Grimrock Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Perturbato said: ok, so wrathmongers can buff ranged attack (maybe FAQ incomming), priest can chant blessings at start of hero phase and prayers during hero phase, and juggement follow the other invocation rules : only priests can dispell it and they stay at the end of round. We don't know if we have to choose between prayers and invocation. And we can take BoC units to add a few versatility to the army ! Is that based on the Khorne article they just put up? The wording on the wrathmongers ability looks like it did pre-faq when the book was released, so I think it's more likely they just goofed and put up the old text. Definitely wouldn't be the first time that they made a mistake on these articles. If it is correct though and they reverted the FAQ then skull cannons would become seriously strong. Two shots each, hitting on 2's with All Out Attack or when targeting large units and re-rolling 1's for the locus. A unit of two could kill a hero per turn without much effort just by shooting, and combined with their melee attacks they could be absolutely devastating. Back them up with a Wrath of Khorne thirster for the double swing on his flail and better locus range and yeah... good times. I'm pretty happy to read about the BoC too, I think this is a much better way to do things. No more fiddling around with huge battalions completely dominating your list, just dragging and dropping a unit or two feels way better. Now I just have to see if I can resist getting a unit of bullgors or bestigors. Edited June 30, 2021 by Grimrock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 16 minutes ago, Grimrock said: Is that based on the Khorne article they just put up? The wording on the wrathmongers ability looks like it did pre-faq when the book was released, so I think it's more likely they just goofed and put up the old text. Definitely wouldn't be the first time that they made a mistake on these articles. If it is correct though and they reverted the FAQ then skull cannons would become seriously strong. well the designers admitted it was intended back in the days of the previous FAQ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamik Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 So it says you can garrison up to 15 models in a regular defensible terrain piece, which I assume the Skull Altar is since it isn't Large or Very Large. If I put a Bloodsecrator and then 10 Bloodreavers in it, does the Bloodsecrator get the +1 Save and -1 to hit rolls targeting him AND Look Out, Sir! for an extra -1 malus to incoming fire? I think it would be fun to garrison a Slaughterpriest with Blood Sacrifice in the Altar with his sacrificial Bloodreavers. The garrison gets him down to a 4+ save, apply other bonuses etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimrock Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 15 minutes ago, Perturbato said: well the designers admitted it was intended back in the days of the previous FAQ Yeah, which made it a real bummer when they nerfed it last time. I do understand that skull cannons might be a little OP with it, but I'm hoping that they didn't mess up and it was intentional. Having viable shooting in Khorne would be a really exciting shakeup and could make for some really interesting lists. Soul grinders could be interesting, maybe even ungor raiders or a cygor. That being said I don't trust war-com at all so I guess we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 the real use of it is the aura of bloodsecrator 16' from any part of the skull altar ! we can add an aspiring deathbringer too 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimrock Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Perturbato said: the real use of it is the aura of bloodsecrator 16' from any part of the skull altar ! we can add an aspiring deathbringer too If I'm not mistaken, I think the wording on the bloodsecrator and aspiring deathbringer always specified melee attacks. That made it pretty obvious the wrathmonger ability was intentional (even without the developer confirmation). If they all worked on melee attacks it would be waaay too broken. Four shot skull cannons would destroy the world. Edited June 30, 2021 by Grimrock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darksteve Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 20 minutes ago, Grimrock said: Yeah, which made it a real bummer when they nerfed it last time. I do understand that skull cannons might be a little OP with it, but I'm hoping that they didn't mess up and it was intentional. Having viable shooting in Khorne would be a really exciting shakeup and could make for some really interesting lists. Soul grinders could be interesting, maybe even ungor raiders or a cygor. That being said I don't trust war-com at all so I guess we'll see. So in the limited window before the FAQ nerfed us I played the skull cannon + wrathmonger combo. (Also included some other interesting interactions with a herald and the first strike artefact) What I'll say about it is that it never felt particularly OP especially compared to how other shooting units have developed in the game. (Looking at stormcast crossbowmen) What I think it does do is give us a much needes piece to our battleplan. