TheadTheOgorSlayer Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 10 hours ago, W1tchhunter said: Any chance you could show off your Chaos Warrior list? This is what I'm trying out tomorrow. Sure! This is from memory so i May have had slightly more or less warriors in each unit so I apologize for any inaccuracies but I ran this list: allegiance: slaves to darkness faction: ravagers chaos lord: agnaxes scales, bolstered by hate trait chaos lord: blasphemous cuirass, eternal vendetta trait exalted hero of chaos: master of deception trait chaos warshrine chaos warshrine 20 chaos marauders w/ axes and shields 25 warriors w/shields 25 warriors w/great weapons battalion:plague touched warband, so everything is marked nurgle this list came to approx. 1970-1980/2000 if I remember correctly few things I took away from this: one unit of warriors is enough, and with nurgle mark you only need 20 to succeed against the enemies hammers. Anything lacking rend is an utter joke, and even high rend opponents will find it difficult to pierce 40 wounds at 5 up rerollable followed by 6 up fnp from the shrines. I would run them in 30s only to keep the negative to hit bonus from that nurgle dude some people like to ally. In my local meta I’m either fighting Nagash or barely any wizards. This is the reason I run zero wizards in my list, I understand that the tp spell would help immensely but against nagash its hard to get it thru. And the chances I waste 110 points is lessened if I take a second chaos lord. The mortal wound protection is also linked to the nagash fear lol. In a true all comers list I’d drop the second lord for a caster. My lack of mobility actually lost me my last game. Although if I had planned properly ahead it wouldn’t have mattered. The tp spell is incredible but also not needed unless things go wrong in my lists. I’m sure with more marauders this opinion would change. Casting 7 is tough sometimes tho next week I’m changing the list to include a unit of 40 marauders and drop both warrior blocks to 20. We will see how it fairs! I also tend to forget that the nurgle battalion has 2 abilities, the 3 up d3 wounds could’ve changed the outcome of some fights so I will keep it in mind next time. after I get another 80 marauders I will be running an undivided list with despoilers and Be’lakor, I’ll post any failures or successes vs my dastardly foes next Wednesday for the revised nurgle list. I’ll also be heavily considering using a caster instead of the 2nd chaos lord for access to the teleport spell. Nagash has 18 inch effective range so honestly I think I’m being paranoid. I could easily just not go within 18 inches of him and still play effectively, while also threatening him with marauders and such if he decides to come to the frontline (which prolly won’t happen lol) and if the enemy is petrifax then I’ll be ignoring him anyways so. And 30 inch dispell range isn’t a huge deal if I plan ahead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 22 minutes ago, Saturmorn Carvilli said: You are right though, I would never run then at anything less than 15. What is the loadout of those warriors? I'm am hesitating to buy the great blade kit to make them hit at rend -1. So, how to build the unit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gistradagis Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, GeneralZero said: What is the loadout of those warriors? I'm am hesitating to buy the great blade kit to make them hit at rend -1. So, how to build the unit? The classic style is to just run them with hand weapon and shield. They'll hit for sht, but have a decent defence against MW. Edited February 13, 2020 by Gistradagis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 For you, the great blades are useless? We can run them with a mix of weapons, so the shields serve the saving, and the greatblades serve the damaging? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PainfullyMediocre Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, GeneralZero said: I'm am hesitating to buy the great blade kit to make them hit at rend -1. So, how to build the unit? How comfortable are you with converting? You can make great blades from the regular kit by cutting the top/bottom off hand weapons and gluing them together. edit: Not mine, but the ones on the left/right Edited February 13, 2020 by PainfullyMediocre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 The problem is not buying/money (10 bucks or less and look nice 😉 ) the problem is battlefield efficiency. I read that our warriors are resilient but do zero damage. If you run them for example: Unit of 15 warriors the boss/aspiring champion with a greatblade 1 standart+ 1hornblower (considered to have weapon+shield 7 (for example can be more can be less) greatblades 5 shields When attaking, your front has at least (lets say) 5 attakers = 5*2+1 = 11 attaks with rend -1 and still have shields/survivability in the unit? Am I right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W1tchhunter Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 10 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: The problem is not buying/money (10 bucks or less and look nice 😉 ) the problem is battlefield efficiency. I read that our warriors are resilient but do zero damage. If you run them for example: Unit of 15 warriors the boss/aspiring champion with a greatblade 1 standart+ 1hornblower (considered to have weapon+shield 7 (for example can be more can be less) greatblades 5 shields When attaking, your front has at least (lets say) 5 attakers = 5*2+1 = 11 attaks with rend -1 and still have shields/survivability in the unit? Am I right? You can't mix weapons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, W1tchhunter said: You can't mix weapons Reading the latest warscroll: "A unit of Chaos Warriors has any number of models, each armed with one of the following weapon options: Chaos Hand Weapon and Chaos Runeshield; Chaos Halberd and Chaos Runeshield; Chaos Greatblade; or pair of Chaos Hand Weapons " : you can mix them. [edit] contrary to most of other units: "The unit is armed with one of the following weapon options" Edited February 13, 2020 by GeneralZero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W1tchhunter Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: Reading the latest warscroll: "A unit of Chaos Warriors has any number of models, each armed with one of the following weapon options: Chaos Hand Weapon and Chaos Runeshield; Chaos Halberd and Chaos Runeshield; Chaos Greatblade; or pair of Chaos Hand Weapons " : you can mix them. It was FAQ'd You can't mix them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStreicher Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Just now, W1tchhunter said: It was FAQ'd You can't mix them sadly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 fock 😞 Problem solved then. Which FAQ was that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W1tchhunter Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Just now, GeneralZero said: fock 😞 Problem solved then. Which FAQ was that? It was the latest one we had, just Google Slaves to Darkness FAQ, think it was January? