GHB17 - Let´s talk order

[Sadysaneto]

Well, seems like GHB17 will manage to blow GHB out of the water - its really great to finally see most of the armies flashed out with battle traits, command traits, artefacts and all (And to believe that those that didnt get new toys, are with new battletomes coming out)

 

Anyways, GW showed of some stuff today, what you thoughts about it?

 

Seraphon - "The Seraphon are one of the most improved armies in the new General’s Handbook, with new allegiance abilities, warlord traits, artefacts and two Warscroll battalions. The most powerful of these is the Lords of Space and Time allegiance ability –  which lets you remove a unit and replace it anywhere on the battlefield more than 9″ from the enemy."

 

Wanderers: 

 

The Wanderers are a fast-moving ranged army, capable of disappearing off of table edges then reappearing – combine this with Melt Away, and you’ll be able to lead powerful melee units on a merry chase around the tabletop while peppering them with deadly ranged fire. The best way to take advantage of this is with Sisters of the Watch – by forcing the enemy to charge you repeatedly, they’re going to have to deal with multiple attacks from Loose to the Last, which allows the Sisters of the Watch to shoot at incoming units.

 

Dispossessed: 

 

If you’re a fan of old-school duardin, the Dispossessed are the army for you. Thanks to Stubborn to the End, Dispossessed units are nearly impossible to shift and you’ll be able to safely take huge units of them.

 

 

 

Fyreslayers:

If you prefer ur-gold over gromril, now’s a great time to get stuck in with a Fyreslayers army thanks to a host of new rules in the Generals Handbook 2017. During the course of the game, you can activate powerful ur-gold runes to swing events in your favour:

 

Oh, yeah, and always read the small letters:

 

The Darkling Covens and the Free Peoples are also getting some special attention in the Generals Handbook 2017, and we thought they both deserved a closer look, so keep your eyes peeled in the coming weeks for our in-depth preview of these factions.

 

 

 

[Carnelian]

Looks awesome. Nothing more to add. Can't wait for the release

[heywoah_twitch]

This is great! I'm residually happy for my friend who plays both Seraphon and Fyreslayers.

[Trout]

My only concern is that they said we will be finding out more in the next few weeks. This implies we aren't anywhere close to the release date. I had thought we would see a release any day now.

[Sheriff]

30 minutes ago, Trout said:

My only concern is that they said we will be finding out more in the next few weeks. This implies we aren't anywhere close to the release date. I had thought we would see a release any day now.

At the rate of announcements it seems to be 1 per week, 2 grand alliances down, 2 to go. (with some smaller previews sprinkled in between). 

So 3rd or 4th week of August I expect. 

[Arkiham]

Friend said "that dispossessed trait is pointless if you take a battalion, and how does it even compare to fyrsayers."

Kinda have to agree with him

 

Only worthwhile one is the teleport, it's all you'll likely see taken across the factions that got it, Dunno why they even bothered with the others 

[Arkiham]

47 minutes ago, Trout said:

My only concern is that they said we will be finding out more in the next few weeks. This implies we aren't anywhere close to the release date. I had thought we would see a release any day now.

Expect it end of 40k konor campaigns, will give them material to cover while they process the results of that 

[Sadysaneto]

15 minutes ago, Arkiham said:

Friend said "that dispossessed trait is pointless if you take a battalion, and how does it even compare to fyrsayers."

Kinda have to agree with him

 

Only worthwhile one is the teleport, it's all you'll likely see taken across the factions that got it, Dunno why they even bothered with the others 

Agree on dispossessed trait. That said i liked the artifacts.

Teleport is bonks, But so is the wanderers ability and fureslayer traits.

[Popisdead]

Think about the Wanderer Melt Away for a second.

 

And... it's useless and ******.  I cannot think of a unit I would want to be charged, that then would have enough survive that I would want to retreat them to be charged again.  Sisters of the Watch?  Unless they are now 120 points I don't want 240 points charged, 7 killed to be able to shoot 2-3 times next turn (if it's my turn).

[MrCharisma]

Interesting but not interesting enough to move me to pure Free People. 

