AoS 2 - Blades of Khorne Discussion

[drkrash]

I have a question about Khorne in a meeting engagement.  If Skarbrand is part of the main body, and thus comes in at the end of turn 1, is he already charged up for round 2? He did not attack in Round 1, after all, and I can't think of any other precedent that would answer this.

EDIT: I'm pretty sure this is right, re-reading the rule, and playing it at the table.

Edited February 25, 2020 by drkrash
added more

[Battlefury]

So Sayl changed from "Sayl the Faithless" to "Sayl sucks now".

What a shame... .

But thanks for the advice.

[Battlefury]

9 hours ago, drkrash said:

I have a question about Khorne in a meeting engagement.  If Skarbrand is part of the main body, and thus comes in at the end of turn 1, is he already charged up for round 2? He did not attack in Round 1, after all, and I can't think of any other precedent that would answer this.

EDIT: I'm pretty sure this is right, re-reading the rule, and playing it at the table.

Good question.

"From the second battle round, if this model is on the battlefield and did not attack in at least one of the combat phases of the previous battle round, when you look up a value on this model’s damage table the model is treated as having suffered 13 wounds."

The Warscroll does not specify, that the unit has to be on the battlefield in round 1, but it has to be in round 2.
My interpretation:

Since the text is stating in 1st place, that "from the second battleround", and in 2nd place "if this model is on the battlefield", that the circumstance being on the battlefield is applied for round 2, not obligatory for round 1.

So afaik I would say, that you are right, when you say, that when he comes in in round 2, the ability does apply to the model.

[Praecautus]

34 minutes ago, Battlefury said:

So Sayl changed from "Sayl the Faithless" to "Sayl sucks now".

What a shame... .

But thanks for the advice.

Not entirely. You can take some Khorne-marked slave units, buff them up and then teleport them over. For example teleport over a daemon prince for a turn 1 alpha strike with torc and have him mess up the weedy heros, he has to be dealt with, while the rest of the army charges up. Or send over a unit of chaos marauders with brass skin and shields and run them into the shooty unit.

 

Sadly Sayl is no longer sold by forge world, but he could be proxied as the scroll / points still valid I think.

Edited February 25, 2020 by Praecautus

[Battlefury]

3 hours ago, Praecautus said:

Not entirely. You can take some Khorne-marked slave units, buff them up and then teleport them over. For example teleport over a daemon prince for a turn 1 alpha strike with torc and have him mess up the weedy heros, he has to be dealt with, while the rest of the army charges up. Or send over a unit of chaos marauders with brass skin and shields and run them into the shooty unit.

 

Sadly Sayl is no longer sold by forge world, but he could be proxied as the scroll / points still valid I think.

Right now I wanted to state th same, but thank you for the reply!

We could easily build our own versions of Sayl, use another model that we find fitting ... . Or watch here for an alternative:

https://www.thingiverse.com/



 

[drkrash]

4 hours ago, Battlefury said:

Good question.

"From the second battle round, if this model is on the battlefield and did not attack in at least one of the combat phases of the previous battle round, when you look up a value on this model’s damage table the model is treated as having suffered 13 wounds."

The Warscroll does not specify, that the unit has to be on the battlefield in round 1, but it has to be in round 2.
My interpretation:

Since the text is stating in 1st place, that "from the second battleround", and in 2nd place "if this model is on the battlefield", that the circumstance being on the battlefield is applied for round 2, not obligatory for round 1.

So afaik I would say, that you are right, when you say, that when he comes in in round 2, the ability does apply to the model.

Furthermore, in most Meeting Engagement battleplans, Skarbrand *is* on the board in Round 1.  He appears at the end of your 1st turn.  So I think he wanders on, quickly sizes up the scene, and gets pissed off!

[Holy_Diver]

How can work a Darkfeast in The Flayed tribe subfaction? I think 20 reavers (in charge) with 2+ RR ones to hit/4+ RR to wound and 4 attacts each can be painful for most people, but I dunno. They can't alphastrike so it's a metter of initiative to do such thing.

Any thought about The Flayed combos?

[Mikeymajq]

3 minutes ago, Holy_Diver said:

How can work a Darkfeast in The Flayed tribe subfaction? I think 20 reavers (in charge) with 2+ RR ones to hit/4+ RR to wound and 4 attacts each can be painful for most people, but I dunno. They can't alphastrike so it's a metter of initiative to do such thing.

Any thought about The Flayed combos?

The Flayed don't do much for reavers. Except maybe the command ability. 

