The Rumour Thread

[Luperci]

4 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

A single USR is a USR too many.
But it sounded like they were referring to stuff like unit champions and musicians? I wouldn't even consider those USRs.

Champion would just be +1 attack I suppose? It's good to reduce word count by changing stuff that everyone colloquially refers to as single word/phrase anyways, like they did for deepstrike, they offset all that in 40k by giving each unit a fully worded ability on top of everything else that got USR-ed, a lot of which aren't even unique and are duplicated across most factions (sticky objectives for example)

Edited March 21 by Luperci

[Greyshadow]

I think more universal special rules are definitely the way to go. The amount of text you have to read over and over again gets old fast. Anything that keeps the cards quick and easy to read is a really good thing.

[Big Kim Woof-Woof]

11 minutes ago, Chikout said:

Now that the Old World exists there's an opportunity to clearly differentiate between the two. Let AoS be more of a beer and pretzels game. If you want to get lost in the minutiae of weapon options and unit builds then The Old World is right there. 

I agree with this wholeheartedly. And I don't even drink beer nor eat pretzels. 

[JackStreicher]

Sigmar’s face has changed

 

[ScionOfOssia]

8 minutes ago, BarakUrbaz said:

Got it, we have to abolish FLY.

Bernouli’s Principle has been revoked. Now only Morghasts can fly, and the Sylvaneth. 

[sandlemad]

Bit disappointing to see the Ruination chamber appear to be grizzled veterans with skull iconography rather than barely coherent lightning-warriors, at least so far. I’m sure the sculpts will be cool but feels like it’s probably more duplication of roles within the SC range.

[Ejecutor]

It is solved REs time:
 

Spoiler

 







First TOW RE:

Edited March 21 by Ejecutor

[Luperci]

2 minutes ago, Ejecutor said:

It is REs time:

 

  Hide contents

 







First TOW RE:

The hand crossbow RE is in the votann KT too it looks like

Edit: There was also one of the claws from abraxias mount iirc and the mines that one of the votann is holding

Edited March 21 by Luperci

[JackStreicher]

19 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

All I see is a Black Orc warboss on a wyvern.. 

Chaos dragon for TOW

[Skreech Verminking]

32 minutes ago, Luperci said:

I haven't seen or heard of anyone playing combat patrol at all really, the thing with Yndrasta being forced to start off the battlefield for the SCE spearhead seems interesting though

I’ll be interesting.

as for combat patrol me and a small team of friends held a tournament with combat patrol.

we had around the 20ish people taking part at it if I remember correctly.

the feedback we got was it was fin but the customizability was kinda lacking.

everybody enjoyed it but would like to not attend a tournament using that format again.

which was interesting.

21 minutes ago, Rummybum said:

Art from the Skaven newsletter, shows the Clawlord/Warlord's mount a bit better

Looks a lot bigger then the one in the trailer.

love the pistol in his left hand

[Kelsicle]

Kind of sounds like the Ruination chamber is the Stormcast Endgame, the hyper elite, super strong final form for the Stormcast after getting through the reforge process.

[Ganigumo]

3 minutes ago, BarakUrbaz said:

Got it, we have to abolish FLY.

Sort of unironically yes. needing to swap pages to figure out what a unit does will always be a chore. We're not so hard pressed for real estate that we can't.

2 minutes ago, Luperci said:

Champion would just be +1 attack I suppose? It's good to reduce word count by changing stuff that everyone colloquially refers to as single word/phrase anyways, like they did for deepstrike

1 minute ago, Greyshadow said:

I think more universal special rules are definitely the way to go. The amount of text you have to read over and over again gets old fast. Anything that keeps the cards quick and easy to read is a really good thing.

Absolutely nothing interrupts a game worse than needing to spend 1-5 minutes scrambling through the rulebook to check what a rule does. Its bad for new players for that exact reason. When you add USRs everybody is a new player. Once you're experienced you probably already know what your warscroll does anyway, so it doesn't actually help.
Pretty much the only scenario its good for is when you're reading rules that aren't your own rules, which in a real game can often be summarized by your opponent quicker anyways.

