The Rumour Thread

[EntMan]

Rumour Engine today almost certainly 40k Orks 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/02/21/the-rumour-engine-21st-february-2023/

[LordSolarMach]

11 minutes ago, EntMan said:

Rumour Engine today almost certainly 40k Orks 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/02/21/the-rumour-engine-21st-february-2023/

Good call, that's almost definitely the smoking grenade on base of the new Snikrot model (as glimpsed in the 40k New Years' preview).

[Shankelton]

6 minutes ago, LordSolarMach said:

Good call, that's almost definitely the smoking grenade on base of the new Snikrot model (as glimpsed in the 40k New Years' preview).

Yup, think your right! Doubt we're getting more for orks in Arks of Omen, as a kommandos and snikrot make the perfect Boarding Patrol, so most likely a Snikrot basing element

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by Shankelton
wrong boxset

[Ganigumo]

5 hours ago, Matrindur said:

Over on Bolter & Chainsword there is a new person leaking about 10th edition right now but the interesting bit for us is that he also said there will be a new Ossiarch Bonereapers character previewed on one of the next Mondays.

Massive amount of salt since his leaks don't line up with others so probably fake and guessing there will be a Ossiarch character also isn't hard but if true still interesting for the order of Battletomes since I would expect them to be next after Kharadron if this turns out true

Edit: Now he also said something about a pool when asked about Seraphon which could be a terrain piece but since we already have one that makes me doubt it even more so probably ignore this

It would be wierd to get the OBR character revealed so soon. The two chaos tomes come before the two death ones on the timeline.

Also a "seraphon"y terrain piece won't be much of a shock, the entire warscry season has been in the gnarlwood and quite a few of the warbands are trying to get into the temple ship that crash landed there.

Still seems like pretty suspect rumors though.

[KingBrodd]

1 hour ago, Lucien 2L said:

I can see a more morghurite nightmare warband : half turned humans and beasty chaos spawn

Oh now that would just be perfection.

1 hour ago, Neverchosen said:

We can get a new type of Slaangor unit and get both 

All Slaangors all the time!!

55 minutes ago, EntMan said:

Rumour Engine today almost certainly 40k Orks 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/02/21/the-rumour-engine-21st-february-2023/

 

42 minutes ago, LordSolarMach said:

Good call, that's almost definitely the smoking grenade on base of the new Snikrot model (as glimpsed in the 40k New Years' preview).

You both better work for Scotland Yard thats some damn fine detective work!!

[King Under the Mountain]

2 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

It was doing well pre-Covid, at least around my neck of the woods. It had garnered a reputation was an affordable, fun to play, well-balanced (for GW) competitive game with Beastgrave. Then the pandemic happened, which kind of killed a lot of the momentum, during which time the new warbands and next edition saw pretty hefty price rises.

When the warbands were around £15 and the seasonal boxes were £30 people were happy to give it a try. Now they're floating around £26/£60, it started tanking and has never really pulled itself out of the muck 'post'-pandemic.

It didn't help that Kill Team '21 has seemingly stolen it's thunder with GW-only skirmish fans, particularly those after something competitive with 'Warhammer' branding. 

Like anything non-40k though, it really does come down to your local scene. Some places it'll be thriving, others it's been dead since release. 

Underworlds was pretty popular pre-covid where I used to live too.  That and Warcry made up the majority of the games I saw played.

[Red Bull]

Underworlds has picked back up a little locally. Rivals format was a big help to bringing back former players who quit during covid or due to the open deckbuilding.

It's just a fun game. Tournaments around here just play 1 match per round, so most events are just 3-4 hours. For those with the minis... I highly recommend trying to attend a local tournament/event. Good times

[EntMan]

49 minutes ago, KingBrodd said:

You both better work for Scotland Yard thats some damn fine detective work!!

Well, I have to confess to getting the tip off from Bolter and Chainsword.

[RileyArlic]

6 hours ago, Matrindur said:

Over on Bolter & Chainsword there is a new person leaking about 10th edition right now but the interesting bit for us is that he also said there will be a new Ossiarch Bonereapers character previewed on one of the next Mondays.

Massive amount of salt since his leaks don't line up with others so probably fake and guessing there will be a Ossiarch character also isn't hard but if true still interesting for the order of Battletomes since I would expect them to be next after Kharadron if this turns out true

Edit: Now he also said something about a pool when asked about Seraphon which could be a terrain piece but since we already have one that makes me doubt it even more so probably ignore this

Yeah, came over to highlight all this. 

