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The New Skaven Battletome, Terrain, Model & eSpells!

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59 minutes ago, ledha said:

Nighthaunts had enough substance despite being the most minor subfaction you could imagine.

That statement insults Grand Alliance: Firebellies

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4 minutes ago, XReN said:

That statement insults Grand Alliance: Firebellies

@ledha Consider me offended on behalf of faction Maneaters

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57 minutes ago, michu said:

They still can have that. But now we can play them in the old way and many skaven players wanted that. 

Yes-yes

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https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/02/05/5th-feb-chaos-battletome-skaven-the-low-downgw-homepage-post-3/

- Wow it seems that all horde units may benefit from the extra hit/wound/bravery per model... And that all heroes may benefit from the the "scurry away" plus "look out sir!" in melee 😍

- Mixing clans seem to allow taking allegiance abilities from all the fielded clans. Eshin behaving like Eshin, Verminus behaving like Verminus etc...

- Magical Lores! Including one just for Grey Seers! Finally a reason to field plenty :)

😍🤩

Extra info from Facebook (thanks @Overread for noticing):

- Clanrats are battleline for Skaven

- Pestilens retain the Nurgle keyword

- Many Skaven boxes are being repackaged with round bases "as we speak"

Anything else?

Edited by Num

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Also said in the Facebook comments that Pestilens are retaining the Nurgle keword - so all those hybrid armies are still valid! 

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25 minutes ago, Overread said:

Also said in the Facebook comments that Pestilens are retaining the Nurgle keword - so all those hybrid armies are still valid! 

yes-yes i can still play with my nurgle-things

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I have a question for everyone that thinks Skaven could still get model updates, not even new units just updated models for existing units. If the new Skaven battletome is available for pre-order this weekend and if GW is planning on updating old Skaven models after, would the new battletome have pictures of the old models or the unannounced updated models? Either they ruin the surprise of updated models or the battletome is "outdated" with pictures of old models whenever they announce them. Has GW done something like that before?

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They are not hinting at any further new models and their product art specifically has multiple older models in metal in them. Packmaster, Iket Claw etc... are all old and shown front and centre whilst the rat ogres are referenced and specifically linked to the old plastics.

 

So far as everyone can tell the only new model is the Engineer with a rocket launcher. Otherwise its just a lore and rules update with some new endless spells and terrain. Any further new or updated models "might" come later at a point much further in the future. 

 

This appears to purely be a "get skaven and flesh eaters up to date" release. And that's perfectly fine; esp when you consider that the new tome unlocks all the other clans as viable choices not just pestilens. 

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To be honest, I think I wouldn't even mind... I have thousands and thousands of points of skaven and still haven't purchased every model they have in their Skaven range... (Thanquol, verminlords, doomwheel, eshin...)
To me, the rules updating was the most urgent thing to do. I have enough to do on the hobby side already, but on the play side I moved in circles trying to come up with remotely decent lists, only to get crushed by newer armies afterwards...

On the lore side too, I was somehow stuck in the old world skavens, as I didn't find enough lore in aos for them

 

Edited by Num
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Finally, I can field my Clanrat horde effectively! I have 300 of those little guys waiting for their day in the sun and not get totally stomped.

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I am not convinced warpfire throwers and poison wind mortars are in the new book. I will be ecstatic if I'm wrong, but the new book contains rules for models they "currently sell", as per the Community team on FB. This very pointedly does not include the afore-mentioned two weapons teams.

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8 minutes ago, Kirjava13 said:

I am not convinced warpfire throwers and poison wind mortars are in the new book. I will be ecstatic if I'm wrong, but the new book contains rules for models they "currently sell", as per the Community team on FB. This very pointedly does not include the afore-mentioned two weapons teams.

Oh I really hope not. I love warpfire throwers, would be very sad if they aren't playable in the new tome. Is there any reason why GW can't use the island of blood skaven models? I think it would help moulder players, and just skaven players in general quite a bit if they could purchase rat ogres from the store without having to also get 3 packmasters and a bunch of little rats for every 2 ogres, and also help calm complaints of there being no updated models in the release. I'm glad they mentioned more reboxing though, goodbye squares!

