Scgt : Predictions

[LLV]

I understood why not so many sign-ups with the date thing, but why 70+ drops? That seems a little strange?

[Sheriff]

i'm one of the dropouts. didn't fancy the portents scenarios, felt like i was being given homework. that and having to bring scenery. 

[Charles]

On 5/14/2018 at 5:11 AM, PlasticCraic said:

@Stevewren nailed it.

Jack Armstrong won with Vanguard Wing.

Chris Myhill with Mixed Order was 2nd.

Darren Watson with Plaguetouched Warband was 3rd.

Liam Cook and  Ben Curry finished 5th and 7th overall with DOK.

Highest Death was Pete Scholey at 6th (Nagash list).

Highest Destruction was Ian Spink at 45th (Bonesplitterz).

 

Was there a Khorne Mortal list present?

Or any Khorne? Was there only 1 and a Murderhost?

Sorry for asking but the link no longer seems to work?

[Olincay]

8 hours ago, TalesOfSigmar said:

They had bang on 100 players. Sold 178 tickets but had a record number of dropouts.

EEk, that's err..abit rough.  I hope that doesn't dishearten Dan, wayne and russ. 

I wonder how much the malign portent scenarios  and  propehcy points had in that,  I know my personal group found that odd and off putting.  Not that we could ever attend since were in Australia. 

Love the podcast btw. 

[svnvaldez]

3 hours ago, Sheriff said:

i'm one of the dropouts. didn't fancy the portents scenarios, felt like i was being given homework. that and having to bring scenery. 

Number 1 reason I drop from events.... a players pack or lack of one that I don't want to play. I have always sided with GH + FAQ and a few sensible house rules (No squares, measure from volume, etc etc)

[Richelieu]

33 minutes ago, svnvaldez said:

Number 1 reason I drop from events.... a players pack or lack of one that I don't want to play. I have always sided with GH + FAQ and a few sensible house rules (No squares, measure from volume, etc etc)

Right.  I know TOs want to do their best to give all armies an opportunity, but a bunch of rules nobody has played just leads to long games, unnecessary frustrations and a result that's no different than if GHB+FAQ had been used.

[Dan.Ford]

8 hours ago, Charles said:

Was there a Khorne Mortal list present?

Or any Khorne? Was there only 1 and a Murderhost?

Sorry for asking but the link no longer seems to work?

I did see an Exalted greater daemon of khorne on the table being played with  (650!!!) my hero.

and Pano was playing Khorne.

I have asked Dan and Russ for Allegiance if possible. But we will see them on the ranking.

But I think there's been a big drop for khorne generally .  Hitting on 4's and attacking armies with minus to hits . 

[Charles]

On 5/16/2018 at 7:37 AM, Dan.Ford said:

 

But I think there's been a big drop for khorne generally .  Hitting on 4's and attacking armies with minus to hits . 

I like to think of it as a gentleman’s agreement not to use Khorne while the are OP. Once the new magic supplement has given them a good nerfing maybe we will see more on the table ?

[Jaehaerys]

On 5/16/2018 at 8:42 AM, Charles said:

I like to think of it as a gentleman’s agreement not to use Khorne while the are OP. Once the new magic supplement has great been them a good nerfing maybe we will see more on the table ?

I played Khorne, finished 24th. There was also a chap running Brass Stampede/Pilgrims List there too (played next to him once). 

[Charles]

1 hour ago, Jaehaerys said:

I played Khorne, finished 24th. There was also a chap running Brass Stampede/Pilgrims List there too (played next to him once). 

Well done, great result!

[sal4m4nd3r]

On 5/16/2018 at 3:42 AM, Charles said:

I like to think of it as a gentleman’s agreement not to use Khorne while the are OP. Once the new magic supplement has given them a good nerfing maybe we will see more on the table ?

You must be high if you think Khorne is broken......

[Gotrek]

56 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

You must be high if you think Khorne is broken......

