The future of compendium warscrolls

[Arkiham]

Ha, this tweet has captured alot of the community perfectly.

 

This is done is jest to those who may get offended.

http://www.captiongenerator.com/296062/SCGT-Bans-compendium

[Ollie Grimwood]

57 minutes ago, Thomas Lyons said:

While something like the compendiumization of current armies is partially speculation, not all of it certainly is.  The reality is that a one-time made-to-order purchase of any old WHFB models still wouldn't let the be legal as their rules sit in the compendium section of the book and they aren't evergreen (so people couldn't buy them leading up to the event).

Even the most speculative claim I made (compendiumization of current armies) will happen eventually (notice my claim of "some day"; unspecific time frame) if the last 30 years of GW is anything to go by.  The production of a long list of armies and sub-factions have repeatedly been discontinued over the years.  Even specific models have been lost in the transition to AOS (I haven't forgotten that I can't play my Dreadlord on Pegasus model under AOS rules).  So while you may critique my hyperbole (rhetorical exaggeration to make a point), you can't actually critique the content of the claim (that GW will make current armies obsolete).  This has been true and will continue to be true into the future.  
 

I course it's criticable it's based on a flawed premise GW hasn't banned anything.  Also preceding AoS they'd made very few armies with army books obsolete, models were updated and occasional units went away sure but crikey my Wood Elves have still got a bloke called Scarloc in them. 

What are we really taking about Chaos Dwarfs (but they did come back) Dogs of War and arguably the Storm of Chaos armies. 

My objection with your hyperbole as you put is that (although you seemed to state it as fact) is that it is speculative, far fetched you claim Petilens is likely to be compendiumised in a couple of years when nothing that was in a Grand Alliance book has been moved to the compendium (quite the opostive in fact).  And that this is all because the SCGT don't like the compendium 

Sorry just seem over the top and unnecessarily so, it doesn't even particularly link with circumstances and I think you know it was a bit silly. 

[Sleboda]

33 minutes ago, phizzco said:

Again, you're always free to keep playing with your models.

This may not apply to all groups, but I'll point out again that for me at least this is not true. As the world goes, so goes my group.  As soon as TK go out of general tournament acceptance, nobody will want to play against my TK. Around here, most gaming is in prep for tournaments*. If the tournaments are not allowing TK, people won't "waste" their time against my TK army.

* This changed for a year when AoS dropped.  It was glorious.  People played with whatever toys they simply enjoyed and we all smiled.  Now, with Matched Play, it's all about "balanced" games only.  As soon as TK go away from the general environment, I won't have the option to play with mine, even casually.

[phizzco]

3 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

This may not apply to all groups, but I'll point out again that for me at least this is not true. As the world goes, so goes my group.  As soon as TK go out of general tournament acceptance, nobody will want to play against my TK. Around here, most gaming is in prep for tournaments*. If the tournaments are not allowing TK, people won't "waste" their time against my TK army.

* This changed for a year when AoS dropped.  It was glorious.  People played with whatever toys they simply enjoyed and we all smiled.  Now, with Matched Play, it's all about "balanced" games only.  As soon as TK go away from the general environment, I won't have the option to play with mine, even casually.

Sounds like your friends suck

 

Just kidding...... kind of.

[mmimzie]

4 minutes ago, phizzco said:

Sounds like your friends suck

 

Just kidding...... kind of.

This is a bit ruder than nessary. Be kid to your fellow war gamers

 

i can understand where he is coming from. Still don't care for compendium in my tournaments though.

[Sleboda]

Re: Sucky friends.

They are actually pretty cool, but it's a simple matter of budgeting time.  If you only get in a few games a quarter, and you have an event coming up, you practice for that event.

 

BTW, a point I made in a totally different topic has been bandied about here.  It is my belief that armies will only "live" for a few years at a time in the new GW world.  Produce a few kits, tie them to some campaigns and Realm books, sell through at the end of a two-year cycle and move on.

What will tournaments do then?

[Thomas Lyons]

35 minutes ago, Ollie Grimwood said:

I course it's criticable it's based on a flawed premise GW hasn't banned anything.  Also preceding AoS they'd made very few armies with army books obsolete, models were updated and occasional units went away sure but crikey my Wood Elves have still got a bloke called Scarloc in them. 

What are we really taking about Chaos Dwarfs (but they did come back) Dogs of War and arguably the Storm of Chaos armies. 