Fireslayers are the real winners for Order under GHB2017, which is no surprise thanks to the start collecting box. 

Looks good otherwise. Order doesn't need much more love compared to Death and Destruction, so I'm happy with this update 

[Veterannoob]

As Fyreslayers die hard I'm stoked, as one using Dispossessed with KO to make them interesting again, I'm stoked.??

loving this so far!

[Aginor]

I had hoped for spells to use for my Seraphon making Slann and Kroak finally worth their points. No new spells it seems.

The teleport bataillon.... if it is cheap and doesnt demand a lot of units it might be good. Otherwise...meh.

But I hope the allegiance abilities are better than that (they cant possibly be worse for Seraphon than the Order ones can they?) and a good amount of point reduction, half of our units is so overcosted it isn't funny anymore.

Our synergies work, that's what keeps us in the game. No need to change those much. It is just the other numbers.

I am still mildly hopeful for that book. But I wanted a real Battletome and it seems we now won't get one, otherwise there wouldn't be so much stuff (still less than I hoped for) in the GHB2017.

[WoollyMammoth]

3 hours ago, Arkiham said:

Friend said "that dispossessed trait is pointless if you take a battalion, and how does it even compare to fyrsayers." 

The Grudgebound War Throng gives this, yes. So obviously you get this without having the restrictions of a battalion. You might argue that the battalion gives you an artifact and better deployment, but we do not know if this is still true with the new handbook. There might be all kinds of awesome things you get with the allegiance stuff. GW figured this ability was really cool and it should be a staple of Duradin. Combine that ability with discounts on hordes, and dwarf hordes become pretty scary.

[ledha]

3 hours ago, Popisdead said:

Think about the Wanderer Melt Away for a second.

 

And... it's useless and ******.  I cannot think of a unit I would want to be charged, that then would have enough survive that I would want to retreat them to be charged again.  Sisters of the Watch?  Unless they are now 120 points I don't want 240 points charged, 7 killed to be able to shoot 2-3 times next turn (if it's my turn).

if you retreat, your opponent will loose one combat phase, which can make the difference between being alive and dead. And he'll still have to roll for another charge (and we all know how a 3" can still miss)

anyway, being able to retreat and shoot is much better than reroll battleshock, i think

We don't know too if the combat/Shooting rules have changed. Imagine being in melee prevent you to shootbeing shooted now. Then melt away become extremely useful

[Sadysaneto]

8 minutes ago, ledha said:

if you retreat, your opponent will loose one combat phase, which can make the difference between being alive and dead. And he'll still have to roll for another charge (and we all know how a 3" can still miss)

anyway, being able to retreat and shoot is much better than reroll battleshock, i think

We don't know too if the combat/Shooting rules have changed. Imagine being in melee prevent you to shootbeing shooted now. Then melt away become extremely useful

And you can run when you retreat.

[ledha]

12 minutes ago, Sadysaneto said:

And you can run when you retreat.

yes, but if you can't run and shoot, then it is better to just retreat

[Nico]

On the Dispossessed, it's essentially deleting the Battalion or making you overpay for it; and it's their only one! Maybe they are halving the cost - can be hard to judge on partial snippets of information.

[someone2040]

I'm a mixed with the Dispossessed. They've definitely been a front runner for potential next army for me, since I have a lot of old Dwarf models from the 90s, some of the newer kits, and seemed like a good potential allies for my Fyreslayers I've just picked up.

I knew I had seen the battle trait somewhere before, so definitely disappointed to hear about it doubling up with the only battalion they get. This is definitely a huge problem IMO, because it seems unlikely we're going to be getting many new battalions in the future. 

I'm also not impressed with the Heavy Metal Ingot. I mean, Warden Kings already re-roll their armour saves, so again, seems like doubling up a bit. I guess you can deal it out to a Runelord, but definitely feels like a thematic, but filler item.