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldhat Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Adding Beasts has me excited even if just for fun variety. What are folks planning on adding from them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 6 minutes ago, Oldhat said: Adding Beasts has me excited even if just for fun variety. What are folks planning on adding from them? I have absolutely no knowledge on it but they must probably fill some gaps in our rosters ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimrock Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 43 minutes ago, Oldhat said: Adding Beasts has me excited even if just for fun variety. What are folks planning on adding from them? I've always wanted to add in some bullgors or bestigors for a solid punch that has some good rend, but it just occurred to me that the coherency rules do a number on them. I think if anything I'd probably look at bringing in a Ghorgon or two to get some non-character monsters. Ungor raiders could be an interesting choice since they add a little ranged punch and can get onto objectives early. Centigors could be an option as well but I think flesh hounds might be a better choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charleston Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) Regarding the Article and the FAQ I am a bit carefull. Concidering it is GW, it seems more likely someone wrote the article who just got the battletome handed over and who wrote it without knowing an FAQ is out there. The missing FAQ on the Website is also mainly a technical reason as they will upload the new ones (Which btw cuts ties to play 2.0 legacy with faq's in the easy way). Meanwhile, I hope that this is intended. It would give us, tgether with the ability to use more warscrolls, just the badly needed whif of fresh air to start somewhat refreshed rulewise into the new edition. 2 hours ago, Zamik said: So it says you can garrison up to 15 models in a regular defensible terrain piece, which I assume the Skull Altar is since it isn't Large or Very Large. If I put a Bloodsecrator and then 10 Bloodreavers in it, does the Bloodsecrator get the +1 Save and -1 to hit rolls targeting him AND Look Out, Sir! for an extra -1 malus to incoming fire? I think it would be fun to garrison a Slaughterpriest with Blood Sacrifice in the Altar with his sacrificial Bloodreavers. The garrison gets him down to a 4+ save, apply other bonuses etc. It's fine, any monster can get lucky and tear it down Edited June 30, 2021 by Charleston 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamik Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, Charleston said: It's fine, any monster can get lucky and tear it down Yeah, with my luck a monster would run straight at it, raze it, and I'd roll a bunch of 1s for all the garrisoned models. AH well, I'm just enjoying the mental image of a slaughterpriest stuffing himself and ten bloodreavers into a utility closet for the battle. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Krungharr Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Are Blood Warriors with double axes worth taking over the Gorefists? I'm really not seeing the benefit over the potential MW returns of the fists; though they certainly look pretty neat with 2 axes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent of Chaos Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 @Perturbato its strange they've used the original version of Crimson Haze and not the FAQ version which specifies melee weapons. The warscroll in the app was updated for the FAQ so unless they are changing the warscroll back I think its just a lazy misprint for the article. Bloodblessings are described as prayers in their own description so pretty certain priests cant do a blessing and a prayer in the same turn however it does sound like the Judgements will no longer disappear on their own accord so that definitely pushes their value up. Especially if Wraith Axe stays at 5+ to chant that will make it very difficult for an opposing priest to banish it. Being able to garrison the bloodsecrator in the altar will be handy for the protection and slightly boosted aura range. The BoC 1 in 4 units thing is very interesting. I wonder where this rule comes from and if it is unique to khorne? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaskier Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 35 minutes ago, Agent of Chaos said: The BoC 1 in 4 units thing is very interesting. I wonder where this rule comes from and if it is unique to khorne? It's going to be part of the new Coalition rules - which will also explain how Khorme/Tzeentch/etc armies can run marked Slaves to Darkness units - and it's a guarantee marked Beasts will not be unique to Khorne, they'll be available to the other god factions too. It certainly allows us to approach our armies in an entirely different way. 1 in 4 units can be marked Beasts is the change I never knew I wanted until right now! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimrock Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said: Are Blood Warriors with double axes worth taking over the Gorefists? I'm really not seeing the benefit over the potential MW returns of the fists; though they certainly look pretty neat with 2 axes. In this edition there's a chance that rerolling 1's could be handy due to the cap on +1 to hit but considering the new coherency rules, the fact that they wound on 4's, and the fact that they have no rend, I don't think you should be looking to blood warriors to actually do damage in combat. I'd go gorefist all the way (at least until they swap them to make the second axe more viable in the next book like they did with the fists in this one). Back to the wrathmonger conversation, I think I've found the best reason for them to not affect ranged attacks. If you pick a chimera as your Beast of Chaos inclusion (previously impossible, but they might very well work if the wording on the article is anything to