Square Bases - How outlawed are they?

[Danny76]

Ok so I am wanting to give AoS a go. I have huge fantasy armies all on squares  

Certainly I’ll be playing several games using squares to see how I feel. But I like the sound of the rules and game play style. So assuming all goes well, I’ve then got some decisions to make. 

Everything is based square and there are many models in my armies (Empire 6k and VC 5k being the main two). So really I want to know what the consensus is on using squares. 

The reason being, I’ve played KoW as a fantasy replacement, and although no one seems to be playing it really at the moment locally, it comes and goes. So having square for that has been fine. (Though if I had all round bases, I could easily just put rounds on trays to play that anyway).

im not sure I have the time or heart to sit and swap all my bases over, so how much is it needed really. Do people still use square? Or by now is it more if you’re in AoS then you’ve had to change them all over? 

I don’t really want an army half and half on each, so it’s a big undertaking. And most likely difficult to do too (I’ve posted in the modeling thread about the practice of doing so). 

Im sure to some extent it will depend on the community around but I don’t even know what there is near me. I know of one gaming club that’s not my cup of tea, and I won’t be doing tournaments or anything like that so don’t have to worry I’m that respect. 

 

Thanks for any advice you can give!

[someone2040]

So in general, it's becoming more and more common for tournaments to force models onto round bases (or blu tacked on top of round). Mainly because there are some particular advantages you get by ranking up on smaller square bases.

 

That being said, there are some solutions:

As mentioned, you can blu tack your squares on top of mdf round bases. Not the most aesthetically pleasing, but it gets the job done.

There are also converters of varying types. Pretty sure I saw some the other day which looked quite cool that just had the corners of the squares poking out a little bit (to change 20mm square into 25mm round type deal).

 

I hate rebasing anything that was glued via plastic glue. It's a pain in the ass. But definitely agree that I'd rather have everything on rounds or none at all. So I think ultimately it's up to you as to whether you start new armies on round, or rebase one of your old armies, or just use converters if it's not something you particularly care about.

[bsharitt]

Yeah they're really only banned at tournament, so you shouldn't have much of a problem. People might mention it in casual play, but people likely won't refuse to play you. If somebody does refuse to play against square bases in casual play, you probably lucked out not playing against them.

The obvious option is the round base trays like you mentioned if you do get around to it. Luckily KoW based on unit foot print not number of models, so you could even get trays with some breathing room and still get your 50%+1 model count in there. That's a route I had considered, but once the GHB came out all the fantasy players came back to AoS and KoW mostly died.

[Danny76]

I like the play style of KoW. 

And it’s size is good. Mostly from what I’ve read AoS doesn’t go to such a big size? What would have been a 3000 point fantasy army?

My third main army is Ogres. The cavalry and cannons aren’t based yet, so that’s fine, and the Ogres would be easier to switch (less of them and a bigger base to work round). So that’s always an option. 

 

I'll look at these round converters if they are perhaps an idea. As that could work well, particularly if they aren’t permanent..

[BURF1]

63.27%

[AverageBoss]

It really depends. GW allows squares at their events. They have never dictated base size or shape (besides 3rd ed fantasy), other than "what the models came with". Its why you still see marines on 25s and square based bikes at major events still for 40K.

For non GW areas, it is completely down to the local player base and community organizer. Many of these places may or may not adopt several house rules. No square bases, no priority rolls, no named characters, modified army construction rules (including alternative points systems), alternative turn sequence (such as alternating activation) etc. Since not all Fantasy models actually have round bases yet, some locations that ban squares might require those models to be on different base sizes from one location to the next.

At the end of the day, you just have to ask your local group how they play the game. Regardless though, it is common courtesy to handle models that moved from 25mm squares to 32 mm rounds carefully. As they have the biggest swing in efficiency (50% extra maximum attacks in a multi rank unit) compared to others. That being said there are several often ignored advantages for larger bases as well (more area control and denial, more viable targets, bigger auras, easier to block objectives). So keep that in mind.

[Greyshadow]

I’ve rebased a few models now and it wasn’t as bad as I thought it would be. I am putting all the new models I buy on rounds and intend to slowly rebase my collection over time. I’d recommend doing any rebasing in small batches.

[AGPO]

I went down the route of rebasing any army I was planning to expand with new minis for purely aesthetic reasons. As others have said it only really matters for tournaments. Nobody worth playing casually is going to give a damn.

Also, White dwarf did an article on rebasing around the time of AOS being released. With minis that have been plastic glued, it's often easier to clip off the sides of the base and glue the rest to the new base before blending the edges in with a little greenstuff. This is much quicker and removes the risk of ruining the minis feet. It also makes them taller and more intimidating :D.