20 reavers will never all get to swing due to their 32mm bases. 

[ogarrah]

2 hours ago, Holy_Diver said:

How can work a Darkfeast in The Flayed tribe subfaction? I think 20 reavers (in charge) with 2+ RR ones to hit/4+ RR to wound and 4 attacts each can be painful for most people, but I dunno. They can't alphastrike so it's a metter of initiative to do such thing.

Any thought about The Flayed combos?

I don't think taking flayed solely to  benefit Bloodreavers is worth it,  as said before the command ability is really the only thing going for them, as it allows them to fight before they get shredded (assuming they got the charge).The only slaughterhost that Bloodreavers can be good in is Goretide. Run and charge is really good, and if you whip them you can get a block of 40 across the board turn one. I've built a whole list around MSU Goretide Bloodreavers running everywhere throwing out 41 attacks each  with Gore Pilgrims and Dark Feast. Having to rely on a charge for a unit to do serious damage is generally not a good strategy,  especially for bloodreavers, because outside  of Goretide, it's hard to get them into combat quickly before they get shredded by shooting/casting . If you want to use lots of reavers, Goretide with Dark Feast and/or Gore Pilgrims is really the only way to go.

[Agent of Chaos]

On 2/23/2020 at 7:04 AM, ogarrah said:

Unless  I can't count or Battlescribe is wrong,  you need one more STD mortal unit to meet the requirement for the Bloodmarked Warband.  I think you need eight STD mortal units plus one STD mortal hero. I don't know much about how STD units play on the table, but it looks like the only option to meet the requirements is to take out a unit of Chaos Knights, and add two units  of Marauder Horsemen. Blood marked warband  is a hard battalion to build a Khorne army around but otherwise you've done a good job.  Don't forget about the Goretide  command ability,  you can zoom around your blood warrior and 'reaver unit to capture points or slow down enemy blenders. Keep in mind that reavers within the Rage of Khorne arua get +2 attacks because of frenzied devotion, so you can either run them around the table or use them to protect your Bloodsecrator.  Depending on what your meta is, I would consider taking out the Chaos Spawn for Hex-Gorger Skulls, in which case I would switch the Blood Sacrifice prayer for Bronzed Flesh or Killing Frenzy, assuming you were planning to use the Spawn as the Blood Sacrifice target.  This list is pretty mobile, and well rounded. The knights, marauders and chaos lords provide good hammers,  and with the Marauder horsemen running everywhere, you should maintain good board control. 

Thanks mate. The Chaos Lord counts as the 8th hero so the battalion checks out. I've been playing khorne a few years now so familiar with all the tricks you mentioned. I'd love to throw the skulls in but I need the spawn for the battalion. Might give the list a run one day and see how it goes. 

[ogarrah]

1 hour ago, Agent of Chaos said:

Thanks mate. The Chaos Lord counts as the 8th hero so the battalion checks out. I've been playing khorne a few years now so familiar with all the tricks you mentioned. I'd love to throw the skulls in but I need the spawn for the battalion. Might give the list a run one day and see how it goes. 

No problem, tell me how it does, I'm interested in running a Khorne marked STD army  someday.

[Praecautus]

On 2/21/2020 at 12:18 AM, Agent of Chaos said:

Tooling around with the Blood Marked Warband. With so many mortal slaves units required its hard to fit much killing power into the list so went for MSU to generate a bunch of bloodtithe... reckon this list has legs?

Allegiance: Khorne
- Slaughterhost: The Goretide
Mortal Realm: Ulgu

Leaders
Chaos Lord on Karkadrak (250)
- General
- Command Trait: Hew the Foe
- Artefact: Dimensional Blade
Chaos Lord (110)
- Daemonbound War-flail
- Artefact: Sword of Judgement
Bloodsecrator (120)
- Artefact: Thronebreaker's Torc
Slaughterpriest (100)
- Blood Blessing: Killing Frenzy
Slaughterpriest (100)
- Blood Blessing: Blood Sacrifice

Battleline
20 x Chaos Marauders (150)
- Axes & Shields
5 x Blood Warriors (100)
- Goreaxes
10 x Bloodreavers (70)
- Reaver Blades

Units
5 x Chaos Marauder Horsemen (90)
- Javelin & Shield
5 x Chaos Marauder Horsemen (90)
- Javelin & Shield
5 x Chaos Marauder Horsemen (90)
- Javelin & Shield
5 x Chaos Knights (180)
- Cursed Lance
5 x Chaos Knights (180)
- Ensorcelled Weapons
1 x Slaves to Darkness Chaos Spawn (50)

Battalions
Gore Pilgrims (140)
Bloodmarked Warband (180)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 137

I like it, will be interested to hear how it does.

