Sapca Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Mark Williams said: One of the FAQs explains this situation. If you have a wsrscroll ability and a prayer or something that triggers an extra attack on a 6, both abilities trigger and you get 2 extra attacks on a 6. That's perfectly clear. But looking for it in FAQs I found this and whew. It was FAQed.Q: Sometimes a dice roll will trigger an effect. For example, a weapon might have a rule that says a hit roll of 6 causes two hits on the target instead of 1. What happens if another effect applies to the same roll? For example, the weapon from the previous example might have a rule that says it inflicts D6 mortal wounds on a hit roll of 6 and the attack sequence ends – would I get to inflict two hits that each inflicted D6 mortal wounds? A: When a dice roll triggers more than one effect, each effect is triggered once. For this example, this means that the hit roll would cause two hits, but only one of the hits would inflict D6 mortal wounds (you would carry out the rest of the attack procedure for the other hit normally). So, my fair case(s) are legit. Judicator (with special bow) in Vanguard Wing + Prayer -> One hit roll of 6 -> 1d6 hits + 1 extra hit from prayer. One out of 1d6 hits has +1 damage from VanguardWing. Liberators, Paired Weapons, Vanguard + Prayer -> One hit roll of 6 -> 3 hits (2 from paired, 1 from prayer). One of hits is d2 due VanguardWing +1 on 6. WHEW. Edit (source): https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/8f9bd00c.pdf Edited August 15, 2020 by Sapca 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 (edited) Thx a lot @Sapcaafter thats its more clear. so special bow judicator on 6 is 1d6 +1 hits on d1 plus 1 hit more on damage 2 right? Anyway vanguard wings seems not so bad at all. If you play like 10 liberators with paired weapons you dont need prayer on them. Just give prayer to judicators. In vanguard wings your liberator can do their job. Im pretty curious to test that in tts. On paper seems that 10 sequitors without battalions are stronger than 10 liberators in vang wing! Edited August 16, 2020 by Tizianolol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapca Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Tizianolol said: . so special bow judicator on 6 is 1d6 +1 hits on d1 plus 1 hit more on damage 2 right? One hit at 2 damage + extra hits from that 1d6 at 1 damage (1d2 + 5d1 max) - this is default with just Vanguard Wing. + 1 hit from Bless Weapons at damage 1. So 1d2 + 5d1 +1d1 max. (7 hits max) Edited August 16, 2020 by Sapca 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juicy Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 Its kind of funny that we discussing the vanguard wing 2 years into this book with the big nerf on it. I like the discussion but libs even with paired weapons and with blessed weapons wouldnt do much damage with those warscrolls. Its cool for friendly games. But bringing these combos to a harder matchup its not going to work. Right now without the castellant buff i feel like 5 and 10 libs die to the same amount of units cause of how squishy these are. 2 years ago they felt a lot better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naem Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Hey guys, I will be attending a small regional 2v2 tournament, where every team has 2000 points so that each player has to bring 1000. I will be playing with an Seraphone ally and now I am looking to build a nice complementary 1k list. I was thinking of maybe going all shooting and magic, while Seraphone brings the big meele units (and also magic). My list would look something like this: Allegiance: OrderAllegiance: Order LEADERS Knight-Incantor (120) Lord-Relictor (100) Lord-Arcanum (150) - GeneralUNITS 5 x Liberators (90) - Warhammer & Shield 5 x Liberators (90) - Warhammer & Shield 6 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (340)ENDLESS SPELLS / TERRAIN / COMMAND POINTS Everblaze Comet (100) What do you guys think, how would you build a list for such a purpose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcvs Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 38 minutes ago, Naem said: Hey guys, I will be attending a small regional 2v2 tournament, where every team has 2000 points so that each player has to bring 1000. I will be playing with an Seraphone ally and now I am looking to build a nice complementary 1k list. I was thinking of maybe going all shooting and magic, while Seraphone brings the big meele units (and also magic). My list would look something like this: Allegiance: OrderAllegiance: Order LEADERS Knight-Incantor (120) Lord-Relictor (100) Lord-Arcanum (150) - GeneralUNITS 5 x Liberators (90) - Warhammer & Shield 5 x Liberators (90) - Warhammer & Shield 6 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (340)ENDLESS SPELLS / TERRAIN / COMMAND POINTS Everblaze Comet (100) What do you guys think, how would you build a list for such a purpose? I played a similar setup before points drops (and before lockdown, so practically another era)m where my teammate was covering