The Rumour Thread

[Neverchosen]

In light of the recent narrative revelations, I want to revisit one aspect of the leaks namely the Damned Legions. When the index was first revealed many people just assumed the listed legions would be lore information and the Legions proper would likely be a smaller list towards the end. I personally suspected that they would each be a standalone legion and I wrote something to that effect when we first got the information. But I think the emphasis on Be'Lakor makes it seem even more likely that each will be a distinct and separate subfaction.

I am going to list the Damned Legions and my personal guess as to how they relate to the current Damned Legions. If you think these will shake out a little differently than my guess, so please post your own theories and note that I imagine the rules being very different than their current form: 

• Archaon The Everchosen - Hosts of the Everchosen
• Be'Lakor, the Dark Master - Despoilers? Legion of the First Prince?
• Champions of the Chaos Tribes - Ravagers
• Masters of the Dark Arts - Cabalists
• Wrought in Iron and Hatred - Knights of the Empty Throne?
• The Ogroids Unleashed - New Subfaction.
• The Lost and Damned - Idolators? Despoilers?
• Warbands of the Eightpoints - Idolators?

As stated earlier, I highly doubt these will be a 1/1 match. Particularly as I feel certain legions that currently exist such as Hosts of the Everchosen and Knights of the Empty Throne could be consolidated rules-wise. Namely if Archaon is or isn't present in a list could effect the rules of the Varanguard. Alternatively, I feel like Idolators might get split across the Lost and Damned (priests and chariots) and Warbands of the Eightpoints (Cultists). Either way this is the part of the new release that excites me the most. It is possible that the Belakor Legion covers the rules for the Legions of the First Prince, in which case the Lost and Damned might be Despoilers? 

I still hope we get Rally the Tribes for Ravagers. Not because it was great competitively, but because it was my favourite summoning mechanic in AOS. Different Chaos Champions calling forth their own cultists just seems to feel right. I also liked tossing in a Gaunt Summoner to bring in some Furries. I just like the idea that with the wave of chaos there were secret cultists laying in wait and demonic summonings occurring from a twisted sorcerer. 

I love crafting my army to fit within the rules and lore of certain subfactions and these seem very flavour-able and fun. With there being 8 having each one tie into a realm also seems like a fun idea. I will have them hail from the Eightpoints and then have a subfaction dedicated to taking each of the realms! I do wonder/worry that Archaon, Be'Lakor, and Eternus will be locked within their respective legions?

I think that we can all agree that Be'Lakor will be fairly successful in this rebellion, but that there is only one possible ending for these dark machinations:

 

Edited July 23, 2022 by Neverchosen

[KingBrodd]

15 hours ago, DinoJon said:

They gotta save non-Chaos warbands for a fancy reveal. I'm sure it'll get a ton of people hyped up for the game. I'm hoping around launch they'll show off at least one other warband coming out for this cycle. 

1 Destruction Warband is all I need to see, considering there may be 4 thats enough for me!!

[KingBrodd]

Leaked new Mounted Chaos Lord is all kinds of Eavy Metal!!

[Neverchosen]

On 7/23/2022 at 9:04 AM, KingBrodd said:

Leaked new Mounted Chaos Lord is all kinds of Eavy Metal!!

As all Undivided Chaos should be!

Chaos should have some nuance and subtly, they should strive to show why people follow these Gods and the Faustian bargains that result in a fall. How a tragic figure riddled with disease finds acceptance with the followers of Nurgle, a general in dire fortune turns to Khorne in a moment of rage and weakness, Tzeentch preying on an academic researching a method to improving society, who now wishes to overthrow society and how a romantic artist may fall to the sway and temptations of Slaanesh while struggling to complete their masterpiece.

However, someone who worships all of the Gods should lack any nuance as they clearly just wants to rock out and wear 5 ton armour and chill out with demons all day while looking like the literal epitome of Warhammer! This applies to Beasts of Chaos but they don't need to cosplay with horned helmets. The true followers of Chaos requires a certain aesthetic and that aesthetic is Spikes and classic Warhammer Eavy Metal!

