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Chris Tomlin

AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

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17 minutes ago, Grudgebearer said:

Why are the sequitors falling out of favor? 

More expensive and with Skaven spamming mortal wounds and FEC fighting first and fighting twice with the 6 mortal wounds on 6s its just an expensive fodder 440 pt target (if you run em in blocks of 20)

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What if you replace evocators with sequitors in Anvil list? They can still hit hard and have more wounds and more models.

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4 minutes ago, frostfire said:

What if you replace evocators with sequitors in Anvil list? They can still hit hard and have more wounds and more models.

well youre getting 20 sequitors for the evocator block.

which means you lose the ability to generate MW like the evocators do and lose the extra unbind and wizard (for the Places of Power mission)

9 Maces so 19 attacks including the prime - so 13 hits - 8 wounds on average - so something with a 4+ save, goes to 5+ saves 2-3 , 10 damage

Then 22 normal attacks - 14 hits, 9-10 wounds lets say 10, 5 are saved on a 4+ save so 5 damage

You did 15 damage total with Sequitors

Evocators do something like 22 damage on average with grandstaves.

 

So..,,,yeah

 

I understand the sequitor toughness argument, but with Skave nand FEC spamming MW as they are, youre just painting a bright red target on the sequitors to die before they do anything.

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Yeah. With rerolling hits they might do more damage but are still outclassed by evocators who can do decent amount of mortal wounds.

Evocators remain amazing in 220 .

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Hello Guys,

im relatively new to AOS and currently im planning to expand my Stormcast Army (I have only the Soul Wars Box for now).

So i looked at the leaked GHB 19 points and build this list:

Celestial Vindicators

  • Lord Arcanum on Celestial Dracoline 220
  • Knight-Heraldor 100
  • Lord-Ordinator 140
  • 6 x Evocators on Celestial Dracolines 600
  • 4x Celestar Ballista 440
  • 5x Liberators 100
  • 5x Liberators 100
  • 5x Liberators 100
  • 10x Skinks 70
  • 10x Skinks 70
  • 1 Command Point 50

1990 Points

Well, the idea is simple:

Kill heroes with the Ballistas and use the Dracolines to erase big units. The rest is for getting objectives and screening.

I really think the damage Dracolines create can be insane.

If i calculated correctly with full Buffs (Charge, Empower, Pride Leader, Pack Alpha and Righteous Hatred) that unit would do on average 39,8 wounds against 3+ Saves or 52,4 wounds against 4+ targets.

I thought probably it would make sense to swap the Knight-Heraldor and the Libs for 3 units of 5 Sequitors, but im not sure.

Your feedback is welcome!

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3 hours ago, Grudgebearer said:

Why are the sequitors falling out of favor? 

MW are more and more common and units attacking in the héro phase or at the start of the combat phase bypass their rerolling saves

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@BartoI have played CV thundercats once.

They deleted a unit of 40 chaos marauders with -1 to hit and 5+ 6+ fnp. Their damage is granted.

Shooting off screening units with ballistas might be better option though.

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13 hours ago, JaffaBones said:

I did the math, you can't! 

Even after dropping the Vanguard Aux Chamber 20p and all the Vanguard changes is not enough to fit it into 2k points with minimum requirements.

This is plain dumb. Why bother having battalions if they won't even fit into 2k? They even touched all units for it but seemed to never have done the math for the battalion.

You can fit the battalion into 2k if you bring Hurricanes instead of Longstrikes.

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13 hours ago, FattBooM666 said:

So @PJetski
Would it be something like this:

Astral Templars

Lord-Castellant - General
Lord-Ordinator
Knight-Heraldor
Knight Incantor - Blades
Knight Incantor - Halo

5x Liberators - Grandhammer
5x Liberators - Grandhammer
5x Liberators - Grandhammer

6x Desolators

Ballista
Ballista
Ballista
Ballista

Should leave us then at 1980pts.

Doesn't look to bad right?

Also was looking at the stardrake:
@Requizen

Lord-Celestant on Stardrake - Staunch Defender, Ignax scales
Lord- Castellant
Lord-Ordinator
Knight - Incantor
Hurricanum

5x Liberators - Grandhammer
5x Liberators - Grandhammer
5x Liberators - Grandhammer

Ballista
Ballista
Ballista
Ballista

Should leave us then at 2000pts
 

Haha I love Ballista + Ordinator + Hurricanum combo, that's so sick. Not sure it belongs with a Stardrake, though. With the big guy, you want zoning and scoring units since he's mostly just going to be tying up and zoning. I'd drop boyh the Hurricanum and Ordinator, just use the Ballistas as threatening Scions units, and then take bodies of one sort or another. Bumping up the Lib units is nice, but so is something like Skinks or similar. 

