Lets Chat: Idoneth Deepkin

[Gecktron]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/04/08/who-are-the-idoneth-deepkin/

Preview Article is up on Warhammer Community 

 

Pre-order starts on 14th of April for the Battletome, the Namarti Thralls, the Eidolon and Dices

[Connelj2]

The tide rules are so good the +1 cover save in the first battle round will really help you survive the alpha strike lists

[Gecktron]

The Tides table is great but I think the "forgotten Nightmares" ability is even stronger! Forcing the enemy which unit they can shoot is a perfect counter to the shooting heavy meta. Its also a great way to keep heroes alive for much longer.

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

There's a kraken in the artwork in that article.  Wish there was one on the tabletop... perhaps some day.

[Barkanaut]

Someday, but they have to keep some surprises. Just like they teased bigger ships in the ko book we still don’t have.  At any rate I have to save money but I want to buy some so badly. All I can do is get the book for now and wait for Christmas. Your all so lucky. 

[Acid_Nine]

OOOOOOOWWEEEE! Those abilities! Man, bringing 40k rules to AoS in this way would be helpful, but I want to see which models have that Nightmare rule. I don't think it will be everything, but if it's just heroes and the like then cool. Well, we have a bullet shield at least in the leviadon,  the supposed defense the model has against range can make this a nice counter army for some kharadon shenanigans. (Some shenanigans at least... Don't think they can survive 40 dwarves with skyhooks though...)

The tide mechanics will be fascinating, and I wonder if there will be magic to change the tides. Having the High tide roll in even if you get double turned would make sure you get some hits in at least, and then ebb tide can help finish guys off. This is like a better version of 40k's canticles of the omnisiah, but for more movement and speed compared to one time buffs.

Now I REALLY want to see the unit rules. I have to know what to focus my purchases on with only 150$ to spend...

And hey, this artwork of the angler clearly shows that almost any race's souls can be stolen, so that's radical. I was hoping that this would be the case, though how much would it suck to consume a rat soul?

 

[Connelj2]

It seems like that made the nightmares rule to ****** down KO and sky fire

[mmimzie]

2 minutes ago, Acid_Nine said:

OOOOOOOWWEEEE! Those abilities! Man, bringing 40k rules to AoS in this way would be helpful, but I want to see which models have that Nightmare rule. I don't think it will be everything, but if it's just heroes and the like then cool. Well, we have a bullet shield at least in the leviadon,  the supposed defense the model has against range can make this a nice counter army for some kharadon shenanigans. (Some shenanigans at least... Don't think they can survive 40 dwarves with skyhooks though...)

The tide mechanics will be fascinating, and I wonder if there will be magic to change the tides. Having the High tide roll in even if you get double turned would make sure you get some hits in at least, and then ebb tide can help finish guys off. This is like a better version of 40k's canticles of the omnisiah, but for more movement and speed compared to one time buffs.

Now I REALLY want to see the unit rules. I have to know what to focus my purchases on with only 150$ to spend...

And hey, this artwork of the angler clearly shows that almost any race's souls can be stolen, so that's radical. I was hoping that this would be the case, though how much would it suck to consume a rat soul?

 

They'd all get it??  It's thier alliegence ability. I guess it could say "heros in your army get the X battle trait"  From what we've seen i think all of the battle traits have been given to the whole army, and only specificly in the battle traits rules would it say "units iwth in x of a hero from your army get x affect" 

So if it was only heros it would say in the ruile you can't target the hero. 

[Acid_Nine]

11 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

They'd all get it??  It's thier alliegence ability. I guess it could say "heros in your army get the X battle trait"  From what we've seen i think all of the battle traits have been given to the whole army, and only specificly in the battle traits rules would it say "units iwth in x of a hero from your army get x affect" 

So if it was only heros it would say in the ruile you can't target the hero. 

Ohhh. OHHH man, you're right. That's even better!

[ledha]

Does it really f**** KO ?

They have ton of redeployment option  as well as deepstrike, and enough firepower to say "yeah, okay then" and then destroy whatever unit is the closest while staying at max range (because they won't have to take any risk to come close and attack the heroes).

