The Rumour Thread

[PraetorDragoon]

Its a personal guess of mine for a while that GW would rotate the season 1 generic cards out of 'standard' when season 3 hit.

[bsharitt]

4 minutes ago, PraetorDragoon said:

Its a personal guess of mine for a while that GW would rotate the season 1 generic cards out of 'standard' when season 3 hit.

I was grudgingly becoming okay with the X-Wing model where you need to buy warbands you don't want in order to get all the cards you want(though I like most of the models well enough alternate AoS models, it was no big deal) as long as they would stay in play the same as X-Wing. But if they're also going to combine the Magic/Heroclix/CCG thing of rotating out sets, I'm probably going to be out of WHU. Might pick up the stand alone releases for models I like, but not more core sets or packs with the cards, which means I'll probably be more picky about which of those I pick up since there won't be cards to push me over the edge of buy models I'm not entirely crazy about.

[JPjr]

21 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

If this portends the removal of season one content from the game, my purchases for Underworlds are done. Full stop. I've purchased quite literally every single product in the line (and in many cases two copies so that my gf and I each had access to the cards for our basement games). To think that a third of it (once season 3 hits) will be dead only about a year after release is awful. I don't buy pricey GW product with the expectation of a 12 month shelf life. I expect many, many years, if not a decade or more, of life. 

obviously this is clearly something that you feel strongly about, but on the plus side if GW are hiring people to go around to all their existing customers houses and monitor what models are used in their basements that's got to be good for the unemployment rate. think of the economy!

[PraetorDragoon]

15 minutes ago, bsharitt said:

I was grudgingly becoming okay with the X-Wing model where you need to buy warbands you don't want in order to get all the cards you want(though I like most of the models well enough alternate AoS models, it was no big deal) as long as they would stay in play the same as X-Wing. But if they're also going to combine the Magic/Heroclix/CCG thing of rotating out sets, I'm probably going to be out of WHU. Might pick up the stand alone releases for models I like, but not more core sets or packs with the cards, which means I'll probably be more picky about which of those I pick up since there won't be cards to push me over the edge of buy models I'm not entirely crazy about.

Quite understandable. (Rotation is why I don't play mtg at standard level)

I just think it makes sense from a competitive (and shopkeeper) standpoint. Cycle out a bunch of cards, and you can print new cards without worrying about broken combos with earlier cards.  We'll see if it happens, as its just speculation on my part.  

[Sleboda]

48 minutes ago, JPjr said:

obviously this is clearly something that you feel strongly about, but on the plus side if GW are hiring people to go around to all their existing customers houses and monitor what models are used in their basements that's got to be good for the unemployment rate. think of the economy!

Lol! Yeah, I get your point, but this game is different from, say, AoS. It's built from the ground up as the "ultimate" competitive GW game with full-on tournament support. Yes, we play for fun, but more than any other GW game, the goal here is to practice a bunch at home and then go to events. 

[Overread]

If you've got Total War Access they are giving away a short story "Prince of Altdorf" for the Old World as a tie into their Warhammer Total War game and the upcoming DLC/Free DLC launch on the 11th of this month. Featuring new Empire units and Lizardmen including gun firing chariots and a massive Ancient beast! 

[michu]

But the game is not gone, just 1st season (and it was here for more than a year). If you have season 2 warbands you can still play with them. Rotation is necessary for the health of game or it will become unwieldy.

Edited September 2, 2019 by michu

[Chikout]

3 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

Lol! Yeah, I get your point, but this game is different from, say, AoS. It's built from the ground up as the "ultimate" competitive GW game with full-on tournament support. Yes, we play for fun, but more than any other GW game, the goal here is to practice a bunch at home and then go to events. 

A quick google tells me that no card stays legal in magic for more than two years. So unfortunately it looks like this might be standard for this type of game. That said we still don’t have confirmation that the shadespire  warbands will be illegal when beastgrave launches. 

[sandlemad]

This sort of rotation is going to be pretty alien to a lot of long time GW folks though, it's much more of a MtG and similar games thing. I don't play underworlds competitively so it won't affect me at all - and there's that, if this is a game you play with friends or in any venue besides tournaments, this will make zero difference -  but if you'd bought into the competitive mindset, I can see how it's frustrating.

It might not be that different from meta-chasing and constantly buying new AoS armies but if it's going to be a blunt "sorry, you can't use those models from about two years ago", it will be irritating for a lot of folks.