The list he puts down is believable to an extent, and he mentions it could be part of a Hachette magazine thingamabob, but there's so many people making big lists and stuff over the past month or so that it's easier to believe that nothing is real.

To be fair, Valrak said "The moon landing was more real than this " which... is kind of a ridiculous statement since the Moon Landing was indeed real, so I'm not sure what he's trying to say here.

Either way, he does indeed mention Arks of Omen book 5 being "the Sanguinor" and the next couple of reveals being an Ossiarch Bonereapers character and 'the pool' for seraphon, which could be a Spawning Pool.

Such a thing could be a terrain piece, could be a sort of new type of spell, or could be some other sort of unit that you can put on the table, but we'll see. 

My blood pressure is through the roof, both because of my excitement for Seraphon and also because of all the salt I'm having to take...

[Skreech Verminking]

22 minutes ago, RileyArlic said:

My blood pressure is through the roof, both because of my excitement for Seraphon and also because of all the salt I'm having to take...

You lucky cold blood-thing.

you can season you food now.

 

[RileyArlic]

1 minute ago, Skreech Verminking said:

You lucky cold blood-thing.

you can season you food now.

 

Indeed, I don't have to just swallow mice whole without flavoring

I am curious about how @Whitefang feels about pools. Good for swimming as well as spawning? 

[EonChao]

5 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

It was doing well pre-Covid, at least around my neck of the woods. It had garnered a reputation was an affordable, fun to play, well-balanced (for GW) competitive game with Beastgrave. Then the pandemic happened, which kind of killed a lot of the momentum, during which time the new warbands and next edition saw pretty hefty price rises.

When the warbands were around £15 and the seasonal boxes were £30 people were happy to give it a try. Now they're floating around £26/£60, it started tanking and has never really pulled itself out of the muck 'post'-pandemic.

It didn't help that Kill Team '21 has seemingly stolen it's thunder with GW-only skirmish fans, particularly those after something competitive with 'Warhammer' branding. 

Like anything non-40k though, it really does come down to your local scene. Some places it'll be thriving, others it's been dead since release. 

Kill Team being so accessible now is a big issue for Underworlds. The Kill Team starter is the same price as Gnarlwood, comes with more minis that are fully modular kits, plastic scatter terrain and is 40k. You can also expand it with a whole bunch of 40k stuff easily with the compendium. Compared to the price of Underworlds warbands it's not difficult to see the appeal of Kill Team from a cost perspective and an ease of access one too.

[RileyArlic]

31 minutes ago, EonChao said:

Kill Team being so accessible now is a big issue for Underworlds. The Kill Team starter is the same price as Gnarlwood, comes with more minis that are fully modular kits, plastic scatter terrain and is 40k. You can also expand it with a whole bunch of 40k stuff easily with the compendium. Compared to the price of Underworlds warbands it's not difficult to see the appeal of Kill Team from a cost perspective and an ease of access one too.

There's also not really any place to go with Underworlds once you have your warband... 

You can expand your deck by getting further card options. You can get different boards that might fit your strat better... But that's it?

You get the Seraphon Underworlds warband and it's not like you can trade the chameleon out for another saurus...

[CommissarRotke]

7 minutes ago, RileyArlic said:

There's also not really any place to go with Underworlds once you have your warband... 

You can expand your deck by getting further card options. You can get different boards that might fit your strat better... But that's it?

You get the Seraphon Underworlds warband and it's not like you can trade the chameleon out for another saurus...

in theory that should make WHU the perfect board-type game for people who don't want to get into actual (tabletop) wargaming though. and it is not, because of the pricing.

edit: deckbuilding can also put people off, however the Rivals format is supposed to negate that particular pain point.

Edited February 21, 2023 by CommissarRotke

[Clan's Cynic]

18 minutes ago, RileyArlic said:

There's also not really any place to go with Underworlds once you have your warband... 

You can expand your deck by getting further card options. You can get different boards that might fit your strat better... But that's it?

You get the Seraphon Underworlds warband and it's not like you can trade the chameleon out for another saurus...

The appeal was you wanted more cards to complete your 'perfect' deck (or just have options) and you could sell the models on, or put them on a shelf for a painting project. This was helped by the fact warbands used to 'only' cost between £15-£18. When they were putting out two teams every three months, this was considered pretty good - particularly as they had decent resale value, like the Kharadron Khemist + his buddies being cheaper than the standalone Khemist model.

