HammerOfSigmar Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 16 hours ago, Maturin said: Cheers mate! So Deepstriking Crossbow Judicators and Vanguard Raptors is worth it after all? raptors is while crossbow jud not from my point of view. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 4 hours ago, HammerOfSigmar said: raptors is while crossbow jud not from my point of view. I'll have to convert all my liberators to Crossbow Raptors then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Mercury Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 14 hours ago, Roark said: This is the latest Astral Templars list I've been toying with. Although it doesn't focus purely in one direction, I think the Raptors are a good recipient for the Templars command, hitting and wounding their preferred targets on 2s. They also unlock the awesome Aetherwings ability. Thanks to advice from this thread, my usual Templars lists contain an Enchantress and Cogs to give the Evobomb great reach, but obviously I'm sacrificing that (and a Ballista) to have this (hopefully) triple threat list. What do people think? Am I being too greedy and diverse? Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Astral TemplarsKnight-Heraldor (100)- General- Trait: Dauntless Hunters Knight-Azyros (100)- Artefact: Godbeast Plate Lord-Ordinator (140)Knight-Incantor (140)- Spell: Azyrite Halo5 x Liberators (100)- Warblade & Shield- 1x Grandblades5 x Liberators (100)- Warblade & Shield- 1x Grandblades5 x Liberators (100)- Warblade & Shield- 1x Grandblades10 x Evocators (440)- 10x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Speed of Lightning6 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (340)3 x Aetherwings (50)3 x Aetherwings (50)Celestar Ballista (110)Celestar Ballista (110)Celestar Ballista (110)Total: 1990 / 2000Wounds: 125 Astral Templars CA only works in the combat phase so its pretty useless on the Raptors... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boobashamaka Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Hey everyone, I am thinking at pushing the limits with Longstrike and go for the following: -Lord Aquilor -Lord Relictor -Knight Azyros -Spellweaver -Spellweaver -Liberators x5 -Liberators x5 -Liberators x5 -Longtrike x9 -Longtrike x9 -Aetherwings x3 -Aetherwings x3 With an Azyros that can be replaced by 1 CP and 1 endless spell. What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 4 hours ago, Sir Mercury said: Astral Templars CA only works in the combat phase so its pretty useless on the Raptors... Damn, I've been cheating for several games. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamartia Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I was interested in starting a small celestial vindicators force, around 1k points. I dont play competetive, just casual games with friends. Having said that i wanted to know how viable units like liberators, judicators and retributors are from the original line of stormcast. While i dont play conp, i would rather not out of my way to handicap myself. If they are viable thats all i need. On top of that what would be a decent 1000 point force roughly to aim for with initial purchases? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crkhobbit Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Most of us play Liberators to meet the battleline requirement. They're fine. Judicators: same answer. They do a thing, and you have to take at least some of them. Retributors are not popular because Evocators out-class them by a bit. But honestly, the damage output per the amount of points spent makes them a pretty close second to Evocators, so I'd say they're pretty great. If you're going with a big melee unit like Retributors, I'd try to get a Knight Heraldor so you can run the Retributors and still charge. They're weak point is their speed, so that helps. How you fill out that 1000 points is going to matter a lot on what you like, and how you end up preferring to play. Most Stormcast units are worthy of being put on the table for non-competitive games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Hamartia said: I was interested in starting a small celestial vindicators force, around 1k points. I dont play competetive, just casual games with friends. Having said that i wanted to know how viable units like liberators, judicators and retributors are from the original line of stormcast. While i dont play conp, i would rather not out of my way to handicap myself. If they are viable thats all i need. On top of that what would be a decent 1000 point force roughly to aim for with initial purchases? I took 2x10 liberators unit for a 1250pts tournament a two weeks ago. Liberators, IF supported, can be really tanky, but not if you just take 5 of them. Staunch Defender+ Castellant lantern's+ debuff enemy units close to them with spells and prayers, and they'll be really resilient. Resilient BUT lackluster in the damage department! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nizrah Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 Hello fellow Sigmarites, i have made 2 rosters for uncoming 2k T. 1. Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Anvils of the HeldenhammerCelestant-Prime (340)Lord-Castellant (120)Lord-Arcanum (160)- General- Spell: Azyrite HaloLord-Veritant (120)- Prayer: Translocation20 x Sequitors (440)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields- 9x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Sequitors (130)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields- 3x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Sequitors (130)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields- 3x Stormsmite Greatmaces9 x Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows (510)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 104 2. Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Astral TemplarsKnight-Heraldor (100)Knight-Incantor (140)- Spell: Azyrite HaloLord-Ordinator (140)Knight-Azyros (100)Lord-Castellant (120)- General- Trait: Dauntless Hunters - Artefact: Godbeast Plate 5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers6 x Desolators (600)Celestar Ballista (110)Celestar Ballista (110)Celestar Ballista (110)Celestar Ballista (110)Total: 1990 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 114 What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamartia Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 (edited) 18 hours ago, Maturin said: I took 2x10 liberators unit for a 1250pts tournament a two weeks ago. Liberators, IF supported, can be really tanky, but not if you just take 5 of them. Staunch Defender+ Castellant lantern's+ debuff enemy units close to them with spells and prayers, and they'll be really resilient. Resilient BUT lackluster in the damage department! Thats neat, was thinking of going for dual swords for celestial vindidcators for aesthetic reasons. So long as theyre not straight garbage im happy. Last thing i want is to invest in models that just dont cut it at all. I'm sure if i play against people that are playing more to win then i would naturally swap to sequitors. Edited July 22, 2019 by Hamartia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Hamartia