[michu]

Well, maybe we got another MtG thing - non-rotating format! 

 

[madmac]

I do wonder how many people specifically buy underworld models to use in underworlds though.

Me personally I get them with the cards and all but I don't actively play underworlds, deck building is just not for me. I get them because they're cool models that (lately) tend to be semi-viable in AoS as unique units, otherwise they're good looking proxies, with the added bonus of being playable in underworlds should it happen to come up.

 

[michu]

I honestly thought about playing WHU but the sheer amount of cards and warbands scared me off. 

[Overread]

Rotation of cards and such isn't going tobe that alien to Warhammer players (most are geeks who will have more than noticed MTG over the years). The main issue is the not-announced changes that take place. It's still an area GW has to improve on with communications. They sitll generally detest the idea of telling us in advance what and why's of removals even when its only a short term thing or a reboxing. Why they are like that I can't work out because all it does is spark up panic and spread bad attitudes toward them when a simple 1 paragraph notation before any removals/changes would resolve any issues instantly. 

 

[sandlemad]

7 minutes ago, michu said:

I honestly thought about playing WHU but the sheer amount of cards and warbands scared me off. 

If you're thinking of just playing casually or treating it like a good and replayable boardgame, it really is easy to get into. A starter box and another warband or two that you like the look of is plenty for something you get out for a quick game every few weeks. 

I don't know if its the cards or the hex board or the rules design but I've found it's considerably more appealing than regular AoS for folks coming from boardgames or 'casual' gaming backgrounds. I've playeed it with family members and friends who would otherwise have an instinctive distrust of tabletop battle stuff and they've loved it. In a sense you'd miss out on the deeper parts of the deckbuilding element but it's still a great game.

1 minute ago, Overread said:

Rotation of cards and such isn't going tobe that alien to Warhammer players (most are geeks who will have more than noticed MTG over the years).

Maybe but I've always seen a certain amount of distrust towards the MtG system (rotation, standard, etc) from WH players because of stuff like that. Could be different crowds though, this may be grogs who are glad they can still play with their early 90s dwarves and/or folks who just aren't into that element of the game.

Edited September 2, 2019 by sandlemad

[Sleboda]

1 hour ago, Chikout said:

A quick google tells me that no card stays legal in magic for more than two years. So unfortunately it looks like this might be standard for this type of game. That said we still don’t have confirmation that the shadespire  warbands will be illegal when beastgrave launches. 

That's not "this sort of game" though. Underworld has two key differences:

1. No random. You buy the cards you want. You spend for the items you want. No ambiguity. I want that card, I get it, I play with it. I build my experience around expectations I control.

2. Models. Painted models. This is an investment of time and effort that far exceeds the casual foil ripping of a card pack. Losing that is terrible.

[zilberfrid]

32 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

That's not "this sort of game" though. Underworld has two key differences:

1. No random. You buy the cards you want. You spend for the items you want. No ambiguity. I want that card, I get it, I play with it. I build my experience around expectations I control.

2. Models. Painted models. This is an investment of time and effort that far exceeds the casual foil ripping of a card pack. Losing that is terrible.

Also note that Magic has multiple forms of play, butmost importantly, cards are cycled back very often, which isn't something I expect from Underworld.

[Carnelian]

It would be a bit of shame if season 1 warbands were cycled out. If its just the season 1 cards that get phased out, I don't think anyone can complain but hopefully they can keep season 1 warbands playable for season 3 too - that way the range is playable at tournaments for between 2.5 - 3 years which is pretty good. 

Even if they do get phased out,they all would have had a shelf life of over 1 year and most closer to 2 and are still supported in AoS, although I accept if you only play Underworlds that wouldn't help. 

I expect GW will tell us when Beastgrave is released. I wouldn't expect them to tell us any earlier what the next stage is or how it works tbh, not sure what benefit GW would get from that. 

I've collected most of the warbands so far (the ones I like the look of) but not all of them, and they all double up ij my AoS armies. and I'm completely overwhelmed with card choice, so personally I'd welcome a hard reset of Underworlds.

[alghero81]

Shadespire came out the 21st October 2017, so worst case scenario it would have been 23 months for the oldest warbands and 17 months for the Magore’s fiends...

