The Rumour Thread

[Cosmicsheep]

15 minutes ago, PrimeElectrid said:

Can we take a moment to talk about how flipping weird it is for a multi-million pound company to give a product to their mates to live stream in full 2 days prior to preorder so that nobody has to actually buy the book.

 

Nobody HAS to buy the book. The rules are free and the points will be in the warscroll builder. But i will still be buying it for the battleplans and ease of use whilst gaming

Edited June 18, 2021 by Cosmicsheep

[rosa]

20 minutes ago, PrimeElectrid said:

Can we take a moment to talk about how flipping weird it is for a multi-million pound company to give a product to their mates to live stream in full 2 days prior to preorder so that nobody has to actually buy the book.

 

I never understood why GW is doing this. 
full reviews of battletomes and boxes sometimes 2 weeks prior official release. 
It always kill the hype for me to the fullest. 
 

[baiardo]

12 minutes ago, Cosmicsheep said:

Nobody HAS to buy the book. The rules are free and the points will be in the warscroll builder. But i will still be buying it for the battleplans and ease of use whilst gaming

Pretty much this!plus there is the diary for PoG right?

Edited June 18, 2021 by baiardo

[Sleboda]

7 hours ago, Gailon said:

Are people getting some kind of amazing prizes for winning tournaments or something?

It's sort of a topic on it's own, but sadly, yes. Prizes at tournaments are, in my opinion, one of the absolute worst parts about this hobby.

It's bad enough that some folks use winning at these things as some sort of alpha dog creating, personality validating, ego inflating experience that lets them measure the size of their, um, you know, in public, but when you then also dangle vacations, cash, and/or hundreds (or thousands) of dollars worth of toys in the face of these "bruh, do you even lift, bruh" types, it gets so much worse.

Prizes bring out the Roid Rager in far too many hobbyists.

[SunStorm]

1 hour ago, PrimeElectrid said:

Can we take a moment to talk about how flipping weird it is for a multi-million pound company to give a product to their mates to live stream in full 2 days prior to preorder so that nobody has to actually buy the book.

 

 

It is weird knowing we still have 2 weeks before the actual stuff is released and people can have seen the entire contents of the box and entire page by page read throughs of the books on line. It must work from a marketing perspective otherwise they wouldn't do it I guess.

But I'm old and don't understand the whole thing social media influencer way of doing things. The more likes/subs/followers you have the more free stuff you get, therefore the more likes/subs/followers you can attract and get access to more free stuff?

The only person I do watch on Youtube who got the book is 2+ tough and he focuses mainly on the lore side of things.

 

Edited June 18, 2021 by SunStorm

[Clan's Cynic]

6 hours ago, Athrawes said:

 

I believe you called me galaxy brained?

It's kind of hard to take the moral high ground when that person is slinging mud.

I and others like me are trying to get people to cool off, have patience, and look at the recent news with some perspective before grabbing pitchforks. And the response is generally being mocked.

A few pages back you dismissed people who post criticisms as 'whiners' and yet act shocked when you get mud on you.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Clan's Cynic

[PrimeElectrid]

37 minutes ago, Cosmicsheep said:

Nobody HAS to buy the book. The rules are free and the points will be in the warscroll builder. But i will still be buying it for the battleplans and ease of use whilst gaming

The battleplans were shown too so you could just print them all off. They’ve basically given the entire product away for free.

It was also a terrible show. Worldwide exclusive preview and the hosts hadn’t  even bothered to do any preparation to be able to discuss the changes for each faction. So why even bother? Just make it a free digital download on WarCom and cut out the middle man. Even better this would give GW a HUGE PR win. They could still sell the physical product for ease of use too.

It’s just a completely baffling decision from every business perspective.

Edited June 18, 2021 by PrimeElectrid

[Cosmicsheep]

8 minutes ago, PrimeElectrid said:

The battleplans were shown too so you could just print them all off. They’ve basically given the entire product away for free.

You could... and i'll admit, that's how i've been playing since AoS 2. But they had me at "ring binder". Playing with printed out A4 sheets is just a pain in the ass... i think the ring binder A5 size book is pure genius, and i wouldn't have seen that without YouTubers like FaceHammer (i know it was it the GW release on WC, but seeing it in the flesh just won me over)

Edited June 18, 2021 by Cosmicsheep

[Icarion]

20 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

A few pages back you dismissed people who post criticisms as 'whiners' and yet act shocked when you get mud on you.