But that Pickaxe looks awesome. That's the kinda stuff I like to see in the faction allegiance abilities, as it'd be far too powerful to dish out to anyone. Dispossessed don't have any abilities from what I can tell to re-roll or add to charge distances, so it has more potentially redeploying shooting units early on (Such as Irondrakes). In particular for Irondrakes, it doesn't seem to count as movement as they're not moving in their preceding movement phase, so they can double shot and potentially be buffed by a Runelord also.

I kinda see it that might be best to put it on a Runelord, so first turn buff some Quarrellers then go mining with the Irondrakes. Pop up next turn, buff the Irondrakes and blast the ****** out of something. 

 

Definitely think this one has given us a good taste of what's to come. Pretty hyped, and definitely want to hear about Free Peoples next as that's my current army.

[Tidings]

6 hours ago, Popisdead said:

Think about the Wanderer Melt Away for a second.

 

And... it's useless and ******.  I cannot think of a unit I would want to be charged, that then would have enough survive that I would want to retreat them to be charged again.  Sisters of the Watch?  Unless they are now 120 points I don't want 240 points charged, 7 killed to be able to shoot 2-3 times next turn (if it's my turn).

This is exactly my reaction. It's such a nice thought, but in practice, any unit of Wanderer archers generally dies in a single round of melee. Let's say Sisters get engaged through a pile in on Eternal Guard nearby. Okay, they can retreat and shoot once, since they moved. Or they can stand still and shoot twice. Still not much extra value. I suppose we have a choice now at least. 

The more interesting bit was where they mentioned Wanderers being able to vanish off the table edge and reappear again. That sounds way more useful. 

[tea_wild_owl]

7 hours ago, Aginor said:

The teleport bataillon.... if it is cheap and doesnt demand a lot of units it might be good. Otherwise...meh

they said that 'The most powerful of these is the Lords of Space and Time allegiance ability', which sounds very cool and opens up some nice strategies and combos.

first of all, it's more reliable than summoning the units. you won't have the flexibility, but you cannot fail the cast and you don't need a slann in your army (at least you don't waste his casting attempts for summoning). you even have unlimited range! see that corner that is 9" away from the enemy, behind enemy lines? I think there could fit a troglodon/bastilodon/carnosaurus to wreck some havoc...

one can finally position mr lollipop (saurus astrolith bearer) next to important units at the front of the battle.

you could send a big thread to the front (bastilodon, engine of the gods,...). to vulnerable and open? just pop a unit of chameleons skinks as a meatshield by their own ability.

teleport the bastilodon onto an objective that can only be taken by heroes/behemoth as seen in the released battleplan. it will hold it for a long time, especially with a cameleon skinks shield or a mystic shield

take a unit of 30 skinks and teleport them in front of  the enemy -  positioning them in a line from one side of the battlefield to the other. if you get the charge, retreat the 3.1". now you limit the whole enemy army to an overall move and charge of 9"/3.1" with a 240 points unit! putting in some shooting and ranged magic (kurnoth, celestium hurikanum ) could become quite devastating. and if you have 2 or 3 of these big blocking units... I think you one can get it

regarding magic, you could teleport Lord kroak to get more enemy units within the range of his spell without the need of a vortex - or u still use it and hit most of the enemy units.

and these are just the first things that come to my mind. I'm really keen to test this out for my seraphons

 

[PraetorDragoon]

People who are dissapointed with the Dispossed Battle Trait should remember that there they also have a "Grudgebound" battletrait and a d6 Grudges table.

[Carnelian]

So much angst....so little time (and information!)

[angrycontra]

I think people shouldn't judge armies just based on these previews. A lot of armies have obviously 2 if not more allegiance abilities (like dispos grudges, flesh eater feeding frenzy and possibly some "relocation" ability for wanderers). Also we haven't even seen basically any points yet. Imagine if unit of 10 gladeguard cost like 80 points. That would make massive difference regardless of allegiance abilities. And finally, seriously ANYTHING is better than order battleshock re-rolls, so excess complaining seems pointless. If you wanted to play high elves (or something else with no allegiance abilities) then you have every right to complain otherwise, just wait for more leaks or the book itself.

[Sadysaneto]

Give ingot to umgrin and let it burn.

[firebat]

The High Elf Stuff looks amazing 

<sobs>