Roark Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 35 minutes ago, Mikeymajq said: I'm so damn happy that we'll finally get plastic doggos and Karanak ! How many pts do you guys suspect he'll be if they change him? 120-140? GW apparently said that the Khorne side of the box comes to 500pts. If we assume Bloodletters stay at 120, Flesh Hounds at 100, and Bloodcrushers go to 140 as rumoured, that puts Karanak at... 140pts. Not sure I rate that very highly (given 5W@4+), but the model is so awesome... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 Or both Flesh Hounds and Karanak at 120 pts... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Coyote said: Or both Flesh Hounds and Karanak at 120 pts... Ah yes, of course. Points increase for Flesh Hounds in recognition of their brutal new shooting capabilities. ;-) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 It's a pitty Bloodletters got changed like this, perhaps a cost reduction will be put in place with their power reduction. But considering how Khorne got changed the last year(s) I doubt they will be cheaper. My best guess is that Karanak is now 140 but more likely 160. Fleshhounds probably will stick at 100. Bloodcrushers at 140 would make them a unit to consider. We will see. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, Killax said: It's a pitty Bloodletters got changed like this, perhaps a cost reduction will be put in place with their power reduction. If they had 2 attacks each with Wrath and Rapture rules at the same cost, do you think that would upset the broader AOS community? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 15 minutes ago, Roark said: If they had 2 attacks each with Wrath and Rapture rules at the same cost, do you think that would upset the broader AOS community? If they had 2 attacks that would be fine, but I very much doubt they have those attack numbers. I do get it somewhat from certain players point of view, in the sence that Bloodletters used to wreck havoc back in 1st AoS. But now without Sayl, Bloodsecrator's stacking and good acces to Mortal wounds things become awefully clear that your better of playing the newer armies with AoS 2 aswell. Sales matter, I do really get that, but I don't think this really needed to be done. If Bloodletters would have gained another attack I'd also think they would have very clearly mentioned it. It's a sideways edit which ends out to be a minor nerf, however it was applied to an army who got a lot of 'top tier tools' removed allready. It's fun to play Khorne still, it's just that more had the older stackable Mortal wound rules, so if they apply the change to all those units eventually then Khorne basically is an anti magic horde army with Gore Pilgrims to sort of count. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Killax said: Never mind. I can't read. Edited December 14, 2018 by Roark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastercrafted Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 10 hours ago, Roark said: GW apparently said that the Khorne side of the box comes to 500pts. If we assume Bloodletters stay at 120, Flesh Hounds at 100, and Bloodcrushers go to 140 as rumoured, that puts Karanak at... 140pts. Not sure I rate that very highly (given 5W@4+), but the model is so awesome... For 140 pts, if you get the free unit of Flesh hounds out of him he is totally worth those points i reckon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan.Ford Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 Bloodletters have been hit in a big way when when calculating mortal wound on big units of bloodletters. The wound output is similar but it's the mortal wounds that have been kick in the nuts by GW. When bloodletters charge in they normally have a hero nearby and a Bloodsecator buff. If you have +3 killing frenzy . You are doing MW on a 2 up and re rolling 1 to hit. That 55+ MW easy. New rules it's 12 MW average. Khorne will have too adapt. BoK and khorne are 19th and 21st in the army ranking . And 9th and 16th the year before . We are going down in strength but GW know this , maybe they have some points changes coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan.Ford Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 Taking down a big monster , character or a big unit of high save armour ,Is not going to happen reliably now but we are still going to lose the unit of 30 bloodletters in exchange. MSU maybe a way for Bloodletters!! Maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beulettor Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 12 hours ago, Roark said: GW apparently said that the Khorne side of the box comes to 500pts. If we assume Bloodletters stay at 120, Flesh Hounds at 100, and Bloodcrushers go to 140 as rumoured, that puts Karanak at... 140pts. Not sure I rate that very highly (given 5W@4+), but the model is so awesome... Or they consider the battalion in the 500 pts, for example : - bloodletters : 100 pts - crushers : 140 pts - hounds : 100 pts - karanak : 120 pts - bataillon : 40 pts ok karanak could be more than 120. But he is only 5 wounds, so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enoby Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 18 minutes ago, Beulettor said: bataillon : 40 pts Seems like that'd be far too cheap for a battalion, considering it gives you 1 CP that's "worth" 50 points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyn Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 By the way, anyone said which are the new bases for flesh hounds ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 Pretty sure Karanak has to be at least 100pts. Seems a bit silly that currently he is cheaper than 5 flesh hounds...and then can summon 5 flesh hounds (granted it is under a condition that could be blocked, but still) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revan123 Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 (edited) Such a wonderful news! And I am just finished those guys! And 90! letters! Well, they still good at 40k though Edited December 14, 2018 by Revan123 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revan123 Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 (edited) As for discussion I played this day with Daughters of Khaine. I attacked fully buffed Witches unit or how they called with fully buffed squad of letters with Crimson crown behind. It was 47 mortal wounds. And 7 failed saves in addion. 