My objection with your hyperbole as you put is that (although you seemed to state it as fact) is that it is speculative, far fetched you claim Petilens is likely to be compendiumised in a couple of years when nothing that was in a Grand Alliance book has been moved to the compendium (quite the opostive in fact).  And that this is all because the SCGT don't like the compendium 

Sorry just seem over the top and unnecessarily so, it doesn't even particularly link with circumstances 

GW hasn't banned anything.  Again, they discontinue the production of a miniature line and then the #notarealarmy crew prohibits them from events.  So, yes, whole sub-factions like Chaos Dwarves (which they did come back, but many still considered them not a real army), Dogs of War, Storm of Chaos armies, as well as Kislev.  Beyond these entire sub-factions are also individual units like the Dreadlord/Sorceress on Pegasus, Halfling Hotpot, and a whole host of other units that seem to get lost in edition transitions.  

I agree that units haven't been moved to the compendium (yet), but lines do get discontinued, and the #notarealarmy mentality will consequently ban these scrolls (as we are currently seeing in a handful of events).  

And for the record, the SCGT doesn't like "some" of the compendium.  If they didn't like the compendium as a whole, then all of the Forgeworld models would be banned, as they are also compendium models. 

[phizzco]

6 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

This is a bit ruder than nessary. Be kid to your fellow war gamers

 

i can understand where he is coming from. Still don't care for compendium in my tournaments though.

I completely apologize. I'm totally kidding.

[Kaleb Daark]

Firstly, what an interesting thread and a mixed range of opinions and viewpoints.

 

As @MrCharisma has said above, does GW sponsor the SCGT?

Irrespective, as an independent tournament they have every right to make up their own rules, and as always some will shrug shoulders and say "so what" some will hoot for joy and others will find issue.

 

I'm going to take an oblique viewpoint here, and I'm sure many will find issue but here goes.

Firstly GW is a business, and ultimately is there to make money.  Unfortunately for better or for worse, that money is for share holders and the business has transcended Ansell, Priestley et all in a shed all having a laugh like good old boys.

If Brets and Tomb Kings died, it was because they weren't financially viable for GW  -  and yes I do hate them for it.  I had promised myself that when 9th landed I would do a bret army.  But also the tournament scene must also in part take responsibility.  the fallen armies didn't sell in these arenas because they were not perhaps seen as competitive enough, and thus overlooked.  But the very nature of such things is to win first and foremost.   I have a very good friend who was a real tournament hound, he would drop an army as soon as anything new landed which could assure him of victory.

He plays X-Wing now, having walked away entirely from AoS.  X-Wing also has waves of releases where the new wave will smack down the previous waves ensuring that players constantly update their collections if they want to stay competitive.  Like it or loath it, that's how businesses stay afloat by evolving their product lines and as a by product render some into obsolescence.  He wouldn't have touched brets in a million years, but by contrast as much as he killed brets off as good as by not giving them a second glance, he also was the bloke who parked 2400 points worth of hard cash down on every army that came out if the army book gave him what he wanted.  He didn't care what he played, he just wanted to climb the rankings.

I have my own thoughts on the fall of brets in warhammer which I have put in another thread so I won't go into it here, but ultimately like TK's they are gone.

GW always said that any army could be used in AoS, however as time progressed, they would not be developed and would indeed be overtaken by the new lines coming in.  The compendiums gave everyone a chance to drag out their army a little longer, but ultimately the end would be the same.

We saw the aesthetic of the new game hidden in plain sight during end times, and in reality before, the scale was wrong, the aesthetic wildly different, they would never in truth sit on the table comfortably with each other.  Wrath mongers and warriors of chaos as a case in point, and I for one would not have a load of (as I saw it) badly sculpted khorne farmers in armoured dungarees in my beloved warriors army.

 

But i'm digressing here.  If SCGT doesn't permit compendiums then just don't attend. In reality you can't do much else.  What you can do however is attend warhammer world events with your compendium army if only to prove a point.  Whether it will achieve anything is debatable but there we are.

During WHFB days was ETC comp any different? No, it was standalone from doing what GW tournaments did at warhammer world, and as I see it, so is this.

 

I started to love AoS with my chaos dwarfs.  I am such a compendium player in that respect as is @Ben. However, the fact that FW have released for the army a new character leads me in hope that some battle tome or campaign book is in the wings in the far future.  The could have shelved Shar'tor or re-purposed him, exactly as they did with the Stillborn Kdaai Destroyer - sorry Skarrac model - who still reeks of chaos dwarf - which makes me smile.

