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firebat last won the day on November 21 2018

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121 Celestant-Prime

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  1. "Why is there no positive side to my models being shot in the face with a cannon!!!"
  2. Both 25mm and 32mm bases can attack in 2 ranks with 1" attacks against similar sized bases. The 32mm only lose out with 2" attacks or when fighting models that are on larger bases as long as you're not ranking the models up fantasy style Maths (Just to be precise like and because I have nothing else to do at 1am it seems) We know x is 16mm and y is 32mm because we know the size of the base so using Pythagoras we can work out how far the centre of the 2nd rank is from the centre of the first: x² + z² = y² y. 32² = 1024 and x. 16² = 256 so z = sqr(1024-256) =27.718 But then it's the edge of the base to the edge of the base so we need to remove the base radius from that which gives 11.713. We then double that to get the distance between the edge of the base in the 2nd rank and the edge of the enemy base so 23.426. Google says 1" is 25.4mm so you almost have a whole 2mm to spare I did it for if the enemy is on a 40mm base too and the distance between is 23.96 so you can still attack with a 2nd rank against models on 40mm bases in theory but in practice it won't work out as well because the models don't rank up against each other so cleanly. in fact even a 100mm base only makes it 0.3mm out from the 2nd rank being able to attack. I also checked on the 3rd rank of 32mm bases if you had 2" weapons (but cheated and used CAD to do it) and the 3rd rank, closest point to closest point is actually only 1.86mm away from being able to attack too. So that was close enough that I checked with 32mm bases fighting against 25mm bases and that ends up still being 1mm away from being able to attack with the third rank with 2" weapons if you had them. Closer than you might think though. What was that about simplifying weapon ranges again? If you haven't been attacking with a 2nd rank with 32mm bases though chances are you're doing yourself out of attacks if the models are base to base.
  3. Really difficult to tell with that Keeper without knowing how the weapon options work. I presume the choice is Whip, Hand or Knife but I don't think much of the whip without knowing the rest of the options the model can have. Suggests the Knife and hand have their own special rules too though. My flat out guess for the knife is that it generates D3 depravity points if it causes a wound. Curious what it's points and summoning cost will be now though considering it's damage overall didn't massively change. 3" range on the big hitting claws is really good. I presume that Dark Temptations and Irresistible Challenge will also generate depravity points so it really feels like we're going to be swimming in them without any changes to costs or other things to spend them on.
  4. https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/04/23/slaanesh-the-new-warscrolls/
  5. Ok lets say 5 editions then. Just because the rules have changed the principles of the army haven't over 6th, 7th, 8th Fantasy and into AoS. Daemonettes are a bit better than they used to be, the rest plays pretty much the same. And the objectives are either set before the game so you know where they are anyway or end up being random and you popping down your terrain piece before you know where they are isn't going to matter. That neon sign isn't worth much because it's in the context of some massively expensive unit having to run right at the enemy. Archon having to attack from within 6" of it is easy to avoid and screen for well in advance for far cheaper than he's worth. Or is this going to be one of those discussions where extra units get piled in to try and reinforce some point because instead of your board control being able to move anywhere any time and attack from any direction you've set up some point you have to attack from to make the most of your already super killy hero. I've already said it has worth from a misdirection point of view several times but deploying the terrain on one flank to make it look like you're attacking from there and then deploying Archaon or an exalted kepper on the other flank isn't making use of the reroll to hit ability, but is probably more useful.
  6. I'm a seeker of Slaanesh and I rolled a double 6 for my run move 😛 Yeah the misdirection aspect is one of the points I was trying to make. Being able to put it in one place, deploy to another and then move to a third. You're free to ignore it and never use it but it's there as a back up if necessary or perhaps a counterattack point. OMG it's going to make my big hitty character even more hitty isn't going to really work though I don't think.
  7. I think covering the objectives is probably the best use of it. As you say it lets you run off and then summon some daemonettes back at home if you really need to with the refund being it makes summoning a unit that you don't really want to summon a bit cheaper when you want to be spending the points on more hero's ideally. Leaving an Enrapturess at home largely depends on other changes. It looks like the damonettes might lose the locus ability so you don't really need to keep a hero along with them so it depends if the Choir of Torments battalion changes as that thing is so stupidly good.
  8. Because in any movement based army it's not about numbers on a page being big, it's about leveraging your movement to get the outcome you want at the right time. Sure in theory it gives a big model that does lots of damage even more damage but that damage is pointless if it's overkill and pointless if you're telegraphing to your opponent exactly where your attack is going to come from and since it has a short range of 6" and the terrain pieces are placed before deployment you might as well attach a big neon sign to it saying "THERE'S GOING TO BE A BIG ATTACK COMING FROM HERE". It will work beautifully against anyone who just deploys all their army right at the front and never measures how far your units can move and will prove to be largely ineffective against anyone that knows how to play well. Seriously, just wait for turn 2? and then what? wait for turn 3? wait for turn 4? If you're sitting around for even a turn you're not using the greatest advantage of the army. I've been playing it over the course of 4 editions of the game now and in general the first turn is used to re position the army and act like a 2nd deployment phase (depending on how much shooting my opponent has). Not run at the enemy like i'm some Khorne player. It does depend where you can place it obviously. If you can place it somewhere near the middle then clearly it will be better but all the images seem to show it as being at the back and being in the middle would be pretty good so i'd expect it to be placed more like the loonshrine at least 12" away from enemy territory, if not more at the back of the board.