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2 minutes ago, Skavelynn said:

Is there any reason why GW can't use the island of blood skaven models?

Officially: no idea. There has never- to my knowledge at least- been any confirmation or denial of the community idea that perhaps it has something to do with sharing sprues with the High Elf half of the set. So it could be that. Or it could not be. No idea.

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11 minutes ago, Kirjava13 said:

Officially: no idea. There has never- to my knowledge at least- been any confirmation or denial of the community idea that perhaps it has something to do with sharing sprues with the High Elf half of the set. So it could be that. Or it could not be. No idea.

The biggest excuse I've seen is that they share sprues and it simply couldn't be done as you've said..I really couldn't think of any other reason why unless it's broken molds or they're ramping up newer things in the future and have no interest. It's a shame considering the Rat Ogors looked quite good. I have a feeling the weapon teams will be replaced\melded into other things such as the Gnawholes or, as I think someone else pointed out, Stormfiends as they already have the same weapons.

I really just need to see what they're doing with Eshin as I have kit-bashed far too much of it so it's good knowing it wasn't all for naught. Aside from that, I'm really hoping Jezzails are brought back into the fold by way of having them put out MW's on unmodified 6's (which almost everything is doing as of late) and make them closer to their Stormcast Raptors counterparts.

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could they not just release a Skaven box set that was just the Skaven half of Isle of Blood? Starcollecting Skaven!

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42 minutes ago, carnith said:

could they not just release a Skaven box set that was just the Skaven half of Isle of Blood? Starcollecting Skaven!

The set wasn't split across sprues on faction lines so it's not as easy as that unfortunately.

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Honestly, I am personally fine with the fact that we aren't recieving new models. We are already very spoiled for choice with a vast range of well sculpted characterful models. I already struggle to field a good portion of my collection, im glad that I dont have to bench anything for some new hotness that i honestly don't need. In fact I'm completely fine with them axing a lot of the dated resins and metals if that means less upkeep.

The terrain bugs me though. It's completely uninteresting and imho doesnt add value to the army or the tabletop. It kind of reminds me of the junk terrain that used to come in the old WHF/WH40k starter sets. The kind that you would only use if you where desperate to get terrain on your table. The endless spells are dissapointing too, but at least with the army specific endless spells I've found the rules to be lackluster enough that i dont feel obligated to buy them. 

Anyways, I'm happy to have a book that will allow me to run a cohesive army out of my current range of models and I'll bite the bullet and buy/run some mediocre looking terrain to make that happen.

Edited by Pangu
Just saw the cost of the Terrain is $55usd. That's an absurd cost for what amounts to 3 craters with some sticks poking out.

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GW Community Facebook Page has confirmed the Skaven battletome will contain rules for all models "the sell"... So no more poisonwind mortar and maybe the warp fire thrower (this one I did see bits of in the artwork though so 50/50?) Is a trimmed line of models worth it thought for a great new Skaventide book bringing the whole family back together and making Skaven more relevant in AoS? I mean I am not sure I would moan too much. Sure, I have half a dozen or more mortars and the same again with warpfire throwers but I also went through worse with my Empire, my Bretonnians and my TK's sooooo, seems ok?

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So potentially if weapon teams aren't in the battle tome, if you take them, will they have to be as allies?

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7 minutes ago, Zuriaxis said:

So potentially if weapon teams aren't in the battle tome, if you take them, will they have to be as allies?

I imagine no, it will be like TK where you can use them in open play but not matched? But this is all hypothetical however certain it seems. Until we see the book it's hard to be completely sure.

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I've been collecting Skaven since WHFB. They were an amazing force back then. They had wacky random rules but something about the sinister nature of Skaven made those rules especially powerful. Unfortunately they got gutted in AoS along with many other factions. Most of their power did not translate over.

