AoS 2 - Blades of Khorne Discussion

[andysonic1]

I only have starter set Blood Warriors so I know which one I'm going with.

[ChaosUndivided]

I'm kinda sick of the whole axe vs fist debate i wish we could put it to rest already.

[andysonic1]

Just now, ChaosUndivided said:

I'm kinda sick of the whole axe vs fist debate i wish we could put it to rest already.

It's going to keep coming up every 15-20 pages or so because there's no repository of good info regarding the new release just yet. I'm unsure how much mods like us mentioning 1d4chan but it's slowly getting updated.

[Coyote]

Axes vs Fists, can we choose each different combat?  Or does the choice have to be all game?  

Say I charge a chaff unit and decide to use double axes, finish that combat, am out of combat completely- and then am charged by an elite unit.  Can I switch to Fists then? 

[Xasz]

6 minutes ago, Coyote said:

Axes vs Fists, can we choose each different combat?  Or does the choice have to be all game?  

Say I charge a chaff unit and decide to use double axes, finish that combat, am out of combat completely- and then am charged by an elite unit.  Can I switch to Fists then? 

Wat.

Wysiwyg (what you see is what you get) plus, equipment is chosen pregame.

Edited March 21, 2019 by Xasz

[ChaosUndivided]

I want to expand on this Goretide slaughterhost + Bloodman warband idea cuz its what i plan on tinkering with first and most. Not because i think its a tournament winner but because for one i got the models and two it looks solid.

I plan on 2x10 Blood Warriors and Magore's. Im not going heavy on these guys cuz their expensive, need a lil babysitting, and i want room for other stuff.

Next im taking at least 1 unit of 10 Reavers for look out sir and to blood sacrifice with a Slaughter Priest. I might take another 20 man Reaver squad to act as a tarpit, the idea here is an early run + charge (whip if needed) to hopefully keep opponent off objective for turn or 2.

I'm thinking a 10 man Skull Reaper unit to throw buffs on. This is gonna do a lot of the heavy lifting while i try to catch stuff out with the Blood Warrior's run + charge. I dont gotta worry about battle shock here and if im gonna focus on buffing a single unit im taking at least 10 of these guys, with their big bases their gonna be too unwieldy in more than 10, same idea for Blood Warrior's.

The Aspiring Death is going to probably follow Reapers around or help a unit of Blood Warriors punch a hole thru something.

The Secrator is probably gonna camp an objective, it depends if i bring warshrine or not. Also if he can keep up with anyone.

I want at least 1 Stoker for that long bomb Reaver pit charge turn 1 if need be but mainly to babysit the Warriors and add to thier threat range. In fact i think i might take 2 to babysit both 10x Warrior units.

Next im taking 2 Slaughter Priest with the altar rerolling blood boil im gonna nuke a enemy support pieces and pass out buffs and sacrifice for bt. Depending on my opponent im gonna bring the judgments too so i can test them. 

Depending on point size of game (i play a lot under 2k cuz time constraints) im either taking another priest for buffs or the Warshrine. I think the shrine has better utility than 3rd priest as i still get blessing but will work good with my blob of Reavers if i go that route, otherwise, as support for the Reapers and/or judgments.

After that whatever points are left over i would take a Korgy or CP or something... I haven't done math.

[Retro]

3 hours ago, Zamik said:

I think the Bloodied Saek model from that set would work out well too. Heck, buying Garrek's Reavers is cheaper than buying a standard Slaughterpriest, if you're willing to kitbash.

How do they stack up for size?

Edit: never mind, someone already mentioned they're a bit smaller.

Edited March 21, 2019 by Retro

[HollowHills]

20 minutes ago, Xasz said:

Wysiwyg

I'm 100% using my easy to build reavers as having meat ripper axes. 

[Xasz]

4 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

I'm 100% using my easy to build reavers as having meat ripper axes. 

I think reavers, especially the ones form the starter box, have both options on the model by default.

Doesn't change the fact that you have to decide before the game.

Edited March 21, 2019 by Xasz

[ChaosUndivided]

I haven't seen anyone mention this yet but Blood Stoker still adds +3 to run AND charge. This is massive cuz before their really was no way to do both same move phase now we can.

[Retro]

4 minutes ago, Xasz said:

I think reavers, especially the ones form the starter box, have both options anyway.

The easy to build ones from the starter box only came with reaver blades, no meat ripper axe option unfortunately.

I've been holding off painting mine until I can decide whether I can put the effort into converting them or not.

[Retro]

37 minutes ago, Coyote said:

Axes vs Fists, can we choose each different combat?  Or does the choice have to be all game?  

