My thoughts on starter boxes

[J.Z.]

Hello Alliance!

As a new player to the hobby (plastic crack they call it ) i started with a small box called a Storm of Sigmar.

My thoughts were- let's try it. It's cheep, there are some different units, two armies (so i thought) - all cool.

In the perspective my opinion on Storm of Sigmar are quite negative. Sure its cheep and easy way to jump in AoS but in very limited way. Sure it's good if you are thinking SKIRMISH. But if you want to start regular army there are numerous issues. First of all you dont get any unit in numbers you need to feel requirements of warscrolls- 5 blood reavers? and then what? you missing next 5! Ok You can buy another Easy to build set but then another problem pop up- the whole unit looks the same. I know this is not necessarily a issue for some players but for me is a little disaster  . I guess you can buy some miniatures on eBay... but.... 

As i mention all units are missing miniatures for a normal AoS units. Buing next 4 Easy to Build boxes rises price of SoS too high IMO

 

But Storm of Sigmar is in the past. It serves it purpose.

Now the BIG Starter set. I think the value is outstanding!! For all the goodies you get price between 55 - 65 (third part retailer) is brilliant. but again it is without issues.

First of all, since rules are free, you actually don't need the rule book (except for all fluff) and it's targeting only players who wants to play poster boys  

Still awesome value! A lot Blood for a Blood GOD!!!

There is still Thunder & Blood and i find this is the starter i should start! You got heroes full warscroll units. Sure it got issue with ETB units looking like f****ng clones but it is great. Plus i think (i hope more experienced players will agree will agree with me) it is a great addition to a big starter.

 

What are your thoughts on starters??

 

 

[AaronWilson]

I got the Tzeentch Arcanite box from my LGS for £80, It has like £150 worth of stuff in. I hope GW keep putting out value boxes like they are right now. 

[Chris Tomlin]

@J.Z. - Have you checked out the "Easy to Build" range? This offers you smaller boxes that can top up the reduced units you get in these starter sets;

http://elementgames.co.uk/search?q=easy+to+build

[Lucio]

Here's something to think about, Storm of Sigmar is all 4 Easy to Build boxes at half the price.

The point of it isn't to start an army, it's to try the modelling, painting and playing aspects of the hobby without spending a lot.

Thunder and Blood is a good, mid-range entry point, it expands on Storm of Sigmar but isn't as tied down as you're looking complete units. It's a better starting point than the original starter set design and complements the Start Collecting range

The Starter set is looking a bit dated, the extra characters and books don't really justify the additional money if you're starting out, but is still great value for money.

 

All in all, the range of choices is great and if you'd been doing this long enough to remember the lack of items like this, then you'd really appreciate just how much they add

 

[J.Z.]

17 hours ago, Lucio said:

Here's something to think about, Storm of Sigmar is all 4 Easy to Build boxes at half the price.

The point of it isn't to start an army, it's to try the modelling, painting and playing aspects of the hobby without spending a lot.

True. I never thought of it as a 4 easy to build boxes but you are right.

And true it's a good place to start painting hobby but it is terrible to start building an a army.

 

Being wiser now i would probably start with one of Start Collecting Army boxes and right battletome.... then again now i have 2 (still unpainted) armies (is what i actually wanted because i'm trying to sell this hobby to my sons)

 

[someone2040]

On 3/27/2018 at 10:04 PM, Chris Tomlin said:

@J.Z. - Have you checked out the "Easy to Build" range? This offers you smaller boxes that can top up the reduced units you get in these starter sets;

http://elementgames.co.uk/search?q=easy+to+build

I think he mentioned in the original post that he could do that, but then he would have identical poses (Something he wasn't personally a fan of).

Personally I don't think it's a huge issue, because posability and customisation is becoming less and less over time anyway.

 

As to the original OP:

I think though, it's important to recognize that basically GW is giving people different price points to jump in at. Yes Storm of Sigmar doesn't give you actual unit sizes for many units, but, it's probably a great little set for someone to get for their kids. Cheap, comes with two forces, not a ton of miniatures and easy to assemble.

It's certainly not going to play like the actual game though, but as a cheap set that you could get someone who you're not sure about sticking around long term (i.e kids with short attention spans) it probably fits the bill.

I think in general though, GW should be marketing Thunder and Blood or the original starter set to teenagers+, because these people (young or old) are more likely to stick around and want to build actual armies that they can play with. 

 

Overall though, I don't think it's a bad thing that GW has multiple starter sets priced at different entry points into the game. Some people will love Storm of Sigmar, because they don't have to fork out a ton of money to get their kid a birthday present. Other people just want to jump into the game proper and are looking for a cheap way to start a new army. Both equally valid cases.

[flemingmma]

Thunder and blood is great imo, the most models for the least money.

[Swooper]

It's a pretty good starter for Skirmish, 17 and 22 renown.

[RuneBrush]

If you pick up the Bloodreaver set for Shadespire, that will give you 7 more Bloodreavers (which look amazing) and a warband for playing Shadespire!

[J.Z.]

8 hours ago, Swooper said:

It's a pretty good starter for Skirmish, 17 and 22 renown.

Only missing heroes.

[J.Z.]

Honestly i would like to see more starter boxes.

Two different armies.

Just to give a choice.

I mean, big starter is full of goodies. But i would like see a clash of Seraphons vs Tzeentch - magic blasting all over battlefield or Nurgle vs Sylvaneth - Rot vs Life.

Don't get me wrong- i love Bloodbound- brutal, cannibalistic, savage. Stormcast Eternals history is so fluffy! (to be honest, when i saw their army for a first time a thought they will be bloody boring do-gooders but i love that they are a tool of vengeance) .... 