 

For brets, as for empire etc, there's still a lot of writing still to be done, so never say never. Who knows, the brets facelift that was planned for 9th may still make its way into AoS.  I'd love to see a darker Bretonnia, realising that the Lady was a lie and finding faith with druids and ...sod it, i'll say it, a narnia mashup mixed with dark grit and anger.  Brooding beauwolf steel instead of the Excalibur chrome plated armour of before.

Again I digress.

 

The compendiums were only there to allow you to tread water in the new system with the prospect of losing nothing if you didn't like it.  I do believe had rowntree been in charge, then it would have been handled very differently, and the community would have embraced it so much better.  I do believe the AoS version to come with GHB2 etc is what Rowntree would have wanted from the off, not the mess that Kirby spilled out, which wasn't fair on players or the game itself.  I also think has the campaign book paradigm been used from the off instead of the army book concept the evolution of the game would have been smoother and more evolved and enrichened because of it - as is happening now.

 

Sayl and tamurkhan were mentioned as not even being in End Times, yet the Tamurkhan campaign was set several hundred years prior to end times.  Priestley's original story arc for end times was of four warriors fighting for each of the ruinous powers all vying to become the lord of the end times - Tamurkhan was nurgle's champion.  This of course never happened, as the whole concept was taken out of his hands, the rest as we know is history.

 

Deep down we all know as AoS progresses those compendium armies will become through natural selection put to pasture, relegated to  a dark corner of the website and then last chanced.  The only thing that will save them from extinction is players purchasing them and showing the GW money men that they still are worth persevering with.  However, as I've said, there's still factions yet to be written for.  But when a new realm with updated he-man sized knights in armour riding pegasus and hypogriffs comes out - buy them up, same with sandy skeletons faction should they appear.  because if you don't all that will happen is that GW will turn around and say "come on community, you're all saying you love TK's and brets but our stock we got here has cobwebs and dust all over it."

"But I've spent thousands on my obselete XYZ"... yes and for GW that's the problem.  you spent rather than are spending.  If you're not a paying customer they don't care. cold but true. You don't pay the bills and they're not a charity.   However that's not to say that you won't spend.  A couple of years ago, I was in my local GW.  I overheard the area manager having a go at the store manager questioning what I was doing in there, and why he (the store manager) was permitting me to stay there and do hobby.  The store manager argued back saying that I always bought something and always put good money in his till.   I never forgot that, and to this day I have a big axe to grind with that area manager.  What the idiot didn't see was that in return for being in the environment I paid full retail in that store rather than go to a mail order outfit and save a fortune.

 

But I've rambled long enough... apologies fellow posters!

 

 

[phizzco]

38 minutes ago, Kaleb Daark said:

Firstly, what an interesting thread and a mixed range of opinions and viewpoints.

 

As @MrCharisma has said above, does GW sponsor the SCGT?

Irrespective, as an independent tournament they have every right to make up their own rules, and as always some will shrug shoulders and say "so what" some will hoot for joy and others will find issue.

 

I'm going to take an oblique viewpoint here, and I'm sure many will find issue but here goes.

Firstly GW is a business, and ultimately is there to make money.  Unfortunately for better or for worse, that money is for share holders and the business has transcended Ansell, Priestley et all in a shed all having a laugh like good old boys.

If Brets and Tomb Kings died, it was because they weren't financially viable for GW  -  and yes I do hate them for it.  I had promised myself that when 9th landed I would do a bret army.  But also the tournament scene must also in part take responsibility.  the fallen armies didn't sell in these arenas because they were not perhaps seen as competitive enough, and thus overlooked.  But the very nature of such things is to win first and foremost.   I have a very good friend who was a real tournament hound, he would drop an army as soon as anything new landed which could assure him of victory.

He plays X-Wing now, having walked away entirely from AoS.  X-Wing also has waves of releases where the new wave will smack down the previous waves ensuring that players constantly update their collections if they want to stay competitive.  Like it or loath it, that's how businesses stay afloat by evolving their product lines and as a by product render some into obsolescence.  He wouldn't have touched brets in a million years, but by contrast as much as he killed brets off as good as by not giving them a second glance, he also was the bloke who parked 2400 points worth of hard cash down on every army that came out if the army book gave him what he wanted.  He didn't care what he played, he just wanted to climb the rankings.

I have my own thoughts on the fall of brets in warhammer which I have put in another thread so I won't go into it here, but ultimately like TK's they are gone.