Of course, that kind of sales pitch of getting people to buy glorified card packs (which happen to contain models) fell apart once GW did the usual and started pricing the warbands closer to full unit kits. At that point, people probably realised for a few quid more they could just buy 10 or so of their main army's unit and stuck to that.

GW seemed to realise they'd 'priced out' the TCG aspect, which is why Rivals format was pushed to the fore. Unfortunately it seems Underworlds has already been cemented as a 'dead game' in a lot of communities (which is always a self-fulfilling prophecy) and people who were in it for the TCG aspect have seen the writing on the wall and just don't buy warbands for the cards anymore because... well, why would they if they've a favourite team to use Rivals with instead?

That said, I don't think GW will execute Underworlds for a while yet. The warbands still seem to sell decently and it's where their junior sculptors get their feet wet, which is why there have been varied warbands so far. I certainly wouldn't expect it to be taken out back before Aeronautica or War Cry.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Clan's Cynic

[KingBrodd]

Im still hoping that we get 10 Warbands for Warcry this Edition. With the next boxed set that bumps the Warbands up to 9, meaning like the Legionaires we may get a single Warband released alongside it.

I also wish we were getting Monsters for it as well but I think that ship may have sailed sadly.

[RileyArlic]

1 hour ago, KingBrodd said:

Im still hoping that we get 10 Warbands for Warcry this Edition. With the next boxed set that bumps the Warbands up to 9, meaning like the Legionaires we may get a single Warband released alongside it.

I also wish we were getting Monsters for it as well but I think that ship may have sailed sadly.

Kinda surprised we haven't gotten monsters... but they did open up for a lot of different factions monsters to be used in the game, so that's something I suppose. 

[CDM]

1 hour ago, KingBrodd said:

Im still hoping that we get 10 Warbands for Warcry this Edition. With the next boxed set that bumps the Warbands up to 9, meaning like the Legionaires we may get a single Warband released alongside it.

I also wish we were getting Monsters for it as well but I think that ship may have sailed sadly.

I think it's a real shame we haven't had a destruction beasties pack similar to the furies and raptortx of the first season. That and a couple more incarnates would of cemented the era of the beast better.

[Chikout]

4 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

The appeal was you wanted more cards to complete your 'perfect' deck (or just have options) and you could sell the models on, or put them on a shelf for a painting project. This was helped by the fact warbands used to 'only' cost between £15-£18. When they were putting out two teams every three months, this was considered pretty good - particularly as they had decent resale value, like the Kharadron Khemist + his buddies being cheaper than the standalone Khemist model.

Of course, that kind of sales pitch of getting people to buy glorified card packs (which happen to contain models) fell apart once GW did the usual and started pricing the warbands closer to full unit kits. At that point, people probably realised for a few quid more they could just buy 10 or so of their main army's unit and stuck to that.

GW seemed to realise they'd 'priced out' the TCG aspect, which is why Rivals format was pushed to the fore. Unfortunately it seems Underworlds has already been cemented as a 'dead game' in a lot of communities (which is always a self-fulfilling prophecy) and people who were in it for the TCG aspect have seen the writing on the wall and just don't buy warbands for the cards anymore because... well, why would they if they've a favourite team to use Rivals with instead?

That said, I don't think GW will execute Underworlds for a while yet. The warbands still seem to sell decently and it's where their junior sculptors get their feet wet, which is why there have been varied warbands so far. I certainly wouldn't expect it to be taken out back before Aeronautica or War Cry.

I'm honestly surprised it has lasted this long. When it was first announced a lot of people didn't think we'd get a second season but 44 warbands later (not counting reused minis) the game is still trucking along. I for one enjoy the fact that it's a one and done system now. Apart from the financial side, getting an "army" ready to play in a weekend is pretty unheard of when it comes to GW. Also it does pretty well here in Japan where even finding space to set up  a warcry board can be a struggle. Almost every time I go to a GW store here, I see people playing. We should be seeing the new starter at Adepticon if not before. I'm looking forward to seeing what they have up their sleeve. Could we see a cities warband as a teaser for the upcoming release? They did that with the first  Gloomspite warband. 

[Marcvs]

3 hours ago, Chikout said:

getting an "army" ready to play in a weekend is pretty unheard of when it comes to GW.

But that's because it's not an army (or even "army") at all. And I am not speaking of the number of minis but of the simple fact that the miniatures are completely irrelevant to the actual game.

 

Pick your favourite board/card game, print (or have someone print for you) 4-10 minis to represent your dudes/gals. Ta dah, you can paint them in a weekend as well and bring them with you and you'll have your Monopoly army!