[JackStreicher]

Imo a mix a usr and the way it has been would be best. Common things like Bodyguard, Champions etc belong into usrs

[Danaork]

There are not notice for new armies during the show or written on warcom ?

[Ejecutor]

6 minutes ago, Luperci said:

The hand crossbow RE is in the votann KT too it looks like

Edit: There was also one of the claws from abraxias mount iirc and the mines that one of the votann is holding

Yup. Realized those after publishing. Edited. It has been a huge chunk of RE. The resolved ones would look lonely. Updating the site.

[Greyshadow]

I am looking forward to this 4th edition. I know balance has been great lately and the people who play regularly are having a blast. For me, an occasional player, I would like to see a more streamlined core rules set and it looks that's the way we are headed. Really keen to play some spearhead - I'll definitely be working on getting my armys spearhead ready.

So far so good. I wonder what is going to happen with the double turn, (I really hope it stays unchanged).

[Luperci]

Just now, Ganigumo said:

Sort of unironically yes. needing to swap pages to figure out what a unit does will always be a chore. We're not so hard pressed for real estate that we can't.

Absolutely nothing interrupts a game worse than needing to spend 1-5 minutes scrambling through the rulebook to check what a rule does. Its bad for new players for that exact reason. When you add USRs everybody is a new player. Once you're experienced you probably already know what your warscroll does anyway, so it doesn't actually help.
Pretty much the only scenario its good for is when you're reading rules that aren't your own rules, which in a real game can often be summarized by your opponent quicker anyways.

For me USRs ease the mental load when playing, if every unit that could fly had a fully written out rule stating it could move over enemy units etc. I would glance at that for a second and go, "oh right flying", whereas if a unit has just "Fly" written, I know exactly what's happening with a fraction of page/card space. For a new player, they see Fly and they can ask what it means, so long as there aren't hundreds of USRs, they're not that hard to keep track of. Also USRs make the warscrolls of factions you don't play easier to comprehend at a glance. If I see an enemy unit I'm playing against with a massive block of text, I'm ngl I just won't bother reading it properly. If some of that is instead single phrases I'm familiar with, it's much easier to take into account my opponents board without having to read their army book fully

[Danaork]

So, are we stilling in Aqshy ?

[ScionOfOssia]

1 minute ago, Danaork said:

So, are we stilling in Aqshy ?

For some reason, yes. Could be worse though, at least we’re not stuck in Ghur again! 

[Ejecutor]

2 minutes ago, Danaork said:

So, are we stilling in Aqshy ?

And Ghyran.

[Greyshadow]

9 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

Absolutely nothing interrupts a game worse than needing to spend 1-5 minutes scrambling through the rulebook to check what a rule does. Its bad for new players for that exact reason. When you add USRs everybody is a new player...

I do understand your point. I felt that way about Fantasy Battles 8th Edition. It is that readability vs playability balance. A few common rules; such as fly, scout, champions, standard bearers, musicians, poison attacks, that are simple and easy to remember aren't too hard for new players but do really improve consistency and readability. 

[Skreech Verminking]

10 minutes ago, Greyshadow said:

I am looking forward to this 4th edition. I know balance has been great lately and the people who play regularly are having a blast. For me, an occasional player, I would like to see a more streamlined core rules set and it looks that's the way we are headed. Really keen to play some spearhead - I'll definitely be working on getting my armys spearhead ready.

So far so good. I wonder what is going to happen with the double turn, (I really hope it stays unchanged).

So far the balance was great.

and I’m keen in seeing if their changes to the double turn will make it more accepted then it currently is.