said: Thats neat, was thinking of going for dual swords for celestial vindidcators for aesthetic reasons. So long as theyre not straight garbage im happy. Last thing i want is to invest in models that just dont cut it at all. I'm sure if i play against people that are playing more to win then i would naturally swap to sequitors. Swords are a treat for the eye but unfortunately, they suck (on paper). The reason why is that they wound on 4+. Sure they hit on 3+, but if you go the hammer way, and fight a unit with 5 or more wounds per model, then you hit on 3 and wound on 3, which is better than hitting on 2 and wounding on 4 if you were to fight the same unit with swords. If you've got yourself a buff, like azyros's, then you can hit on 2+ and wound on 3+ with your hammers. Edited July 22, 2019 by Maturin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fundre Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Hamartia said: Thats neat, was thinking of going for dual swords for celestial vindidcators for aesthetic reasons. So long as theyre not straight garbage im happy. Last thing i want is to invest in models that just dont cut it at all. I'm sure if i play against people that are playing more to win then i would naturally swap to sequitors. Dont use castigators. They are total rubbish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stus67 Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 Trying to make a Stardrake competitive is harder than I thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 2 hours ago, stus67 said: Trying to make a Stardrake competitive is harder than I thought How about three Templars on Stardrake for 2000 points ? Should be fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamartia Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Maturin said: Swords are a treat for the eye but unfortunately, they suck (on paper). The reason why is that they wound on 4+. Sure they hit on 3+, but if you go the hammer way, and fight a unit with 5 or more wounds per model, then you hit on 3 and wound on 3, which is better than hitting on 2 and wounding on 4 if you were to fight the same unit with swords. If you've got yourself a buff, like azyros's, then you can hit on 2+ and wound on 3+ with your hammers. Fair enough! I figured the math-hammer was a little closer between the two. Edited July 22, 2019 by Hamartia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 azyros give reroll 1 to hit buffs, not +1 to hit...... another thing worth considering when do math for sword and hammer is that -1 to hit debuff is kind of widely seen in this game(for example, SCE has several), but -1 to wound debuff is not so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommissarRotke Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 (edited) 7 hours ago, Maturin said: Swords are a treat for the eye but unfortunately, they suck (on paper). The reason why is that they wound on 4+. Sure they hit on 3+, but if you go the hammer way, and fight a unit with 5 or more wounds per model, then you hit on 3 and wound on 3, which is better than hitting on 2 and wounding on 4 if you were to fight the same unit with swords. If you've got yourself a buff, like azyros's, then you can hit on 2+ and wound on 3+ with your hammers. this is why I'm upset Leena Stormspire was a Liberator Prime and not a Questor... who tf is taking liberators with swords 1 hour ago, HammerOfSigmar said: azyros give reroll 1 to hit buffs, not +1 to hit...... another thing worth considering when do math for sword and hammer is that -1 to hit debuff is kind of widely seen in this game(for example, SCE has several), but -1 to wound debuff is not so. are you saying the swords are a closer matchup, since they'd go up to 4+ and not 5+? Edited July 22, 2019 by CommissarRotke additional quote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 1 minute ago, CommissarRotke said: this is why I'm upset Leena Stormspire was a Liberator Prime and not a Questor... who tf is taking liberators with swords Why can't you play her as a Knight Questor ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommissarRotke Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 2 minutes ago, Maturin said: Why can't you play her as a Knight Questor ? The rules she comes with are "officially" just a Prime, but you're exactly right and the cape she gets means it's a no-brainer proxy. Questor seems like more of a narrative pick than matched though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 Well Knight Questor isn't really competitive anyway and Leena is sold around 60E minimum on Ebay so, how about a regular Knight Questor converted with some bits if you really want to use him ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 1 hour ago, HammerOfSigmar said: azyros give reroll 1 to hit buffs, not +1 to hit...... another thing worth considering when do math for sword and hammer is that -1 to hit debuff is kind of widely seen in this game(for example, SCE has several), but -1 to wound debuff is not so. Yeah sorry my bad. Problem is SCE are an elit army. Any failed to hit rolls or wound hurts a lot. I learned it the hard way during my first games and tournament this month. So what I'm aiming for, is to lower both hit and wound rolls, as well as reroll them. I swapped in my mind the bonus given by the azyros with the one given by the celestial hurricanum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 35 minutes ago, CommissarRotke said: this is why I'm upset Leena Stormspire was a Liberator Prime and not a Questor... who tf is taking liberators with swords are you saying the swords are a closer matchup, since they'd go up to 4+ and not 5+? I am not saying the sword is definitely better, I just want to remind you guys of the missing thing when do the maths🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucur Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 Swords ARE better if you have access to buffs that concern the wound roll. Hammers are better if you have buffs to your hit roll. As Liberators have lay low the tyrant, inherently they sometimes come with a hit buff built in, so hammers is the standard choice (besides the cheap models from sc and old starter coming with only hammers and shields). At the end of the day the damage output of a squad of Liberators is negligible and whether you do an average .2 or .22 damage per attack is no difference, so go with what you prefer the looks of. They're only there to take up space, tick battleline and hold out until damage can be directed at their adversary from elsewhere. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 I much prefer swords and shields. There are heaps more debuffs to Hit than to Wound floating around... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maturin Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 22 minutes ago, Roark said: I much prefer swords and shields. There are heaps more debuffs to Hit than to Wound floating around... And there are also way more buffs to hit than to wound ;). But as Lucur said, Libs aren't here to dish the damage! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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