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Hurricanum is great. I once used it in my ballista list similar to the list above.

It buffs both missile and melee, which is cool because you don't have to be wholly within the aura, and do mortal wounds in range.

Since it is cheaper without the wizard on it, it might be a better ally unit imo. 

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Posted (edited)

Here's the list I'm going to start testing Desolators with:

Astral Templars

Drakesworn Templar (General, Artefact, Storm-winged)
Lord-Castellant
Knight-Incantor (Celestial Blades)
Lord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (Azyrite Halo)
Knight-Azyros
6x Desolator
3x5 Liberators

There's 60 points left over. I could add in endless spells (Purple Sun or Geminids?) or replace one of the Liberator squads with Judicators for additional focused fire.

I don't think it can be better than Anvilstrike, but I reckon that's true for most lists.

Edited by PJetski

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laogc seems a little expensive if you're not taking Sequitors.  If you drop him down to an Invo, you'd have another 80 points to go with your 60 spare.  That's 140 - take something with a teleport and Swords maybe?

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Quick Q:  can you stack the Lord Arcanum on Dracoline command ability ; Pack Alpha (add 1 to attacks characteristic of .... etc. ).

 

Thanks.

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6 minutes ago, stato said:

Quick Q:  can you stack the Lord Arcanum on Dracoline command ability ; Pack Alpha (add 1 to attacks characteristic of .... etc. ).

 

Thanks.

Quick A: yup. :P

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25 minutes ago, crkhobbit said:

laogc seems a little expensive if you're not taking Sequitors.  If you drop him down to an Invo, you'd have another 80 points to go with your 60 spare.  That's 140 - take something with a teleport and Swords maybe?

LAGC has a few different functions. Cycle of the Storm and his healing spell are very valuable defensive tools for a list that relies on a 16 wound monster and 5 wound cavalry.

Second, his speed allows him to keep up with the Desolators/Stardrake or grab objectives.

Third, spirit flasks on a 7 wound model are much better than on a 5 wound model since he is much more likely to survive. He can also heal the turn after using spirit flasks, or heal the Incantor.

A second dispel scroll is useful but with the Stardrake giving -1 to enemy casters it is of marginal value.

8 minutes ago, stato said:

Quick Q:  can you stack the Lord Arcanum on Dracoline command ability ; Pack Alpha (add 1 to attacks characteristic of .... etc. ).

 

Yes... but when would this ever be worthwhile? Dracolines all hit on 3+ already, a second +1 hit is almost always useless. 

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54 minutes ago, PJetski said:

Here's the list I'm going to start testing Desolators with:

Astral Templars

Drakesworn Templar (General, Artefact, Storm-winged)
Lord-Castellant
Knight-Incantor (Celestial Blades)
Lord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (Azyrite Halo)
Knight-Azyros
6x Desolator
3x5 Liberators

There's 60 points left over. I could add in endless spells (Purple Sun or Geminids?) or replace one of the Liberator squads with Judicators for additional focused fire.

I don't think it can be better than Anvilstrike, but I reckon that's true for most lists.

So whats the plan against gristlegore? Stormbreath them to death? Alongwith whatever mortal wound rain the drakesworn brings?

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, PJetski said:

Yes... but when would this ever be worthwhile? Dracolines all hit on 3+ already, a second +1 hit is almost always useless. 

The CA adds 1 attack to the Draco's Claws not +1 to hit.  I think you confuse that with Pride Leader trait.

Both in combination are probably the hardest hammer we can get on the charge.

Edited by schwabbele
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Posted (edited)

@PJetski why not drop the Incantor and go for Heraldor and Azyros? Another fast hero, rr1s on hit is valuable for the 2+ breath and Heraldor to get the Stardrake where you want it seem to make more semse than the unbind, especially considering the -1 to cast you mentioned.

Edited by Lucur

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2 minutes ago, schwabbele said:

The CA adds 1 attack to the Draco's Claws not +1 to hit. 

Oh sorry I thought you were talking about the Pride Leader mount trait for some reason 😅

3 minutes ago, jhamslam said:

So whats the plan against gristlegore? Stormbreath them to death? Alongwith whatever mortal wound rain the drakesworn brings?

Yup. You can reliably get to 2+ rr1 breath attacks against MONSTERs, which should do 6d3 mortal wounds. The Drakesworn bow might do a wound, and some endless spell (probably Geminids) cast at +1 is fairly reliable, too. If it doesn't kill them then at least it should weaken them enough that they won't be much of a threat in the combat phase.