Of course any classic Eavy Metal painter should know that there is only one way to base these soldiers the ultimate embodiments of Chaos, Madness and Disorder. With the juxtaposition of a Goblin Green base on a freshly mowed lawn of green flock:

Edited July 24, 2022 by Neverchosen

[MitGas]

1 hour ago, Neverchosen said:

I think that we can all agree that Be'Lakor will be fairly successful in this rebellion, but that there is only one possible ending for these dark machinations:

 

Does that mean the bachelor will return as a ghost-daemon who sounds like Chris Latta? 🤔  And Archaon becomes crazy shortly after? If yes, then I'm all for it. 

[Nezzhil]

1 hour ago, Neverchosen said:

In light of the recent narrative revelations, I want to revisit one aspect of the leaks namely the Damned Legions. When the index was first revealed many people just assumed the listed legions would be lore information and the Legions proper would likely be a smaller list towards the end. I personally suspected that they would each be a standalone legion and I wrote something to that effect when we first got the information. But I think the emphasis on Be'Lakor makes it seem even more likely that each will be a distinct and separate subfaction.

I am going to list the Damned Legions and my personal guess as to how they relate to the current Damned Legions. If you think these will shake out a little differently than my guess, so please post your own theories and note that I imagine the rules being very different than their current form: 

• Archaon The Everchosen - Hosts of the Everchosen
• Be'Lakor, the Dark Master - Despoilers? Legion of the First Prince?
• Champions of the Chaos Tribes - Ravagers
• Masters of the Dark Arts - Cabalists
• Wrought in Iron and Hatred - Knights of the Empty Throne?
• The Ogroids Unleashed - New Subfaction.
• The Lost and Damned - Idolators? Despoilers?
• Warbands of the Eightpoints - Idolators?

As stated earlier, I highly doubt these will be a 1/1 match. Particularly as I feel certain legions that currently exist such as Hosts of the Everchosen and Knights of the Empty Throne could be consolidated rules-wise. Namely if Archaon is or isn't present in a list could effect the rules of the Varanguard. Alternatively, I feel like Idolators might get split across the Lost and Damned (priests and chariots) and Warbands of the Eightpoints (Cultists). Either way this is the part of the new release that excites me the most. It is possible that the Belakor Legion covers the rules for the Legions of the First Prince, in which case the Lost and Damned might be Despoilers? 

I still hope we get Rally the Tribes for Ravagers. Not because it was great competitively, but because it was my favourite summoning mechanic in AOS. Different Chaos Champions calling forth their own cultists just seems to feel right. I also liked tossing in a Gaunt Summoner to bring in some Furries. I just like the idea that with the wave of chaos there were secret cultists laying in wait and demonic summonings occurring from a twisted sorcerer. 

I love crafting my army to fit within the rules and lore of certain subfactions and these seem very flavour-able and fun. With there being 8 having each one tie into a realm also seems like a fun idea. I will have them hail from the Eightpoints and then have a subfaction dedicated to taking each of the realms! I do wonder/worry that Archaon, Be'Lakor, and Eternus will be locked within their respective legions?

I think that we can all agree that Be'Lakor will be fairly successful in this rebellion, but that there is only one possible ending for these dark machinations:

 

We know that Legion of the First Prince is in the Battletome as a new subfaction. Eternus has this keyword.

[Clan's Cynic]

Saw this StD lore spoiler on DakkaDakka, don't know the original quote's source.

Spoiler

"Well well, little bit of interesting news from the StD battletome leakers.

Lorewise what’s happened is Kragnos got Grand Marshall Archaon so riled up that he let slip his ultimate plan to turn on the Dark Gods after the Realms have been dealt with(this is why since the beginning he’s cemented his power at All-Gates, not because it allows full access for his legions into the Realms but because it’s the only place Chaos can freely enter them. He controls their access and can turn it off like a spigot) causing his eighth circle of Varanguard(he still retains the majority, that’s why he had them worship him rather than the Dark Gods) to abandon him and join Belakor in their ongoing civil war to lead Chaos.

That’s where the new character Eternus is from. A Varanguard that left Archaon and signed up for Belakor’s Bootleg Stormcast program to become immortal like them(though noticeably tethered further to Belakor)."