Only a couple of thoughts to consider. keeping the chaos lord on foot in range of everyone to use his double pile in will be hard as most of your slave units are so fast, you may want to consider the cloak that buffs movement on him instead so he can keep up.

A blood stoker would be nice to fit in to give the mobile units even more range - marauders get a super long charge with him and help the lord keep up. But I think you need to adjust a lot to slot him in.

 

 

[Roark]

Yeah, I've found that the Chaos Lord isn't so great without the Thermalrider Cloak. Obviously you take him almost entirely for his command, but with Hew the Foe and double weapon profile he's an awesome beatstick for his measly points. Having 7 (!) wounds helps a lot too.

[drkrash]

Are Meeting Engagements a *kind* of Pitched Battle? Or are they just *like* a Pitched Battle?

There was a Sword & Steele batrep where Naomi used Baleful Lords in a Meeting Engagement to use 3 Bloodthirsters (normally you can only have 2).  I wondered what people's thoughts on this were...since I have a Meeting Engagement tournament coming up...

[Agent of Chaos]

Cheers for the thoughts guys. Would love a Bloodstoker in there but every unit is needed for the battalion. I could drop a unit of knights for 5 warriors and the Stoker. Less killing power but more blood tithe... hmm

I hear you on the chaos lord and having hims as the goretide general is an interesting idea for sure but I really wanted the Karkadrak to be a beatstick as the list lacks hammers. The chaos lord probably would get more out of Thermalrider cloak but then I cant take Dimensional Blade or Sword of Judgement on the karkadrak.  He will just have to run really fast and keep up!

[Roark]

4 hours ago, Agent of Chaos said:

I hear you on the chaos lord and having hims as the goretide general is an interesting idea for sure but I really wanted the Karkadrak to be a beatstick as the list lacks hammers.

Sorry man, I was just waffling about the Chaos Lord in a vacuum really and yeah, you can't have everything. The Chungus Lord is a pure killer with one of those Rend -3 weapons and significantly easier to buff (than a maxed unit) with the Chaos Lord's command - cloak or no cloak! In fact, your list is quite good for that in that regard with no huge swarms.

I always get frustrated with the Bloodmarked Warband (usually when the third Chaos Spawn waddles into the list to make up the numbers).

[Beer & Pretzels Gamer]

Kicking off a Khorne based narrative cycle this weekend.  Basic concept is that Bel’akor has stirred up trouble between the Daemon and Mortal sides of the Blades of Khorne.  It is an argument that can only be settled by a contest to see which group can claim more blood for the blood god.

From Khorne perspective after playing a lot of mixed lists lately it is an excuse to bulk out the units in order to be better able to field pure Daemon and pure Mortals lists.  Enables us to try out some units we haven’t really seen much of on the table as well.

The Daemons list is pretty simple:

Tyrants of Blood Battalion w/RAGE, FURY and Skarbrand

Murderhost w/Skulltaker and three units of Bloodletters (30-10-10)

Karanak

For Mortals we’re taking advantage of it being narrative to up the drops:

Gore Pilgrims w/2x Slaughterpriests, Bloodsecrator, 40x Reavers, 5x Bloodwarriors & 5x Bloodwarriors

9x Skull Crushers

5x Wrathmongers

Aspiring Deathbringer

Mighty Lord of Khorne

Chaos Lord on Karkadrak

For the mortals we’re trying out a Reaver Deathstar of the 40x Reavers, Bloodsecrator, 5x Wrathmongers, Aspiring Deathbringer and Slaughterpriest w/Killing Frenzy to see if the aura bubbles can be managed to max the attacks and hit probabilities.  

The intent Is to play through three rounds with the Khorne winner getting to be the general of that side in the 8K blowoff finale.  We’ll adjust each list each round (can’t wait to get Mazarall the Butcher out there).

For the opposing armies the intent is to try out some new battletomes.  So this weekend the Daemons will be going up against a BCR list while the Mortals will face off against Gutbusters to try out the new Mawtribes tome.  Hoping the next round to try out the new KO tome.

Biggest outstanding question is whether score should be kept with Skulls (# of models killed) or Blood (# of wounds from models killed)?  Leaning towards the latter to even out facing different factions (e.g. BCR and KO likely to have lower model count then say Gutbusters or Sylvaneth...)