[zilberfrid]

3 hours ago, Chikout said:

I'm honestly surprised it has lasted this long. When it was first announced a lot of people didn't think we'd get a second season but 44 warbands later (not counting reused minis) the game is still trucking along. I for one enjoy the fact that it's a one and done system now. Apart from the financial side, getting an "army" ready to play in a weekend is pretty unheard of when it comes to GW. Also it does pretty well here in Japan where even finding space to set up  a warcry board can be a struggle. Almost every time I go to a GW store here, I see people playing. We should be seeing the new starter at Adepticon if not before. I'm looking forward to seeing what they have up their sleeve. Could we see a cities warband as a teaser for the upcoming release? They did that with the first  Gloomspite warband. 

I pointed many to Underworlds to get a taste of a faction. Before the 50% price increase with less models on average that is, of course.

[JackStreicher]

I quit underworld the day they announced that cards will become invalid and one has to buy new cards to play - I love myself some expensive trash paper, don’t I? Hard Nope.

Although I bought the current starter since my gf and I were stocking up on board games for relaxed evenings with friends

[Chikout]

15 minutes ago, Marcvs said:

But that's because it's not an army (or even "army") at all. And I am not speaking of the number of minis but of the simple fact that the miniatures are completely irrelevant to the actual game.

 

Pick your favourite board/card game, print (or have someone print for you) 4-10 minis to represent your dudes/gals. Ta dah, you can paint them in a weekend as well and bring them with you and you'll have your Monopoly army!

I'm not sure what point you are making. How is this bad?  Yes Underworlds is easy to prepare for because it's not a   traditional wargame,  but that's a good thing. The miniatures are tokens  but to call them completely irrelevant is a stretch. Their use is no different than in Warhammer quest or Bloodbowl.   Gw needs to do more games that step outside the  bounds of the games they have made in the past. 

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

8 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

The appeal was you wanted more cards to complete your 'perfect' deck (or just have options) and you could sell the models on, or put them on a shelf for a painting project. This was helped by the fact warbands used to 'only' cost between £15-£18. When they were putting out two teams every three months, this was considered pretty good - particularly as they had decent resale value, like the Kharadron Khemist + his buddies being cheaper than the standalone Khemist model.

Of course, that kind of sales pitch of getting people to buy glorified card packs (which happen to contain models) fell apart once GW did the usual and started pricing the warbands closer to full unit kits. At that point, people probably realised for a few quid more they could just buy 10 or so of their main army's unit and stuck to that.

GW seemed to realise they'd 'priced out' the TCG aspect, which is why Rivals format was pushed to the fore. Unfortunately it seems Underworlds has already been cemented as a 'dead game' in a lot of communities (which is always a self-fulfilling prophecy) and people who were in it for the TCG aspect have seen the writing on the wall and just don't buy warbands for the cards anymore because... well, why would they if they've a favourite team to use Rivals with instead?

That said, I don't think GW will execute Underworlds for a while yet. The warbands still seem to sell decently and it's where their junior sculptors get their feet wet, which is why there have been varied warbands so far. I certainly wouldn't expect it to be taken out back before Aeronautica or War Cry.

The biggest problem for me was that I could not figure out which warbands and cards were still supported for the longest time. I hope they clean that up soon. I know there are now generic decks that any warband can use, but I hope they re-release the shadespire guys with new fighter cards, as well.

It's a difficult game to pitch right now:

 

Hey look, it's a miniature/card game hybrid by GW!

Oh, so you can army build like in Warhammer? -No.

But you can deck build like in magic, right? -Also no.

Well, at least you can play any warband against any other. -That is also not possible.

 

Right now, what you can do in Underworlds is pretty tightly constrained. It is truly best engaged with as a board game, where you buy something once and then it's complete. The avenue for expansion is not building up "your dudes", it is buying a different warband.

[Marcvs]

2 hours ago, Chikout said:

I'm not sure what point you are making. How is this bad?  Yes Underworlds is easy to prepare for because it's not a   traditional wargame,  but that's a good thing. The miniatures are tokens  but to call them completely irrelevant is a stretch. Their use is no different than in Warhammer quest or Bloodbowl.   Gw needs to do more games that step outside the  bounds of the games they have made in the past. 

My point was that it is not "not a traditional wargame", its place lies entirely outside the scope of the "wargame" hobby. Simply, it's a boardgame and/or card game, and the miniatures (like in other games of course) are simply pretty tokens.

My second point was that once the first point is established, all comparisons with Warhammer or even Warcry in terms of time to paint/cost/space required, are kind of pointless.