The difference being I'm not trying to claim a moral highground and paint only the other side of this discussion as "vicious and childish" 

I'm arguing for patience, but I am NOT trying to virtue signal the 'righteousness' of my position. I have no problem getting mud on myself, but loath the hypocrisy of people who sling mud, and then argue they themselves are stainless. 

Edited June 18, 2021 by Athrawes

[DeLewko]

32 minutes ago, SunStorm said:

 

It is weird knowing we still have 2 weeks before the actual stuff is released and people can have seen the entire contents of the box and entire page by page read throughs of the books on line. It must work from a marketing perspective otherwise they wouldn't do it I guess.

But I'm old and don't understand the whole thing social media influencer way of doing things. The more likes/subs/followers you have the more free stuff you get, therefore the more likes/subs/followers you can attract and get access to more free stuff?

The only person I do watch on Youtube who got the book is 2+ tough and he focuses mainly on the lore side of things.

 

I simply don't watch those. What's the point of watching unboxings anyway it's not like we don't know what's inside the box. 

If i feel like watching some grey sprues i have plenty at home

[zilberfrid]

12 minutes ago, DeLewko said:

I simply don't watch those. What's the point of watching unboxings anyway it's not like we don't know what's inside the box. 

If i feel like watching some grey sprues i have plenty at home

Different reasons.

For obscure sets, it's sometimes the only way to know what's on the sprue. For GW big box stuff, I watch them at Goobertown for cat compatibility analysis.

[Golub87]

31 minutes ago, Athrawes said:

I'm arguing for patience..

Ummm... Why? It is not like they earned our patience.

It seems to me that the community lives in perpetual "a few months from now this will be a balanced and fun game, you will see" state of mind.

Always waiting for the next FAQ, never getting anything.

[MothmanDraws]

7 minutes ago, Golub87 said:

Ummm... Why? It is not like they earned our patience.

It seems to me that the community lives in perpetual "a few months from now this will be a balanced and fun game, you will see" state of mind.

Always waiting for the next FAQ, never getting anything.

wait for the hedonites book faq surely they will fix it

wait for kragnos, surely those models will fix it

wait for 3rd the new core rules will fix the army (did a little until today)

wait for 3rds points to bring everyone else to our costs this should balance us out

wait for FAQ to the GHB surely that will save us

after that already see rumblings of "dont worry the next points change in 6 months will sort it"

Edited June 18, 2021 by MothmanDraws

[Icarion]

9 minutes ago, Golub87 said:

Ummm... Why? It is not like they earned our patience.

It seems to me that the community lives in perpetual "a few months from now this will be a balanced and fun game, you will see" state of mind.

Always waiting for the next FAQ, never getting anything.

Patience because you and others here cannot possibly have played any meaningful number of games in 3rd edition using the new points. There have been no tournament, there is NO META. We have ideas about issues with the ruleset, but no proof. 

 

The idea that this position is apparently a controversial one, is however proof of how toxic the community is becoming. 

 

Edited June 18, 2021 by Athrawes

[The Red King]

8 hours ago, Athrawes said:

And I'd say expecting games workshops attempt to balance their game to be flawless for every army (when they have never managed it before) is equally unrealistic.

Having lived through many edition changes, this one looks very polished by comparison in terms of eyeballing balance, but all their armies have never been on an even footing at the launch of a new edition. Some people screeching like they have been purposely slighted by gamesworkshop for their choice of army is a tantrum. 

 I'd argue that trying to organize a boycotting effort over something that just 5 years ago warhammer fans would have killed for (yearly points updates) because you're unsatisfied with them is the height of entitlement. 

Could things be better? OF COURSE. Could they be worse. YOU BETTER BELIEVE IT.

On the whole, and playing several of the armies the "community" has declared have been nerfed into oblivion, This edition change seems to have a wider swath of armies within swinging distance of their peers, with some high and low outliers, but compared to earlier edition changes this looks to be in a better state.

 

People online need to have more realistic expectations.

I'm not going to be spearheading any boycotts myself but this reads like an abusive relationship.

"You cant expect them to be good when they never have before, just be happy that they are only as bad as ever!"

"Considering what they've done before this is actually a good thing in comparison."

"You can't be upset that you got punched in the gut because they could have hit you lower."