[Malfean]

Has anyone been using the Slaves to Darkness Daemon Prince for its Command Ability to delay enemies moving onto objectives or denying charges so you can set up and engage melee at the pace you want to dictate? Granted it doesn't work as well vs stuff like Changehost, but still might be worth considering vs armies like Bonereapers or Orruk Warclanz. 

Edited February 28, 2020 by Malfean

[Zamik]

47 minutes ago, Malfean said:

Has anyone been using the Slaves to Darkness Daemon Prince for its Command Ability to delay enemies moving onto objectives or denying charges so you can set up and engage melee at the pace you want to dictate? Granted it doesn't work as well vs stuff like Changehost, but still might be worth considering vs armies like Bonereapers or Orruk Warclanz. 

I've been using the Crimson Crown on the DP to have that aura going all the time when fighting Ogors and Nighthaunt recently. There's nothing like cancelling out those Wave of Terror rolls!

[Beer & Pretzels Gamer]

20 hours ago, Beer & Pretzels Gamer said:

Biggest outstanding question is whether score should be kept with Skulls (# of models killed) or Blood (# of wounds from models killed)?  Leaning towards the latter to even out facing different factions (e.g. BCR and KO likely to have lower model count then say Gutbusters or Sylvaneth...)

The other detail we are working out is the Blood Tithe.  We’re stretching to get two full Khorne armies on table so our summoning bench (pre-Daemon army casualties) is WRATH, 10x Bloodletters, 10x Flesh Hounds (at least 5 of which we initially need to reserve for Karanak), 6x Bloodcrushers, and a Bloodmaster.  So decent but if both players were looking to draw from it could easily see conflicting demands.

Fortunately the nature of the bet is such that the Mortals shouldn’t want to be summoning Daemonic aid.  So at least for tomorrow’s game no Summoning for the Goretide.  For balance then we are thinking the Daemons should be prevented from using the Rewards table.  Truthfully we haven’t used the Rewards Table as much as we’ve summoned so not sure how much balance that actually provides?

[Balloon Dwarf]

Just getting into Khorne and was looking at the warscrolls and the like.. Is there a reason that nobody seems to take skullreapers? They seem like a pretty punchy unit and part of a lot of battalions... Sorry if this has been answered already but with 247 pages its a lot to get through. 

[Praecautus]

1 hour ago, Balloon Dwarf said:

Just getting into Khorne and was looking at the warscrolls and the like.. Is there a reason that nobody seems to take skullreapers? They seem like a pretty punchy unit and part of a lot of battalions... Sorry if this has been answered already but with 247 pages its a lot to get through. 

Welcome to Khorne 

In answer your your question, skull reapers are great in a mortal list as they bring a lot of MW output. I think most mortal players will be taking 10.

Their only weakness is being a bit slow, but otherwise they are solid.

[Zamik]

2 hours ago, Balloon Dwarf said:

Just getting into Khorne and was looking at the warscrolls and the like.. Is there a reason that nobody seems to take skullreapers? They seem like a pretty punchy unit and part of a lot of battalions... Sorry if this has been answered already but with 247 pages its a lot to get through. 

They're slow, and pretty expensive (ten of them cost more than any Bloodthirster besides Skarbrand!). That being said, if you can keep the unit healthy, they can mess up whatever they meet. In a game recently against Ogors they tore up a unit of 6 Gluttons, a unit of 40 Gnoblars, and a Scraplauncher.

[jazman84]

1 hour ago, Zamik said:

They're slow, and pretty expensive (ten of them cost more than any Bloodthirster besides Skarbrand!). That being said, if you can keep the unit healthy, they can mess up whatever they meet. In a game recently against Ogors they tore up a unit of 6 Gluttons, a unit of 40 Gnoblars, and a Scraplauncher.

Yep, Blender potential is very high, however, the lack of rend can really blunt them against anything with a half-decent save. They have great weapon profiles other than this lack of rend. Because of this I reckon they are best at deleting low armored hordes and high wound targets that have low armor. And keep them away from more resilient targets, because you'll be throwing a lot of dice with little result.

 

Oh, and back them up with some Warmongers and a Bloodsecrator for +2 attacks.

Edited March 1, 2020 by jazman84

[Malfean]

A lot of the army could use more rend, Skullreapers especially, though on the competitive side of things I'm not sure how much it'd help with so many armies fielding bricks of durable infantry, some of which get back up when killed. Or fast shooting that just melts our army in 1-2 turns.

Love the models though. I'm making five for a Warcry game.