The Rumour Thread

[Clan's Cynic]

1 hour ago, Chikout said:

What happened to this week's Dawnbringer story? Last week's article said we were getting one. 

WarCom intern might've just made a mistake since we've had all of the four titular Harbingers featured in one now. 

[Gitzdee]

Moved post here:

 

Edited July 7, 2023 by Gitzdee
Moved post

[Neverchosen]

I wonder if we will get an Oghram style campaign. I feel like even the most ardent Stormcast Fan would want to give the other army the win as AOS fans seem to really like to share the love within the community.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/07/07/global-battle-situation-report-the-end-draws-near/

Edited July 7, 2023 by Neverchosen

[Clan's Cynic]

2 hours ago, Neverchosen said:

I wonder if we will get an Oghram style campaign. I feel like even the most ardent Stormcast Fan would want to give the other army the win as AOS fans seem to really like to share the love within the community.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/07/07/global-battle-situation-report-the-end-draws-near/

I cynically disbelieve the scores are actually as close as GW would like us to believe, but a 80% 'honest' track for the Marines would be pretty boring for what is ultimately a mini-PR game. 

At least the AoS equivalent would actually be a bit up in the air as to who would win, since Stormcast don't have the enormous popularity disparity of Marines.  

[GhostShark]

9 hours ago, Gitzdee said:

 

I dont think a lot of new players choose to play an army with models that are ancient with no signs of new models in the future. 

Would new players know this though?

[Skreech Verminking]

13 hours ago, Hollow said:

up slots from ToW studio allotment, to free up space within the AoS range for more new AoS models

By tow do you suggest that the bonesplitters shall be an old world only army?

[bethebee]

4 hours ago, GhostShark said:

Would new players know this though?

New players are often told off from older armies by veteran players and most of the time it's very easy to tell something is old and hasn't aged well.  Even someone entirely new to wargames could tell you a Winterbite Ogor army looks off and clunky compared to a new Seraphon one.

[Gitzdee]

@bethebee beat me by a sec.

Edit: do want to add that some models/ subfactions can only be bought at a warhammer store or online.

If i want to buy another Arachnarok i couldnt even if i wanted to at the moment. 

Edited July 8, 2023 by Gitzdee

[Bigtoof]

15 hours ago, Hollow said:

That's exactly what I am advocating. Sorry untold legions of Bonesplitters players. You can still use your models. Still, buy the models. Still paint the models. Still read about them in the lore. But they will be sold under the ToW banner rather than the AoS banner. That is literally all I am suggesting. So that they take up slots from ToW studio allotment, to free up space within the AoS range for more new AoS models. 

Because Lumineth/Elves are one of the most popular fantasy archetypes? Have been given a NEW AoS identity and have huge room for expansion via Tyrion. Daughters of Khaine have been given a NEW AoS identity and have huge potential for expansion via Malerion and Sylvaneth have been given a NEW AoS identity with huge expansion opportunity via Kurnothi. 

I think it is in the best interest for AoS to keep its ranges, factions and lore tight. I personally think that just continually adding things without the balls to cut stuff makes for a bloated, mixed mess in the long run. We saw it happen with Fantasy and 40k is struggling to maintain 2000+ datasheets. I have said this before, but If I were head of the AoS Studio I would cut the bottom 10/20% "performing" units (in terms of age/sale/gameplay) of every Faction, each edition. They would be retired and moved into either ToW (if they fit) or Legends and go into a MTO rotation. 

I for one am very pleased you’re not in charge of the studio.

[Hollow]

4 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

By tow do you suggest that the bonesplitters shall be an old world only army?

Yeah. 

 

2 hours ago, Bigtoof said:

I for one am very pleased you’re not in charge of the studio.

 

Fair enough. It's fun to daydream about it. I suppose it is just a fundamental difference in design philosophy. Just to be clear. I'm not advocating for a reduction in ranges. I'm advocating for the ranges to have a sort of "hard cap" for product lines (which some factions like Cities and Stomcast have reached IMO I don't think factions need more than 50 active Battlescrolls).