[Kaleb Daark]

don't be bullied.  Play the game, see if you like it. 

If you get into it and really go for it, you'll probably want to do it for your own personal enjoyment as it's just a lot nicer visually  

[KnightFire]

Personally I find square bases really ugly, I wouldn't refuse to play a new or returning player using them at a club, but would expect them to re-base eventually if they wanted to continue - however before rebasing its worth playing a few games to make sure you are enjoying how your army plays in AoS, its quite possible you decide that you want a shiny new army.

I had quite a few 8e armies - vampire counts, skaven, wood elves, bretonians and empire.

I have rebased about 50% of the death (about 2500 points for AoS) and the rest hasn't really been touched because I just don't feel they fit the AoS setting at the moment. 

It wasn't that bad rebasing the death - I used the approach mentioned above, using a dremmel to remove the edges of the old square bases, then sticking the remains of the square base onto a round, and adding basing material (the old mourn mountain snow in the case of my death) to cover it. I didn't worry too much about making it a perfect join as its not a well painted army anyway. I got through 50 skeletons, 100 zombies, 30 ghouls and a handful of other models in a couple of weeks (at about 1 hour a day)

 

 

[Gaz Taylor]

16 minutes ago, Kaleb Daark said:

don't be bullied.  Play the game, see if you like it. 

If you get into it and really go for it, you'll probably want to do it for your own personal enjoyment as it's just a lot nicer visually  

100% agree with this. You play the game you want to play.

I like Kings of War but the issue I have with it is that I would much rather be playing Warmaster due to how it reminds me of it. But Age of Sigmar is my go to game name for my fantasy fix as I really enjoy playing it and the models look brilliant on the board with round bases. So I would suggest that you try AOS for a bit and see what you think. You will either love it or you won't. If you love it you can rebase your models and use trays when playing KOW but I would definitely try before you rebase  

[Moonlightwolf]

Haven't really seen anyone bothered about base shape for friendly games. The AoS rules state things should be measured from the model not the base and basically treats bases as irrelevant from a rules perspective, though in practice that usually doesn't quite work out. A lot of tournaments house rule this and require models to conform particular base sizes and shapes but outside of that I've never seen anyone refused a game based on base shape.

[Bosmer Nightblade]

Use whatever bases you want tbh. Only some tournaments restrict bases, and as others have said, anyone else who would force you to restrict isn't worth playing.

[karch]

11 hours ago, Danny76 said:

ill depend on the community around but I don’t even know what there is near me. I know of one gaming club that’s not my cup of tea, and I won’t be doing tournaments or anything like that so don’t have to worry I’m that respect. 

Since you won't be playing tournaments square bases are totally safe.

If you find anyone objecting to play your minis in the bases they came with then it's probably not worth playing with him anyway,

 

[VBS]

Check your local community to see their consensus, as you will be playing with them. 

I don't think there is anything "outlaw" since GW will probably never give a strict guide on bases for AoS (if they keep on being as inclusive as they are now, as forcing rounds will turn off a lot of people, especially those with large pre-AoS collections).

If you play KoW, squares are quite useful but making future armies on rounds (for AoS) combined with adapted movement trays (for KoW) is probably the way to go. Would definitely protect you from whiny ******.

Flexibility for multiple gaming systems. That's what I'll do at least when I remake my Free People army. Can't bother rebasing old armies though, I'll gladly stick to WFB/KoW if it's a problem for certain AoS players.

[Warboss Gorbolg]

I've played several games with my Battle for Skull Pass Moonclan Grots on 20mm squares at my local GW and I just leave a little space around each base to approximate a 25mm round.  I don't spend a lot of time making sure each one is perfectly or evenly spaced and my opponents have always seemed satisfied.  I tell them when setting up that's what I intend to do. 

If I ranked them up tightly, it certainly would be a significant advantage, and at that point what is the purpose of playing matched play (where the concept is that we're playing "fair")?  For casual games at least, I've found this to be a simple solution that has worked for me and my opponents without requiring a big investment on my part up front.

 I'm now in the process of replacing the BfSP Grots with new models on rounds, in part because I need those netters that BfSP left out!  After hating the idea of rounds when it was first revealed, I've come around and now strongly prefer the aesthetics of the rounds.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Moonlightwolf said:

The AoS rules state things should be measured from the model not the base and basically treats bases as irrelevant from a rules perspective, though in practice that usually doesn't quite work out.

Too right! The FAQ that gave the example of a grot with a spear never being able to attack a unit on a flying stand because the models would always be out of range of each other - that annoyed me. Silly game design there, which is quite rightly ignored by everyone.

