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Gaz Taylor

AoS 2 - Clan Verminus / Skaven Discussion

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Have they removed the Poisoned Wind Mortar Team  from the battletome?

Edited by Noit

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18 minutes ago, Noit said:

Have they removed the Poisoned Wind Mortar Team  from the battletome?

Yup. It is still legal due to General's Handbook though however by next edition it may be removed entirely.

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48 minutes ago, Zuriaxis said:

Yup. It is still legal due to General's Handbook though however by next edition it may be removed entirely.

Does not have skaventide keyword and skaventide have no allies....

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12 minutes ago, sorokyl said:

Does not have skaventide keyword and skaventide have no allies....

Ah. Then it's in need of a FAQ; if you want to play them I imagine any opponent of decent character would let you, I do that with a guy who runs old school elves.

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Is anyone considering Eshin in any way? Nightrunners seem much worse now that their rend is gone in exchange for more shooting capability, but it's on Skink levels unbuffed. Pre-game movement is up as well, but I feel it may be better to just run multiples of 10-20 Gutter Runners in their place and get Clanrats in if you really need bodies.

Not sure how to feel about the Deceiver either when you look at how much better the other Verminlords got (for the most part). Something can still be said for Skitterleap, but isn't that available as a spell lore spell now? Glazed over the review video but I thought I heard that. Anyway, I'm just trying to make a case for pure Eshin, but I don't quite think there is one; Mixing Eshin, Clanrats and Skryre toys is what I'm aiming for... but the more I think about it, bringing 30-40 Stormvermin is probably a better bet in most cases when it comes to dealing damage.

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2 minutes ago, Gwendar said:

Is anyone considering Eshin in any way? Nightrunners seem much worse now that their rend is gone in exchange for more shooting capability, but it's on Skink levels unbuffed. Pre-game movement is up as well, but I feel it may be better to just run multiples of 10-20 Gutter Runners in their place and get Clanrats in if you really need bodies.

Not sure how to feel about the Deceiver either when you look at how much better the other Verminlords got (for the most part). Something can still be said for Skitterleap, but isn't that available as a spell lore spell now? Glazed over the review video but I thought I heard that. Anyway, I'm just trying to make a case for pure Eshin, but I don't quite think there is one; Mixing Eshin, Clanrats and Skryre toys is what I'm aiming for... but the more I think about it, bringing 30-40 Stormvermin is probably a better bet in most cases when it comes to dealing damage.

Mixed clans is probably the best option. Pure Eshin doesnt have all the toys and options. Dont discount Moulder either. Rat Ogors could be legit now in large packs with a Master

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32 minutes ago, Malakithe said:

Mixed clans is probably the best option. Pure Eshin doesnt have all the toys and options. Dont discount Moulder either. Rat Ogors could be legit now in large packs with a Master

Well, yeah, I don't think I ever meant to really try pure Eshin.. poor choice of word. I have to justify all the conversions\kitbashing I did and that would leave me with 80 Gutter Runners. Would be interesting to see what 4x20 could do if taken with Skryre but I definitely feel I would need to leave out the Deceiver at this point. Lot's of time will be spent theory-crafting lists over the next few weeks it seems.

You do make a good point on Moulder, I had been on the fence about grabbing some Ogors (IoB ones from eBay at least, standard kit is horrific) but everyone seems to eyeing them pretty heavily now, along with the Abominiation.

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57 minutes ago, Gwendar said:

Well, yeah, I don't think I ever meant to really try pure Eshin.. poor choice of word. I have to justify all the conversions\kitbashing I did and that would leave me with 80 Gutter Runners. Would be interesting to see what 4x20 could do if taken with Skryre but I definitely feel I would need to leave out the Deceiver at this point. Lot's of time will be spent theory-crafting lists over the next few weeks it seems.

You do make a good point on Moulder, I had been on the fence about grabbing some Ogors (IoB ones from eBay at least, standard kit is horrific) but everyone seems to eyeing them pretty heavily now, along with the Abominiation.

