The Rumour Thread

[Vaellas]

Personally feel these changes look great and also simple for new players 

[Ganigumo]

Opinions!

• "These(CP) are a crucial resource in the new edition, and scarcer than before.*
  • AKA unless you're OBR or KO you're now getting more than you used to ???
• Bonus CP to player with less VP seems like its better than the player going second, but it creates an incentive to sandbag the VP line to get those CP. This is already a problem in that one Battleplan where the losing player removes objectives.
• (edit) Everybody can issue commands, no more elite stuff, thank you. I never got why stuff like maw grunta gougers and troggs cant, but literal mindless undead like zombies can. (I know troggs are dumb as bricks but still)
• Covering Fire is WAY stronger than unleash hell, even unleash hell had to be nerfed from 9" to 6". This is probably going to be a problem. Somehow this makes kruleboyz worse since you can't hasty shot UH now though (pending warscroll rewrite).
• Rally - Just remove it, this is pretty complex, but it needs to be so it isn't broken I guess.
• Counter Charge: I like this. I hate that we have commands that cost different amounts of CP, Its not a lever they should play with IMO. The value of this is just as dependent on the quality of the unit using it as Covering Fire, so why is this 2CP and that 1CP. Just make them all 1CP and be done with it.
• Redeploy: Buffed, no nearby unit restriction, and less interruption after moving every unit. You just do it at the end of the phase. Good change to make it simpler, but now there's not really any counterplay to it.
• Magical Intervention: Seems fun, But I'm not looking forward to the 1 drop lumineth teclis castle giving away the first turn and still having shields up.
• Power Through: another ogor rule everybody gets "Can't have 💩in Ogor Mawtribes" 

Edited April 10 by Ganigumo

[Gaz Taylor]

1 minute ago, Vagard said:

Charging a unit during your opponent's turn without any disadvantage is way more impactful than shooting with a -1 to hit the closest unit at the end of his shooting phase

Yup, especially as it can be used to move units to contest objectives or get into your opponents part of the board (depending on how you win games in new edition). Also seem very powerful when used with some unit abilities with how they've sneaked this into the preview! 

[Vagard]

Just want to know how you understand the reroll charge : to me you have now to spend your CP before rolling dices and then maybe waste a CP if you succeed you charge at the first roll. (given the image here)

-> to me the action of rolling the dices is during the "effect" part of the ability (3), not during the "declare" part (1)

Guess we will have to wait how the charging ability is presented now

[Cdance93]

5 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

Opinions!

• "These(CP) are a crucial resource in the new edition, and scarcer than before.*
  • AKA unless you're OBR or KO you're now getting more than you used to ???
• Bonus CP to player with less VP seems like its better than the player going second, but it creates an incentive to sandbag the VP line to get those CP. This is already a problem in that one Battleplan where the losing player removes objectives.
• (edit) Everybody can issue commands, no more elite stuff, thank you. I never got why stuff like maw grunta gougers and troggs cant, but literal mindless undead like zombies can. (I know troggs are dumb as bricks but still)
• Covering Fire is WAY stronger than unleash hell, even unleash hell had to be nerfed from 9" to 6". This is probably going to be a problem. Somehow this makes kruleboyz worse since you can't hasty shot UH now though (pending warscroll rewrite).
• Rally - Just remove it, this is pretty complex, but it needs to be so it isn't broken I guess.
• Counter Charge: I like this. I hate that we have commands that cost different amounts of CP, Its not a lever they should play with IMO. The value of this is just as dependent on the quality of the unit using it as Covering Fire, so why is this 2CP and that 1CP. Just make them all 1CP and be done with it.
• Redeploy: Buffed, no nearby unit restriction, and less interruption after moving every unit. You just do it at the end of the phase. Good change to make it simpler, but now there's not really any counterplay to it.
• Magical Intervention: Seems fun, But I'm not looking forward to the 1 drop lumineth teclis castle giving away the first turn and still having shields up.
• Power Through: another ogor rule everybody gets "Can't have 💩in Ogor Mawtribes" 

I think the rally change is wonderful and a lot more flexible now since it can be used in single models as well. 
 

also a great way to counter tactics 

Edited April 10 by Cdance93

[Mortal Wound]

54 minutes ago, The Red King said:

Why does charging cost twice as much as shooting when you already have a much shorter range and unreliable result?

Presumably because charging is moving, and moving out of phase allows for objective control shenanigans.

Or think of it this way: if getting an extra move (Redeploy) is worth 1CP and getting an extra attack (Covering Fire) is worth 1CP, it stands to reason that getting an extra move AND an extra attack (Counter Charge) would be worth 2CP.

Not to mention that with the right unit, you can then Power Through and charge something else on your turn... Sounds nasty with chariots or heavy cav, though CP-intensive.

