Playing Cities of Sigmar: are you really?

[dekay]

1 hour ago, Kugane said:

I think COS  may have too many options and variables that it makes it hard to playtest and build a decent list on the spot. There are few units that are clear auto-take.

That is probably true! We've figured out some powerful combinations early, but given with how many variables we're working, it's possible that more will come in time. Armies like flesheaters or daughters of Khaine, with their extremely limited unit rosters, were able to figure out the most broken combos in the matter of weeks. We might need more time to find all of them. 

[Satyrical Sophist]

2 minutes ago, dekay said:

That is probably true! We've figured out some powerful combinations early, but given with how many variables we're working, it's possible that more will come in time. Armies like flesheaters or daughters of Khaine, with their extremely limited unit rosters, were able to figure out the most broken combos in the matter of weeks. We might need more time to find all of them. 

I mentioned earlier, but CoS has 152 warscrolls. That's a lot of combinations.

[nuttyknatty]

Playing Cities of Sigmar? Well Me and @Baz are going to give it a good try next week with a 2,500pts a side battle using all of the Streets of Death rules and a sprinkling of Arcane Objectives.

I’ll be fielding an Anvilgard force made of Freeguild whilst @Baz will be bringing a Living City list!

 

You can’t get more CoS than this!!😍😍😍

[Moldek]

I don’t play CoS but I like reading the exchange of point of views here.

It does seem like people who wanted to have a easily playable list with an old wfb army have a tougher challenge. I understand why it can suck; on the other hand it’s not a problem specific to AoS since a lot of factions struggled for years with outdated army books, and some units gained or lost power through the editions. Still it feels like with a bit of flexibility you could do some interesting dwarves or empire lists if you try.

On the other side I get that it’s frustrating to see people playing « half the army » and complaining that it sucks. There’s so much cool modeling opportunities too for a combined force. Still most people complaining are just venting or a bit emotional about the good old days and it’s not a reason to start thinking of « old world players » as a bunch of sour grapes.

Except for a certain frozen goat who seems hell bent on screaming it’s hatred to everyone, in every thread, no matter what response it gets... it’s starting to feel like trolling, sorry, troggothing...

to sum it up, let’s all be nice to eachother, also I’m not a mod  😅

[SwampHeart]

9 hours ago, Icegoat said:

If someone can show me a competitive list using my old ironbreakers my empire only units and no dam storm cast or tree people I'll concede that we have the best army book ever but that army doesn't exist. Because GW warped the freeguild army into the dark elf buddy force with their wood elf and dwarf friends. Who need a lot of help from their space marine saviours to win. 

Long live the old world. 

You could have just typed 'I'm too cheap to buy new things needed to be able to play with the new book' - would have been faster, easier, and more concise. Also if you think SCE are needed or even actually very good in CoS - again you're bad at the game. Most CoS winning lists are running 0-1 SCE units in them because they don't fit well in the book at all. 

[Paladin of Khorne]

5th edition empire was more inclusive of elves and dwarves; it wasn’t until 6th edition GW streamlined them into almost total human focus. If anything, this tome allows for the vintage empire feel more than the recent Empire iterations did. 

Nothing like an alliance of Dwarves, Elves, and Men to fight evil. Til men ****** it up that is...

[Maturin]

6 hours ago, SwampHeart said:

You could have just typed 'I'm too cheap to buy new things needed to be able to play with the new book'

Ahem

[Maturin]

16 hours ago, Icegoat said:

Long live the old world. 

And it's coming back soon, aka 3 years ^^. Can't wait.

[Maturin]

16 hours ago, Icegoat said:

If someone can show me a competitive list using my old ironbreakers my empire only units and no dam storm cast or tree people I'll concede that we have the best army book ever but that army doesn't exist.

Give us a precise list of what you own, I'm pretty sure we can make a great list out of it :).

Using COS Hallowheart, I ravaged a friend playing the new Ironjaws. He charged t1 is Maw Crusha and 6 gore guntas into my 20 PG supported by 2*10 Handgunners and 20 SoTW. He ravaged my Handguners, killed 7 PG and that was it. My turn, I destroyed him, he conceded.
Believe me, if you know what you're doing, COS is a powerhouse, we've got so much flexibility, it's incredible!

[Kramer]

11 hours ago, The Nameless One said:

Playing Cities of Sigmar? Well Me and @Baz are going to give it a good try next week with a 2,500pts a side battle using all of the Streets of Death rules and a sprinkling of Arcane Objectives.

I’ll be fielding an Anvilgard force made of Freeguild whilst @Baz will be bringing a Living City list!

 

You can’t get more CoS than this!!😍😍😍

Streets of death is really fun if you have plenty of terrain! The more the better. 
Enjoy! 

