AoS 2 - Blades of Khorne Discussion

[kenshin620]

32 minutes ago, Surtur said:

 

Edit: Remember the value of multiple artefacts in Khorne lists - some missions require you to have an artefact or a Wizard! I hope none of you considers taking wizards...

But.......rerolls! 😜

Spoiler

 

[Kaz]

1 hour ago, Kaz said:

Hey there, I'm a completely new face here (I've actually been lurking here a LONG time), a longtime Khorne fan here, returning to AOS. Just asking, does the Bloodsecrator, Aspiring Deathbringer, Wrathmonger attack buffs work on Skullcrusher mounts or Mighty Lord of Khorne Flesh Hound, since they aren't command abilities or artifacts? Also, would the Locus of Fury work on Bloodcrusher mounts?

To be seriously honest, I'm still relatively new to AOS, (Been mostly 40K Khorne), although I do like the new stuff quite a fair bit.

Still seems to me that Skulltake had a mistype on GW's part. Maybe an FAQ might solve it? But thanks Bululu for the info!

So for this stuff, can these buffs that aren't command trait/artifact affect mounts/companions (Like juggernauts, flesh hounds, etc.)?

[andysonic1]

14 minutes ago, Aryann said:

What are all options to generate bloodtithe points? 

Same as before: any unit that dies generates a point. There's a prayer that generates 1 point, and there are several artifacts and general traits that add additional blood points when enemy heroes are slain by that unit. Nothing's changed really there.

There are some people interpreting the previews as saying you only get a certain amount per turn or something but this is false.

@kaz regarding Skulltake: yes it's an error in that guy's tome. In the preview it is all melee weapons.

Edited March 16, 2019 by andysonic1

[Kaz]

14 minutes ago, Aryann said:

What are all options to generate bloodtithe points? 

Just watched GMG

Seems somewhat similar to before

1 - Bloody Exemplar - Trade 1 blood tithe for 1 command point

2 - Spelleater Curse - mostly the same

3 - Murderlust - Free move, or charge attempt if within 12"

4 - Apoplectic Frenzy - Free pile in and attack for one unit

5 - Brass Skull Meteor - One enemy unit suffer D3 mortals, then all enemies within 8 inches roll dice, 3+ suffer 1 MW, 6 suffer D3 MW

6 - Relentless Fury - Everyone gets Blood Warriors no respite

7 - Crimson Rain - once per battle, permanent, every subsequent hero phase, all KHORNE models heal D3 wounds

8 - Slaughter Triumphant - shown on Warhammer community

 

[Bjornas]

Has it been figured out how and when the Judgements "disappear" yet?

On the Skulltake batallion, the Khorgoraths lost their +3 attacks but it seems every unit in the batallion gets the extra dmg on 6 to wound now (instead of just the Skullreapers). Useful on a Bloodstoker-whipped unit, for sure.

I'm leaning towards that and the Skullfiend tribe, which'll be useful against units that rely on nearby buffers (such as the ones my regular Nighthaunt opponent uses). Especially if you can send the Hexgorger skulls to coerce wizards into moving from the other side of the table. 

 

 

 

[kenshin620]

3 minutes ago, Kaz said:

So for this stuff, can these buffs that aren't command trait/artifact affect mounts/companions (Like juggernauts, flesh hounds, etc.)?

Buffs from abilities, spells, and prayers do affect mounts/companions unless specified.

[Kaz]

3 minutes ago, andysonic1 said:

Same as before: any unit that dies generates a point. There's a prayer that generates 1 point, and there are several artifacts and general traits that add additional blood points when enemy heroes are slain by that unit. Nothing's changed really there.

There are some people interpreting the previews as saying you only get a certain amount per turn or something but this is false.

@kaz regarding Skulltake: yes it's an error in that guy's tome. In the preview it is all melee weapons.

THANKS MAN

[Kaz]

46 minutes ago, Xasz said:

Khorne was more or less in need of a new book, due to outdated rules and an errata several pages long because of this.

Adding to this issue, Khorne was not really relevant in the meta (for a long time). DoK (Daughters of Khaine) and some other army setups pretty much do what Khorne does but with more bodies (and usually more efficient and saver).