Sure, okay, they won't snipe your heroes, but will probably wreck everything else.  It's a full gunline army, after all, and idoneth doesn't look like very resilient.

However, it is much more effective against artillery or long-ranged shooting unit (hey vanguard raptor, kurnoth hunter) who are used as hero sniping and sometime woth their cost only if they attack and remove some particular models.

[mmimzie]

Just now, ledha said:

Does it really f**** KO ?

They have ton of redeployment option  as well as deepstrike, and enough firepower to say "yeah, okay then" and then destroy whatever unit is the closest. Sure, okay, they won't snipe your heroes, but will probably wreck everything else.  It's a full gunline army, after all, and idoneth doesn't look like very resilient.

However, it is much more effective against artillery or long-ranged shooting unit -hey vanguard raptor) who are used as hero sniping and sometime woth their cost only if they attack and remove some particular pieces.

This is pretty true, but it depends on how you use the battle trait.

Lets say you bring allies of Liberators 20 strong and buff them with mystic shield, As the trait doesn't care if you ahve other unit's. It's jsut the idoneth can't be hit if they aren't the closest. 

Alternatively you can pose a unified front. Let's say you have an army all of 3 man eel squads. If you line up the squads, each with one model up front. Then  your  opponent woudl ahve to line thier whole army up to target down any one specific unit, and any units that aren't lined straight back, will have to have the models in a single unit each trying to target a different unit from it's fellows. 

The second strategy goes well with high tide, as even if all your units get widdle down to only a single model. They all are affectively like one big unit on turn 3, as they all fight at the start. 

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

8 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

Lets say you bring allies of Liberators 20 strong and buff them with mystic shield, As the trait doesn't care if you ahve other unit's. It's jsut the idoneth can't be hit if they aren't the closest. 

"Let the Stormcasts go first.  They brag of their immortality so much they can lend it to our cause."

[DantePQ]

I guess it all comes down to how expensive they are, without extra protection they will die quickly. 

Avatar rules we have seen were solid but it all comes down to one thing - will they have any mortal wounds protection? 

[MacDuff]

They might get some types of terrain protection. I could see the shipwreck serving as a mobile bastion that gets washed around. And look closely at the latest photos - GW mentions coral and fish tide pools (a Look Out Sir rule?), and the coral-like stuff they show at the bottom sure looks like it's made of plastic. It might appear over time and provide melee cover from mortal wounds and even cause damage (coral is sharp!). Who know yet? I'd also bet they have the big kraken coming as a second big kit, or they wouldn't have given it such prominence on the Warhammer Community site.

[maximum_pants]

25 minutes ago, DantePQ said:

I guess it all comes down to how expensive they are, without extra protection they will die quickly. 

Avatar rules we have seen were solid but it all comes down to one thing - will they have any mortal wounds protection? 

the lore from the white dwarf mentioned the namarti being able to be resurrected using gathered souls.
so they may end up being skeleton warrior stat lines.

[Barkanaut]

26 minutes ago, MacDuff said:

They might get some types of terrain protection. I could see the shipwreck serving as a mobile bastion that gets washed around. And look closely at the latest photos - GW mentions coral and fish tide pools (a Look Out Sir rule?), and the coral-like stuff they show at the bottom sure looks like it's made of plastic. It might appear over time and provide melee cover from mortal wounds and even cause damage (coral is sharp!). Who know yet? I'd also bet they have the big kraken coming as a second big kit, or they wouldn't have given it such prominence on the Warhammer Community site.

We allegedly also haven’t seen the turtles alt build that rumors day is a sort of whale thing with fur on the bottom. Could be full of it though as we’re very close to wave 1 release and it’s pretty risky to not show the whole range. 

[mmimzie]

Yeah it all comes down to points. If they are super frail, but very killy than you'll see allies that lets you take advantage of the hiding battle trait. If the turtles are tank like turtles should be than likely the turtles can try to fill that role for the army. 

 

The main thing is if anything in the force can be super killy than the army is in a good spot because the army has a great tool for protecting  a glass  hammer. 