2 minutes ago, Lucur said:

@PJetski why not drop the Incantor and go for Heraldor and Azyros? Another fast hero, rr1s on hit is valuable for the 2+ breath and Heraldor to get the Stardrake where you want it seem to make more semse than the unbind, especially considering the -1 to cast you mentioned.

I already have an Azyros in the list, and I dont think the Heraldor is necessary because of the 6" dauntless move.

I want the Incantor to have two WIZARDs for objectives, a second unbind (with a dispel scroll), a second Spirit Flask, and to cast both Celestial Blades and Azyrite Halo on the Desolator mob in the same turn or toss an endless spell. I think I will value this more than the ability to run/retreat/charge and horn blast on scenery in this particular list.

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8 minutes ago, schwabbele said:

The CA adds 1 attack to the Draco's Claws not +1 to hit.  I think you confuse that with Pride Leader trait.

Both in combination are probably the hardest hammer we can get on the charge.

Thanks (and thanks everyone else who answered).

I'm hampered by running my list as Tempest Lords (damn you narrative tendancies!) so struggle compared to the other Stormhosts. With Sequitors and Evocators going up my previous tactic of using Arcanum of Gryph with his command abilities is less useful, so thinking i might try to spend all my CP on a dracoline horde :0)

 

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2 minutes ago, PJetski said:

 

Yup. You can reliably get to 2+ rr1 breath attacks against MONSTERs, which should do 6d3 mortal wounds. The Drakesworn bow might do a wound, and some endless spell (probably Geminids) cast at +1 is fairly reliable, too. If it doesn't kill them then at least it should weaken them enough that they won't be much of a threat in the combat phase.

im sure you already know :)  but the threat from terrorgheists comes from Gaping Maw which is re rollable thanks to their mount trait - Gruesome bite.

 

Its also the only attack that doesnt get bracketed. At all. And does not take any penalty to its damage or hit rolls from any wounds the terrorgheists take. THIS is the real MW spammer.

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5 minutes ago, jhamslam said:

im sure you already know :)  but the threat from terrorgheists comes from Gaping Maw which is re rollable thanks to their mount trait - Gruesome bite.

 

Its also the only attack that doesnt get bracketed. At all. And does not take any penalty to its damage or hit rolls from any wounds the terrorgheists take. THIS is the real MW spammer.

I'm quite aware. This is another reason I like using the geminids, since it can reduce the number of attacks.

The odds of killing a Gristlegore TG before you even engage it in melee are pretty good. Between Storm-winged (can be activated in both movement & charge phase), Rain of Stars, Skybolt Bow, Geminids, dracoth breath, Azyros lantern, spirit flasks (on your turn they go before the TG attack), you can get the damage through. It's important to use the dispel scroll on Unholy Vitality on the turn before you go for the kill. Once you kill the general their list falls apart quickly.

Nothing is guaranteed because it's still a dice game after all, but it seems like you should be able to reliably handle a gristlegore list with this

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2 hours ago, Requizen said:

Haha I love Ballista + Ordinator + Hurricanum combo, that's so sick. Not sure it belongs with a Stardrake, though. With the big guy, you want zoning and scoring units since he's mostly just going to be tying up and zoning. I'd drop boyh the Hurricanum and Ordinator, just use the Ballistas as threatening Scions units, and then take bodies of one sort or another. Bumping up the Lib units is nice, but so is something like Skinks or similar. 

Okay so if I try the shooty combo I need more bodies rather than drake? 

 

Uhm the other you point out, skip hurricanum and ordinator? 

Dont I loose a lot value without ordinatir? 

What did you have in mind? 10x evocators? 

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1 hour ago, PJetski said:

Here's the list I'm going to start testing Desolators with:

Astral Templars

Drakesworn Templar (General, Artefact, Storm-winged)
Lord-Castellant
Knight-Incantor (Celestial Blades)
Lord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (Azyrite Halo)
Knight-Azyros
6x Desolator
3x5 Liberators

There's 60 points left over. I could add in endless spells (Purple Sun or Geminids?) or replace one of the Liberator squads with Judicators for additional focused fire.

I don't think it can be better than Anvilstrike, but I reckon that's true for most lists.

This feels really fun, if a bit death star ish :P

Geminids are probably still the best general use Endless Spell in the game even at 60 points. I'd take em, especially since Skinks are no longer 60 points :( 

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Prosecutors are surprisingly efficient now, at least in small squads where the Prime can get the Trident. They're not as good as Hurricane Raptors, slightly better than Crossbow Judicators, but they are much faster, easier to use, and a little bit more durable in terms of points/wound and reroll save1.

Maybe there's a potential list here with 20x Judicators and 3x3 Prosecutors in a Vanguard Wing? You could go Anvils to double tap the Judicators

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