If you take AoS as one large product line and the GW website as where Gw is at in terms of its offerings. You have about 600 or so total product listings under the AoS Banner. (There are multiple listings for the same product, but I think roughly 600 is about the size of the AoS total line allocation)  I would like to see a total of 60/100 total products "added to the line", but almost as many "removed" from the line as well. Keeping the total number of offerings around 600 or so. 

Others would like for the current 600 to stay and for new kits to be added so that each edition adds more and more. 

When it comes to creative space I am much more of a death/rebirth kinda fella. It's good to have a clear-out every so often. I've used this metaphor before, but it's just like maintaining and cultivating a Tree (or plants in general) it is good to prune and remove the dead weight. Keep it healthy, fresh, and vibrant. 

Now I'm just saying I think BS should be moved to TOW because they are from the OW. I also have 0 idea in regards to sale numbers. For all I know the BS might be shifting hundreds of kits a week and if I was privy to that information I would be singing an entirely different tune. It's just a subjective view of what I think works in a faction (mostly as it refers to the models as a "collection", not just as gaming bits.) 

Edited July 8, 2023 by Hollow

[Skreech Verminking]

19 minutes ago, Hollow said:

Yeah. 

 

 

Fair enough. It's fun to daydream about it. I suppose it is just a fundamental difference in design philosophy. Just to be clear. I'm not advocating for a reduction in ranges. I'm advocating for the ranges to have a sort of "hard cap" for product lines (which some factions like Cities and Stomcast have reached IMO I don't think factions need more than 50 active Battlescrolls).

If you take AoS as one large product line and the GW website as where Gw is at in terms of its offerings. You have about 600 or so total product listings under the AoS Banner. (There are multiple listings for the same product, but I think roughly 600 is about the size of the AoS total line allocation)  I would like to see a total of 60/100 total products "added to the line", but almost as many "removed" from the line as well. Keeping the total number of offerings around 600 or so. 

Others would like for the current 600 to stay and for new kits to be added so that each edition adds more and more. 

When it comes to creative space I am much more of a death/rebirth kinda fella. It's good to have a clear-out every so often. I've used this metaphor before, but it's just like maintaining and cultivating a Tree (or plants in general) it is good to prune and remove the dead weight. Keep it healthy, fresh, and vibrant. 

Now I'm just saying I think BS should be moved to TOW because they are from the OW. I also have 0 idea in regards to sale numbers. For all I know the BS might be shifting hundreds of kits a week and if I was privy to that information I would be singing an entirely different tune. It's just a subjective view of what I think works in a faction (mostly as it refers to the models as a "collection", not just as gaming bits.) 

If we are culling stuff, I think a good idea would be to start with the stormcast.

of course culling the few thousand of unit they have is probably something gw isn’t interesting in doing so, my general thought would be to just make the 3-5 units that all are the same thing do the same thing and are pretty much equipped the same, become a single warscroll.

for example: Liberators, sequitors and vindicators are all one now.

with the option of having hand weapons or spears as their primary weapons

[sandlemad]

33 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

If we are culling stuff, I think a good idea would be to start with the stormcast.

of course culling the few thousand of unit they have is probably something gw isn’t interesting in doing so, my general thought would be to just make the 3-5 units that all are the same thing do the same thing and are pretty much equipped the same, become a single warscroll.

for example: Liberators, sequitors and vindicators are all one now.

with the option of having hand weapons or spears as their primary weapons

This is an excellent idea and I think very different to outright binning whole factions. There’s a huge amount of redundancy in the stormcast range and by taking this approach you could comfortably slash a ton of warscrolls without having any effect on playstyle, background, army character, etc.

[MitGas]

19 minutes ago, sandlemad said:

This is an excellent idea and I think very different to outright binning whole factions. There’s a huge amount of redundancy in the stormcast range and by taking this approach you could comfortably slash a ton of warscrolls without having any effect on playstyle, background, army character, etc.

Yeah, SC could use some tidying up - and this way would be perfect, Skreech and sandlemad. 
 

to spin it even further and give GW an excuse to make SC more space marine-esque: they could make a single kit for those units in the future with different details (helmets eg) and weapons. The proportions would stay the same across the range but from what I know , 9/10 like the new sleeker SC better anyways. 
 

[xking]

I am not interested in removing any more models from the game. 