the melee side so I went all out on shooting. Of course it depends from the style of play (in the "casual" to "competitive" continuum) but basically with today's point it would be something like this Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Anvils of the HeldenhammerKnight-Vexillor (110)- Pennant of the Stormbringer- Artefact: Soulthief Knight-Incantor (120)- General5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers9 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (510)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Total: 1000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 60 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FattBooM666 Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 On 7/24/2020 at 1:29 PM, stuntymike said: Enjoying this chat folks. With regards to what's a good all-comers list I'm trying to get my head around how to build for Better Part of Valour. Obviously it's all about battleline, so I'm caught between whether it's better to beef up the numbers in your battleline units - which prob means taking Sequitors, as 10 Libs seems meh - or maybe taking more battleline units. What's everyone's take on how to build for that scenario? Looking at the battleplans you ideally want good battleline, mobile heroes and a behemoth in order to max your scoring chances. So basically I'm trying to work out how best to do all/some of these. It's not easy! Anyway, I've got a wee one-dayer coming up in a couple of weeks and going to run the below. I don't think it's optimal at the moment, but I'm for fun and to dust of the cobwebs and Eltharion should be a laugh to use. Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Anvils of the HeldenhammerLeadersKnight-Incantor (120)- General- Command Trait: Deathly Aura - Spell: StormcallerKnight-Heraldor (100)Lord-Relictor (100)- Prayer: TranslocationKnight-Azyros (100)- Artefact: Soulthief The Light of Eltharion (220)- AlliesBattleline5 x Liberators (90)- Warblade & Shield- 1x Grandblades5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x GrandhammersUnits3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)9 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (510)10 x Evocators (420)- 10x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Speed of LightningEndless Spells / Terrain / CPsExtra Command Point (50)Total: 1970 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 220 / 400Wounds: 117 I like it, i have a similar that i will try in a week. But instead of eltharion I have 20 sentinels. 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcvs Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 (edited) 3 drops, a (relatively) survivable behemot, some battlelines and some damage. What does it do? Not much Spoiler Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Anvils of the HeldenhammerLord-Arcanum on Tauralon (280)- General- Command Trait: Deathly Aura - Celestial Staves (Artefact): Staff of Azyr- Spell: Thundershock- Mount Trait: Steel PinionsKnight-Incantor (120)- Artefact: Soulthief - Spell: Chain LightningKnight-Incantor (120)- Spell: Lightning BlastLord-Exorcist (90)- Spell: Azyrite HaloKnight-Azyros (100)- Mystic Light (Artefact): Lantern of the Tempest5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers20 x Judicators (560)- Skybolt Bows- 4x Shockbolt Bows5 x Judicators (140)- Skybolt Bows- 1x Shockbolt BowsGrand Convocation (130)Thunderhead Brotherhood (150)Dais Arcanum (30)Total: 1990 / 2000Extra Command Points: 2Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 110 Built mostly trying to play around with battallions. The thunderhead brotherhood doesn't do much in fact so it could be swapped out. A castellant might be more useful than the Azyros, but then I would loose the dais and I like the mobility it provides. Of course fitting in a comet would also be interesting. One could also leave out the azyros/castellant for the comet (and 2 drops) but I think the lantern of the tempest is really useful these days Edited August 20, 2020 by Marcvs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Marcvs said: 3 drops, a (relatively) survivable behemot, some battlelines and some damage. What does it do? Not much Hide contents Built mostly trying to play around with battallions. The thunderhead brotherhood doesn't do much in fact so it could be swapped out. A castellant might be more useful than the Azyros, but then I would loose the dais and I like the mobility it provides. Of course fitting in a comet would also be interesting. One could also leave out the azyros/castellant for the comet (and 2 drops) but I think the lantern of the tempest is really useful these days Yeah, there are more interesting battalions if you want to do a 2 drop list :). Warrior Brotherhood for instance + Tauralon. We really need a decent battalion including either 3 juds or 3 libs units. Edited August 20, 2020 by Maturin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 Any idea for really strong 1250 list? I have no problem with winning tournaments with normal points like 2000 but the 1250 ones are pain in the ass... Numbers of free buffs from AA which stormcast dont get make the game really hard... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Anvils of the HeldenhammerLeadersKnight-Azyros (100)- General- Command Trait: Deathly Aura- Mystic Light (Artefact): Shriving LightLord-Relictor (100)- Artefact: Soulthief- Prayer: TranslocationBattleline10 x Judicators (280)- Skybolt Bows- 2x Shockbolt Bows20 x Liberators (360)- Warhammer & Shield- 4x GrandhammersUnits3 x Prosecutors with Stormcall Javelins (90)- 1x Stormsurge Tridents3 x Prosecutors with Stormcall Javelins (90)- 1x Stormsurge Tridents3 x Prosecutors with Stormcall Javelins (90)- 1x Stormsurge TridentsBattalionsVanguard Wing (140)Total: 1250 / 1250Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 200Wounds: 88 What about this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Nizrah said: What about this? Nope. 10 judicators won't do enough damage to what you'll point them at. PLus They're the only threat in the list. Edited August 24, 2020 by Maturin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 5 minutes ago, Maturin said: Nope. 10 judicators won't do enough damage to what you'll point them at. PLus They're the only threat in the list. Any other idea for 1250? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkayestDM Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 (edited) Here's an idea. Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (200)- GeneralLord-Castellant (120)5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield20 x Sequitors (480)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields5 x Evocators (210)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Total: 1220 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 96 Edited August 24, 2020 by OkayestDM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcvs Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 9 hours ago, Nizrah said: Any idea for really strong 1250 list? I have no problem with winning tournaments with normal points like 2000 but the 1250 ones are pain in the ass... Numbers of free buffs from AA which stormcast dont get make the game really hard... go mini Starcast Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsMortal Realm: ChamonLord-Celestant on Stardrake (500)- General- Celestine Hammer- Command Trait: Staunch Defender - Artefact: Plate of Perfect Protection - Mount Trait: Storm-wingedCelestant-Prime (300)Knight-Incantor (120)- Spell: Lightning Blast5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x GrandhammersEverblaze Comet (100)Total: 1220 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 49 (alternatively no comet for a castellant) More seriously: my limited experience with 1250 pts (a few games and two tournaments) has been ...not great. It was pre-ghb and I faced multiple salamander lists and appreciated how Be'Lakor can be a pain in the ass when you can only have one deathstar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 Yesterday i was literally destroyed by two lists: 50 Phenix guard and 70 witch aelfes... The lack of AA of SCE make me suffer when playing low points game. We have literally no AA and have to pay huge amounts of points for heroes which brings these bonuses... SCE needs total rework. Like what is the point of SCE with 4+ sv, only 2 attacks, and huge 40 mm base when witch aelf can have 4 attacks with full rerolls, 4+ sv, 5+ ward with reroll and 25 mm base?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naprapaten Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Game is not balanced around 1250 points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 18 hours ago, OkayestDM said: Here's an idea. Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (200)- GeneralLord-Castellant (120)5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield20 x Sequitors (480)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields5 x Evocators (210)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Total: 1220 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 96 I like this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kramer Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 22 hours ago, Nizrah said: Any idea for really strong 1250 list? I have no problem with winning tournaments with normal points like 2000 but the 1250 ones are pain in the ass... Numbers of free buffs from AA which stormcast dont get make the game really hard... At 1250 you might go Death Star build. With big dracht unit, heraldor for run and charge. 2x judicators to hold objectives and some msu for interference and objective grabbing. would that work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 19 hours ago, OkayestDM said: Here's an idea. Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (200)- GeneralLord-Castellant (120)5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield20 x Sequitors (480)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields5 x Evocators (210)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Total: 1220 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 96 I can't decide how i would finish this... Hmmm...Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Celestial VindicatorsLeadersLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (200)- General- Command Trait: Single-minded Fury- Artefact: Stormrage Blade- Spell: Azyrite Halo- Mount Trait: Aethereal StalkerLord-Castellant (120)Battleline20 x Sequitors (480)- Tempest Blades and Soulshields- 9x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x GrandhammersUnits5 x Evocators (210)- 5x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Speed of Lightning3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsExtra Command Point (50)Total: 1230 / 1250Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 200Wounds: 90 ORAllegiance: Stormcast EternalsMortal Realm: ChamonLeadersLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (200)- General- Command Trait: Staunch Defender- Artefact: Plate of Perfect Protection- Spell: Azyrite Halo- Mount Trait: Aethereal StalkerLord-Castellant (120)Battleline20 x Sequitors (480)- Tempest Blades and Soulshields- 9x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x GrandhammersUnits5 x Evocators (210)- 5x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Speed of Lightning3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Total: 1220 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 96 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkayestDM Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 5 hours ago, Nizrah said: I can't decide how i would finish this... Hmmm...Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Celestial VindicatorsLeadersLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (200)- General- Command Trait: Single-minded Fury- Artefact: Stormrage Blade- Spell: Azyrite Halo- Mount Trait: Aethereal StalkerLord-Castellant (120)Battleline20 x Sequitors (480)- Tempest Blades and Soulshields- 9x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x GrandhammersUnits5 x Evocators (210)- 5x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Speed of Lightning3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsExtra Command Point (50)Total: 1230 / 1250Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 200Wounds: 90 ORAllegiance: Stormcast EternalsMortal Realm: ChamonLeadersLord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (200)- General- Command Trait: Staunch Defender- Artefact: Plate of Perfect Protection- Spell: Azyrite Halo- Mount Trait: Aethereal StalkerLord-Castellant (120)Battleline20 x Sequitors (480)- Tempest Blades and Soulshields- 9x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x GrandhammersUnits5 x Evocators (210)- 5x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Speed of Lightning3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)3 x Aetherwings (40)Total: 1220 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 96 Both have their virtues. It really depends on the strategy you want to focus down on. The extra command point gives you a reliable way to get buffs off for your Sequitors or Evocators, and is good to have in general. The extra Aetherwing offers you a little more mobility, and an extra unit to screen or grab objectives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 36 minutes ago, OkayestDM said: Both have their virtues. It really depends on the strategy you want to focus down on. The extra command point gives you a reliable way to get buffs off for your Sequitors or Evocators, and is good to have in general. The extra Aetherwing offers you a little more mobility, and an extra unit to screen or grab objectives. Well, i mean im concerned about going Staunch defender or more killy way of CV... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkayestDM Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 1 hour ago, Nizrah said: Well, i mean im concerned about going Staunch defender or more killy way of CV... That comes down to whether you want to be offensive or defensive. Personally, I recommend going aggressive with CV. At 1250 points, a big block of sequitors is no joke, and the 5-man evocators will also pose a respectable threat to enemy units. Force your opponent to run from/cope with those threats (supported by the Lord Arcanum and Lord Castellant) while your libs and Aetherwings hold or secure objectives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozly Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 Anvils of heldenhammer Heroes Lord Aquillor - General - Obsidian Amulet Knight Azyros - soulthief Knight Venator - Luck Stone Knight venator Battle Line 5 vanguard hunters 5 Vanguard Hunters 5 Vanguard hunters Other Unites 3x Longstrikes 3x longstrikes 3x Longstrikes Aetherwings Aetherwings Aetherwings Palladors Vanguard Angelos Vanguard Auxillary Vanguard Justicar 1 drop Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcvs Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Bozly said: Thoughts? Think you are missing an artifact (hive mind presently goes for Lantern of the Tempest on azyros and moves the soulthief to the second venator) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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