 

[Ganigumo]

Just now, Luperci said:

For me USRs ease the mental load when playing, if every unit that could fly had a fully written out rule stating it could move over enemy units etc. I would glance at that for a second and go, "oh right flying", whereas if a unit has just "Fly" written, I know exactly what's happening with a fraction of page/card space. For a new player, they see Fly and they can ask what it means, so long as there aren't hundreds of USRs, they're not that hard to keep track of. Also USRs make the warscrolls of factions you don't play easier to comprehend at a glance. If I see an enemy unit I'm playing against with a massive block of text, I'm ngl I just won't bother reading it properly. If some of that is instead single phrases I'm familiar with, it's much easier to take into account my opponents board without having to read their army book fully

We can re-use names and text, like we shouldn't have 37 variants of flying. But every model that has flying should say:
 

Quote

Flying: This unit can pass across terrain and models so long as it ends its movement in a "legal position". If it ends or starts its movement on a piece of terrain measure the diagonal distance.

Same with stuff like bodyguards etc.
I get the urge to consolidate it into one central location, so you don't end up repeating yourself endlessly, but it really is bad user experience. 
There's a rule of thumb for UX design that important information should never be more than 3 clicks away, because your user will get increasingly annoyed with each subsequent click. There's some pushback, but its mostly a rule that reminds you to be cognizant of the amount of time it takes for your user to get to the desired information.
All rules on the warscroll: A bit more cluttered, but you just open up your battletome/app and find the warscroll for all the info.
USRs: Clean warscroll, but to figure out what each rule does you need to: Find the rule on the warscroll, open up the core book to the index, find the USR in the index, flip to the page number, find the rule. Also pray any other USRs you need are on the same page.

 

 

1 minute ago, Skreech Verminking said:

So far the balance was great.

and I’m keen in seeing if their changes to the double turn will make it more accepted then it currently is.

 

Their comments on the double turn are just exactly how I think it already operates. A lot of battleplans give strong incentive to not take them for scoring reasons.

[Kaladreon]

24 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

Sort of unironically yes. needing to swap pages to figure out what a unit does will always be a chore. We're not so hard pressed for real estate that we can't.

Absolutely nothing interrupts a game worse than needing to spend 1-5 minutes scrambling through the rulebook to check what a rule does. Its bad for new players for that exact reason. When you add USRs everybody is a new player. Once you're experienced you probably already know what your warscroll does anyway, so it doesn't actually help.
Pretty much the only scenario its good for is when you're reading rules that aren't your own rules, which in a real game can often be summarized by your opponent quicker anyways.

The whole point of USRs is that you aren't flipping back and forth. The same rule term/keyword allows you to know what somethign does no matter what faction or warscroll it is seen in. As it stands, abilities that are pretty much the same ahve minor changes and different wording, so that requires reading it out, sometimes debate, flipping through to see how it interacts with the core rules, etc. This goes away if you say something like 'my unit has scout' and your opponent knows thats the same rule as seen in every other army.

[Luperci]

5 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

We can re-use names and text, like we shouldn't have 37 variants of flying. But every model that has flying should say:
 

Same with stuff like bodyguards etc.
I get the urge to consolidate it into one central location, so you don't end up repeating yourself endlessly, but it really is bad user experience. 
There's a rule of thumb for UX design that important information should never be more than 3 clicks away, because your user will get increasingly annoyed with each subsequent click. There's some pushback, but its mostly a rule that reminds you to be cognizant of the amount of time it takes for your user to get to the desired information.
All rules on the warscroll: A bit more cluttered, but you just open up your battletome/app and find the warscroll for all the info.
USRs: Clean warscroll, but to figure out what each rule does you need to: Find the rule on the warscroll, open up the core book to the index, find the USR in the index, flip to the page number, find the rule. Also pray any other USRs you need are on the same page.

 

 

Their comments on the double turn are just exactly how I think it already operates. A lot of battleplans give strong incentive to not take them for scoring reasons.

The point is that you shouldn't have to cross reference for USRs each time though? If it's really so bad they could have a pull out sheet from the core book with all the USRs listed in alphabetical order for easy cross reference though I suppose. This is where GW needs to really embrace the digital format imo, because all of this could just be drop downs or redirects from the actual warscroll