sception said:

What do you use for that?  Last time I tried, I found the converters I used couldn't handle GW epubs, always ended up with messed up formatting.  Haven't tried in a long while, though.

I used Adobe as I have it for work. There are dozens of free programs avalible which you can use to convert. Just google epub to pdf converter. 

[Ogregut]

Just realised there are no ogres in the orc and goblin list even tho they are releasing the classic ogre models. 

Guess they must be in the arcane journal lists. 

[Noserenda]

6 hours ago, Hollow said:

Which is demonstrably not the case. You don't generate a quarter of a billion pounds in revenue over 6 months by not making anything. 

 

Yes. You may notice they make quite a lot of things? Without knowing how many of a thing they made though. It selling out is a worthless figure, you literally can't solve the equation

 

 

 

No they didn't. Empire was always one of the biggest selling factions in Fantasy, The Imperium of man (and it's multiple human-based subfactions) are 40k biggest selling "faction" and Marines are literally the biggest selling product liine and they are... super humans. Every bit of information we have and any metric we have access to shows that human-based factions were, are and will continue to be the main profit drivers for all of GW games. Because they sell more than everyone else. 

This is simply untrue, you are wrong about Empire and you are wildly misleading about 40k. The imperium isnt popular, Space marines are, and it's not even vaguely close, they've previously made up half gws sales in total, let alone 40k and are at best debateably human aesthetic wise.

Meanwhile, from extensive sales experience I can tell you first hand the human Warhammer armies were never top sellers, certainly in the 00's, Empire was kinda mid table and Bret's were bottom, in fact I'd be surprised if my shop ever sold any.

But don't take my word for it, Alan Merret confirmed as much in his Jordan Sorcery interview, and he's one of the best people to know. (Though I was surprised he put elves ahead of vampires)

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Hollow said:

You're definition of "low" effort seems to be pretty far removed from realities definition of it. There has been plenty showing the care, work and attention put into the system and the faction releases. The O+G release has over 20 kits returning. Which is more than some other companies aspire to release in an entire year for their entire games. 

Yes, low effort. Compared to any other game release gw makes nearly all of the work is already done.The miniatures are already concepted, designed, produced and in most cases previously released.

Compared to a truly new game or a range refresh they have shaved years of work off, it's an absolute bargain for the company as nearly all the work that does need doing is writers, who are on average pretty cheap. (Which kinda sucks but hey).

low effort is actually a good thing here though, because Warhammer was never going to come back as a complete revamp or anywhere near as fast as some people are naively assuming...BUT IT IS COMING BACK and that's pretty good overall, it's just going to be patchy for a few years, just like every other release from Specialist games has been.

 

Well. Except Titanicus, the best game SGS makes

[Doko]

8 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

But don't take my word for it, Alan Merret confirmed as much in his Jordan Sorcery interview, and he's one of the best people to know. (Though I was surprised he put elves ahead of vampires)

 

yup i was looking for the vid where i read this. but empire was one of the less sold armys in fantasy even if they were the favorite army of many fantasy designers and said by this boss of gw,they tried push the sales of empire giving them more units that other armys and more plastic kits but this didnt worked.

the top seller was warrior of caos,then high elfs and dwarfs,then many others mixed and at the botton empire,bretonian and khemri

 

also we dont know if tow have been a success or not,they produced very SMALL amount of boxes and these sold out fast.

but this dont mean nothing.

they could have done only one box of each and these dudes think that was a success because  was sold out.

we know that many stores only had ONE box delivered,sell one box by each store is a huge success? i dont think so

Edited January 21 by Doko

[Hollow]

14 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

This is simply untrue, you are wrong about Empire and you are wildly misleading about 40k.

No it is not. No I am not. and again... no I am not.

14 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

The imperium isnt popular,

Yeah... ok. 

15 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

they've previously made up half gws sales in total

This is forum talk that has been taken and repeated so often that it has become "fact". There has never been confirmation of this. What you have read on Warseer and Dakka isn't gospel. 

 

16 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

best debateably human aesthetic wise.

So what would you "debate" they are then? Orks? Elves? Dwarves? Reptiles? I'd say the super humans that look like humans, are written about as humans, operate as humans and are tasked with defending humanity are.... infact, human. 