26 from 29 girls died. And three of them just buried nine letters during counter attack. Now the questions. Why do we even needed priests with Killing frenzy now? How are going to AT LEAST try to deal with Daughters? Or Nighthaunts? Or Fyreslayers? Not only math will say that it is impossible to get through their saves and FNP and not to get damage that will wipe out the half of the unit in return. At least they can't nerf Nurgle more, than meta did to him. I want my unmodified six at least on blightkings, if letters are gone. As for khorne, our hope no in blobs of 30 chaos warriors with glaives - 120 attacks with aspiring champion and secrator, +3 to their saves with priests and FNP from mortal wounds. It is the best thing I can come up with. Or blobs of blood warriors with same buffs. Edited December 15, 2018 by Revan123 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 In responce to the above, I think Karanak will cost 140 at least, because let's be honest here, the deal we get on Special Characters never really has been amazing. Skarr technically is cheap, so is Scyla but the 'great' special characters are generally costly for us. 40 point Battalions... I just don't see this happening for Khorne. It could be possible he's 160 and the Bloodletters are 100 but considering how Khorne evolved the last years, I doubt that too. @Revan123, fantastic army! Great job truely! In terms of DoK, under the right conditions I'd say they generally do Khorne's job better. Which isn't to say that Bloodletters are useless but is to say that Mortal wounds under the new rules are just much harder to find in Khorne, and that matters. Somewhere way back in this topic or even last edition I felt Bloodletters are what made Khorne competitively stick around, these have been altered, which means the grip on the competitive meta has been lost or is very lose. How to deal with other armies like mentioned? Unclear, Gore Pilgrims remains good, Blood Hunt remains good, as Fleshhounds recieved a minor buff but other than that yeah spam some mortals, hope that the anti-horde spells don't get to you I guess. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 Probably a work in process - looks like Warscroll updates (*not points changes*) have been made for at least- Bloodletters Flesh Hounds Blood Crushers Not for Karanak or the new Battalion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Ares Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 (edited) All the warscrolls have changed in some way. They’re updated in the app already. (If you’ve updated your app today) no points changes at all in the azyr app Edited December 15, 2018 by Thanatos Ares Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coyote Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 (edited) How do you update? *edit - my WH AoS app shows updated as of 2 days ago, the Warscroll Builder website has the updates not my Azur yet Edited December 15, 2018 by Coyote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 1 hour ago, Coyote said: How do you update? *edit - my WH AoS app shows updated as of 2 days ago, the Warscroll Builder website has the updates not my Azur yet Android phone it's through the Google Play store, my apps. I assume it is similar for iPhone. I just updated and all the warscrolls are in and updated, karanak and the new slaanesh Herald are there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andysonic1 Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 (edited) Is this a new change?: Bloodcrusher's Murderous Charge now increases in damage based on how many models the enemy unit has. Equal or under 5 = D3 MW. Over 5 = D6 MW. In the book it's based off how many models the Bloodcrusher unit has not the enemy unit. Edited December 15, 2018 by andysonic1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beulettor Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, Coyote said: How do you update? *edit - my WH AoS app shows updated as of 2 days ago, the Warscroll Builder website has the updates not my Azur yet Some people had the update 2 days ago, maybe iOS users ? It was today on Android but I don't think the warscrolls are different from 2 days ago. Edit: on WH AOS. Edited December 15, 2018 by Beulettor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleb Daark Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 Azyr is now updated: Karanak 90pts Flesh hounds 100pts Bloodcrushers 150pts Bloodletters 120pts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleb Daark Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 ok scrub that, the update description mentions it's just the rules updates - dont know if that means points as well or not - probably not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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