Aos 2 - Lumineth Realm-Lords Discussion

[Siegfried VII]

3 hours ago, LuminethMage said:

After I joined this site I was honestly also surprised about how many  people seem to harbor negative feelings about elves (or are just trolling, not sure). I’m honestly baffled by this, sure, I like Lumineth the most, but there isn’t any fantasy faction I really dislike, no-interest is as far as it goes. 

During the first reveal when we had a similar situation, I argued a lot, but nothing good comes out of that, and you only work yourself up. From what I see, none of us enjoys looking like they are always bitching around or being defensive. So I try to avoid doing that (don’t succeed always though).

But, I doubt we can really do anything about it, so waiting this out at places like this part of the forum is probably good, we are only a maybe a week away before the show moves on.

On topic, I’m also getting at least 2 boxes of these because they are such good looking models. 😍  And I like the abilities from a fluff point of view, they are really thematic. Let’s hope they either get a few more abilities by themselves or have good synergy with some of the new heroes. I’d be a shame if such a good looking and nostalgic unit would only be playable in non-competitive games. But sadly that happens to many factions (hello Slaangor). 

Agreed. I have a difficult time tempering my nerves with what I read.. And it's not only on the forum, but also on the official aos posts on facebook were there is 0 moderation and the comments get even worse.. There really is no excuse. And it is not a matter of likes and dislikes. Personally I was never fond of dwarves and they are not my cup of tea but I never went to trash talk them on any forum/facebook comment or disrespect the guys who love them or go and ******/complain like the sky is falling on topics that actually have a different purpose..

I believe it is one of the main negative sides of the internet as especially in the last few years there are tons of people who hide behind their keyboards and think they can be toxic/rude/offending without any consequences.. Most of these people are cowards at heart and I highly doubt they would have the balls to behave this way up close and personal.. Sorry if that came out as a rant but I needed to get it out of my system..😅

Hopefully the next preorder will be Cursed City and they'll leave us alone.. 🙂

On topic I did some math too using the AoS Statshammer app and I compared 10 Bladelords with 20 Wardens on the assumption they will be about the same points and Bladelords will have sunmetal weapons and power of hysh.

x20 Wardens with power of hysh deal and without the bonus of fighting a unit that has charged do 16,28 damage on a 4+ save unit.

x10 Bladelords using flurry of blows with power of hysh and 3 attacks per model (so 30 all in all) do 13,33 damage on a 4+ save unit.

x10 Bladelords using flurry of blows with power of hysh and 4 attacks per model (so 40 all in all) do 17,78 damage on a 4+ save unit.

So in order to outperform the Wardens each of the Bladelords in the unit must have 4 enemy models in range.. any fewer than this and they are worse..

x10 Bladelords using perfect strike do something like 7,43 damage on a 4+ save unit. (which is what 5 Sequitors do with half the points most likely)

x10 Dawnriders on the charge fighting a 1 wound non mounted unit with power of hysh do 20,33 damage against a 4+ save.

Of course the Bladelords mathhammer is based on conjecture and assumptions since we lack the full picture but I did it to give us a possible taste of what we may be getting.. I have ordered 20 of them so I hope their points make them at least viable if not valuable.. 🙂

Edited March 25, 2021 by Siegfried VII

[Austin]

1 hour ago, Siegfried VII said:

Agreed. I have a difficult time tempering my nerves with what I read.. And it's not only on the forum, but also on the official aos posts on facebook were there is 0 moderation and the comments get even worse.. There really is no excuse. And it is not a matter of likes and dislikes. Personally I was never fond of dwarves and they are not my cup of tea but I never went to trash talk them on any forum/facebook comment or disrespect the guys who love them or go and ******/complain like the sky is falling on topics that actually have a different purpose..

I believe it is one of the main negative sides of the internet as especially in the last few years there are tons of people who hide behind their keyboards and think they can be toxic/rude/offending without any consequences.. Most of these people are cowards at heart and I highly doubt they would have the balls to behave this way up close and personal.. Sorry if that came out as a rant but I needed to get it out of my system..😅

Hopefully the next preorder will be Cursed City and they'll leave us alone.. 🙂

On topic I did some math too using the AoS Statshammer app and I compared 10 Bladelords with 20 Wardens on the assumption they will be about the same points and Bladelords will have sunmetal weapons and power of hysh.

x20 Wardens with power of hysh deal and without the bonus of fighting a unit that has charged do 16,28 damage on a 4+ save unit.

x10 Bladelords using flurry of blows with power of hysh and 3 attacks per model (so 30 all in all) do 13,33 damage on a 4+ save unit.

x10 Bladelords using flurry of blows with power of hysh and 4 attacks per model (so 40 all in all) do 17,78 damage on a 4+ save unit.