As it stands, pretty much all of the book is known at this point and it seems like a strict downgrade. What GW seemingly did, is redistribute power away from a handful of models to the whole range. This means several small nerfs to a lot of models, so a lot of the range feels 'meh' or like one big 'soup' now. The big problem with this approach is, that while the power is not reeeeeeaaaallllly gone but just distributed differently (at least for the most part, some things are just strictly worse), that not all combinations of units make up for a meaningful setup. This will ultimately lead to setups that will lack something they usually had which feels somewhat bad from a player perspective, especially if your army is somewhat niche.

EDIT: Khorne was and is probably not "bad" but was pretty much locked in a tier 2 to 3 loop for a long time. The new book is not gonna change that and the GHB19 is pretty far away. Hence, the frustration.

Man this kinda scares me... I really do want to pull out my (recently painted) models, but I'm worried about getting crushed...

 

@Bjornasapparently u roll a dice at end of player turn (I think), on 1-4, it disappears, if theres a slaughterpriest within 8 inches, add 1 to the roll

[Rumblefish]

7 minutes ago, andysonic1 said:

 

There are some people interpreting the previews as saying you only get a certain amount per turn or something but this is false.

So when that preview was talking about having more tithe to spend after your opponent had a double turn it literally meant that more of your units will have died so you'll have more tithe. Ha.

[Bjornas]

3 minutes ago, Kaz said:

 

@Bjornasapparently u roll a dice at end of player turn (I think), on 1-4, it disappears, if theres a slaughterpriest within 8 inches, add 1 to the roll

That sounds a bit weird, since when would the skulls have a chance to affect enemy wizards, if they go away the same turn they were summoned?

Edited March 16, 2019 by Bjornas

[andysonic1]

1 minute ago, Rumblefish said:

So when that preview was talking about having more tithe to spend after your opponent had a double turn it literally meant that more of your units will have died so you'll have more tithe. Ha.

I mean, it's not wrong! That's usually how it goes.

1 minute ago, Bjornas said:

That sounds a bit weird, since when would the skulls have a chance to affect enemy wizards, if they go away the same turn they were summoned?

Battle round not player turn. Everyone needs to go watch the book review: 

 

[Coyote]

Clearly having operator error - Does anyone have the update on the WH AOS App?  My app says updated with BoK, but I don’t see any changes. 

[Sedraxis]

8 minutes ago, Kaz said:

Man this kinda scares me... I really do want to pull out my (recently painted) models, but I'm worried about getting crushed..

Please don't let all the initial negative reactions to nerfs ruin all the new goodies, bonuses and tools you are getting.

Khorne was already in a good spot and I don't believe they'll be worse off after this new tome.

Some people just have a hard time dealing with the loss of their abuseable mechanics like congalines, buff-stacking and other outdated rules. Nerfs always seem to hurt more then buffs seem to heal.

Besides, in AoS you as a player has the biggest influence in wether you get crushed or not!

Edited March 16, 2019 by Sedraxis

[Kaz]

5 minutes ago, andysonic1 said:

I mean, it's not wrong! That's usually how it goes.

Battle round not player turn. Everyone needs to go watch the book review: 

 

Yep my bad, I did watch it but got mixed up, sorry if I aided any confusion! 

[Dan.Ford]

47 minutes ago, Surtur said:

I think regarding battalions we have to remember that they contain a CP (50 points value), an artefact  (which I usually price at 30-50 points - ask yourself what you would give for a specific artefact) and a drop reduction (which can be huge). So all in all the new Gorepilgrim for me comes at 40 points. And Dark Feast at 10! Of course values can change depending on the particular list. But if you see it that way, they are very valuable. 

Edit: Remember the value of multiple artefacts in Khorne lists - some missions require you to have an artefact or a Wizard! I hope none of you considers taking wizards...

 

56 minutes ago, andysonic1 said:

Battalions got a huge decrease in points across the board. Gore Pilgrims 200 -> 140, Dark Feast 200 -> 110. BARBARIAN HORDES ARE GO!

If you look at the Gore Pilgrim at 140 

You think you have gain 60 but to re place what is lost.

Re roll prayers

Immumity to battle shock.

To replace what we have lost you have to get an Exalted Deathbringer at 80 points plus an Command one point per turn.