Edited July 23, 2022 by Clan's Cynic

[Twisted Firaun]

2 hours ago, Neverchosen said:

In light of the recent narrative revelations, I want to revisit one aspect of the leaks namely the Damned Legions. When the index was first revealed many people just assumed the listed legions would be lore information and the Legions proper would likely be a smaller list towards the end. I personally suspected that they would each be a standalone legion and I wrote something to that effect when we first got the information. But I think the emphasis on Be'Lakor makes it seem even more likely that each will be a distinct and separate subfaction.

I am going to list the Damned Legions and my personal guess as to how they relate to the current Damned Legions. If you think these will shake out a little differently than my guess, so please post your own theories and note that I imagine the rules being very different than their current form: 

• Archaon The Everchosen - Hosts of the Everchosen
• Be'Lakor, the Dark Master - Despoilers? Legion of the First Prince?
• Champions of the Chaos Tribes - Ravagers
• Masters of the Dark Arts - Cabalists
• Wrought in Iron and Hatred - Knights of the Empty Throne?
• The Ogroids Unleashed - New Subfaction.
• The Lost and Damned - Idolators? Despoilers?
• Warbands of the Eightpoints - Idolators?

As stated earlier, I highly doubt these will be a 1/1 match. Particularly as I feel certain legions that currently exist such as Hosts of the Everchosen and Knights of the Empty Throne could be consolidated rules-wise. Namely if Archaon is or isn't present in a list could effect the rules of the Varanguard. Alternatively, I feel like Idolators might get split across the Lost and Damned (priests and chariots) and Warbands of the Eightpoints (Cultists). Either way this is the part of the new release that excites me the most. It is possible that the Belakor Legion covers the rules for the Legions of the First Prince, in which case the Lost and Damned might be Despoilers? 

I still hope we get Rally the Tribes for Ravagers. Not because it was great competitively, but because it was my favourite summoning mechanic in AOS. Different Chaos Champions calling forth their own cultists just seems to feel right. I also liked tossing in a Gaunt Summoner to bring in some Furries. I just like the idea that with the wave of chaos there were secret cultists laying in wait and demonic summonings occurring from a twisted sorcerer. 

I love crafting my army to fit within the rules and lore of certain subfactions and these seem very flavour-able and fun. With there being 8 having each one tie into a realm also seems like a fun idea. I will have them hail from the Eightpoints and then have a subfaction dedicated to taking each of the realms! I do wonder/worry that Archaon, Be'Lakor, and Eternus will be locked within their respective legions?

I think that we can all agree that Be'Lakor will be fairly successful in this rebellion, but that there is only one possible ending for these dark machinations:

 

As much as I LOVE the transformers movie, it was the pinnacle of 80s western animation, I have to disagree with Be’lakor’s fate. It takes a lot of effort to destroy a daemon, even when it’s the Chaos Gods doing the killing, odds are he’ll be banished once more.

From a lore perspective, the overarching battle between Archaon and Be’lakor does hinder chaos as a whole (like @Enoby has stated) as we’re only seeing the actions of two of the “Aliiance’s” heavy hitters fighting each other. I personally hope we get some more named characters that are not tied to these two guys in any major way so that this is no longer the case.

Edited July 23, 2022 by Loyal Son of Khemri

[Neverchosen]

1 minute ago, Loyal Son of Khemri said:

As much as I LOVE the transformers movie, it was the pinnacle of 80s western animation, but I have to disagree with Be’lakor’s fate. It takes a lot of effort to destroy a daemon, even when it’s the Chaos Gods doing the killing, odds are he’ll be banished once more.

Haha, I do not think it will be a permeant death but rather an embarrassing banishment. I feel like Be'Lakor will realistically outlast Archaon and will become a minor Chaos God... but I think it will continue to be a rocky road and never actually happen directly in the narrative but exist in prophesies and such.

54 minutes ago, Nezzhil said:

We know that Legion of the First Prince is in the Battletome as a new subfaction. Eternus has this keyword.