GW always said that any army could be used in AoS, however as time progressed, they would not be developed and would indeed be overtaken by the new lines coming in.  The compendiums gave everyone a chance to drag out their army a little longer, but ultimately the end would be the same.

We saw the aesthetic of the new game hidden in plain sight during end times, and in reality before, the scale was wrong, the aesthetic wildly different, they would never in truth sit on the table comfortably with each other.  Wrath mongers and warriors of chaos as a case in point, and I for one would not have a load of (as I saw it) badly sculpted khorne farmers in armoured dungarees in my beloved warriors army.

 

But i'm digressing here.  If SCGT doesn't permit compendiums then just don't attend. In reality you can't do much else.  What you can do however is attend warhammer world events with your compendium army if only to prove a point.  Whether it will achieve anything is debatable but there we are.

During WHFB days was ETC comp any different? No, it was standalone from doing what GW tournaments did at warhammer world, and as I see it, so is this.

 

I started to love AoS with my chaos dwarfs.  I am such a compendium player in that respect as is @Ben. However, the fact that FW have released for the army a new character leads me in hope that some battle tome or campaign book is in the wings in the far future.  The could have shelved Shar'tor or re-purposed him, exactly as they did with the Stillborn Kdaai Destroyer - sorry Skarrac model - who still reeks of chaos dwarf - which makes me smile.

 

For brets, as for empire etc, there's still a lot of writing still to be done, so never say never. Who knows, the brets facelift that was planned for 9th may still make its way into AoS.  I'd love to see a darker Bretonnia, realising that the Lady was a lie and finding faith with druids and ...sod it, i'll say it, a narnia mashup mixed with dark grit and anger.  Brooding beauwolf steel instead of the Excalibur chrome plated armour of before.

Again I digress.

 

The compendiums were only there to allow you to tread water in the new system with the prospect of losing nothing if you didn't like it.  I do believe had rowntree been in charge, then it would have been handled very differently, and the community would have embraced it so much better.  I do believe the AoS version to come with GHB2 etc is what Rowntree would have wanted from the off, not the mess that Kirby spilled out, which wasn't fair on players or the game itself.  I also think has the campaign book paradigm been used from the off instead of the army book concept the evolution of the game would have been smoother and more evolved and enrichened because of it - as is happening now.

 

Sayl and tamurkhan were mentioned as not even being in End Times, yet the Tamurkhan campaign was set several hundred years prior to end times.  Priestley's original story arc for end times was of four warriors fighting for each of the ruinous powers all vying to become the lord of the end times - Tamurkhan was nurgle's champion.  This of course never happened, as the whole concept was taken out of his hands, the rest as we know is history.

 

Deep down we all know as AoS progresses those compendium armies will become through natural selection put to pasture, relegated to  a dark corner of the website and then last chanced.  The only thing that will save them from extinction is players purchasing them and showing the GW money men that they still are worth persevering with.  However, as I've said, there's still factions yet to be written for.  But when a new realm with updated he-man sized knights in armour riding pegasus and hypogriffs comes out - buy them up, same with sandy skeletons faction should they appear.  because if you don't all that will happen is that GW will turn around and say "come on community, you're all saying you love TK's and brets but our stock we got here has cobwebs and dust all over it."

"But I've spent thousands on my obselete XYZ"... yes and for GW that's the problem.  you spent rather than are spending.  If you're not a paying customer they don't care. cold but true. You don't pay the bills and they're not a charity.   However that's not to say that you won't spend.  A couple of years ago, I was in my local GW.  I overheard the area manager having a go at the store manager questioning what I was doing in there, and why he (the store manager) was permitting me to stay there and do hobby.  The store manager argued back saying that I always bought something and always put good money in his till.   I never forgot that, and to this day I have a big axe to grind with that area manager.  What the idiot didn't see was that in return for being in the environment I paid full retail in that store rather than go to a mail order outfit and save a fortune.

 

But I've rambled long enough... apologies fellow posters!

 

 

Wonderful post!

[Ollie Grimwood]

7 hours ago, Thomas Lyons said:

GW hasn't banned anything.  Again, they discontinue the production of a miniature line and then the #notarealarmy crew prohibits them from events.  So, yes, whole sub-factions like Chaos Dwarves (which they did come back, but many still considered them not a real army), Dogs of War, Storm of Chaos armies, as well as Kislev.  Beyond these entire sub-factions are also individual units like the Dreadlord/Sorceress on Pegasus, Halfling Hotpot, and a whole host of other units that seem to get lost in edition transitions.  