 

Yes I think some people are over reacting with the hate on GW and sky is falling attitude but you are definitely on the furthest point in the opposite direction of that scale.

I'm not gonna applaud GW everytime they successfully resist the mistake of reverting to AoS 1.0 rules lol. They're a large preeminent company that charges premium prices. Each individual consumer is entitled (a dirty word I know) to decide whether or not the product being sold to them is worth the money being charged. So "better than the worst they could possibly do." Is not the bar I'm setting for my hobby budget personally.

[Golub87]

Just now, Athrawes said:

Patience because you and others here cannot possibly have played any meaningful number of games in 3rd edition using the new points. There have been no tournament, there is NO META. We have ideas about issues with the ruleset, but no proof. 

 

The idea that this position is apparently a controversial one, is however proof of how toxic the community is becoming. 

 

You are right, of course. Slaangor are clearly a hidden powerhouse of the new edition, hence the preemptive points hike. All is well with the world, always was, always will be.

[Icarion]

Just now, Golub87 said:

You are right, of course. Slaangor are clearly a hidden powerhouse of the new edition, hence the preemptive points hike. All is well with the world, always was, always will be.

sigh.

I'm getting so tired of the irrational indignation and passive aggression from certain members of this board.

Let me lay out a hypothetical for you.

By the end of aos 2, there were arguably 6 or so top tier armies that were (generally speaking) winning tournaments and very competitive. Likewise there were about 5 or so, bottom of the pack armies that really struggled to compete at any level. The rest of the factions fell into the middle of the pack.

Got it?

Imagine then, that its 5 months from now, severl new battletome have been released and there have been a bevy of proper aos 3 tournaments. A meta has clearly developed. From this info, we can see that there are now 7 or 8 armies that appear regularly in the top three finishes of tournaments, and prove very competitive. In comparison there are only 1 or 2 armies that really struggle to compete. The rest of the armies again fall in the fat middle of competitive results.

If you played one of the armies that still ended up in the that bottom portion of competitiveness, you might feel that the game is in a terrible state, but anyone honest with themselves would view the general state of the games, and spread of competitive armies as better than it was (in this hypothetical) at the end of the previous edition.

No one can possibly knows if this will be the case. But likewise no one knows that it wont. You need patience to see how this will shake out. And freaking out the day of new points is just stirring up community outrage and generally spoiling what has the potential to be an exciting time for AOS fans.

Have patience.

I could be totally wrong, and this edition could be the least balanced ever. It doesn't look that way from this moment to me, but it really could be the case. 

So maybe try to control you indignity, have patience and maybe even acknowledge that you just cannot know for sure how this will shake out. Your kneejerk reaction to outrage, does not constitute proof of malfeasance on the part of GW. 

 

[Golub87]

4 minutes ago, Athrawes said:

By the end of aos 2, there were arguably 6 or so top tier armies that were (generally speaking) winning tournaments and very competitive. Likewise there were about 5 or so, bottom of the pack armies that really struggled to compete at any level. The rest of the factions fell into the middle of the pack.

Got it?

 

And this is quite a terrible state of the game. Got it?

Especially given that certain match-ups are even more lopsided.

And you have the nerve to argue patience and to lecture people whose armies have been ruined. I literally can't field a legal army with the models I own. I can't have a legal game even if I looked past the travesty of Slaanesh points and wanted it.

And yeah GW might not be malicious towards certain factions and players. Gross incompetence is also on the table.

[King Under the Mountain]

I know this is just a normal PR "Non-answer" but it still gives me hope for more examples of Dwarven firepower 

Edited June 18, 2021 by King Under the Mountain

[KingBrodd]

6 minutes ago, King Under the Mountain said:

I know this is just a normal PR "Non-answer" but it still gives me home for more examples of Dwarven firepower 

Mate I'm buying into the belief, a similar post was made about Mawtribes a month ago and there was a similar GW response something along the lines of 'Maybe there will be more mouths to feed for this Edition'. Could just be PR talk but I'm eating that salt and hoping it's TRUE. 

[Nagash42]

Seems it took till 3rd edition for this place to turn into dakka lol.

I await chaos dwarf rumours now as I play my hedonites in path to glory.

[novakai]

35 minutes ago, King Under the Mountain said:

I know this is just a normal PR "Non-answer" but it still gives me hope for more examples of Dwarven firepower 

said the same thing about firebelly 3 years ago

[shinros]

1 hour ago, Athrawes said:

sigh.