I might be misreading but i think he was talking about murderhost backed up by bloodsecrator and priests stacking killing frenzy so the bloodletter bombs are just vomiting mortal wounds all over everything while getting a free 2d6 move every turn

[Charles]

 

1 hour ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

You must be high if you think Khorne is broken......

Sorry it was a bad joke. Khorne is incredibly underpowered compared to the new battletomes.

The models are also over pointed as well especially the Bloodthirsters

[Richelieu]

12 minutes ago, Charles said:

 

Sorry it was a bad joke. Khorne is incredibly underpowered compared to the new battletomes.

The models are also over pointed as well especially the Bloodthirsters

Slightly underpowered, not incredibly underpowered.  Incredibly underpowered armies don't regularly make top ten appearances at large tournaments.  I could cite you at minimum 3 recent examples of Khorne doing this.  Incredibly underpowered would be things like Ogors, Ironjawz, BCR, FEC, Moonclan, Slaves to Darkness, Slaanesh, Darkling Covens, etc., etc..

[Iradekhorne]

i only play khorne  with mortals... and i have 0 problems. I dont think khorne is underpowered, gore pilgrims do a great job ib my hand. 

My last game vs tzeentch was devastating for him i dispelled 4 spells with blood thithe+artifact, both of my slaughterpriest died vs skyfires, but my bloodwarriors in last turn hitting twice+ my skullreapers dominated the game. they killed a unit of 20 tzaangors and the great daemon of tzeentch with my juggerlord with gorecleaver.

I don't think khorne as underpowered army, is just OK

[Olincay]

2 hours ago, Charles said:

 

Sorry it was a bad joke. Khorne is incredibly underpowered compared to the new battletomes.

The models are also over pointed as well especially the Bloodthirsters

I run Tzeentch and i still clentch my buttcheeks when i see 90 bloodletters running at me.  

 

[MOMUS]

On 15 May 2018 at 5:59 PM, LLV said:

I understood why not so many sign-ups with the date thing, but why 70+ drops? That seems a little strange?

I think it was just bad timing, same weekend as warhammer fest -which had massive AoS announcements.

The malign portent scenarios were included to swap out missions which can sometimes be match up dependant and not really give much of a game. This might've backfired being a case of better the devil you know.

would be telling to see how many refunds were issued are the deadline was two week before the event. 

[LLV]

5 hours ago, MOMUS said:

I think it was just bad timing, same weekend as warhammer fest -which had massive AoS announcements.

The malign portent scenarios were included to swap out missions which can sometimes be match up dependant and not really give much of a game. This might've backfired being a case of better the devil you know.

would be telling to see how many refunds were issued are the deadline was two week before the event. 

Yeah it was more the drops themselves I was staggered by as we all knew sign up going in was stunted due to fest and date change

[DantePQ]

Anybody got DoK army lists? 

[WoollyMammoth]

On 5/17/2018 at 2:54 PM, Richelieu said:

Slightly underpowered, not incredibly underpowered.  Incredibly underpowered armies don't regularly make top ten appearances at large tournaments.  I could cite you at minimum 3 recent examples of Khorne doing this.  Incredibly underpowered would be things like Ogors, Ironjawz, BCR, FEC, Moonclan, Slaves to Darkness, Slaanesh, Darkling Covens, etc., etc..

I don't think that the problem is with these armies being underpowered - I think that most of these armies are in a good place, its just that some specific lists are able to either break the game by removing interactivity for most opponents, or just get too much for their points. These lists clearly stand out, and are being played regularly by competitive-minded people.

A lot of it is just the culture of the game.  Competitive people have it in their mind that Vanguard Wing or Changehost is the best - and they play a ton of games with their list, especially against other competitive-minded players. So the 'pilots' of these lists are just better players. There are also more of these players than not; for example there might be 12 Vanguard Wing players and 2 FEC players .. even if these lists were equal, mathematically you are going to see more Vanguard Wings at the top. If competitive players decided that Ogors were the army to beat, every tournament is likely to be filled with at least a couple Ogor lists at the top.