[Aelfric]

Now what we need is a one drop battalion. 

[Tizianolol]

Pre order is 14 of April.. When book come out?

[Themoocher]

2 minutes ago, Tizianolol said:

Pre order is 14 of April.. When book come out?

21st

[mhsellwood]

I have to say that at this point I am

 

 

 

 

super excited!

The basic trait is really potent, particularly given the benefits inherent in charging on turn 3 (although to be fair I would expect that the Tides of Death level will be alterable with spells, or rituals, or General's traits, or artefacts, or enclave abilities, or battalions) and so the play style of getting the models you need in the right location while not wanting them to be shot to bits hugely benefits from the Deepkin ability to control their opponents options. Also, if you have played 40K you will know how much protection relatively soft but hugely important characters get from a similar but arguably weaker ability.

I think it gains most from having a couple of tanks in the army - but there should be plenty of choices either within the army or from the allies. Some people have mentioned liberators as allies (reasonable assumption), but depending on the choices available I could see Phoenix Guard as they are crazy tanks, or Drakespawn knights, or just chucking in an arch mage to stiffen everybodies backbone. Within army the eel riders with swords are described as very tough, and the Leviadon looks like a tank and is described as hard to hit with ranged weapons, so I think we can remain 'pure' and still maximise our ability to resist shooting.

Some people have talked about it not providing protection vs magic doing mortal wounds, which is of course true. However to be fair there are very few armies that rely solely on magic doing the heavy lifting with ranged attacks (honourable tip of the hat to Legion of Sacrament here), so Deepkin characters are still much harder to kill than equivalents in other armies.

[Aelfric]

It will be interesting to see who they can take as allies.  The only certainty is Stormcast at the moment.  Also interested to see who can take them as allies bearing in mind they need their ethersea to fight on land.

[mmimzie]

1 minute ago, Aelfric said:

It will be interesting to see who they can take as allies.  The only certainty is Stormcast at the moment.  Also interested to see who can take them as allies bearing in mind they need their ethersea to fight on land.

So daughters of khaine, have idoneth listed as one of thier allies, so i assume that relationship goes both ways??? 

 

13 minutes ago, mhsellwood said:

I have to say that at this point I am

 

 

 

 

super excited!

The basic trait is really potent, particularly given the benefits inherent in charging on turn 3 (although to be fair I would expect that the Tides of Death level will be alterable with spells, or rituals, or General's traits, or artefacts, or enclave abilities, or battalions) and so the play style of getting the models you need in the right location while not wanting them to be shot to bits hugely benefits from the Deepkin ability to control their opponents options. Also, if you have played 40K you will know how much protection relatively soft but hugely important characters get from a similar but arguably weaker ability.

I think it gains most from having a couple of tanks in the army - but there should be plenty of choices either within the army or from the allies. Some people have mentioned liberators as allies (reasonable assumption), but depending on the choices available I could see Phoenix Guard as they are crazy tanks, or Drakespawn knights, or just chucking in an arch mage to stiffen everybodies backbone. Within army the eel riders with swords are described as very tough, and the Leviadon looks like a tank and is described as hard to hit with ranged weapons, so I think we can remain 'pure' and still maximise our ability to resist shooting.

Some people have talked about it not providing protection vs magic doing mortal wounds, which is of course true. However to be fair there are very few armies that rely solely on magic doing the heavy lifting with ranged attacks (honourable tip of the hat to Legion of Sacrament here), so Deepkin characters are still much harder to kill than equivalents in other armies.

Well also  having access to wizards at all is in and of itself a protection against magic. 

[Aelfric]

19 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

So daughters of khaine, have idoneth listed as one of thier allies, so i assume that relationship goes both ways??? 

 

Well also  having access to wizards at all is in and of itself a protection against magic. 

I'm not sure that it always goes both ways, though I don't have an example to hand.  But as you say DoK can ally them in, so one can assume that the ethersea follows them around regardless, which is a good sign.  I expect that they will only ally with all the old Dark Elf factions.

[TheNotebookGM]

I want KO as allies so I can make some bright yellow Skywardens