18 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

Alan Merret

In the interview he said that the sales were dissapointing, which is not the same as being bad. They were dissapointing because of the amount of resources they allocated to them. As a side note Rountree giving Merrett the boot was one of the best things that happened to the company in 2016. (Which coincidentaly was the beginning of GWs meteoric rise in value) 

26 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

Meanwhile, from extensive sales experience I can tell you first hand the human Warhammer armies were never top sellers, certainly in the 00's

As someone who had a trade account in the early 00's I consider my direct sales experience to be completely irrelevant to how GW operates today. It's such a different company. (Although WOC, HE and Empire were the top 3 in my experience) 

 

Anyways... this is all off topic and irrelevant. 

[Jefferson Skarsnik]

7 hours ago, Jefferson Skarsnik said:

I painted up a test scheme Swordmaster in the week and couldn't believe how easy it was compared to the wardens and sentinels I've done. I just...painted some straight lines for the armour trim then painted some silver rectangles for the armour, gryph charger grey and it was like 70% done. The instances of "****** I spilled over into an intricate detail I'd already painstakingly finished" were almost 0.

OK I jinxed myself, it took me a long time to get the sword shading right and the eyes on these are harder to pick out than the newer models. But I'm still a liiittle bit more optimistic I can get through 17 more of these

 

[Big Kim Woof-Woof]

Something that I couldn't stop myself thinking about at 4am when I couldn't sleep: what was the Orc Shaman on Wyvern's name in the scenario that came in the Fourth Edition box? I keep thinking Sharptooth... but I think I'm getting mixed up with The Land Before Time! Any fellow old farts remember? 

[The Red King]

Anyone smarter than me explain what happens when a unit is joined by a character who has terror? The rule clearly states it doesn't make them immune to terror but do they still cause it when they declare a charge or get charged? If so is it the characters unit strength or the units? The book clearly says characters unit strength is added to the unit but it doesn't state vice versa for this particular example.

[Black_Templar_Lad]

8 hours ago, Gareth 🍄 said:

Drew a larger crowd than the launch of 10th edition 40K apparently.

That is an amazing surprise if true. A Specialist supported game drew in a larger gathering than 10th Edition launch?! Well well well....

Has anyone given their impressions of the day? I've not seen anything yet. 

[Marcvs]

24 minutes ago, Black_Templar_Lad said:

That is an amazing surprise if true. A Specialist supported game drew in a larger gathering than 10th Edition launch?! Well well well....

Has anyone given their impressions of the day? I've not seen anything yet. 

Square based got you covered

 

[Marcvs]

8 hours ago, Ogregut said:

I've missed writing army lists like this!! 

In case you want a digital alternative (not yet perfect but getting there)

https://old-world-builder.com/

[Black_Templar_Lad]

24 minutes ago, Marcvs said:

Square based got you covered

 

Haha cheers mate, I was literally about to post this, just finished this a few minutes ago.

That has made me feel the hype. To see Rob so excited and his really positive experience, the giant queues, the community there, what a wonderful sight to see.

I especially loved the museum esque timeline showcase of the Old World, and Robs note of kids asking their parents what happened on certain dates. It's a nice thought that yes, ToW is probably aimed at the older players and generations, but there's always a new generation, and they're seeing the same (and new) things that filled us with wonder when we first got into the hobby, and that can only be good for the hobby.

An hour wait for the shop?! And apparently the staff were shocked with the numbers.

Guarantee that will send a ripple up through management. 

I'm absolutely guttered my books haven't been dispatched yet, but boy am I excited.

[Tonhel]

6 hours ago, Doko said:

yup i was looking for the vid where i read this. but empire was one of the less sold armys in fantasy even if they were the favorite army of many fantasy designers and said by this boss of gw,they tried push the sales of empire giving them more units that other armys and more plastic kits but this didnt worked.

the top seller was warrior of caos,then high elfs and dwarfs,then many others mixed and at the botton empire,bretonian and khemri

 

also we dont know if tow have been a success or not,they produced very SMALL amount of boxes and these sold out fast.

but this dont mean nothing.

they could have done only one box of each and these dudes think that was a success because  was sold out.

we know that many stores only had ONE box delivered,sell one box by each store is a huge success? i dont think so

Lol, come on. You can't be serious about the bolded part. The amount of products GW made for TOW would have been enough to recover the initial cost and make a profit. It's a publicy traded company and not a charity. I am 99% certain they run the numbers and knew exactly how much they would need to produce/selll to make the investment back and make a profit. It can certainly be that that treshold was not really high and that the cost of the investment was not high.