So in order to outperform the Wardens each of the Bladelords in the unit must have 4 enemy models in range.. any fewer than this and they are worse..

x10 Bladelords using perfect strike do something like 7,43 damage on a 4+ save unit. (which is what 5 Sequitors do with half the points most likely)

x10 Dawnriders on the charge fighting a 1 wound non mounted unit with power of hysh do 20,33 damage against a 4+ save.

Of course the Bladelords mathhammer is based on conjecture and assumptions since we lack the full picture but I did it to give us a possible taste of what we may be getting.. I have ordered 20 of them so I hope their points make them at least viable if not valuable.. 🙂

Do we know they are 5 to a box?  Maybe you have ordered 40 and you  just didn't know it.

And, on the subject of internet negativity, you just gotta block that out! ESPECIALLY once people know it bothers you, because the internet is like a pack of sharks that was raised poorly.

[Tiberius501]

Yeah the Internet is as bad as it is good. Just don’t read the asshats, they’re everywhere for everything.

EDIT: So this is just speculation and theory crafting, but if Ymetrica does change (I’m expecting it won’t though at this stage), would it be too powerful if it allowed the army to utilise the stone stance for ignoring -1Rend, while units who already have the stance ignore up to -2 instead? That way their army makes better use of it without being so niche. But perhaps it’d be too powerful on other units. 

Edited March 25, 2021 by Tiberius501

[Siegfried VII]

5 hours ago, Austin said:

Do we know they are 5 to a box?  Maybe you have ordered 40 and you  just didn't know it.

And, on the subject of internet negativity, you just gotta block that out! ESPECIALLY once people know it bothers you, because the internet is like a pack of sharks that was raised poorly.

They always show in the pictures the contents of the box/product so 99% there 5 in a box. 😉 

 

5 hours ago, Tiberius501 said:

Yeah the Internet is as bad as it is good. Just don’t read the asshats, they’re everywhere for everything.

EDIT: So this is just speculation and theory crafting, but if Ymetrica does change (I’m expecting it won’t though at this stage), would it be too powerful if it allowed the army to utilise the stone stance for ignoring -1Rend, while units who already have the stance ignore up to -2 instead? That way their army makes better use of it without being so niche. But perhaps it’d be too powerful on other units. 

I don't see them do that, but I do see them perhaps changing Ymetrica so it boosts all the aelementiri.. Personally though I would just add a 5th nation (like Helon for example which was already mentioned in a wacom teaser post) and have it boost the hurakan units. It would be more unique that way and and we would still have 3 more nation of which 2 could be for the other temples and another one generic for when Tyrion gets his time to shine..

[Gistradagis]

1 hour ago, Siegfried VII said:

I don't see them do that, but I do see them perhaps changing Ymetrica so it boosts all the aelementiri.. Personally though I would just add a 5th nation (like Helon for example which was already mentioned in a wacom teaser post) and have it boost the hurakan units. It would be more unique that way and and we would still have 3 more nation of which 2 could be for the other temples and another one generic for when Tyrion gets his time to shine..

I guess the problem with that approach is that they are using the Ymetrica scheme for all painted models and lore, meaning named characters are tagged Ymetrica. So if they leave Ymetrica as is, and add another great nation for Hurakan, we might end with a weird mix of named Hurakan that work best in Ymetrica.

[LuminethMage]

Yeah it’s really a problem that they chose Ymetrica, although they made such a close connection between Ymetrica and the Alarith. Any other faction would have been better. 

Already a small problem with Myari. Any other faction would have been at least a bit useful. 

This problem will become bigger if they don’t change it. Most of the named heroes are bound to end up with the Ymetrica keyword. 