[TheOtherJosh]

While there have been many discussions on “what kind of bases to use” the key thing to remember is that in AoS “rules as written” bases don’t matter. Measurements are supposed to be “model to model”.

“A model’s base isn’t considered part of the model - it’s just there to help the model stand up - so don’t include it when measuring distances.” (P.1 of the “The Rules” for AoS in “Tools of War”)

Folks choose to use base to base measurement because it is convenient and means that people aren’t piling bases on top of their nicely configured and detailed scenic bases.

So, use the models you have, and have fun! And welcome to AoS!

[Twitch of Izalith]

Its flipping stupid that they are STILL selling kits with square bases 2 and a half years after the game that used squares was discontinued. Even when things go out of stock and they need to cast more they still pack them with square bases!

I've been buying Dark Elf kits for 10 months and have a mountain of squares in my bits box...

Things do look better on rounds though so I think you will end up going that way if you do get into AoS.

I still play fantasy occasionally (usually 4th edition cos we all love the magic phase)  so I have never re-based any of my old armies. In fact I probably use rounds in fantasy more often than something on a square gets into AoS.

For Kings of War its the tray size rather than the base/number of models that's important so I'm sure you can keep playing if you can find some trays that will take rounds

[Twitch of Izalith]

6 hours ago, Gaz Taylor said:

I like Kings of War but the issue I have with it is that I would much rather be playing Warmaster due to how it reminds me of it.

I hope they never re-release that - I barely have a flat surface in my house that doesn't have a miniature on it already without reasons to buy more! I never played it when it first came out and always regretted it.

[bsharitt]

3 hours ago, Jamie the Jasper said:

Too right! The FAQ that gave the example of a grot with a spear never being able to attack a unit on a flying stand because the models would always be out of range of each other - that annoyed me. Silly game design there, which is quite rightly ignored by everyone.

On one hand the melee attacks into flying units always struck me as odd and the model to model where the ground unit can't reach makes logical sense. Of course if people really did this in practice, or if the rules went the route of no melee for flyers, it would of course change the game dramatically. The base to base with melee for flyers is the simplest solution, but to get a more elegant solution, you'd have to sort of design the game system with flying in mind and build in range options that are expected to be default, which can throw off the theme a bit since strong melee armies should definitely be an option in a fantasy setting. So I think you get silly rules and outcomes either way.

[eekamouse]

I've not seen square bases banned in any tournaments around here. There was some discussion last year that was quickly shot down.

I run a mix of square and round. If someone actually has a problem with that, it's easy not to play with them.

[AGPO]

5 hours ago, Twitch of Izalith said:

I still play fantasy occasionally (usually 4th edition cos we all love the magic phase)  so I have never re-based any of my old armies. In fact I probably use rounds in fantasy more often than something on a square gets into AoS.

Damn I'd love to play fourth again sometime. That was the edition that for me properly into Warhammer. Totally agree on the repacks. If you don't have an extensive bits box of rounds you're adding a big mark up for all those extra bases.

[Sleboda]

9 hours ago, TheOtherJosh said:

While there have been many discussions on “what kind of bases to use” the key thing to remember is that in AoS “rules as written” bases don’t matter. Measurements are supposed to be “model to model”.

“A model’s base isn’t considered part of the model - it’s just there to help the model stand up - so don’t include it when measuring distances.” (P.1 of the “The Rules” for AoS in “Tools of War”)

Folks choose to use base to base measurement because it is convenient and means that people aren’t piling bases on top of their nicely configured and detailed scenic bases.

So, use the models you have, and have fun! And welcome to AoS!

Indeed.

Don't let the bases bother you, and if someone else is bothered by your 100% legal, officially cool by the printed rules bases, that's on them, not you.

 

At the OP-

You really could play without bases at all and be absolutely legal. Be cautioned, some might tell you that if you do that you must be trying to gain some sort of unfair advantage, but you should look them right in the eye and say ....

 

 

Spoiler

"That's a baseless accusation."

 

Ha!  I kill me.

 

 

 

[Kaleun]

My point of view as an Warhammer Fantasy player is that the square bases are better than the round bases. Ruleswise the base doesnt matter and why on earth would they be forbidden on a tournament?!?

The rebasing process is wasted time and money. (and you produce a lot of square-base-scrap of course)

Also in AoS I want to use magnetisised bases to move my "regiments" quicker and make moving less time consuming. Square bases have the oportunity to have your army marching in tidy formations. You might prefer round bases on single modes units, but for everything else I use square bases.