AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion

[KingKull]

Gotta say I'm not happy with the warcry warbands as core. As people already mentioned, it's gonna be very weird seeing multiples of a very specific and characterful model in a single unit that's supposed to be little more than "cannon" fodder, and in retrospect I wish that instead of Warcry they developed a six-unit Darkoath sub-faction (generic barbarians, range barbarians, beastmasters, gimmick barbarian unit etc.). In addition, if the warbands' rules remain the same, I don't see any reason to take any other band apart from the Golems, as the potentially rerollable 4+ save on a cheap horde unit seems almost too good for objective camping (not to mention additional immersion breaking here, as a group of dust-bathing nobodies has the same armour save as warriors clad in chaos warplate). 

[michu]

7 minutes ago, KingKull said:

Gotta say I'm not happy with the warcry warbands as core. As people already mentioned, it's gonna be very weird seeing multiples of a very specific and characterful model in a single unit that's supposed to be little more than "cannon" fodder, and in retrospect I wish that instead of Warcry they developed a six-unit Darkoath sub-faction (generic barbarians, range barbarians, beastmasters, gimmick barbarian unit etc.). In addition, if the warbands' rules remain the same, I don't see any reason to take any other band apart from the Golems, as the potentially rerollable 4+ save on a cheap horde unit seems almost too good for objective camping (not to mention additional immersion breaking here, as a group of dust-bathing nobodies has the same armour save as warriors clad in chaos warplate). 

You forgot to take Allegiance Abilities into account, maybe there will be something that will make other warbands better in particular situations. 

And even if they are "nobodies", creating armour is their style of life - they would get really good at crafting them (and I would say their armour is some kind of chaos warplate), so their save is justified.

[KingKull]

27 minutes ago, michu said:

You forgot to take Allegiance Abilities into account, maybe there will be something that will make other warbands better in particular situations. 

And even if they are "nobodies", creating armour is their style of life - they would get really good at crafting them (and I would say their armour is some kind of chaos warplate), so their save is justified.

I agree with you on the armour smiting part, but even with that taken into account, there are still some glaring inconsistencies with the range's design language as it's being presented to us, and I didn't want to go into greater detail with my original post since there's so much of it that it might become a thread of its own. If we were to disregard awkward unique doppelganger models, we're still supposed to believe that a helmet, a partial chest plate and a shield (talking of Golems, and supposing that it's the same chaos warplate material), yields the same amount of protection as being encased in armor from head to foot with a big-ass shield to boot, and that somehow a hulking humanoid with tremendous weapon-arms and the champion with Spine-crusher thing hit as hard as the regular Iron golem foot soldier, but that either of those (supposedly) do less damage than the much more sensible weapons of the chaos warriors? God dammit. 

Edited December 2, 2019 by KingKull

[Dreadmund]

11 minutes ago, KingKull said:

I agree with you on the armour smiting part, but even with that taken into account, there are still some glaring inconsistencies with the range's design language as it's being presented to us, and I didn't want to go into greater detail with my original post since there's so much of it that it might become a thread of its own. If we were to disregard awkward unique doppelganger models, we're still supposed to believe that a helmet, a partial chest plate and a shield (talking of Golems, and supposing that it's the same chaos warplate material), yields the same amount of protection as being encased in armor from head to foot with a big-ass shield to boot, and that somehow a hulking humanoid with tremendous weapon-arms and the champion with Spine-crusher thing hit as hard as the regular Iron golem foot soldier, but that either of those (supposedly) do less damage than the much more sensible weapons of the chaos warriors? God dammit. 

Magic.

[Morovir]

That's just the problem of AoS being a d6 based game - things with different levels of armour are going to have the same save. Think Liberator and Retributor, for example. Bear in mind that Chaos Warriors also have an extra wound to differentiate them.

[Spears]

With the current rules I could see an argument for the Unmade and Splintered fang in addition to the Golems. Unmade do a decent job of retaining their damage to the last few wounds whilst having a bonkers special rule, not being able to retreat can absolutely win games. The splintered fang are pretty awesome recipients of any +1 attack buffs whilst having some innate healing. Even the untamed beasts have some utility in their pre game move whilst the Cypher lords bring a pretty sweet -1 to hit, shame it isn't on a ranged attack though.

Corvus cabal are definitely at the bottom of the pack for me though, their wet noodle ranged attack doesn't make up for their not quite fly ability.

[GeneralZero]

19 minutes ago, Spears said:

With the current rules I could see an argument for the Unmade and Splintered fang in addition to the Golems. Unmade do a decent job of retaining their damage to the last few wounds whilst having a bonkers special rule, not being able to retreat can absolutely win games. The splintered fang are pretty awesome recipients of any +1 attack buffs whilst having some innate healing. Even the untamed beasts have some utility in their pre game move whilst the Cypher lords bring a pretty sweet -1 to hit, shame it isn't on a ranged attack though.

Corvus cabal are definitely at the bottom of the pack for me though, their wet noodle ranged attack doesn't make up for their not quite fly ability.

As pointy guys, the unmade are also the ones that fit superbly, I think. They are also my fav if I had to add one warcry unit. BTW, contrary to SC! and ES (day one purchase) , I'll wait more info to decide IF I take a warcry unit. I have so many things already...

[JackStreicher]

🤔

let‘s summarize what we get (// have) for StD:

- Chaos Warriors

- 6 Warcry Warbands

- Fomoroid Crusher

- Sphiranx

- the Myrmidon

- Mutalith Changebeast

- Slaughterbrute

- The Harpies and Chickens from the Warcry Box (?)