[Mogwai Man]

17 hours ago, Icegoat said:

If someone can show me a competitive list using my old ironbreakers my empire only units and no dam storm cast or tree people I'll concede that we have the best army book ever but that army doesn't exist. Because GW warped the freeguild army into the dark elf buddy force with their wood elf and dwarf friends. Who need a lot of help from their space marine saviours to win. 

Long live the old world. 

It's supposed to be a cosmopolitan force, if you're playing a mono list and failing, that's on you. Also CoS doesn't need stormcast to win.

[adreal]

When cities was announced I was excited and apprehensive for what it ment for my wanderers army (2k built from the old battalion).

I lost glade guard and 4 out of my 5 heroes (I had started to play heavy sisters of the watch).

When cities dropped i was happy, my surviving warscrolls got buffs to make them more universal and good, with some point adjustments that do actually seem fair.

I needed to add in some other stuff to make my army fit into 2k, so I looked at other aelven options (I play a wanderers army) to fill out what I needed.

Shadow warriors give me a good shooting unit that isn't static, and their deployment rules fit wanderers to a tee, so taking (at the time) 10 was no drama for me.

I've always wanted a big beasty for my wanderers, I can now include a forest dragon, so taking a Dreadlord and converting up a wild rider prince wasn't hard at all.

 

After playing in a local tournament, my lack of movement really hampered me, so out went a nomad prince, in came another 10 shadow warriors. I could have gone dark riders, but only 5 didnt feel like they would do enough.

 

I have a nice themed army that does seem to have some teeth, limited due to choices yes, but still, I like how it plays

[Double Misfire]

Kinda feel like Wood Elves are the exception to the lost units rule. If anything they got a bunch of units back and gained new ones with Living City Sylvaneth. 😉😁

[Aloth_Corfiser]

Still having lost the Wanderer ranged specialist heroes hurts soo much. ;(
It had such a nice gritty feeling to face Demon Princes or Arkhans Legions with these little guys.
At this point I am considering switching back to mixed order .... or just wait for Hysh Aelves. So yeah, I am narrow minded about that - even allying in Sylvaneth seems out of the question to me. 

Don't want to come across as overly whiny, however: Is anyone else bugged about the limited artefact choice for the Cities? (3 for every City) This is the only major gripe for me - apart from that the Book is good and executed well considering the Options you have.

[dekay]

15 minutes ago, Aloth_Corfiser said:

Don't want to come across as overly whiny, however: Is anyone else bugged about the limited artefact choice for the Cities? (3 for every City) This is the only major gripe for me - apart from that the Book is good and executed well considering the Options you have.

The choice is limited, but at least most of them are actually good. They are often taken instead of generic realm or order artifacts (with exception of Ignax Scales and Thermalrider Cloak) and that's more than some other factions can claim. My complaint about artifacts comes from the fixed realms rule, though. This really is limiting in many ways and I don't think that such limitation was necessary.

[Fulcanelli]

45 minutes ago, Aloth_Corfiser said:

It had such a nice gritty feeling to face Demon Princes or Arkhans Legions with these little guys.

This. I've started an army of CoS after the release of the battletome. I've never run Empire, Dwarfs or Elves before, but I now like the concept of normal people fighting against big monster, demi-god and supernatural powers.

Regarding the OP, I completely agree, this faction is designed as melting pot... and yet my choice FOR NOW is to go full humans – However, I'll convert some units in order to make them human (for example my Cogsmith is human) and not lose effectiveness.

The reason to exclude some races for my CoS list is purely "aesthetic": I like strong identity in an army and therefore visual uniformity on the table.  Someone might argue that colour scheme can fix this, but elves or stormcasts alongside humans...it just doesn't sound visually good to me.

So, this is only a matter of taste... I don't play ultra-competitive games, but CoS give me (and probably others gamers) the opportunity to converting unique stuff (what I enjoy most) and deploy a visually rewarding army.  Also, I am aware I'm not using the book in the appropriate way 

[zilberfrid]

1 hour ago, Fulcanelli said:

This. I've started an army of CoS after the release of the battletome. I've never run Empire, Dwarfs or Elves before, but I now like the concept of normal people fighting against big monster, demi-god and supernatural powers.

Regarding the OP, I completely agree, this faction is designed as melting pot... and yet my choice FOR NOW is to go full humans – However, I'll convert some units in order to make them human (for example my Cogsmith is human) and not lose effectiveness.

The reason to exclude some races for my CoS list is purely "aesthetic": I like strong identity in an army and therefore visual uniformity on the table.  Someone might argue that colour scheme can fix this, but elves or stormcasts alongside humans...it just doesn't sound visually good to me.