To be fair even if they don’t retire them it’s increasingly more difficult for season 1 warbands to keep up. If season 3 introduces a new mechanic, season 1 would be 2 mechanics behind and there’s so much you can do with cards to compensate the absence of a wizard or other mechanic. In saying that I hope they don’t retire them but they will eventually just phase out.

[Overread]

I can't see GW releasing new warabands for all the factions all over again. Even if they could I'd rather those production slots went to actual AoS war models not another block of 5 or so characters. Would you rather see a new plastic Skyre Acolyte kit or a new band of 5 skaven rats. 

Instead I'd hope that this is GW repackaging/releasing a combined rules deck - ergo retiring the universale cards and updating the core rules and giving those warbands fresh cards to play with on the tabletop. That would be the best move as it means all those forces remain current for all current and future gamers and also means that GW hasn't got to produce a whole slew of repeat warbands just to keep th game going. MTG does that, but that's purely cards and the whole system is different. 

[Double Misfire]

So I'm probably putting two and two together and making 12 here, but the new Warcry mercenary heroes are a pretty broad church with stuff not really fitting in with any of the established warbands like the skaven Grey Seer being present. Maybe the plastic Battlemages/Empire Wizards are being reboxed to slot into Order warbands... 🤔

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/09/02/monsters-mercenaries-awesomeness-for-everyone/

[PaniuBraniu]

GW have already announced rules for the first Grand Clash  of the third season:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1lN0DIboI1Gp2GGSRlAzm2WeoXDSZsJyj/view

They explicitly stated, that all WU products would be eligible, excluding Dreadfane and banned cards from the BAR list. 

Now the only way to get rid of season 1 content is to put all the season 1 cards on the BAR list upon Beastgrave premiere.

[Overread]

12 minutes ago, Double Misfire said:

So I'm probably putting two and two together and making 12 here, but the new Warcry mercenary heroes are a pretty broad church with stuff not really fitting in with any of the established warbands like the skaven Grey Seer being present. Maybe the plastic Battlemages/Empire Wizards are being reboxed to slot into Order warbands... 🤔

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/09/02/monsters-mercenaries-awesomeness-for-everyone/

It's likely running on the Grand Alliance system - that and we are pretty certain that GW will eventually add more factions to the game such as skaven. It's just a bit odd that this expansion is coming before that update. I'd have released them at the same time or cards before the mercenaries; esp since the addition of other factions should, in theory, just require a card release to get them playable - perhaps with an oversized card for a quest list or such.

[Double Misfire]

6 minutes ago, Overread said:

It's likely running on the Grand Alliance system - that and we are pretty certain that GW will eventually add more factions to the game such as skaven. It's just a bit odd that this expansion is coming before that update. I'd have released them at the same time or cards before the mercenaries; esp since the addition of other factions should, in theory, just require a card release to get them playable - perhaps with an oversized card for a quest list or such.

It's a nice way to tease future factions, and get people who hadn't previously picked up a warband because their favourite race weren't in the game yet, say a skaven fan who had previously been on the fence about the game grabbing an Unmade warband to run a Grey Seer with.

[Shankelton]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/09/02/tales-of-forbidden-power-blood-tendergw-homepage-post-4/

Not sure if its been linked here yet with all the CoS discussion, but we got our first Ogor story today!

Interestingly enough it also makes specific mention of some of the Maneater and Firebelly, resin sculpts. Might point to more of the resin line sticking around then at first predicted/speculated.

[Overread]

21 minutes ago, Shankelton said:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/09/02/tales-of-forbidden-power-blood-tendergw-homepage-post-4/

Not sure if its been linked here yet with all the CoS discussion, but we got our first Ogor story today!

Interestingly enough it also makes specific mention of some of the Maneater and Firebelly, resin sculpts. Might point to more of the resin line sticking around then at first predicted/speculated.

I think the resins will hang around if GW only updates 1 model for the range. The resins would vanish fast if they are updating more.

That said never take lore as a protection from removal. Typically whoever writes the lore isn't in manufacture/product departments and the two can be very separate with lore and writing often being behind the game at times and yet at other times ahead of the game. So its a bit of a mish mash really. 

It's a neat bit of writing though and nice to see the Ogor displaying some sense of intelligence and not just total mindless destruction. Even in the Old World ogors were seen as not the brightest, but at the same time not mindbreakingly stupid - at least for the leaders.