AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

[stratigo]

1 minute ago, Beliman said:

You don' get it.. nobody cares if you think that my ideas are poor.

Just explain your own as @zilberfrid did before this post.

 

 

Maybe read more than one line.

[Beliman]

7 minutes ago, stratigo said:

 

Maybe read more than one line.

I already did, and  @zilberfridjust explained it better. Btw, I already understood your arguments in your first "answer" and hope that you are right and GW only nerfs (if any) Zilfin and the Spell in the bottle.

But still, my question was about what buffs, nerfs  and what people want to see in Broken Realms  and the Big FAQ.

 

[Boar]

42 minutes ago, Beliman said:

But still, my question was about what buffs, nerfs  and what people want to see in Broken Realms  and the Big FAQ.

Yeah let's go with that:

Ironclad goes up in points (FAQ): it is very efficient unit when it comes to effects of triumphs/aethergold, CP, transport effciency, and effects of endrinworks compared to other ships which isn't fully reflected in it's cost.

Oustanding questions get resolved(FAQ): things like Emergency Ventplates still are not resolved, I paid for book GW give me working product

WLV is nerfed somewhow (FAQ): even before KO I heard lot of negativity about this spell, KO just made it worse with 100% reliable delivery system

Skywardens boosted (Broken Realms): if they could f.ex add +1 to hit on pikes in FAQ, not waiting for Realms book it would be even better, but probably book is the earliest we could hope for change, which leads me to:

Barak Nar and Brokk Grungsson (Broken Realms): as it stands both are somewhat lackluster. With rules of Nar not really giving you enough tools to choose it over other ports, and locking you into both artifact and trait (both kinda underwhelming). Brokk also suffers in comparison with generic hero who can take command trait and artifact and unlock skyriggers as battleline. So some rewrite here would be nice. Narrative pretext for rewrite could be centered around shocking discovery Brokk himself made in Greywater Fastness on his Grand Tour.

[Eevika]

Finally got to painting my KO for a local slow grow league. Here are a few pics of the guys.
 

[eciu]

Sooo those KO are really into Synthwave ?

[nissefika]

 

7 hours ago, Boar said:

Yeah let's go with that:

Ironclad goes up in points (FAQ): it is very efficient unit when it comes to effects of triumphs/aethergold, CP, transport effciency, and effects of endrinworks compared to other ships which isn't fully reflected in it's cost.

Oustanding questions get resolved(FAQ): things like Emergency Ventplates still are not resolved, I paid for book GW give me working product

WLV is nerfed somewhow (FAQ): even before KO I heard lot of negativity about this spell, KO just made it worse with 100% reliable delivery system

Skywardens boosted (Broken Realms): if they could f.ex add +1 to hit on pikes in FAQ, not waiting for Realms book it would be even better, but probably book is the earliest we could hope for change, which leads me to:

Barak Nar and Brokk Grungsson (Broken Realms): as it stands both are somewhat lackluster. With rules of Nar not really giving you enough tools to choose it over other ports, and locking you into both artifact and trait (both kinda underwhelming). Brokk also suffers in comparison with generic hero who can take command trait and artifact and unlock skyriggers as battleline. So some rewrite here would be nice. Narrative pretext for rewrite could be centered around shocking discovery Brokk himself made in Greywater Fastness on his Grand Tour.

I can agree on Ironclad, I would maybe add or change it to iron sky command as it that list that keep wining and not they all KH. 

Ventplates is somewhat clear but just make it total clear.

WLV this is also the auto included in the tuarnemant wining list so bring back 100p for a start. 

Agree on Broken Realms, I would add new battalions, maybe with gunhuualer and skywarden . Just give as new why on building list.

[Ekrund Oath Splitters]

20 hours ago, Boar said:

Yeah let's go with that:

Ironclad goes up in points (FAQ): it is very efficient unit when it comes to effects of triumphs/aethergold, CP, transport effciency, and effects of endrinworks compared to other ships which isn't fully reflected in it's cost.

Oustanding questions get resolved(FAQ): things like Emergency Ventplates still are not resolved, I paid for book GW give me working product

WLV is nerfed somewhow (FAQ): even before KO I heard lot of negativity about this spell, KO just made it worse with 100% reliable delivery system

Skywardens boosted (Broken Realms): if they could f.ex add +1 to hit on pikes in FAQ, not waiting for Realms book it would be even better, but probably book is the earliest we could hope for change, which leads me to:

Barak Nar and Brokk Grungsson (Broken Realms): as it stands both are somewhat lackluster. With rules of Nar not really giving you enough tools to choose it over other ports, and locking you into both artifact and trait (both kinda underwhelming). Brokk also suffers in comparison with generic hero who can take command trait and artifact and unlock skyriggers as battleline. So some rewrite here would be nice. Narrative pretext for rewrite could be centered around shocking discovery Brokk himself made in Greywater Fastness on his Grand Tour.