Moulder seems to have won the 'best improvement' award. No one gave them enough attention until now so it will be great to see packs of nasty creatures running along side the hordes and suicide guns

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19 minutes ago, Malakithe said:

Moulder seems to have won the 'best improvement' award. No one gave them enough attention until now so it will be great to see packs of nasty creatures running along side the hordes and suicide guns

Too bad instead of still selling this

500?cb=20160707163247

 

We have to make do with this!

99120206005_SKARatOgresGiantRats02.jpg

 

 

 

Uuuuugh! I sure LOVE 6th edition skaven.....😛

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Just now, kenshin620 said:

Too bad instead of still selling this

500?cb=20160707163247

 

We have to make do with this!

99120206005_SKARatOgresGiantRats02.jpg

 

 

 

Uuuuugh! I sure LOVE 6th edition skaven.....😛

I think they look alright on rounds

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11 minutes ago, kenshin620 said:

 

99120206005_SKARatOgresGiantRats02.jpg

I actually really like the look of those packmasters, even though they're obviously just slightly altered plague monks. The rat ogres are awful though, especially the heads which just look super ugly and derpy. Shame GW can't/don't put the island of blood models on the store, probably going to scour ebay for them since I'm thinking of using rat ogres over stormfiends now.

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11 hours ago, Skavelynn said:

I do think GW could have balanced the Stormfiends better. They basically just removed/nerfed everything good about them and didn't buff the other weapon options that weren't that good, plus removed the ability for packmasters to buff them. Pure skryre doesn't seem like it will be all that strong anymore but we shall see, as others said don't want to assume too much before the tome is actually here and we playtest the new rules to figure out what works and what doesn't. Warp Lightning Cannons, Doomwheels and wizards are all seeming like they'll still be pretty good.

I do predict that stormfiends will be replaced by rat ogres though for the most part, alongside some packmasters and a weapon team or cannon they'll essentially fill the stormfiend role for equal or cheaper points. Plague monks are also sounding like they're going to be absolute monsters.

I'm sorry but what? Didn't buff the bad weapon options? +1 attack and rend on mini mortars plus huge range boost. +1 to wound with ratlings and those things gain most from new warpstone sparks (+1 damage on range). And as far as rest of the changes go, I wouldn't call them nerfs. Doom-flayers didn't change, warpshock gauntlets are now unmodified hit (which is nerf and buff at same time), flamers are terrible against single target and insane against hordes (again, nerf/buff), drills do less damage but have more reliable deepstriking (as you're guaranteed to enter battlefield in turn 3), stormfiends points also went down 30 which is very significant drop.

The only true nerfs I'd say they received are weapon options nerf (something I ultimately thought being a good thing) and inability to use packmasters to boost their hit. I have plenty of issues with this new book's battleline systems and all that, but the stormfiends are honestly the last thing that annoys me. Quite the opposite, I like those changes (I even guessed some of those changes correctly in skyre thread before this book). I can however understand and sympathize with the weapon limitation changes forcing players to go back and change original weapons (flamers and shock gauntlets most likely) to something else. But I'd also argue that writing was on the wall and GW was either going to flat out nerf the best options or reduce their numbers (flamers were especially problem with their auto-hit mortals) so these changed do not surprise me one bit.

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Hey guys, do Verminlords have acces to the new Grey Seer loore? If we have to run pure forces for the Monks to be battleline i would love to have new spells at least. Also IT would be fine for the masterclan to be excluded from the rule, as they cooperete with anyone as IT suits them. 

Edited by Fecistius
Grammar

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15 minutes ago, Fecistius said:

Hey guys, do Verminlords have acces to the new Grey Seer loore? If we have to run pure forces for the Monks to be battleline i would love to have new spells at least. Also IT would be fine for the masterclan to be excluded from the rule, as they cooperete with anyone as IT suits them. 

NO it's key word grey seer but the grey seer spells are mostly just worse versions of many of the verminlord specific spells. 