  9. Those terrain rules seem really bad to me. I guess for free the depravity points refund might be nice now and then and it could be good to plonk down as a bit of misdirection but for an army built around movement and positioning the hero reroll is worthless. Also surely with all these extra depravity points the costs are going to go up because as I said in the topic in discussion, assuming the Keeper gets buffed up to 14 wounds like the BT and LoD it's buy 2 get 1 free not even accounting for them generating points on abilities and wounds they inflict.
  10. No it specifically mentions daemon wizards as different from mortal wizards: "Regardless of which of the hosts you choose, your Slaanesh Wizards will have three spell lores to choose from, each offering new ways to beguile your foes – or obliterate them. Daemon Wizards, for example, will be able to shred hordes with Hysterical Frenzy." "Mortal Wizards, on the other hand, have access to a suite of cunning sorceries like Battle Rapture – a fantastic option for shielding a large unit of Chaos Knights or Hellstriders from battleshock tests." then "Greater Daemon Wizards – that’s Shalaxi Helbane and the Keeper of Secrets – have some of the very best options in the book. Song of Secrets allows you to squeeze loads of depravity points out of your enemies, while Slothful Stupor can completely shut down enemy Heroes."
  11. Difficult to tell a lot about that article without knowing about the rest of the changes. The Daemonette ability of generating extra hits being made an allegiance ability is really good and the change for bigger units works out about the same. The now Godseekers host ability getting nerfed a bit I kind of expected. Being able to summon units in at 9" from then enemy and then only need to roll a 7 to make the charge was a bit too good and the supposed downside wasn't even that with Slaanesh movement. Be interesting to see if Devotee of Torment sticks around and if it does where it goes. Seeing as it's stupidly good at the moment it wouldn't shock me if it vanishes. I do wonder if the depravity point costs will stay the same. I feel I generate a good amount as it is so being able to get even more from both abilities and Mortal wounds seems a bit much based on just the article but who knows. It seems to imply that heralds might be becoming wizards again which would be great. It mentions daemon wizards and then talks about Greater Daemon wizards as they're own thing. Song of Secrets seems really good although obviously it depends on the army you're against. Really curious to see how the profile for the Keeper of Secrets changes now. If it goes up to 12 wounds, that's 11 depravity points and so nearly half another Keeper to be summoned if the costs don't change. I'd be willing to take one just to throw it away against some multi wound unit, all the time gleefully taunting my opponent that the more they actually damage my characters the faster I can bring new ones back. Pretty happy with the daemon stuff on there in general but then again I was happy with the daemon side to begin with. After having thought about things more since the release yesterday I wonder if they're going to roll the Khorne Bloodbound units and Tzeentch Acolytes into the new StD/Darkoath stuff like they did with the Tzaangors into Beasts. I always thought that Slaanesh mortals should mirror Khorne in a way and that would be a good way to do it if it opens up a bunch of choices with maybe a few Slaanesh mortal units much like they tended to do with the cult troops in 40k. Slaangors I never felt really fit anyway and it's a good other side to the more beastial choices available to Nurgle and Tzeentch. Probably wishful thinking though.
  12. Being willfully ignorant contributes less than the criticism. This has been addressed multiple times that you're the one latching on to the word mortal as the be and end all when the Arcanites and Clan Pestilens have been mentioned multiple times. I'd argue that the whole reason that the Disciples of Tzeentch was such a great release was because it included the Arcanites as a whole extra faction on top of the mortals and daemons and if it had just been an update to the daemon models then there would have been far less interest in them.
  13. No you can't because they don't exist. No one is talking about mortals as in Slaves to Darkness. You're completely missing the point and latching onto the word mortal as somehow being the important bit when it's not. No one cares about Chaos Warriors. Everyone can take Chaos Warriors. I can take them in a Tzeentch army. They play largely the same regardless of how you mark them. The issue isn't if they happen to be a daemon or not. It's cult troops. It's like them releasing a Slaanesh book for 40k and leaving out the Emperors Children and the Noise Marines but you'd be saying it's fine because they can still take Chaos Marines despite the other god specific legions being included in their own books.
  14. Khorne = Daemons, Bloodbound, Mortals. Tzeentch = Daemons, Arcanites, Mortals Nurgle = Daemons, Maggotkin, Mortals, Skaven Slaanesh = Daemons, Mortals
  15. This isn't going to happen. There aren't going to be a bunch of new rules for units, characters and battalions that there are no models or images for just because they're going to turn up at some unspecified future date for the other game.
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