Edited April 10 by Mortal Wound

[ScionOfOssia]

Oh, looks like we now know what some keywords are: Crit (Effect), Anti-Infantry, Charge, and Companion

[EthanolMuffins]

Looks fun, cant wait til 4th drops so I can get my first AoS game under my belt

[Ganigumo]

3 minutes ago, Cdance93 said:

I think the rally change is wonderful and a lot more flexible now since it can be used in single models as well. 
 

also a great way to counter tactics 

Its better than current Rally yes, but I wouldn't miss rally if it was gone entirely.

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

6 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

Bonus CP to player with less VP seems like its better than the player going second, but it creates an incentive to sandbag the VP line to get those CP. This is already a problem in that one Battleplan where the losing player removes objectives.

I have seen designers say that they like to build games where being close to winning and losing look very similar, because it keeps the finale exciting. It's nice in theory, but I suspect different players respond to it differently. 

[Tonhel]

1 hour ago, Grimrock said:

Why is it always extremes like this? Nobody wants lifelong support for minis or feel like they're owed it. If you want an example, Chaos Marauders and Marauder Horsemen are about to be replaced with new darkoath models and when the news dropped were people getting upset and threatening boycott? No, they were ecstatic to see the new sculpts. Those models came out right around the time I started the hobby in 2002 and they've had a great run, almost nobody is sad to see them go. Sacrosanct models that came out less than 6 years ago? That's not a great run. That's not a good run. That's barely a warmup jog. 

The worst part is people totally understand that the stormcast line is bloated and in dire need of consolidation, but this problem is entirely GW's fault. They're the ones that have been diligently bloating the line with release after unnecessary release to the point where it's entirely unmanageable. So they've made a mistake and the route they've chosen to fix their mistake is to punish their customers. Not only that, but they show no signs of learning from their mistake because, while punishing their customers for simply buying their products, they're continuing to bloat out the line with yet more releases. This is what's really hammering in the nail in for most people. 

It lasted 2 editions of a game that now starts it 4th edition. 6 years is not exactly a short time.

About the command abilities. I have no idea what to expect.

I am surprised the Sce on chariot has still different weapon profiles. I expected it to be merged like the liberator weapons.

 

[Sahrial]

I was worried but I’m surprisingly here for these updates.

my Ogors really love countercharges and power through (assuming we keep some sort of impact rule)

[Sahrial]

Also looks like we have more universal weapon rules to add:

Anti-[keyword] (effect)

Charge (effect)

Crit (effect)

[Mortal Wound]

14 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

Opinions!

• Covering Fire is WAY stronger than unleash hell, even unleash hell had to be nerfed from 9" to 6". 
• 💩

It's not, it is way easier to screen against because it now goes against the nearest unit, after movement is done but before charges. As a Slaves to Darkness player living in an environment oversaturated with CoS players that all love their fusiliers, this new command made me breathe a huge sigh of relief. Just put a chaff unit in front of my spiky lads and bam, no more getting shot off the table (or rather, no more getting shot off the table an additional time). Takes me back to Warhammer Fantasy days when the no1 rule of playing Chaos was 'you always put Warhounds in front of the Chaos Knights' 😄

I mostly agree with your other assessments, but felt I needed to point this out because I love this change.

[Son Of Morghur]

1 minute ago, Tonhel said:

6 years is not exactly a short time.

Woaow, I suggest that everyone who agrees with GW absurd decision, reshuffles at least 1/4 of their army, puts all this in the cellar, and then rebuys and repaints the very same amount every second edition then!

I am just sorry, but this miniature game gets a new Book every 3 years. Compared to the relatively slow change and release of the game, throwing a BIG part or the WHOLE army away every 6 years is extreme.

I don't know how much money you earn, nor how much time you have, but if this is the route AoS goes I will not support the game anymore. I do already find "big" rules change every 3 years just to sell everything anew pretty extreme, since most of the rule changes are not even that big and could easily be made through some form of extensions...

Also some REALLY cool additions get lost everytime a new edition starts. I remember playing a against a friend who played Daemonkin in 40K and I had a LOT of fun playing against this army. Now Daemonkin are just more or less gone! (Same applies to a lot of subfactions or extensions).

Of course, the possibility to play older editions is still there! And I also get that GW has to make cash somehow. But don't forget that they definitely have a HUGE margin on their prices.

[PJetski]

4 minutes ago, Mortal Wound said:

It's not, it is way easier to screen against because it now goes against the nearest unit, after movement is done but before charges. As a Slaves to Darkness player living in an environment oversaturated with CoS players that all love their fusiliers, this new command made me breathe a huge sigh of relief. Just put a chaff unit in front of my spiky lads and bam, no more getting shot off the table (or rather, no more getting shot off the table an additional time). Takes me back to Warhammer Fantasy days when the no1 rule of playing Chaos was 'you always put Warhounds in front of the Chaos Knights' 😄

I mostly agree with your other assessments, but felt I needed to point this out because I love this change.