I dont think the Ironclad should go up in points if im honest. 480pts is quite a lot and whilst it might be fundamental to winning lists with a certain Skyport (Zilflin) and endless spell (WLV) i dont think its all that great. When you compare it to other things in its weight class it doesn't have the survivability or firepower to earn its keep. Its power comes from transporting your bundle of heroes and units to where ever they need to be with Fly High and it only needs to loose 7 wounds to loose that ability until it heals. Once you start adding your units it becomes and expensive investment that is all in one tight package.

Overall i still think some of our units are still overcosted, the Frigate and Thunderers (in my eyes they are 20pts over costed for both) being the main ones in my opinion. What should be dealt with is Zilflin and how it interacts with Spell in a Bottle, so it doesnt affect the other Skyports because of anothers apparent greatness. I play Barak Urbaz, what works for Zilflin doesnt work for me and im sure there are many KO players out there that use other less playable Skyports like Zon and Thryng.

What I would like to see from Broken Realms is a new unit for us, like how DoK and HoS got, maybe even a new Skyport and a couple more battalions. We have quite a few combat buffs in our army but we really arent the army for it, so we should be able to capitalise on that with a unit that can tango with other melee threats. Something like a Grundstok unit armed with aether shields and picks/hammers. Personally id like more ships, or upgrade sprues from GW/FW to give use some new guns on existing boats. Imagine an Ironclad that had 4 Fumigators instead of its Aethershot Carbines or a Volley Gun instead of a Heavy Sky Cannon. Or what about a Grundstok Gunnery Master/Sergeant that is a dedicated hero for the Grundstok and provides some nice CA for them.

Id love a carrier type vessal that transported small Gyrocopter like fighters, Gyros are a huge part of my force as it is for the steamguns, reliable MW output and their 16" movement at a nice cheap cost. That is what I would like to see, the faction getting more fleshed out not nerfed into unplayability again. I had a huge collection way back with our first battletome, 5 Frigates, 2 Ironclads, 60 Company and I sold 80% of it as the book was just uninspiring and flat. Atleast with the new book I feel like my army represents its fluff.

Edited November 17, 2020 by Ekrund Oath Splitters

[eciu]

My main issue is how medicore Great Works for frigates are, and that there are only 3 of those for a ship class which makes most sense to field in 2+ numbers. 

[Boar]

2 minutes ago, eciu said:

My main issue is how medicore Great Works for frigates are, and that there are only 3 of those for a ship class which makes most sense to field in 2+ numbers. 

That's good point, if we got new stuff for Frigates it would be great

[zilberfrid]

1 hour ago, eciu said:

My main issue is how medicore Great Works for frigates are, and that there are only 3 of those for a ship class which makes most sense to field in 2+ numbers. 

That I do agree on. Ironclads and Gunhaulers both have really fun options, but the frigate seems a bit meh.

[stratigo]

I'd love more works for frigates and gunhaulers. And a reason to take frigates since I have 2

[Soolong]

I would like to see a new unit that uses shields as handgliders to jump from our ships, give them a 3d6 charge when a ship fly highs during the turn and doing a mw for every model in the unit when they charge to represent them landing on their foes. No guns just melee focus. Would be pretty darn cool. 

[Beliman]

3 hours ago, Ekrund Oath Splitters said:

I play Barak Urbaz, what works for Zilflin doesnt work for me and im sure there are many KO players out there that use other less playable Skyports like Zon and Thryng.

I switched from Zilfin to Mhornar and even if Mhornar is not as strong as Zilfin, it has a lot of potential.
I started playing some Barak-Zon last week,  and I can't make it work.... 😞 Two games this weekend, hope it goes better than  the last ones... 

[BradyBoi9388]

Newbie here that just bought the warcry warband and looking to pick up the new battlforce. I'd like to run an entire flying/balloon list, because that would be thematic and fun. Are there some good ways to do this?

[Docthe3rd]

Hey all,

So I'm looking at making a 1000 point list for an upcoming campaign, and am looking for input. It's currently my old Meeting Engagement list, but I want to adapt it into a "normal" 1000 point list, if changes are needed:

KO Meeting Engagement

Skyport: Barak-Zon

 

Leaders

Aether Khemist

 

Endrinmaster w/ Dirigible Suit (General)

-        Bearer of the Ironstar

-        Aethersped Hammer

Battleline

 10x Arkanaut Company

            -1x Aethermatic Volleygun

            -1x Light Skyhook

            -1x Skypike

10x Arkanaut Company

             -1x Aethermatic Volleygun

            -1x Light Skyhook

            -1x Skypike

 6x Skywardens

-        2x Aethermatic Volley Gun

-        2x Skyhook

 6x Skywardens

-        1 Skyhook

Other Units:

Grundstok Gunhauler

-        Sky Cannon

-        Coalbeard’s Collapsible Compartments

 

Any and all changes are ok, since I'm planning on getting some more anyway - I never really know when I should put in the bigger airships, but have been meaning to buy one for a while now. 