[woolf]

48 minutes ago, Gistradagis said:

I guess the problem with that approach is that they are using the Ymetrica scheme for all painted models and lore, meaning named characters are tagged Ymetrica. So if they leave Ymetrica as is, and add another great nation for Hurakan, we might end with a weird mix of named Hurakan that work best in Ymetrica.

agree with this, its weird that they used a specialized nation as the main color scheme... But the Ymetrica lore is very tightly connected to the Alarith and mountains etc so would be more logical to introduce a new specialist nation for the wind-guys I would think (as opposed to add new rules to Ymetrica covering Hurakan key worded units)... unless they retcon the Ymetrica lore to be aelementiri focused rather than Alarith 😂 but that would obviously be super weird given this was clearly designed as one book from the start and then cut in half for the releases..

Perhaps what they will do is add to the lore of Ymetrica to also include wind-temple and then add a second set of rules for Hurakan (as currently the ymetrica abilites are keyworded Alarith)

[Dreadmund]

I'm really surprised at how much negativity I'm seeing about the new LRL rules from LRL players. Fair enough if you're a beasts of chaos player seeing our rules previews and getting a bit salty, but why are we getting upset? 😕

Who sees that we're going to have access to shooting cavalry that can retreat 6 inches in the combat phase with fly and says "I am disappointed"?

And it's not from people who think we're going to be a little too good for the balance of the game, it's from people who expected better. I truly don't understand. Some people are just addicted to whinging.

[Aloth_Corfiser]

@DreadmundI don't see much negativity in this Thread, as for me: I am happy with the reveals.

Concerning the Ymetrica Rules and Lore: I don't want to sound whiny, but I always ask myself "How hard can it be to paint a Model in the Iliatha or Syar paint- scheme when planning to take photos for the Online Store?" I just wanted to say, because the discussion came up. This focus on Ymetrica did put me off at the beginning. I know that's the Path GW operates with all Factions in AoS but it is starting to get tiresome and I don't see the merit in this approach.
But well,  that's the only thing I am a little bit upset about.

Hopefully we will take a closer look at the Loreseeker and Calligraph today! 😄

[Ragest]

8 minutes ago, Dreadmund said:

I'm really surprised at how much negativity I'm seeing about the new LRL rules from LRL players. Fair enough if you're a beasts of chaos player seeing our rules previews and getting a bit salty, but why are we getting upset? 😕

Who sees that we're going to have access to shooting cavalry that can retreat 6 inches in the combat phase with fly and says "I am disappointed"?

And it's not from people who think we're going to be a little too good for the balance of the game, it's from people who expected better. I truly don't understand. Some people are just addicted to whinging.

Because we want to try different stuff, and we saw nothing near the power of actual units, so is a bit dicouragening.

Btw is not fair to compare one of the worst and oldest book with one of the newest tbh.

[woolf]

13 minutes ago, Dreadmund said:

I'm really surprised at how much negativity I'm seeing about the new LRL rules from LRL players. Fair enough if you're a beasts of chaos player seeing our rules previews and getting a bit salty, but why are we getting upset? 😕

Who sees that we're going to have access to shooting cavalry that can retreat 6 inches in the combat phase with fly and says "I am disappointed"?

And it's not from people who think we're going to be a little too good for the balance of the game, it's from people who expected better. I truly don't understand. Some people are just addicted to whinging.

not sure I agree there is that much negativity, what I can see its mainly the counter reaction to crys about LRL being more OP and NPE etc etc while when you think about these new units from perspective of fielding them those reactions doesn't really seem to be justified (obv based only on what has been revealed)...  

[Tizianolol]

I think bladelords with flurry of blows can do like 4 attacks per model easy.  Its 2" range so first line is 4 attacks per model ( maybe more vs skaventide clan rat or monks) behind would be like 3 attacks. 2" is not a joke imo

[Dreadmund]

I didn't mean in this thread, but i have seen negativity about in group chats/Twitter. Maybe I shouldn't expect better from nerds on the internet, but I don't see how you could read the previews from this week and be anything but pleased.

[Siegfried VII]

In here we have no negativity from LRL fans, I haven't checked the facebook group today, but up until yesterday I don't remember LRL players be negative..

The main issue that may come to light (and I believe is the reason some people are worried) is the fact that the new units are prone to direct comparisons with other lumineth units already existing due to having similar roles with the relult ofone being perhaps clearly better than the other..