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Do you guys think Moulder is competitively viable now? Being able to resurrect/heal the big block of rat ogres you suicide charged in turn one on a 4+ (with the command trait) seems pretty strong. I wish GW updated rat ogres and a dedicated box of giant rats would be nice. Pretty hard to find any in stock on ebay. 

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3 minutes ago, Verminlord said:

Do you guys think Moulder is competitively viable now? Being able to resurrect/heal the big block of rat ogres you suicide charged in turn one on a 4+ (with the command trait) seems pretty strong. I wish GW updated rat ogres and a dedicated box of giant rats would be nice. Pretty hard to find any in stock on ebay. 

i mean i don't see  much reason to go hard anything. THat said it does look like a cool strategy.

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33 minutes ago, Verminlord said:

Do you guys think Moulder is competitively viable now? Being able to resurrect/heal the big block of rat ogres you suicide charged in turn one on a 4+ (with the command trait) seems pretty strong. I wish GW updated rat ogres and a dedicated box of giant rats would be nice. Pretty hard to find any in stock on ebay. 

Competitive as in pure Moulder?  No way...just like Eshin they lack...pretty much everything. Eshin and Moulder, and now to a degree, Skryre are support for Verminus. Need to see the battalions but I have a feeling mixed clans will be the way to go. Clanrats with supporting stuff whether thats pew pew from Skryre or beasts from Moulder

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Not sure if it was already possible, but realising it made me chuckle... clawleasers can command verminlord a to gnash-gnaw on their bones. Probably with a host of clanrats between them and blamingly pointing to an underling while doing so 😂

 

  • Haha 3

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14 minutes ago, Kramer said:

Not sure if it was already possible, but realising it made me chuckle... clawleasers can command verminlord a to gnash-gnaw on their bones. Probably with a host of clanrats between them and blamingly pointing to an underling while doing so 😂

 

That's quite interesting to notice, because if Gnash-gnash can affect all units in a certain radius, it can also give other clawlords and verminlord warbringers  extra attacks. Cool stuff

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2 hours ago, Verminlord said:

Do you guys think Moulder is competitively viable now? Being able to resurrect/heal the big block of rat ogres you suicide charged in turn one on a 4+ (with the command trait) seems pretty strong. I wish GW updated rat ogres and a dedicated box of giant rats would be nice. Pretty hard to find any in stock on ebay. 

I think it depends on your definition of competitively viable. GT level... don’t think so. Moulder looks to be very depended on their hero’s to be good. For example: You do have cheap bodies, but without hero’s it collapses. And they are to squishy. 

On a local 1 day tournament level, I think with some clever play and maybe avoiding some specific net lists you will surprise a lot of players and potentially do quite well. 

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Who will ever use rat ogres?

They are better but still unuseful.

Edited by Noit

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51 minutes ago, Noit said:

Who will ever use rat ogres?

 

Probably me.

im Also rethinking of taking the hell pit abomination into my army, since he literally became the horror to fight against with horde units.

 

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Quick thought: boosting up a prized Moulder creation with 6 Master Moulders ---> what happens if it comes back from dying via their command ability? Does it retain it's health buff?

 

Also a good way to prevent Rat Ogre losses by boosting one of them into the clouds, and allocating wounds to it first - practically guaranteeing the rest of the ogres in that unit survives a round of focused fire. Boneripper & friends.

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5 minutes ago, Mayple said:

Quick thought: boosting up a prized Moulder creation with 6 Master Moulders ---> what happens if it comes back from dying via their command ability? Does it retain it's health buff?

 

Also a good way to prevent Rat Ogre losses by boosting one of them into the clouds, and allocating wounds to it first - practically guaranteeing the rest of the ogres in that unit survives a round of focused fire. Boneripper & friends.

I don’t think you can use Master Moulders to boost rat ogors’ wounds can you? The prized creation ability only affects Clan Moulder units with the fighting beast keyword, and rat ogres do not have it - they’re ‘pack’ instead. 

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