Dark feast , a reduction was needed.

[Kaz]

3 minutes ago, Sedraxis said:

Please don't let all the initial negative reactions to nerfs ruin all the new goodies, bonuses and tools you are getting.

Khorne was already in a good spot and I don't believe they'll be worse off after this new tome.

Some people just have a hard time dealing with the loss of their abuseable mechanics like congalines, buff-stacking and other outdated rules. Nerfs always seem to hurt more then buffs seem to heal.

Besides, in AoS you as a player has the biggest influence in wether you get crushed or not!

Thanks so much!! I’ve always loved Khorne in general (never really liked stormcasts:P), it’s nice to be here! 

[Xasz]

3 minutes ago, Sedraxis said:

Please don't let all the initial negative reactions to nerfs ruin all the new goodies, bonuses and tools you are getting.

Khorne was already in a good spot and I don't believe they'll be worse off after this new tome.

Some people just have a hard time dealing with the loss of their abuseable mechanics like congalines, buff-stacking and other outdated rules. Nerfs always seem to hurt more then buffs seem to heal.

Besides, in AoS you as a player has the biggest influence in wether you get crushed or not!

While I pretty much agree with the general sentiment (streamlining is good and not being discouraged).

I'd be pleasantly surprised to downright shocked if this book turns out to be more than non existent in the tournament meta.

[Retro]

8 minutes ago, Dan.Ford said:

 

If you look at the Gore Pilgrim at 140 

You think you have gain 60 but to re place what is lost.

Re roll prayers

Immumity to battle shock.

To replace what we have lost you have to get an Exalted Deathbringer at 80 points plus an Command one point per turn.

Dark feast , a reduction was needed.

Well the reroll prayers is technically available for free now

[ChaosUndivided]

Idk guys. This feels like a side step than a step back. I can see some good list coming out of this. I think people may just have to adapt.

[HollowHills]

I feel like a list that uses a big blob of skullcrushers with a slaughterpriest using bronzed flesh and a sorcerer Lord for reroll saves of 1 could be quite good. Add a stoker for plus 3 inch to move and charge with reroll all wounds...

I can see that working at a tournament level. 

[Kaz]

I do feel that the Daemon Battalions seem relatively underwhelming,  only stuff like Tyrants of Blood,c Murderhost and Charnel hosts seems decent (even then Murderhost was nerfed)

i do think that the Mortal Khorne Battalions are all pretty great, all of them seem to have pretty strong and ubiquitous benefits. 

We might actually see 2000pts lists with 2 Battalions, since points costs were reduced, and I’ve seen Gloomspite Gitz lists doing that

[Bjornas]

They have gone pretty far on the 'wholly within' theme. Characters are really gonna have to hug their units, it's gonna take some time to get used to having to measure the distance from every model to the respective character.

Is it as extreme with bubble characters in other new battletomes?

[Luke.w]

What do we think of Skarbrand's new warscroll? For those who don't know, if he is not in combat for at least one phase in the battle round, he is treated as having taken 13 wounds on the damage table for the next battle round. This is a huge buff imo. Carnage goes to an immediate 1+ and slaughter to 9 attacks. With access to reroll hits from WoK, Skarbrand is a real threat. Also no need to hit with carnage any more and although it is mortal wounds applied now, they spill over within the enemy unit. With bloodsecrator that is a gauranteed 16 mortal wounds + slaughter.

He is still fragile as anything and slow, but if screened correctly I think he can be a real powerhouse.

[ledha]

14 minutes ago, Bjornas said:

They have gone pretty far on the 'wholly within' theme. Characters are really gonna have to hug their units, it's gonna take some time to get used to having to measure the distance from every model to the respective character.

Is it as extreme with bubble characters in other new battletomes?

yes. I play stormcast and everything barring a very few exception is wholly within, including castellant's light or heraldor's trumpet (the entire terrain need to be wholly within of the heraldor, making his range much worse than before)

[AresX8]

@Luke.w He's had that before, the extra attack on Slaughter is nice, the real kicker is that since Carnage autohits, the more attacks we can throw on him, the bette, like imagine doing 24 mortal wounds automatically  when within range of a Bloodsecrator and Wrathmongers. That's no joke!