- Chaos Chariots

- Chaos Shrine

- Marauder Horsemen (?)

- Marauders (?)

- Darkoath Warqueen & Chieftain

- Old Chaos Warriors

- Chaos Knights

- Sorcerer on Obese, Deformed flying walrus-Cat-Lion (Manticore)

- Chaos Lord on foot.

- Chosen (?)

- Varanguard

-Archaon

- Endless Spells

 

Imo generic new Marauders would have been amazing as well as a new less generic kit (siege engine/huge monster, Beastmastets etc.)

what do you think? Did I forget a unit?

Edited December 2, 2019 by JackStreicher

[DJJazzyFred]

45 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

🤔

let‘s summarize what we get (// have) for StD:

- Chaos Warriors

- 6 Warcry Warbands

- Fomoroid Crusher

- Sphiranx

- the Myrmidon

- Mutalith Changebeast

- Slaughterbrute

- The Harpies and Chickens from the Warcry Box (?)

- Chaos Chariots

- Chaos Shrine

- Marauder Horsemen (?)

- Marauders (?)

- Darkoath Warqueen & Chieftain

- Old Chaos Warriors

- Chaos Knights

- Sorcerer on Obese, Deformed flying walrus-Cat-Lion (Manticore)

- Chaos Lord on foot.

- Chosen (?)

- Varanguard

-Archaon

- Endless Spells

 

Imo generic new Marauders would have been amazing as well as a new less generic kit (siege engine/huge monster, Beastmastets etc.)

what do you think? Did I forget a unit?

Maybe the Gaunt Summoner, if they carry over from the Everchosen Battletome

[Charleston]

@JackStreicher in your hate infused rage (may the dark deities bless your for it) against the manticore you forgot the Lord on Manticore and also the Lord on Daemonic Mount. Soul Grinder will either be also included or cut from AoS I belive.

[Charleston]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/12/02/kit-focus-start-collecting-slaves-to-darknessgw-homepage-post-1/#gallery-4

 

Chosen are in the image below, so may be assumed to survive the book

[ColsBols]

Are we gonna get Chaos Gargant?

[Reqent]

1 hour ago, JackStreicher said:

🤔

 

what do you think? Did I forget a unit?

The godsworn hunt and Theddra (who is included in the kit) is the only unit I cam think of

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

There's a female head in the new Warrior kit, I think. That's pretty cool.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/d17ef36e.jpg

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

35 minutes ago, Charleston said:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/12/02/kit-focus-start-collecting-slaves-to-darknessgw-homepage-post-1/#gallery-4

 

Chosen are in the image below, so may be assumed to survive the book

Spire Tyrants as well!

[calcysimon]

Oh no, chaos lord base size is increased

(from photo) 

 

[ChaosUndivided]

I have been patiently awaiting this day to come...

I have a bit of catching up to do as i havnt been on tga for awhile or doing the best job following all the GW news.

@KingKull what a character looks like and what there save is are completely irrelevant as this opens up a can of worms across nearly every faction. Lets just assume they are protected by their dark god or its plain old magic that keeps them standing in the thick of battle.

@JackStreicher i too would like to see generic Maurauders updated. Next to these new models they gonna look trash. GW also dropped the ball on mortals during the Slaanesh update so im not holding my breath.

@ColsBols i doubt Chaos Gargant is going to be left out.

Im not crazy about the Warcry warbands being "core" to this army personally and i agree the duplicate sculps on these guys makes me cring but am i mistaken or don't they have alternate builds? Even so... What an awesome conversion opportunity.

[GeneralZero]

5 hours ago, JackStreicher said:

🤔

let‘s summarize what we get (// have) for StD:

- Chaos Warriors

- 6 Warcry Warbands

- Fomoroid Crusher

- Sphiranx

- the Myrmidon

- Mutalith Changebeast

- Slaughterbrute

- The Harpies and Chickens from the Warcry Box (?)

- Chaos Chariots

- Chaos Shrine

- Marauder Horsemen (?)

- Marauders (?)

- Darkoath Warqueen & Chieftain

- Old Chaos Warriors

- Chaos Knights

- Sorcerer on Obese, Deformed flying walrus-Cat-Lion (Manticore)

- Chaos Lord on foot.

- Chosen (?)

- Varanguard

-Archaon

- Endless Spells

 

Imo generic new Marauders would have been amazing as well as a new less generic kit (siege engine/huge monster, Beastmastets etc.)

what do you think? Did I forget a unit?

You forgot the famous , the biggest, the majestuous Chaos War Mammoth !

[Charleston]

3 hours ago, calcysimon said:

Oh no, chaos lord base size is increased

(from photo) 

 

Yeah, you are right..man, it was already a pain getting him on 32mm with all that green stuff 😮

[Eldarain]

Please bring back characters on Chariots. Loved that.

[Cambot1231]

I've got my fingers crossed for an updated Gorebeast chariot Warscroll.  Would be great to see more of those guys tearing across the battlefield!

[Midjithero]

1 hour ago, Cambot1231 said:

I've got my fingers crossed for an updated Gorebeast chariot Warscroll.  Would be great to see more of those guys tearing across the battlefield!

Me too...except I already converted my gore beast to be a counts as Daemonic Mount for my now useless mortal Slaanesh >.< oh well, guess I need another one (if they get good)!

[JackStreicher]

I don‘t like the chariots. Imo they look to cramped (another side effect of designing models to fit on a small chariot square base)

[Spears]

Purely on theme rather than rules are people envisaging using one type of warcry warband in their armies or embracing the undivided aspect and fielding a mash up of several.

[michu]

For me it's definitely all of the warcy warbands.