I don't even agree with removing stuff from the old world from the game either. Even if we get new Beast elves, I still don't think Wanderers should have been removed

Edited July 8, 2023 by xking

[xking]

The dwarf helicopters should stay in cities of Sigmar!

[Hollow]

1 hour ago, sandlemad said:

This is an excellent idea and I think very different to outright binning whole factions. 

There is a difference between thinking a product line made for the ToW, should be sold under the Old World Banner and AoS kits sold under a AoS banner to wanting something to be "binned". As I said, if the Bonesplitter sales are there, then GamesWorkshop should do a full Bonesplitter range refresh. I just fundamentally think, that apart from a few exceptions AoS should be moving away from ToW kits almost entirely. (Dark Elves, High Elves, Bonesplitters, BoC, Ogors, Skaven) all should be "AoSified".

If 4th edition is going to "bin" any kits I would bin the Endless Spell kits. Anyways... just my thoughts. AoS players can rest easy. I don't think the AoS studio will be under my control any time soon. 😅

[YoghurtKobold]

7 minutes ago, Hollow said:

Anyways... just my thoughts. AoS players can rest easy. I don't think the AoS studio will be under my control any time soon. 😅

So it stays in the hands of people who are binning whole game systems, armies and kits (recent WHU cuts) without prior notice? Great, Well thanks for nothing then.

[Chikout]

24 minutes ago, YoghurtKobold said:

So it stays in the hands of people who are binning whole game systems, armies and kits (recent WHU cuts) without prior notice? Great, Well thanks for nothing then.

The thing I'd say about this is that while it's definitely annoying GW has a better track record than they used to. (The recent edition of Aeronautica lasted longer than Gorkamorka for example) They also keep their products available for far longer than most other similar companies. A typical Lego kit lasts about 3 years. Pokémon and MTG cards go out of print all the time. 

The savage Orc box is 12 years old. Is there a single other plastic manufacturer that keeps things in print that long?

[novakai]

9 hours ago, bethebee said:

New players are often told off from older armies by veteran players and most of the time it's very easy to tell something is old and hasn't aged well.  Even someone entirely new to wargames could tell you a Winterbite Ogor army looks off and clunky compared to a new Seraphon one.

Bonesplitterz are also in a weird unappealing spot of having no plastic hero, lack of units and kit boxes, and stuff like the Big Stabbaz being hard to accrue because it leaves you with 16 savage Orruks.

while it can be fun batch painting the orcs and paint on warpaint, it really isn’t an army that hobbyist can enjoy. People who would completely collect this army are probably in the niche army competitive player sphere, that are probably willing to massively buy those   2 same kits to fill out every single options of Spear, sword,  bow, or dual weapon. most normal people aren’t willing to collect this type of army that far.

granted 40K players have use Bonesplitterz bits to convert their army into a Snakebite OrK army but it also a realistically niche way to use them as well.

[Bigtoof]

2 hours ago, Chikout said:

The savage Orc box is 12 years old. Is there a single other plastic manufacturer that keeps things in print that long?

I think the kit actually holds up quite well. There’s a lot that I like about, the way it goes together and joins for example are great, no need for sprue glue or liquid green stuff here - contrary to the new saurus.

The poses and sculpts I think make them nice and simple to paint albeit they could do with some more variety for sure. They look like proper orks, they aren’t too busy with mountains of cloth or stuff.

I’m not entirely sure on GWs logic on refreshing kits - Khorne Berzerkers I always believed to be a popular kit - they waited over twenty years for their refresh? 

I’m currently working on a small 1000pt Bonesplittaz army using the underworld warband to provide me with the hero’s I need. I do hope we don’t go the way of the dodo. 
 

[Gitzdee]

1 hour ago, novakai said:

granted 40K players have use Bonesplitterz bits to convert their army into a Snakebite OrK army but it also a realistically niche way to use them as well.

Beastsnaggas kinda filled this hole in the army for the most part. I was thinking about using savage orruks for 40k boyz and beastsnaggas as ardboyz though.

A box with 2 or 4 new big stabbas that dont look the same would also be welcome. Along with new heroes.

It was nice to paint savage orcs fast in whfb when u had to paint big blocks. But aos uses msu most of the time, no need for that anymore. I do still like the kit though. Its a clean design that does what it needs to do.