There are very few armies which just lack the tools to deal with most others. I took FEC to LVO and I beat Tzeentch, 90 bloodletter Gore Pilgrims, Sylvaneth. All my losses were mainly from mistakes, certain lists were more of a challenge than others, but nothing was impossible for me to overcome.

Ogor lists can actually be very strong. The double general Slaanesh lists are oppressive. A lot of these lists might do well if .. anyone was playing them. Nothing in AoS feels like the brick wall that 8th edition power lists were. Some lists have disadvantages against others, but there is no list that is an automatic win button. I'm interested to see the changes they make in the new edition to level out some of the more annoying exploits so that the same lists are not being played so often.

[AthlorianStoners]

@WoollyMammoth yeah I agree with this 100%. I don’t play in an ultra competetive e vironment, but for what it’s worth I see huge success with my BCR. 

[Burf]

5 hours ago, WoollyMammoth said:

I don't think that the problem is with these armies being underpowered - I think that most of these armies are in a good place, its just that some specific lists are able to either break the game by removing interactivity for most opponents, or just get too much for their points. These lists clearly stand out, and are being played regularly by competitive-minded people.

A lot of it is just the culture of the game.  Competitive people have it in their mind that Vanguard Wing or Changehost is the best - and they play a ton of games with their list, especially against other competitive-minded players. So the 'pilots' of these lists are just better players. There are also more of these players than not; for example there might be 12 Vanguard Wing players and 2 FEC players .. even if these lists were equal, mathematically you are going to see more Vanguard Wings at the top. If competitive players decided that Ogors were the army to beat, every tournament is likely to be filled with at least a couple Ogor lists at the top.

There are very few armies which just lack the tools to deal with most others. I took FEC to LVO and I beat Tzeentch, 90 bloodletter Gore Pilgrims, Sylvaneth. All my losses were mainly from mistakes, certain lists were more of a challenge than others, but nothing was impossible for me to overcome.

Ogor lists can actually be very strong. The double general Slaanesh lists are oppressive. A lot of these lists might do well if .. anyone was playing them. Nothing in AoS feels like the brick wall that 8th edition power lists were. Some lists have disadvantages against others, but there is no list that is an automatic win button. I'm interested to see the changes they make in the new edition to level out some of the more annoying exploits so that the same lists are not being played so often.

This is much closer to the truth than a lot of what I've seen talked about but ultimately I think it's a bit optimistic.

The best players don't usually let the internet do all their list building for them. There's a reason they choose the lists they do and 'TGA said so' isn't it.

Some lists have such obvious weaknesses that it creates what is essentially an artificial skill gap. When you play an army like Tzeentch against BCR, the game you're playing is quite a bit simpler than the game he is, even if the raw destructive power of the lists isn't particularly different.

Ultimately the armies that are seen as weak aren't generally as bad as people say they are. Player skill and RNGesus win the day in all but the worst matchups. A good BCR player, for example, will beat an average or poor Tzeentch player most of the time. BUT, these armies aren't secretely diamonds in the rough waiting for Jack Armstrong, or Russ Veal, or Jeff Campbell-Crawley to ride them to multiple podiums either.

Most Battletome armies people really criticize are what I like to call 2-2-1 armies. 

 

[GeneralZero]

the good part is that there've not been so much possibilities than today: AoS is kinda mature with tons of battletomes and tons of armies. Add in this the fact that in several armies, you have several (super) builds,  you get numerous armies flavoured to unlimited way of play.

For example, I've invested in death, at last (still waiting the delivery...today I hope). There are many builds arounds several bataillons which do well in tourney. I'll be happy with my death units because I already know that I can play them in so many ways. I won't be borred until chicken have teeth ;-)