Thanks for the help!

[dmorley21]

I see some of you calling for changes - I'm really hoping there aren't that many changes honestly. Due to COVID, I haven't been able to play since the latest round of points changes and I just think overall there hasn't been nearly as much playing as there would be otherwise - so it's a lot more difficult to say what's good and what needs fixing unless it's really obvious. 

As for Broken Realms, my biggest hope would be to give KO more melee options just to present a different choice. I'm not sure if that would be a battalion, or something like a warscroll rewrite for Skywardens. 

[CitizenX]

So I am really feeling the urge to get into KO by getting the battleforce box and the half of aetherwar. Any advice for someone brand new to the faction?

[nissefika]

29 minutes ago, CitizenX said:

So I am really feeling the urge to get into KO by getting the battleforce box and the half of aetherwar. Any advice for someone brand new to the faction?

You also need arko screens

[Eevika]

Just finished painting this great guy. 

[Rachmani]

Should they tinker with the Ironclad, I think it'd be essential to alter Frigattes. 
Points, Endrinworks & +1 Fly High capacity (to get 10 + 1 Hero in one Frigatte). All good candidates.

[Phasteon]

Hello fellow skyfarers, just took a beating from a Kroak Seraphon list yesterday and I must say, even knowing how weak KO are against that kind of AoE MW spam I was kind of overwhelmed by how little I could do about it (played Barak Nar, but I guess it doesnt matter - I even shut down Kroaks entire casting for a whole turn! did not help in the end...) 

 

I have to admit, I played it kind of poorly and did not directly focus Kroak because he told me that he can send wounds to his temple guard AFTER his 4+ shrug, so I tried avoiding him and capture the rest - turned out a very crucial mistake. 

But even if I had focussed him/the guard first and tried to put him down ASAP, by the time I would have killed him safely the damage would already been done. 

An unfortunate early doubleturn for him sealed the deal. 

 

Long story short, I dont think KO need to be adjusted with an obvious weakness like that, because there are plenty of armies with those AoE MW options, Kroak being probably the most evil one. 

In hindsight I could have picked the Voidstone Orb to counter the Balewind Vortex, reducing Kroaks AoE range by 6“, killing the Astrolith ASAP to make it 10“ again, staying out of range BUT we are playing a campaign with fixed lists and I did not want to go 100% anti magic when there are some players that dont use magic at all. Same goes for tournaments too I guess - took the flarepistol instead which I did not even got to use because the Navigator was AoEd to death before... 

 

Well, maybe I lack some practice at the moment, but that game was still brutal. 

Next one will be against the coalesced, who practically halve my armies damage, will be fun too I guess (not) 

Edited November 23, 2020 by Phasteon

[Beliman]

1 hour ago, Phasteon said:

I have to admit, I played it kind of poorly and did not directly focus Kroak because he told me that he can send wounds to his temple guard AFTER his 4+ shrug, so I tried avoiding him and capture the rest - turned out a very crucial mistake. 

I can't help with them (really low experience and it ended really bad), but I think that the Saurus Guard ability is before you allocate any wound or mortal wound, and the Slann ability ticks when you allocate a wound or mortal wound. So Saurus Guard Protection should be before the 4+ shrug.

Nothing big, but that could help focusing Lord Kroak (you could kill the Guard faster).

Edited November 23, 2020 by Beliman

[Boar]

4 hours ago, Phasteon said:

Long story short, I dont think KO need to be adjusted with an obvious weakness like that, because there are plenty of armies with those AoE MW options, Kroak being probably the most evil one. 

I know Teclis have one, who else?

Having weaknesses, bad matchups is given, if army has 1-2 bad matchups and say 15 favorable it definitely would need adjusting. How much KO need adjusting and where (Zilfin mostly perhaps?) is another subject, but having (one) obvious weakness isn't really compelling argument. Slaneesh was weak vs shooting, it still needed downgrade.

Kroak OTH is example of unit that definetly needs adjustment.

[japaricio]

I don't think KO is that dominant as someone is saying. AoS is played by objetives, and while KO has a mobility advantage, it also true that we don't like spreading too much our forces, an Ironclad is for sure a centrepice and hits hard, but considering its point value, its doesn't hit THAT hard, it hits hard because it carries other dwarfs inside. We can kill most of the armies in 5 turns, but if we do so, we mostly lose the game, because we are hitting and repositioning all the game, and not playing the objetives taht well.

 

What's more, we have some weaknesess, the MW spam from Seraphon or LrL, ID playing tricks with our shooting, armies that alpha stricke us...

 

Our current situation is good, but we are not top meta, not even the Spell in the Bottle Ziflin list. So if you play other lists (as most of us who don't play the same always), we don't have that much success, which is fine for me.

[Boar]

2 hours ago, japaricio said:

but we are not top meta

Prevelance of KO in top 5 of tournaments results appear to contradict that.

There are also attempts at more indepth analysis by folks out there.