But the treshold they had set was shattered in less than 12 hours. So for everything envolved with it from writers to management the launch of TOW is a succes.

You could certainly be correct about the low stock, but I would really be amazed if they made not enough stock to recoup the investment+profit.

Everything selling out is the only possible positive outcome. I mean what does it need to be called a succes for some posters here? Launch day at Nottingham was a succes. Atleast the same amount of people / interest as their flagship 40K.

GW is taking note, they know now that they can make some good money with it. 

I am not a tournament player and never will be, but it seems the TOW tournament at Adapticon was filled instantly and the waiting list is also maxed out. The hype is real.

[Ogregut]

2 hours ago, Big Kim Woof-Woof said:

Something that I couldn't stop myself thinking about at 4am when I couldn't sleep: what was the Orc Shaman on Wyvern's name in the scenario that came in the Fourth Edition box? I keep thinking Sharptooth... but I think I'm getting mixed up with The Land Before Time! Any fellow old farts remember? 

Wasn't it Old Blacktoof? 

 

57 minutes ago, Marcvs said:

In case you want a digital alternative (not yet perfect but getting there)

https://old-world-builder.com/

Thanks I'll check it out. There is something fun about writing army lists with pen and paper tho! 

[Public Universal Duardin]

I'm genuinely surprised by the doom and gloom surrounding the game, especially on TGA. Despite it being a Specialist Game, and GW being GW, I've genuinely not been this hyped about anything Warhammer related in a while. It's Warhammer Fantasy! Just like I remember it! And they're bringing old models back, in metal, that I'd have to sell my kidney for on ebay! Maybe I'm simple but to me that's enough to deter the existential dread of our world irl, at least for a while.

I feel there's a certain apprehension towards TOW on these forums, but if I'd go to the WHFB Reddit communities I'd instead have to see people slagging AoS. Which I don't want either! Maybe things will eventually balance out when/if we get the TOW subforums and people realise its OK to be fans to both.

[Big Kim Woof-Woof]

22 minutes ago, Ogregut said:

Wasn't it Old Blacktoof? 

That was it! Cheers! 

[Black_Templar_Lad]

3 minutes ago, Public Universal Duardin said:

I'm genuinely surprised by the doom and gloom surrounding the game, especially on TGA. Despite it being a Specialist Game, and GW being GW, I've genuinely not been this hyped about anything Warhammer related in a while. It's Warhammer Fantasy! Just like I remember it! And they're bringing old models back, in metal, that I'd have to sell my kidney for on ebay! Maybe I'm simple but to me that's enough to deter the existential dread of our world irl, at least for a while.

I feel there's a certain apprehension towards TOW on these forums, but if I'd go to the WHFB Reddit communities I'd instead have to see people slagging AoS. Which I don't want either! Maybe things will eventually balance out when/if we get the TOW subforums and people realise its OK to be fans to both.

I think that'll come in time mate. Especially this forum, I've not had this feel-good vibe from a forum community since, well, ever. Sound mindedness will prevail.

What a time to be alive. Warhammer is bigger than ever now. LET'S GOOOOOO.

Yesterday marked the beginning of a glorious path, and it will be GLORIOUS!

 

[Bosskelot]

There's definitely plenty of legitimate criticism you can level about how GW has handled TOW so far and stuff you wish they would change their minds on, but I'm sorry TOW has been an objectively successful launch. The hype and enthusiasm for this game is incredibly large. They sold out almost everywhere within an hour of preorders going up. Non-preorder stock in the local stores around here was all gone by the end of release day. My LGS has said that the amount of preorder requests they had was 2nd only to new 40k editions and completely obliterated past ones like HH, AOS, KT, Warcry etc. Speaking of my LGS, they created a Facebook group for organizing games of TOW down there; it's been up for a week and already has 100 members. This is a LOCAL group for a LOCAL gaming store.

Saying "oh well they just didn't make lots of it so it wasn't that successful" well then I guess the Deathwing box is a giant flop because that's out of stock too.

What actually makes this doubly impressive is that this release focused on the two most unpopular armies in the game and it still, obviously, smashed GW's sales forecasts. We haven't even gotten to the big hitters like Greenskins, High Elves and Chaos yet.