Seems now they are getting the Legions of Nagash treatment. One big issue with that is that the death rules were very strong and a super strong Allegiance Traits took them over the top. Unfortunately Skaven rules are mostly very bad, they need a lot more than just the LoN treatment, they need some serious re-thinking. Some scrolls like the Doomwheel & the Abomination got big point cuts, but they need good rules - not point cuts. The low 4+ to hit and 5+ saves, combined with the lowest bravery in the game really makes their lists fall flat right now.

I have tried all kinds of lists with them in AoS, everything feels disjointed and weird. The Allegiance stuff they announced today is all good but its not enough info to go on yet. If most of the scrolls and points are the same albeit all the Skaven units can be fielded together, that is not enough to make a good army. Skaven is a big enough faction that you'll be able to figure out the most optimal list and make something strong on the table-top, but I'm hoping for rules that see a resurgence in Iconic units like the Grey Seer, the Doomwheel, the Warp Lightning Cannons, Abominations, hordes of Clanrats/Slaves, Stormvermin, the Screaming Bell and especially Verminlords.

The other thing is Skaven lore. Its was very much tied to the Old World and the Empire, neither of which exists anymore. The End Times - Thanquol was my favorite book in the series. But a lot has changed - instead of stealing the power of chaos (via warpstone) and using it for their own clever and nefarious needs, they have now joined Chaos as like a form of beastmen. The shadowy and mysterious Great Horned rat turned into some kind of wannabe Chaos god. Its been just kind of off but they haven't gotten official lore yet. I'm hoping a lot of their deep history is reformed for the new world within the new lore.

For now I'm going to stay positive and assume that GW knows what they are doing and we will see a lot of great warscroll updates in the new tome. The new stuff they announced today has a lot of potential to be good. The Endless Spells and terrain has had great rules in the last sets. So far they have done a great job reinventing factions for the new world. Legions of Nagash and Beasts of Chaos did great work to modernize their factions and I expect the same for Skaven.

Meanwhile perhaps my my most played army in AoS is FEC .... FEC have great rules and are in an awesome position since 2.0. Even with minimal scroll updates, adding a new spell lore and more cohesion to their army is going to make them a force for sure. The new Archregent spell is bonkers and those spells are awesome looking. Cant wait for the new releases!

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I really want the Verminlord Deceiver's power to NOT change.  That's just too awesome.  Also hoping my Gutter Runners will still be as sneaky and ninja-tastic as they are now.  I have 47 so far.  Assassins must be due for some improvement right?!?!?

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6 hours ago, Kirjava13 said:

I am not convinced warpfire throwers and poison wind mortars are in the new book. I will be ecstatic if I'm wrong, but the new book contains rules for models they "currently sell", as per the Community team on FB. This very pointedly does not include the afore-mentioned two weapons teams.

One of the top couple images in this morning's article was a warpthrower team.  Using a discontinued unit in promotional art would be quite the oversight.

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11 hours ago, Throt the Unclean said:

I have a question for everyone that thinks Skaven could still get model updates, not even new units just updated models for existing units. If the new Skaven battletome is available for pre-order this weekend and if GW is planning on updating old Skaven models after, would the new battletome have pictures of the old models or the unannounced updated models? Either they ruin the surprise of updated models or the battletome is "outdated" with pictures of old models whenever they announce them. Has GW done something like that before?

I think it was triumph and treachery book for fantasy where we saw terrain pieces that were released later than the book, like, after the start of AOS

Edited by XReN

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1 hour ago, Vaeron said:

One of the top couple images in this morning's article was a warpthrower team.  Using a discontinued unit in promotional art would be quite the oversight.

Agreed, although not a guarantee. It might be that GW will no longer sell these pieces but continue to have them in battletomes for the sake of older players or eBay hunters. Like you I hope they do. It sets yet another dangerous precedent in AoS to discontinue a perfectly good unit not just from production but from the game entirely.

I do like the idea of the rarity of models tho - discontinued or only part of start collecting sets (means that armies are more likely to be unique on the field of battle!).

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