Say I charge a chaff unit and decide to use double axes, finish that combat, am out of combat completely- and then am charged by an elite unit.  Can I switch to Fists then? 

No you can't, once you've chosen them pre game, that's what they are for the entire match. Some people will play "what you see is what you get"(WYSIWYG) where you have to play them as what the models physically have equipped, some people will be more lenient and let you play them however you like. 

You still can't change them mid game though.

[HollowHills]

22 minutes ago, Xasz said:

Doesn't change the fact that you have to decide before the game.

Agree, but I don't think Wysiwyg is a fun way to play if it stops you doing something which is easy for both players to understand, can be marked in your list and communicated before a game. 

Etb counting as meat ripper axes, skeles with swords counting as with spears etc. Its a nicer way to play. 

But different than if you said "my wrathmongers count as skullreapers" for instance. 

[ChaosUndivided]

1 minute ago, HollowHills said:

Agree, but I don't think Wysiwyg is a fun way to play if it stops you doing something which is easy for both players to understand, can be marked in your list and communicated before a game. 

Etb counting as meat ripper axes, skeles with swords counting as with spears etc. Its a nicer way to play. 

But different than if you said "my wrathmongers count as skullreapers" for instance. 

I got 10 Skull Reapers/ Wrathmongers with magnetized weapons... Yes that 40 magnetized bits lol. But for what they cost and utility of both options i don't regret doing it.

[Xasz]

19 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

Agree, but I don't think Wysiwyg is a fun way to play if it stops you doing something which is easy for both players to understand, can be marked in your list and communicated before a game. 

Etb counting as meat ripper axes, skeles with swords counting as with spears etc. Its a nicer way to play. 

But different than if you said "my wrathmongers count as skullreapers" for instance. 

I am with you for the most part, wysiwyg is rarely enforced in a harsh way.

Personally, I often mix my units so they could count for different setups while maintaining a pleasing visual.

If it's a pickup game no one cares anyway, but if you roll into a tournament with several units having noticeably different equipment (i.e. 100% different) than you marked down on you sheet...

Edited March 21, 2019 by Xasz

[Reuben Parker]

Not exactly sure on all new points but I think this should get into new 2k if not can switch to a cheaper character. Looking at zero priest instead just MSU mass blood tithe which to me seems far more interesting  I really want Khorne to play and have work as a suicide army as it will be so different to anything else (I own a lot of sigmar armies).

Skarr bloodwrath
Scyla 
Valkia 
Mighty Lord
Bloodsecrator - thermal rider cloak
Thedda- allies 

Godsworn hunt - allies 
Magores fiends 
Riptooth 
Garreks reavers 
3x10 reaver 
10 blood warrior 
2x5 skull reaper 
2x5 wrath monger 

18 blood tithe and a whole host of wounds (needed as new khorne are slow as hell now). 

Edited March 21, 2019 by Reuben Parker

[That Guy]

1 hour ago, ChaosUndivided said:

When you get right down to it i would say gorefist are hands down better.

Nice, post. To add some stats. Say you run 2 units of MSU blood warriors. To prevent complecations with the goreglaive non existant. 
2 leaders means 1 extra attack per unit. So you'll have 11 attacks per unit. 22 for 2 with the axes. Going twin gore axes. You'll roll 3-4 times a 1. 
That re-rolls into a 2/3th chance of becoming a hit. So you'll probably miss 1 hit out of the 22 if you go goreaxes. going into wound rolls, means you'll give out 10.5 wounds. Let's say you are lucky and you give 11 wounds. These have no rend. With gorefists you'll miss 3-4 hits, going to 18 or 19 hits. meaning you'll do 9 or 9.5 wounds. Looks like on average you'll force 1 and MAYBE 2 extra saves going with goreaxes. But wait, if you die, you'll do more! Dying immidiately means you'll force another 1-2 extra saves. So on average you can say that a blood warrior unit with goreaxes at LEAST forces 2-4 extra saves. This goes up by 1-2 extra saves every time they fight. Now gorefists are dependend how many saves you have to make. since even with being outrended you can take a save, it means with 10 models with 2 wounds. you'll be at least dealing 3 mortal wounds if you fully fight till death in melee. But it gets better once you take them in say a slaughterborn list or give them bronzed flesh, allowing them to survive with save throws. Both wargear setups are dependent on the unit they are fighting. against horde and low save models dual axes might do a bunch of damage over time, but... it could also mean that those hordes do a bunch of weak attacks vs you that you get to save and throw back at them in terms of mortal wounds on top of your normal attacks. It's just a really hard subject.