I'm getting so tired of the irrational indignation and passive aggression from certain members of this board.

Let me lay out a hypothetical for you.

By the end of aos 2, there were arguably 6 or so top tier armies that were (generally speaking) winning tournaments and very competitive. Likewise there were about 5 or so, bottom of the pack armies that really struggled to compete at any level. The rest of the factions fell into the middle of the pack.

Got it?

Imagine then, that its 5 months from now, severl new battletome have been released and there have been a bevy of proper aos 3 tournaments. A meta has clearly developed. From this info, we can see that there are now 7 or 8 armies that appear regularly in the top three finishes of tournaments, and prove very competitive. In comparison there are only 1 or 2 armies that really struggle to compete. The rest of the armies again fall in the fat middle of competitive results.

If you played one of the armies that still ended up in the that bottom portion of competitiveness, you might feel that the game is in a terrible state, but anyone honest with themselves would view the general state of the games, and spread of competitive armies as better than it was (in this hypothetical) at the end of the previous edition.

No one can possibly knows if this will be the case. But likewise no one knows that it wont. You need patience to see how this will shake out. And freaking out the day of new points is just stirring up community outrage and generally spoiling what has the potential to be an exciting time for AOS fans.

Have patience.

I could be totally wrong, and this edition could be the least balanced ever. It doesn't look that way from this moment to me, but it really could be the case. 

So maybe try to control you indignity, have patience and maybe even acknowledge that you just cannot know for sure how this will shake out. Your kneejerk reaction to outrage, does not constitute proof of malfeasance on the part of GW. 

 

So slaanesh players just need to be patient right? Don't worry, next faq will sort the book out, oh it didn't? Just wait for broken realms Kragnos! Oh wait, that didn't do anything either, don't worry just wait for AOS 3 and MSU, I'm sure our book was written for AOS 3, oh no, the points went up again in GHB, don't worry guys, just wait for the next faq, better yet, be patient and wait for the next GHB. 

In the past I said these exact things, now? I think it's a load of nonsense, customers dealing with a hobby like this should at least get decent rules, that even goes for the other bottom tier armies. Being "okay with it" or being patient won't get GW to change things, now I think being active in messaging them and more, will get the point across, because something is wrong in that design team. At least in my opinion.  

Edited June 18, 2021 by shinros

[Ogregut]

31 minutes ago, KingBrodd said:

Mate I'm buying into the belief, a similar post was made about Mawtribes a month ago and there was a similar GW response something along the lines of 'Maybe there will be more mouths to feed for this Edition'. Could just be PR talk but I'm eating that salt and hoping it's TRUE. 

Some more plastic ogor characters would be great, I'll actually paint the pile of big guys I've got in a box. Having so many finecast characters really put me off. 

To many armies, not enough time!! 

[whispersofblood]

1 hour ago, Golub87 said:

And this is quite a terrible state of the game. Got it?

Especially given that certain match-ups are even more lopsided.

And you have the nerve to argue patience and to lecture people whose armies have been ruined. I literally can't field a legal army with the models I own. I can't have a legal game even if I looked past the travesty of Slaanesh points and wanted it.

And yeah GW might not be malicious towards certain factions and players. Gross incompetence is also on the table.

 

1 minute ago, shinros said:

So slaanesh players just need to be patient right? Don't worry, next faq will sort the book out, oh it didn't? Just wait for broken realms Kragnos! Oh wait, that didn't do anything either, don't worry just wait for AOS 3 and MSU, I'm sure our book was written for AOS 3, oh no, the points went up again in GHB, don't worry guys, just wait for the next faq, better yet, be patient wait for the next GHB. 

HoS are terrible, its obvious and clear for everyone. But, that doesn't mean that the game itself and the emergent meta will be terrible. To think so would be a fallacy. What @Athrawes is arguing that we should all be building to what we believe is good, and let the meta emerge from that effort, so that we can then with some actual insight, facts, data and statistics identify what works and doesn't work. 

Most AoS and wargame discussion is very inference heavy to begin with, which personally I find barely acceptable. But, we are going off the deep end, because of how we feel about the points costs. Like no one has even posted a hypothetic list yet and had discussion about the capacity for factions to achieve the battle tactics or their grand strategies. We are definitely mostly dealing in untruth.