Edited July 8, 2023 by Gitzdee

[Doko]

On 7/7/2023 at 5:43 PM, Gitzdee said:

I dont think a lot of new players choose to play an army with models that are ancient with no signs of new models in the future

i started to play 7 years ago,and i knew all that but even then i started a general order army of 100% buyed new and not recycled of fantasy models:

20 longbeards

30 hammerers

30irondrakes

30 ironbreackers

20 dwarf warriors

2 dwarkings

3 runelords

2 gyrocopter/bomber

2 dragonlords

1 archmage

1 loremaster

5 wild ryders

i knew that these models wasnt going to get more units or attention of gw(but i really i didnt think that they were to delete any of these after the purge of fantasy to aos neither)

but im a old player that dont like the new aos models but love the old fantasy models.

so i wanted play aos but i didnt liked the aos models,so i got the old fantasy models

 

i dont get the persons that want the old fantasy units deleted of aos,whats their problem? 

rigth now if some players dislikes aos armys because they are too much weirds(vengolorian lord,teclis,flying fishs etc) but love fantasy models as dispossesed or bonesplitters can play to aos with these fantasy armys.

 

if they remove fantasy models then these players wont play to aos and aos gonna loose some playerbase.

so why delete these fantasy units? rigth now all are plus for aos and gw if they keep them.

to save room? everything is direct sale of fantasy so they dont get any room to keep them.

i really i dont see whats the problem with keep old fantasy units but i see many problems if they delete them

Edited July 8, 2023 by Doko

[madmac]

1 minute ago, Bigtoof said:

I think the kit actually holds up quite well. There’s a lot that I like about, the way it goes together and joins for example are great, no need for sprue glue or liquid green stuff here - contrary to the new saurus.

The poses and sculpts I think make them nice and simple to paint albeit they could do with some more variety for sure. They look like proper orks, they aren’t too busy with mountains of cloth or stuff.

I’m not entirely sure on GWs logic on refreshing kits - Khorne Berzerkers I always believed to be a popular kit - they waited over twenty years for their refresh? 

I’m currently working on a small 1000pt Bonesplittaz army using the underworld warband to provide me with the hero’s I need. I do hope we don’t go the way of the dodo. 
 

The kit being so versatile is both a blessing and a curse. At first it feels amazing that buying one 20 model box lets you build out no less than four different units, Big Stabbas, Archers, Morboys and Spear Orcs, but on the other foot you'll very very quickly get tired of building and painting most of the entire army using the same like 5 torsos and 10 heads etc etc. It's a very similar feeling to painting Fyreslayers, or Mawtribes. After a while you would simply kill a man for a new pose to paint, no questions asked. Adding to the pain is that Bonesplitters are a horde army, with no centerpiece models, and most of the heroes are a bunch of resin you're better off skipping, so you'd better really really love your two plastic troop boxes.

They've been mostly poorly served in the rules department too, not in an underpowered way but in a "you would need to be dysfunctional to actually want to play any of the meta lists" sort of way. Like in 1st edition where the optimal list involved rolling literally hundreds of dice rolls for archers, with re-rolls AND exploding sixes to keep track of.

All that said, I love my Bonesplitter Boyz, and it would take very little in the way of new models to make them shine. Update the resin heroes, give them a centerpiece monster and at least one new unit kit and it'll feel like Christmas compared to where they've been all these years.

[cyrus]

What if the orruk wave of Dawnbringers book 2 brings along 2 new kits for ironjawz ( Maw-Gruntas + Ardboyz) and 2 kits for Bonesplitterz ( Wurrgog/wardokk + Big boss on warboar) 

[novakai]

17 minutes ago, cyrus said:

What if the orruk wave of Dawnbringers book 2 brings along 2 new kits for ironjawz ( Maw-Gruntas + Ardboyz) and 2 kits for Bonesplitterz ( Wurrgog/wardokk + Big boss on warboar) 

Dunno the Recent RE look more like Kruleboyz stuff to be honest

and technically they said the book focuses on Destruction which can imply Ogors or even more Gitz models (portal Trogg) 

that and it could be more destruction focus but it possible other armies outside the GA get stuff as well like the last book did.