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldarain Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Same one that neutered the Nurgle CA (It was too powerful, now terrible) and made the warshrine not stack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakeb1te Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 41 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: For you, the great blades are useless? We can run them with a mix of weapons, so the shields serve the saving, and the greatblades serve the damaging? With rerolling 1s for instance, they have the same output as hand weapons I believe. The MW5+ save is so much more valuable than even a little more damage that the greatblades provide. The only argument for a loadout that isn't sword and board, is for double handed weapons at units of 15+ (rerolling hit rolls and rerolling saves without needing buffs), and halberds, for the truly massive brick of warriors in narrow spaces. Unfortunately, I think greatblades are pointless without any way to make them +1 to hit. Edited February 13, 2020 by Snakeb1te Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gistradagis Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 48 minutes ago, Snakeb1te said: With rerolling 1s for instance, they have the same output as hand weapons I believe. The MW5+ save is so much more valuable than even a little more damage that the greatblades provide. The only argument for a loadout that isn't sword and board, is for double handed weapons at units of 15+ (rerolling hit rolls and rerolling saves without needing buffs), and halberds, for the truly massive brick of warriors in narrow spaces. Unfortunately, I think greatblades are pointless without any way to make them +1 to hit. Well, I'm of a mind of trying a block of 15+ Warriors with greatblades and Khorne mark. That way we get the sort of weapon they need to have a chance to do something, re-roll 1s to hit and have +1 to wound ("close" to the general). I honestly don't know to what point the shield for the 5+ against MW is good. I've played like 3-4 games and haven't used them a single time. There aren't that many things that deal MW directly, and the ones that do will usually target a more valuable unit than Chaos Warriors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saturmorn Carvilli Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 4 hours ago, GeneralZero said: What is the loadout of those warriors? I'm am hesitating to buy the great blade kit to make them hit at rend -1. So, how to build the unit? My Undivided Ravagers army runs two groups of 15 Chaos Warriors with Hand Weapon and Shield. The models were built slightly before the new Battletome, and I wasn't going to bother getting an upgrade kit for the weapons not already on the sprue. Just the same, I am okay hand weapon and shield compared to double hand weapons. At H:3+, W: 3+ it is pretty consistent at yielding me some 7-8 wounds (between losses and getting reach) most of the game. My Warriors aren't my preferred target for Daemonic Power or other combat buffs, so I can't see Great Weapons doing much better anyways being harder to hit and Rend -1 being more situational in its effectiveness considering fewer attacks connecting. Halberds are the same since mixed weapons aren't allowed, and I can get most, well enough, Warriors within reach most of the time. I could see the shield being situational depending on a player's meta. I am typically making 1-3 Runic Shield attempts every game and saving somewhere in the neighborhood of about 5 wounds throughout a game. I don't know if that is worthwhile or not as I don't really think about it since I am am not going to change my Warriors loadout. The shields do tend to have a player level psychological effect from my opponents that become a bit frustrated I have any sort of defense to Mortal Wounds. I think their plans revolve around the idea of removing models without issue. When even a 33% save interferes as they appear like they have to think on their feet more than they wanted to. I think my Warriors get targeted a whole lot less because of this. I do enjoy the schadenfreude that occurs when they also start trying to put Mortal Wounds on my knights which is followed by a run down of what units of mine don't have MW defense. At least until I have played them a few times these opponents seem overly annoyed they can't just damage these units outright. I think there are arguments to be made for most Warrior loadouts. I like sword and board since I see Warriors as purely a land control unit and want as much defense as possible since the unsuppoted offense is always going to be lacking regardless of weapon choice. Plus, I like the fact that if I decide on Mark of Khorne I am not doubling up on the same special ability which I think happens way to much in Slaves to Darkness. Finally, I have never found myself wanting extra reach or Rend to give up more consistent hitting or wounding. My Warriors are also on the bottom of the pile of units I want to give combat buffs (such as Warshrine or Daemonic Power) this hasn't been as much on an issue for me. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