Oh cool thanks for that, unfortunately we do not know if the Legions of the first prince will remain the same as it is now. I feel like it could take the Despoilers Rules and include 1/4 demon units. I would like if the rules stayed as they are though as it gives AoS a full demon faction

26 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

Saw this StD lore spoiler on DakkaDakka, don't know the original quote's source.

  Reveal hidden contents

"Well well, little bit of interesting news from the StD battletome leakers.

Lorewise what’s happened is Kragnos got Grand Marshall Archaon so riled up that he let slip his ultimate plan to turn on the Dark Gods after the Realms have been dealt with(this is why since the beginning he’s cemented his power at All-Gates, not because it allows full access for his legions into the Realms but because it’s the only place Chaos can freely enter them. He controls their access and can turn it off like a spigot) causing his eighth circle of Varanguard(he still retains the majority, that’s why he had them worship him rather than the Dark Gods) to abandon him and join Belakor in their ongoing civil war to lead Chaos.

That’s where the new character Eternus is from. A Varanguard that left Archaon and signed up for Belakor’s Bootleg Stormcast program to become immortal like them(though noticeably tethered further to Belakor)."

Eternus' lore fits so well with my AOS project and he feels like a must grab tbh. But I also like to construct my own lore so he will likely be my general and use Eternus rules but likely remain within my own little meta narrative. 

[Boingrot Bouncer]

6 hours ago, YoghurtKobold said:

Oh I doubt that was the last chaos warband for a long time. But hopefuly it was the last STD warband. I hope for god specific warbands. And we are probably going to get them. Those Rotmire guys are Nurgle I guess and Tzeentch with that Wyrdlights and obelisk from rumour engine is almost guaranteed.

Sadly I know you are right, and of all the chaos gods tzeentch will probably have the most different look at compared to already existing warbands. 

[Chikout]

I just realized that after this release slaves to Darkness will be the second most updated faction after Stormcast with about 35 new kits since AoS started. That's more than Lumineth and IDK combined. 

This will also technically be the fourth Slaves to Darkness focused book since launch. Again that's more than anyone except Stormcast. I'm curious why they escape the criticism that everyone sends the way of the Aelves and the stormcast. 

[Twisted Firaun]

34 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

Haha, I do not think it will be a permeant death but rather an embarrassing banishment. I feel like Be'Lakor will realistically outlast Archaon and will become a minor Chaos God... but I think it will continue to be a rocky road and never actually happen directly in the narrative but exist in prophesies and such.

Oh cool thanks for that, unfortunately we do not know if the Legions of the first prince will remain the same as it is now. I feel like it could take the Despoilers Rules and include 1/4 demon units. I would like if the rules stayed as they are though as it gives AoS a full demon faction

Eternus' lore fits so well with my AOS project and he feels like a must grab tbh. But I also like to construct my own lore so he will likely be my general and use Eternus rules but likely remain within my own little meta narrative. 

I’d argue that Be’lakor has already reached “minor” god status already. In 40K it’s being implied he’s the reason so many “undivided” daemon princes continue to pop up in the narrative despite GW pushing undivided out the window, and he has countless cults and warbands dedicated to him (and even an entire knight world too). AOS-wise he’s perma-killed out an entire Stormhost and isolated a Chamon from the rest of the realms. The Stormhost is the most important part of the previous sentence, as all those souls have to go somewhere…. 

Using the rules for established characters to represent your own dude is a time honored tradition in the hobby. I’m currently working on a custom death-god who uses Nagash’s typeset throughout the Grand Alliance, and there’re countless examples on this site to back up this idea.

[Grimrock]

52 minutes ago, Chikout said:

I just realized that after this release slaves to Darkness will be the second most updated faction after Stormcast with about 35 new kits since AoS started. That's more than Lumineth and IDK combined. 

This will also technically be the fourth Slaves to Darkness focused book since launch. Again that's more than anyone except Stormcast. I'm curious why they escape the criticism that everyone sends the way of the Aelves and the stormcast. 

There are a few reasons. The first is the vast majority of the kits come in the form of warcry models. While they're technically in the slaves to darkness book, they weren't designed for AoS, they're for warcry. For the most part the rules in AoS are more of a bolt on afterthought. That and the fact that the vast majority never actually see the table makes it difficult to count them as true new kits.