I agree that units haven't been moved to the compendium (yet), but lines do get discontinued, and the #notarealarmy mentality will consequently ban these scrolls (as we are currently seeing in a handful of events).  

And for the record, the SCGT doesn't like "some" of the compendium.  If they didn't like the compendium as a whole, then all of the Forgeworld models would be banned, as they are also compendium models. 

Well we've certainly digressed but I think we can put the history discussion too bed we've narrowed it down to our personal perception of the events and I won't argue that.  Good call on Kislev. 

I think compendium refers to the Generals handbook compendium section specifically. 

[Thornshield]

 
But i'm digressing here.  If SCGT doesn't permit compendiums then just don't attend. In reality you can't do much else.  What you can do however is attend warhammer world events with your compendium army if only to prove a point.  Whether it will achieve anything is debatable but there we are.

Good post. I'm just going to touch on one point you made, quoted above. There's more that you can do besides voting with your feet.

You can promote more variety in events, some allowing compendium, some disallowing. Worried a large event changes the scene? Work to make an event (yours or others that you support) larger/visible, more heard, but most importantly, spread the message that the alternative is a viable approach while respecting the other.

May do another post when the Twitter poll closes later today. Which, I must stress, is purely for fun and not trying to enforce anything. Though there will be some messages that can be taken away from it.

Deciphered from the whispers of our missing god Slaanesh

[Ollie Grimwood]

2 minutes ago, Thornshield said:

 

Good post. I'm just going to touch on one point you made, quoted above. There's more that you can do besides voting with your feet.

You can promote more variety in events, some allowing compendium, some disallowing. Worried a large event changes the scene? Work to make an event (yours or others that you support) larger/visible, more heard, but most importantly, spread the message that the alternative is a viable approach while respecting the other.

May do another post when the Twitter poll closes later today. Which, I must stress, is purely for fun and not trying to enforce anything. Though there will be some messages that can be taken away from it.

Deciphered from the whispers of our missing god Slaanesh
 

 

One of the most sensible things I've read 

[CoffeeGrunt]

18 hours ago, CoffeeGrunt said:

If you have put money into the company over the last decade, they don't care and will at some point possibly discontinue your army. 

 

14 hours ago, Rhellion said:

Decade??? I would go further and say if you haven't bought an army in the last two years you aren't (financially) supporting AoS like the customer base they are targeting... and as a business they probably care less about your opinion.

How did you read what I wrote and interpret it as the exact opposite?

11 hours ago, phizzco said:

This is pretty much the same as video games. Street fighter, tekken, smash brothers, call of duty, rainbow 6.... all these games people buy, then in a year , or maybe 2, companies release a new game. Everyone moves on, especially once game companies shut down old game servers.

This is more like the original plan for the XBox One: I.e., you buy a console and hundreds of pounds worth of games over the years, but because the XBone was planned to be always-online, there was an issue that when MS shut down the servers at the end of its life cycle, your console and entire collection of games would be immediately unusable.

I still have my games going back to my PS2. I still have the option of booting up my old games, while playing my new ones. This is more like if someone took a hammer to my PS2 and XBoX 360 two years after the XBone dropped. Your analogy doesn't hold up.

[Thornshield]

Just to finish off, with the results of the not-official, not-legally binding, purely for fun & a bit of statistical analysis, twitter poll I ran on this topic.



Looks awfully like the polls of 2016! The first takeaway is that as a whole, neither side has an overwhelming majority, but with slightly more preferring to include compendium.

I split it into tourney/casual (twitter restrictions stopped me from being too specific with breakdowns like non-competitive tourney players etc) and you could really read the results as two polls.

On the casual side, you have a clearer majority wishing to continue playing with Compendium. They surely can do so, especially in casual games. More to come on this point later.

The tourney side is super close and possible indication of a divide, as evidenced by the heated arguments on this thread & Twitter. Now, what I want to say here again is we need to accept both sides, and I'd hope the way forward is for a 50/50 split of events that allow/disallow compendium, voting with your feet as it were.

Because any messages sent out on the Internet by decisions like banning compendium for an event often is taken literally by players not even playing at tourneys (eg the casual players or newcomers reading up on the game), there is the danger that they take it for gospel & actively shun Compendium scrolls even for non-Matched play games (if GW remove it from GHB2 down the line), despite evidence people would like the flexibility.

So I'm reiterating the important message of the above is that we need to send a clear message that it's fine to play with compendium if you choose to & to accept the other side's view respectfully. TGA and the AoS scene has been really welcoming and friendly, but I fear it's going back to some darker days.