readercolin Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 So I spent some time mathhammering the comparison between the different chaos warriors. It gets annoyingly complicated due to seeing if there are differences between the different marks. So I spent the time to see what the results were for a block of 5 warriors with each weapon and each mark, as well as what a difference full re-rolls gives you. Here are some of the results: Facing off against a save of - To no ones great surprise, against a save of - dual hand weapons do the most damage wtihout any buffs, and dual weapons are the same as weapon + shield with full re-rolls. More interestingly, having a Khorne General is the biggest buff to power without other buffs for every unit except dual weapons, in which case the khorne general adds as much as a nurgle hero does. With full re-rolls, the nurgle hero provides the biggest buff, followed by the slannesh hero buff, with khorne providing the least bonus (ignoring undivided/unbuffed). Against a save of 4+ Here is a bit more surprising. Without full re-rolls, dual hand weapons deal the most damage across the board. Additionally, hand weapon + shield does the same damage as greatblades with any buff other than slannesh, with slannesh slightly outdamaging sword + shield. With full re-rolls, then greatblades do more damage across the board, with the Nurgle buff being the most damage. Once again, without re-rolls the Khorne general buff gives the greatest benefit across the board except that dual hand weapons match that with a nurgle buff. With full re-rolls, once again the Nurgle buff is the largest, and khorne the least (ignoring undivided/unbuffed). The overall conclusion that I can draw from this is that if you are wanting to have a unit run around without getting full re-rolls, you would get the best damage out of a unit of nurgle warriors with dual weapons. However, if you want a block of warriors and you are willing to stick some buffs on them, then Nurgle Greatblades are a valid option. As far as the shields MW shrug goes, I've had some matchups where it is irrelevant, and others where it has been a big deal. Playing vs Bonereapers, Deepkin, KO, Cities, Fyreslayers, etc. the Shields are fairly pointless, as those factions don't have a plethora of mortal wounds that they produce, and instead rely on rend or just a ton of attacks. Vs Ironjaws, Ogres, etc. there are enough casual mortal wounds flowing that the shrug has occasionally been relevant. Overall, I rate the shields as ok, but not vital in most matchups, because you are going to take more damage from rend weapons then you are MW most of the time, and damage is something that slaves are usually lacking in, so getting a bit more is always nice. However, in basically every case, you would be better damage wise spending 300 points on 40 marauders than you would 15 warriors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernival Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Hey guys, unrelated question, but I figured this is the best place to ask. I have a huge StD army but rarely get to play the game- have just started getting some semi regular games in and I had a question regarding auras. Namely, do heroes casting out an aura benefit from its effect? From my reading it seems like that is not the case, but i just wanted to clarify since i couldn't really find any info online about it. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gistradagis Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Bernival said: Hey guys, unrelated question, but I figured this is the best place to ask. I have a huge StD army but rarely get to play the game- have just started getting some semi regular games in and I had a question regarding auras. Namely, do heroes casting out an aura benefit from its effect? From my reading it seems like that is not the case, but i just wanted to clarify since i couldn't really find any info online about it. Thank you. All the aura effects say something such as "Do X for friendly StD within Y" of this model (the hero)." Now, is the hero within those Y"? Yes, they are within 0" of themselves, to be specific. Are they a friendly StD unit? Yes. Consequently, all heroes are obviously affected by their own auras. Edited February 13, 2020 by Gistradagis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernival Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 17 minutes ago, Gistradagis said: All the aura effects say something such as "Do X for friendly StD within Y" of this model (the hero)." Now, is the hero within those Y"? Yes, they are within 0" of themselves, to be specific. Are they a friendly StD unit? Yes. Consequently, all heroes are obviously affected by their own auras. Oh, that's awesome! Thank you. I dont know why but I kept reading into it as the aura was projecting out from the model to 12 inches and wasnt affecting the model itself. That's great news! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gistradagis Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Just now, Bernival said: Oh, that's awesome! Thank you. I dont know why but I kept reading into it as the aura was projecting out from the model to 12 inches and wasnt affecting the model itself. That's great news! No problem, I had the same question at first too! It's very typical of videogames and such that auras projected from heroes and the like affect other troops, but not themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Krungharr Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 On 2/7/2020 at 10:40 AM, whispersofblood said: Blue Scribes 2+ Spell portal, from 30.1" cast daemonrift through portal, If I can tag the Sorcerer, every unit within 7" of the spell portal can take d3+sorcerer/spell portal/potential Be'lakor MW. Lord of Change dispels spell portal. You can't cast an endless spell through the portal. https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/age_of_sigmar_malign_sorcery_designers_commmentary_en.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whispersofblood Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 39 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said: You can't cast an endless spell through the portal. https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/age_of_sigmar_malign_sorcery_designers_commmentary_en.pdf You cast the spell and end it's movement within 6", it can be removed and set up again within 6" of the other mirror. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted February 14, 2020 Share Posted February 14, 2020 10 hours ago, GeneralZero said: What is the loadout of those warriors? I'm am hesitating to buy the great blade kit to make them hit at rend -1. So, how to build the unit? For units of 15 or more, I would take halberds and shields to fight in two ranks - absolutely any day of the week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Krungharr Posted February 14, 2020 Share Posted February 14, 2020 18 hours ago, whispersofblood said: You cast the spell and end it's movement within 6", it can be removed and set up again within 6" of the other mirror. Whoa! That's pretty neat. Might also be good for the Purple Sun then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.