If you ignore the warcry models then StD got precious little since Archaon. A few stopgap monopose kits in a start collecting, an overpriced hero, and then of course be'lakor although he also kind of has his own faction which dilutes it as a StD release. Not much to write home about.

This particular book is really the first time they're getting proper attention. Full proper resculpts of kits that have been in use for what, around 20 years? Actual new units that are designed for AoS from the ground up. A proper advancement of their narrative (hopefully) instead of just more of the status quo.

[Twisted Firaun]

59 minutes ago, Grimrock said:

This particular book is really the first time they're getting proper attention. Full proper resculpts of kits that have been in use for what, around 20 years? Actual new units that are designed for AoS from the ground up. A proper advancement of their narrative (hopefully) instead of just more of the status quo.

Speaking of advancing the plot….. how does everyone here think the tome is gonna include major events? We know from @Baron Klatz’ sources that  Vandus is getting censured by Sigmar, Archaon is in hot water with the gods and some of his followers, but how does this interact with some of the other events happening in the mortal realms? 
 

Everyone and their mother is converging on Ghur due to Kragnos’ tantrum, and Shyish is once again left relatively defenseless due to infighting and wounds inflicted upon its leader…. I personally think we’re gonna see at least one warband try to corrupt Kragnos, as he’s too powerful to be left to his own devices.  We’ll probably get another round of Chorf teases and hints, followed by some stories focusing on warbands being swayed to Be’lakor or Archaon’s banners.

[Plinketts Mawtribes]

I want that huge Gutfort to play a part in coming events...the Ogors have been almost completely absent from the lore for too damn long.

[KingBrodd]

12 minutes ago, Plinketts Mawtribes said:

I want that huge Gutfort to play a part in coming events...the Ogors have been almost completely absent from the lore for too damn long.

The Great Gutfort needs to be present!!

I agree the Mawtribes have literally done nothing since AOS began, even during the Siege of Excelsis they only got a paragraph.

I want them to be big players in AOS, every Destruction race infact, rather than always getting a cop out as a Big Waaagh!!

[Kronos]

Leviathan Siege Dread Sprue.

Edited July 23, 2022 by Kronos

[HollowHills]

New Lumineth rules seem interesting. I think you'll want the Enlightener in 90% of lists tbh. 

Also Moooooooo.

[Neverchosen]

33 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

New Lumineth rules seem interesting. I think you'll want the Enlightener in 90% of lists tbh. 

Also Moooooooo.

 Alarith gettin' some love?

Yee-friggin'-haw!!! 🤠🐮

Edited July 24, 2022 by Neverchosen

[Captaniser]

33 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

New Lumineth rules seem interesting. I think you'll want the Enlightener in 90% of lists tbh. 

Also Moooooooo.

Where can they be found? Reddit?

[RyantheFett]

42 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

New Lumineth rules seem interesting. I think you'll want the Enlightener in 90% of lists tbh. 

Also Moooooooo.

Oh I cant wait!!! Are they up anywhere? Are they good changes!??! And also in case somebody needs a theme song to go with the cows, Doja Cat got us covered!

 

Edited July 24, 2022 by RyantheFett

[DinoJon]

 

41 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

New Lumineth rules seem interesting. I think you'll want the Enlightener in 90% of lists tbh. 

Also Moooooooo.

Can you post source or collection of the new rules? 

[Beliman]

I'm interested in the new rules too! Can anyone post any link or msm me?

[HollowHills]

The source is my infinite knowledge and wisdom.

 

[chosen_of_khaine]

26 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

The source is my infinite knowledge and wisdom.

 

I really hope "aren't very good" just means "not abusable" and not "garbage tier" because the whole aesthetic of lines of pikemen backed up by archers with cavalry in the flanks is one of the major appeals of Lumineth.

Then again, I'm pretty tired of vague discord leaks that are just one dude's opinions with minimal actual information, so I'm putting basically no weight to this.

Edited July 24, 2022 by chosen_of_khaine