 

Are you going to put Warriors in front of your Knights before the Knights charge?

[Son Of Morghur]

The new rules look really cool to me! I wish I could say that I am REALLY excited, I still am, but on the other hand, I am disgusted that I'll only be able to play my BoC officially for half an edition.

Part of me is still happy and excited, part of me is just very sad....

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

27 minutes ago, Gaz Taylor said:

Yup, especially as it can be used to move units to contest objectives or get into your opponents part of the board (depending on how you win games in new edition). Also seem very powerful when used with some unit abilities with how they've sneaked this into the preview! 

That Anti-Infantry keyword has me unreasonably hyped.

[Dragon-knight77]

Side note there Black Library Reader’s Choice 2024 and look at the option for Fantasy

not insuating nothing just find it humorus after the discussion early this morning 

Black Library Reader’s Choice 2024 – Which Warhammer Stories Will Rise Again This Year? - Warhammer Community (warhammer-community.com)

[Mortal Wound]

13 minutes ago, PJetski said:

Are you going to put Warriors in front of your Knights before the Knights charge?

No, I'm going to put Raptoryx, Furies, Spawn, Darkoath Horsemen or whatever else is cheapest/fastest moving in front of my Knights, and then charge through them if moving through friendlies is allowed like in 10th 40k. If it's not, I'll just have the screening unit end its move at an appropriate angle so that it can be cleared while staying the closest target for Covering Fire.

Edited April 10 by Mortal Wound

[Luperci]

14 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

That Anti-Infantry keyword has me unreasonably hyped.

Oh I missed that, the new aos weapon USRs seem a lot better than the 40k ones, much easier to comprehend at a glance. (The lack of strength vs toughness is also a factor I'll grant)

Edit: thinking about it now, do we think KB will just have all their weapons get Crit(mortals) and lose the poisoned blades faction ability 

Edited April 10 by Luperci

[Ganigumo]

23 minutes ago, Mortal Wound said:

It's not, it is way easier to screen against because it now goes against the nearest unit, after movement is done but before charges. As a Slaves to Darkness player living in an environment oversaturated with CoS players that all love their fusiliers, this new command made me breathe a huge sigh of relief. Just put a chaff unit in front of my spiky lads and bam, no more getting shot off the table (or rather, no more getting shot off the table an additional time). Takes me back to Warhammer Fantasy days when the no1 rule of playing Chaos was 'you always put Warhounds in front of the Chaos Knights' 😄

I mostly agree with your other assessments, but felt I needed to point this out because I love this change.

 

Someone else pointed out the speed issue, which is a problem for some armies, but this also lets you shoot at things that aren't charging (like throwaway objective capturing units), and the range change makes it way easier to use this while safely behind a screen. You can be out of charge range and still get blasted now, plus stuff like impact hits can't lessen the effectiveness of the shooting.

36 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

I have seen designers say that they like to build games where being close to winning and losing look very similar, because it keeps the finale exciting. It's nice in theory, but I suspect different players respond to it differently. 

If you design the game so games are close (only a few VPs off in AoS case) you need to be really careful about catchup mechanics so they don't become the optimal strategy. Losing so you can win is a wierd incentive.
In games with more decisive wins you can be way more lenient with catchup mechanics, since generally the safer option will always be to stay in the lead.

 

5 minutes ago, Luperci said:

Oh I missed that, the new aos weapon USRs seem a lot better than the 40k ones, much easier to comprehend at a glance. (The lack of strength vs toughness is also a factor I'll grant)

Edit: thinking about it now, do we think KB will just have all their weapons get Crit(mortals) and lose the poisoned blades faction ability 

God I hope so. Maybe they can get an actual allegiance ability.

[Jaepic]

The charriot scroll had july 2024 on top before they changed the image😄

[Sahrial]

5 minutes ago, Luperci said:

Oh I missed that, the new aos weapon USRs seem a lot better than the 40k ones, much easier to comprehend at a glance. (The lack of strength vs toughness is also a factor I'll grant)

Edit: thinking about it now, do we think KB will just have all their weapons get Crit(mortals) and lose the poisoned blades faction ability 

That seems like a reasonable guess to me.

I do like that each rule is looking more like a trigger effect rather than a hard and fast rule, with its different versions possible across different warscrolls.

[Sception]

1 hour ago, Beliman said:

The secon "move" is at the End of Any Turn phase.

There shoudn't be any problem.

You're absolutely right.  For some reason I thought power through was end of the charge phase, not end of the turn.  My mistake.