The Windchargers while I feared in the beginning the unique movement rules make them a truly unique and interesting choice and I believe they will find their place in lists, especially with the players who prefer high movement armies to pilot..

The Bladelords with what we know so far seem to have a good chance  of suffering from this effect if they end up being worse in the damage department than wardens, not as resilient as stoneguard and worse horde killers than dawnriders.. How many wounds they have and their point cost will be crucial in the end..

Another unit that may suffer from this are the ballistas which have a high chance of directly compete with the sentinels.

Well we'll know in a few days one way or the other.. 🙂 

[Beliman]

26 minutes ago, Ragest said:

Btw is not fair to compare one of the worst and oldest book with one of the newest tbh.

Imho, the new Lumineth rules seems to be a lot better than the new Slaanesh book!

I must say that the new Vanari Bladelords doesn't seems to have a high dmg output. Maybe they don't need it? time will tell.
Maybe it's an AoS 3.0 spoiler?

Anecdote: A friend of mine made another profile for Vanari Bladelords, the funny thing is that the gaming group believed that it was the real one because it was more "real":

[Ragest]

1 minute ago, Beliman said:

Imho, the new Lumineth rules seems to be a lot better than the new Slaanesh book!

I must say that the new Vanari Bladelords doesn't seems to have a high dmg output. Maybe they don't need it? time will tell.
Maybe it's an AoS 3.0 spoiler?

Anecdote: A friend of mine made another profile for Vanari Bladelords, the funny thing is that the gaming group believed that it was the real one because it was more "real":

Yes, and that's sad I love Slaneeshi mortals models but the rules were pretty bad. And not just because bat ouputs or bad savings, are boring. At least in Lumineth, even if eveything is "meh" like Blademasters, we are going to surely have fun with hurakans.

That warscroll is from my friend Deinok (known because he did the wonderful table many people use in TTS) and yes, even in my community most of people thought that was the true warscroll and didn't understand why we said Blademasters had bad damage.

[Beliman]

5 minutes ago, Ragest said:

That warscroll is from my friend Deinok (known because he did the wonderful table many people use in TTS) and yes, even in my community most of people thought that was the true warscroll and didn't understand why we said Blademasters had bad damage.

Maybe we know each other, Deinok is my TO and a friend of mine too!!

Edited March 25, 2021 by Beliman

[Tiberius501]

3 auto hitting attacks with d3 dmg and -2Rend seems like it way outperforms the attacks within 2”. I’d of done 1 attack at 2dmg, or 2 attacks at d3. 

[Beliman]

4 minutes ago, Tiberius501 said:

3 auto hitting attacks with d3 dmg and -2Rend seems like it way outperforms the attacks within 2”. I’d of done 1 attack at 2dmg, or 2 attacks at d3. 

It was a joke! Don't take it seriously. People just expect some things from new warscrolls.

[Tiberius501]

Just now, Beliman said:

It was a joke! Don't take it seriously. People just expect some things from new warscrolls.

Ah haha sorry, took it way too literally! 

[LuminethMage]

Oh man, it really seems to move. 😍

How to stylishly float around the battlefield

Edited March 25, 2021 by LuminethMage

[Jefferson Skarsnik]

There are sadly now reports of people out there developing full-blown Stage IV Lumineth Derangement Syndrome. Just wandering into random shops and dwellings ranting about "aelves" being "pansies" until asked to leave. When the end comes they can't even have an open casket at the funeral because their face has permanently contorted into the "confused" react

Edited March 25, 2021 by Jefferson Skarsnik

[Siegfried VII]

The shrine rules are awesome and give an extra incentive not to use Teclis which is great!

It gives extra control of our casting and unbinding and the free command abilities will help us tons as our army at the moment at least is starving for command points!! I think it is wonderful without being offending!! 🙂

[Acid_Nine]

Yea, this makes it so that Avalorn isn’t a mainstay in my force too! Handing out a free command point for archers or the ballista would be nice, and it extends the base’s range for the bubble. Plus, this is basically the total eclipse cannon we needed, which allows us to get that spell out a lot more easily without having to rely on the twin stones

 

[Ragest]

Perfect rules to me. Is nothing OP, is exactly what every LRL army can need and is wonderful