Thanks for listening!

Deciphered from the whispers of our missing god Slaanesh

[Ratamaplata]

"Knowing the implications..." makes that a very leading question. Terrible way to word a poll if you want to use the result in any meaningful way.

[CoffeeGrunt]

It's a vague question with a small data pool, so I don't feel it can really be considered much more than advisory. Should have added an option for, "Don't Care," to cover the apathetic people who aren't bothered by it.

[Ratamaplata]

3 minutes ago, CoffeeGrunt said:

It's a vague question with a small data pool, so I don't feel it can really be considered much more than advisory. Should have added an option for, "Don't Care," to cover the apathetic people who aren't bothered by it.

Yeah another good point.

A lot of people may have said no because they don't support the removal. This doesn't mean they are against the removal, they may not care either way.

Totally useless data.

[MrCharisma]

I do have a feeling from this tourament stance and comments from some of the AoS Leaders in the community that they know or are anticipating a change in GHB 2. 

With Bretonnia and Tomb King removed from the GW website (with no legacy in the Last Chance section), perhaps the bandaid will be ripped off and the Old World won't be supported. 

[Marc Wilson]

11 minutes ago, Ratamaplata said:

"Knowing the implications..." makes that a very leading question. Terrible way to word a poll if you want to use the result in any meaningful way.

Good fun poll  but yeah the subtitle is leading and the question is very general. Do I think TO's can do what they want - they sure can! Would I be unhappy if an army of mischievous foxes slipped into peoples bedrooms and deleted all compendium scrolls, permanently, forever - sure I would be!

[CoffeeGrunt]

1 minute ago, MrCharisma said:

With Bretonnia and Tomb King removed from the GW website (with no legacy in the Last Chance section), perhaps the bandaid will be ripped off and the Old World won't be supported. 

So long as GW start opening up more options for the Grand Alliances that really need it, that might be okay. The problem is that the more anaemic factions rely on Compendium to have any real chance of being a full army.

[Arkiham]

5 minutes ago, Ratamaplata said:

Yeah another good point.

A lot of people may have said no because they don't support the removal. This doesn't mean they are against the removal, they may not care either way.

Totally useless data.

tbh, if you don't care either way you have no place voting in it. 

[Chris Tomlin]

I love you Ming, you know that, but the way that poll is set out is absolute nonsense and gives us nothing meaningful in return except to create more abrasion and fear mongering. More than anything I genuinely don't understand what you hoped to achieve from it?

This really is not big news guys.

Some tournaments will disallow compendium (however they choose to define that word), others will say it's fine. Some casual/narrative groups or events will do the same.

Be aware, this happened throughout 2016 and slipped by relatively quietly. I suspect all the fuss is because people are probably realising that the likelihood is that GW will stop supporting the compendium scrolls. That still doesn't stop you playing with your models or running events where others can use them. Attacking TO's for their decisions is pretty crazy when you think about it, no?

Already, @Ben has announced that his event in March is allowing compendium and I suspect that whilst 4 events (one of which I believe is a SCGT warm up - @Tom Loyn) have come out and said no to compendium, there will be plenty that also leave it in. So pick and choose your events as you see fit. I do get that it does have an effect outside of events, I'm not going to deny that. Tournament practice is obviously a thing.

Of the 57 players who bought tickets to my event in March, I have had not one negative comment from them since announcing I will be disallowing compendium (In fact I've received plenty of texts/DMs etc in support of the decision) - that's real numbers, actual tournament players, some of which may well be effected by this. The reality simply isn't anywhere near as bad as what this thread and Twitter are making it.

[Rhellion]

52 minutes ago, CoffeeGrunt said:

 

How did you read what I wrote and interpret it as the exact opposite?

"I would go further"... meaning, I was making a more specific statement than you general, 10 year statement. I specified a different statement than yours, yes. My wording was pretty clear by what I meant.

I don't care what you did over the last ten years. TBH, now it only matters since AoS came out. The years before... are the reason Warhammer was destroyed. 

[Turragor]

8 pages means there's a lot of valid feeling behind this but given the melodrama and occasional bitterness on each side and the relatively trivial seed for this debate, I don't think ppl are going to get what they want out of it.

Like I think no one will end up feeling happy.

So if I was offering advice that people were taking, I'd abandon this thread and reforge the strong feelings you guys might have into more constructive threads, better arguments or even projects or endeavours that work more towards what you envision your own personal hobby looking like in 2017 and beyond.

Just my opinion!