So, this is only a matter of taste... I don't play ultra-competitive games, but CoS give me (and probably others gamers) the opportunity to converting unique stuff (what I enjoy most) and deploy a visually rewarding army.  Also, I am aware I'm not using the book in the appropriate way 

I agree with you, to a point. My elves have the same poofy sleeves as their human brothers, because they use their weapons or have additional greenstuff. I really like them having different heads, different size and different gender, but the fashion sense is very similar. And yes, this could well mean that there are elves among the pistoleers, but not among the Dark Riders.

For the Stormcast it is a bit more difficult, they are very distinct. I would argue that Karl Franz and his collegue General are big enough to stand in for them, but otherwise you'd have to do with cutting off their shoulderpads, putting a better head on them and hoping that this is enough to make them fit. Their distorted body proportions do make this a hard sell for elves, (though the female is a possibility), and dwarves are an even poorer fit. You could add a few cogs and greebles in the joints, and make it a dwarf-controlled mecha/power armour.

Edited December 23, 2019 by zilberfrid

[Myrdin]

Whats the point of going "Mixed Order" when this book by its very nature integrates mixed order and has rules and allegiances built in to support it in better way than the GBA Order book ever had ?

Considering you can encompass SCE, S, and KO into your army and ally with everybody else, NOT playing COS but still wanting to play Mixed Order makes no sense to me.

Edited December 23, 2019 by Myrdin

[zilberfrid]

5 minutes ago, Myrdin said:

Whats the point of going "Mixed Order" when this book by its very nature integrates mixed order and has rules and allegiances built in to support it in better way than the GBA Order book ever had ?

Considering you can encompass SCE, S, and KO into your army and ally with everybody else, NOT playing COS but still wanting to play Mixed Order makes no sense to me.

It does not have rules for Fyreslayers (except as mercs), Idoneth, DoK, Silver Tower minis, Carmine Dragon or Seraphon. The "Inspiring" also works on more factions than the equivalent in Cities.

Most of the time Cities will be better, but if you really want to use Carmine Dragon, you have no other choice.

[Aloth_Corfiser]

44 minutes ago, Myrdin said:

Whats the point of going "Mixed Order" when this book by its very nature integrates mixed order and has rules and allegiances built in to support it in better way than the GBA Order book ever had ?

Considering you can encompass SCE, S, and KO into your army and ally with everybody else, NOT playing COS but still wanting to play Mixed Order makes no sense to me.

I meant it in a way that reflects the units I really want to play:
For example: In a Cities of Sigmar Army I am unable to use the Heroes I like and the Proxies just destroy some immersion for me. (Playing Elves as Humans and vice versa)
When I want to use Wayfinders, Archmages, Waywatchers, Glade Lords, Spellweavers, Dragon-Nobles, Glade Guard, Reavers,  etc. etc. - then it is in my humble view, necessary to go with mixed Order. 
Maybe I also want to kitbash Models in way that they seem to use a certain artefact - a department the Cities book is clearly lacking in. Same when I want to have an Army from a different realm than Aqshy or Ghyran.... .
Granted I tend to imagine completely "unplayable" Lists  from a competitive point of view, - so in the end the Question if something "makes no sense" is a Question of Playstyle preference.
 

Edited December 23, 2019 by Aloth_Corfiser

[Myrdin]

I am not picking a fight. "Makes no sense" is literally what it means, so no need to go trying to find a deeper meaning behind it.

I personally am not keen on using allies in general. And as such I would never play a Grand Alliance army regardless of Faction which is basically an amalgamation of random allies with no actual rules to tie it in together. If I want something thats not fitting as an ally unit, I will convert the model to make it fit (example a Beastmen Demon prince I converted to go along with my "pure" Beastmen, though it does use the Allies rules), so this has never been an issue.

Hey if thats how you enjoy running your army more power to you. Not gonna hear me complain.

Edited December 23, 2019 by Myrdin

[Kramer]

58 minutes ago, Myrdin said:

 I am not picking a fight... 

 

...Hey if thats how you enjoy running your army more power to you. Not gonna hear me complain.

Then what’s the point of this thread  

Edited December 23, 2019 by Kramer

[Aloth_Corfiser]

@Myrdin I did not mean to sound upset or anything, sorry if it did come across as such.
It is just that I am kind of frustrated with the Aelf Situation, thats all. 

[adreal]

Loosing wanderer heros sucks, but I can use my spell weaver as a Ghyran battlemage, I'm sure with some thought I can find something to use for my waywatchers.

My waystrider is a freeguild general

[feraxil]

On 12/23/2019 at 3:48 PM, adreal said:

Loosing wanderer heros sucks, but I can use my spell weaver as a Ghyran battlemage, I'm sure with some thought I can find something to use for my waywatchers.

My waystrider is a freeguild general

Waywatchers can be shadow warriors imo.