Edited March 21, 2019 by That Guy

[Retro]

58 minutes ago, HollowHills said:

Agree, but I don't think Wysiwyg is a fun way to play if it stops you doing something which is easy for both players to understand, can be marked in your list and communicated before a game. 

Etb counting as meat ripper axes, skeles with swords counting as with spears etc. Its a nicer way to play. 

But different than if you said "my wrathmongers count as skullreapers" for instance. 

I was intentionally trying to keep my post non committal.

Every person and gaming group will have a completely different opinion on the topic. Personally, my friends and I don't care as long as it is communicated, but I also know of people who are staunch WYSIWYG players.

Neither way is wrong, and I think the majority of people in a casual setting will give you some leniancy as long as you aren't totally abusing it.

If someone asked me if they could use skull reapers as wrathmongers to see how they play before buying another box. I'd say sure, go for it. But if they tried to keep doing it for months on end that might change things.

Also tournaments are typically 100% WYSIWYG, there shouldn't be any room for misinterpretation in a competitive setting.

[Bjornas]

Btw regarding the Juggerlord in Skullfiend Tribe: Giving him the Gorecleaver while giving the +2A weapon to an Ex. Deathbringer w/ Impaling Spear, keeping them close to each other and within the Bloodsecrator bubble would generate 10 attacks for the Deathbringer. Nasty.

[Reuben Parker]

8 minutes ago, Bjornas said:

Btw regarding the Juggerlord in Skullfiend Tribe: Giving him the Gorecleaver while giving the +2A weapon to an Ex. Deathbringer w/ Impaling Spear, keeping them close to each other and within the Bloodsecrator bubble would generate 10 attacks for the Deathbringer. Nasty.

The thing is the spear (which I love and is the best model) gets so many attacks anyway either more rend, more damage or maybe just making it the sword of judgement will normally be better. 

[Bjornas]

5 minutes ago, Reuben Parker said:

The thing is the spear (which I love and is the best model) gets so many attacks anyway either more rend, more damage or maybe just making it the sword of judgement will normally be better. 

Yea maybe, it just crossed my mind. There'll be a lot of 6's to wound with 10 attacks though, especially if he gets to reroll the 1's from the juggerlord. Definitely trying it out for a few games.

[ledha]

Now that i think about it, blood warriors having the possibility to switch between the axe bonus and the gorefist bonus at each combat phase would have been a very cool rule, making them more efficient (but not too overly so), fitting to their theme of warriors, and much more cool to use

[Kaz]

11 hours ago, Mikeymajq said:

I think all full rerolls aren't specifically for failed rolls in the book, if I'm not mistaken.

Then the dice go: FINE YOU DONT WANT YOUR HITS I’LL GIVE YOU MISSES

Nuffle can be a ****** sometimes

8 hours ago, kahadin said:

I hate to be a wet blanket, but this is really true. The reavers are man sized, while the priests are giants. It's not as cheap, but the exhalted dbs would be good with minimal conversion. 

Can confirm. A Slaughterpriest is SWOLE. If you think the Dwayne the Rock Johnson is big, the Slaughterpriest is taller, and even more buff, despite his seemingly lanky appearance. It’s nice that our priests compared to the puny priests of other races are very manly and do very many push ups and thus have MESSIVE pecs. 

8 hours ago, NemoVonUtopia said:

I chose gorefists mostly for aesthetics and because since they do mortal wounds I figure they will result in more consistent damage if I have to make a similar amount of armour saves. 

I think which is best depends on what you are facing and I dont think there is a clear winner. Since each bloodwarrior could attack 4-10 times depending on buffs and if they attack first and then die, rerolling ones will always be useful but you have to go through the normal attack sequence to cause more damage. Gorefists depend on how many attacks are coming in so their usefulness depends on what is attacking them which is less controllable.

So just based off my opinions and experience I dont think there is a clear best choice overall. Idk what statistics says about it.

I wrote a huge post earlier about it! I won’t dig it up again, but I’d say gorefists.

 

[Rivener]

I’ve begun considering some sort of Death Star for Khorne.

The Wrathstar: a 15+ man Bloodforged unit of Wrathmongers. A Warshrine with Killing Frenzy, the standard Bloodsecrator, and add Skarr Bloodwrath. 

Plenty of rerollable 3+ to-hit, and you MIGHT be able to fit them in next to a Bloodstoker. Fight twice, then fight again when they die, then explode for MWs. Battleshock can be mitigated by being Bravery 9 (Skullgrinder 8 +1 for being 10 models)

Thoughts?

[That Guy]

Do we have a list with the points somewhere?