go by) then the wrathmongers would double up their shooting allowing an automatic 2d6 mortal wounds to anything within 14". The damage scales down pretty quickly as they take wounds, but the Chimera is only 220 points and has a ton of melee profiles to benefit from bonus attacks as well. You could easily fit two in a wrathmonger bubble and that alpha would be back breaking for a lot of armies. Edited July 1, 2021 by Grimrock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drezden Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 All I'm thinking about now is that we need to pray and wait for a new battletome, what is now looks like some kind of porridge without an idea for an army with outdated profiles and rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 3 minutes ago, Drezden said: All I'm thinking about now is that we need to pray and wait for a new battletome, what is now looks like some kind of porridge without an idea for an army with outdated profiles and rules. well saturday we will have a lot of FAQ, we hope it will clarified all of this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charleston Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 8 hours ago, Jaskier said: It certainly allows us to approach our armies in an entirely different way. 1 in 4 units can be marked Beasts is the change I never knew I wanted until right now! Actually that is more awesome the longer I am thinking about it. I always loved Bestigors and wanted to run some, also a Ghorgon has exactly the punch we lack (-1 Rend 3D Profile). Ungors may be a nice meatshield althrough they really compete with bloodreivers for the slot. But all in all, It looks like a BoC SC! is on the way to me Actually, with the option to play BoC and StD as part of the alligience and with the reverted Wrathmonger FAQ BoK would turn back into a damn enjoyable faction for 3.0. Feels almost like having a new Battletome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perturbato Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 yeah so i asked the play tester in the article and i'ts one prayer per phase yeah ^^ i wasn't objective at all i know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimeToWaste85 Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 5 hours ago, Charleston said: Actually that is more awesome the longer I am thinking about it. I always loved Bestigors and wanted to run some, also a Ghorgon has exactly the punch we lack (-1 Rend 3D Profile). Ungors may be a nice meatshield althrough they really compete with bloodreivers for the slot. But all in all, It looks like a BoC SC! is on the way to me Actually, with the option to play BoC and StD as part of the alligience and with the reverted Wrathmonger FAQ BoK would turn back into a damn enjoyable faction for 3.0. Feels almost like having a new Battletome Wrathmongers babysitting two skull cannons and two soul grinders, say what? Fill in with cheap Bloodreavers, underworld bands (oh, cheap blood tithe points and a dispel from Magore’s doggy) a slaughter priest for the bronzed flesh and one of the Underworld bands with a sorcerer (ew) for mystic shield. Well hello there, obnoxiousness. Throw in Scyla for his 8” pile-in attack to work around Unleash Hell. Sound about right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrk Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 Any opinion on Exalted Deathbringer loadout? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordDave Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 On 6/30/2021 at 6:58 PM, Oldhat said: Adding Beasts has me excited even if just for fun variety. What are folks planning on adding from them? Since Monsters seems more of a thing now was thinking of allied Fomoroid Crusher or Cat thing from StD, but some of the BoC monsters look quite interesting. Also Bullgors, cos why not? Basically excited to paint something that’s not a small dude on foot or a daemon… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charleston Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 7 hours ago, TimeToWaste85 said: Wrathmongers babysitting two skull cannons and two soul grinders, say what? Fill in with cheap Bloodreavers, underworld bands (oh, cheap blood tithe points and a dispel from Magore’s doggy) a slaughter priest for the bronzed flesh and one of the Underworld bands with a sorcerer (ew) for mystic shield. Well hello there, obnoxiousness. Throw in Scyla for his 8” pile-in attack to work around Unleash Hell. Sound about right? You sound quite upset about this theorycraft which makes me wonder why? It may sound like an obnoxious combination but we have experienced even worse during a long duration of AoS 2. While Wrathmongers are a very potent force multiplier to the few shooting attacks we have, they die quite fast against ranged attacks. Also Soulgrinders are not the most reliable shooters with a 4+ to hit. While I agree on Skullcannons beeing really doped up by this I don't expect people to play more than a unit of 3 of them as they have a huge footprint and can be easy tied down. Also concider that in casual games people have a feeling for what is obnoxious and for competetive noone should bat an eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordDave Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 3 hours ago, Pyrk said: Any opinion on Exalted Deathbringer loadout? I’ve got the spear one, the MW output is nice when it works, but not reliable. Being able to stand behind someone and fight was handy, but not sure if new coherency rules will scupper that… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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