I just would like to see more possibilities.

 

And, yeah there are Army Starter boxes but for a somebody like me- who just starting the hobby starters like this ale great entry point. Especially if you want a box with a buddy who want the second army.

[Twitch of Izalith]

The actual "start collecting" sets and battleforce boxes are amazing value. I got a Tzeentch Arcanites box with 25% off recently - so £145 worth of models for £75!

Its not like a really spend any less though - I just end up with way more models than I would have otherwise and armies I would never have started if the initial buy in wasn't so reasonable.

I think the starter sets are fine if you have never played a tabletop wargame - you get enough stuff to experience what its like at a low cost of entry. If you are already experienced at gaming, a returning hobbyist or you are confident you will want to expand your collection to a full army then the army start collecting sets are the way to go in my opinion.

 

[J.Z.]

On 29.03.2018 at 12:07 PM, Twitch of Izalith said:

The actual "start collecting" sets and battleforce boxes are amazing value. I got a Tzeentch Arcanites box with 25% off recently - so £145 worth of models for £75!

Its not like a really spend any less though - I just end up with way more models than I would have otherwise and armies I would never have started if the initial buy in wasn't so reasonable.

I think the starter sets are fine if you have never played a tabletop wargame - you get enough stuff to experience what its like at a low cost of entry. If you are already experienced at gaming, a returning hobbyist or you are confident you will want to expand your collection to a full army then the army start collecting sets are the way to go in my opinion.

 

I hear you.

They are great price, but i'm talking from position of totally new to a hobby.

Sure. Next year, when i will start collecting WH40k i will start with Start Collecting box. If i want start a new army i will start with start collecting. 

But as a new player i was a little confused and i wanted to start with, as i thought at that time, the right way.

And i dont regret starting with a Storm of Sigmar. My thought is that is great entry point for undecided but for somebody who got a taste of blood it's not enough.

Now I got big starter and i will order a Thunder & Blood and this is a great start for a army... two actually... and since i'm fresh i'm using main rule book to get a AoS  universe better.

[J.Z.]

I was away from forum for a last..... 2 months.... 

Well... in meantime there AoS 2.0 new starter box pop-up!

At first glance a loved it.... after a week.... it's.... meh.....

I mean - more dull Stormcast???? this is a 3 big box set with SE. I know that GW wants to make them next Space Marines but come on!

Nighthout looks great....

But the Stormcasts.... I don't get it.... Sacrosanct Chamber is one of the smallest Chambers in vast legions of Sigmar forces. They are specialised in forging new legion and building warmachines- yet they get a whole army and by the looks of it the now going to be one of the main forces for SE.

Now I'm no expert on lore. Im just a beginner in Mortal Realms but i don't find logic in that. 

[Kugane]

13 hours ago, J.Z. said:

I was away from forum for a last..... 2 months.... 

Well... in meantime there AoS 2.0 new starter box pop-up!

At first glance a loved it.... after a week.... it's.... meh.....

I mean - more dull Stormcast???? this is a 3 big box set with SE. I know that GW wants to make them next Space Marines but come on!

Nighthout looks great....

But the Stormcasts.... I don't get it.... Sacrosanct Chamber is one of the smallest Chambers in vast legions of Sigmar forces. They are specialised in forging new legion and building warmachines- yet they get a whole army and by the looks of it the now going to be one of the main forces for SE.

Now I'm no expert on lore. Im just a beginner in Mortal Realms but i don't find logic in that. 

I personally love the look of the new stormcast eternals. I have been waiting for sculpts that have some more cloth on them and these look great to me :).

[J.Z.]

 

Just now, Kugane said:

I personally love the look of the new stormcast eternals. I have been waiting for sculpts that have some more cloth on them and these look great to me :).

I like of how they look also but there is far too many Stormcast models if you compare to other factions.

I would like them to focus more on different factions and I don't want GW to copy the same mistake they do with WH40K - tones of Imperium models and basically none for Xenos. Look at whole Destruction alliance- they just looks abandoned!

[Kugane]

12 minutes ago, J.Z. said:

 

I like of how they look also but there is far too many Stormcast models if you compare to other factions.

I would like them to focus more on different factions and I don't want GW to copy the same mistake they do with WH40K - tones of Imperium models and basically none for Xenos. Look at whole Destruction alliance- they just looks abandoned!

I know what you mean. I am waiting for a meaningful stealth army release that isn't stormcast eternals for 3 years now. I really want some clan Eshin or shadow blades release, but chances are slim to ever see those I guess. 

I think in fantasy games there should be a variety of " basic" play styles to cater to different kind of fantasy players. I would love to see an oriental themed army. Stuff like the dragon empire kickstarter really shows there is huge demand for it. I wish GW would capitalize on that.

[J.Z.]

Just now, Kugane said:

I know what you mean. I am waiting for a meaningful stealth army release that isn't stormcast eternals for 3 years now. I really want some clan Eshin or shadow blades release, but chances are slim to ever see those I guess. 

If Sisters of Battle are returning there is a chance :D:D:D:D:D

But they are still Imperial.

 

When i first step into the Games Workshop store in Plymouth 3 years ago i fell in love with the Orks. But more i read and more models i checked i noticed how abandoned the were by GW. Many armies in WH40k needs TLC big time.

That was one of the reasons i decide do go for AoS.... but if they adopt the same politics here that will be disaster.

[Kugane]

5 minutes ago, J.Z. said:

If Sisters of Battle are returning there is a chance :D:D:D:D:D

But they are still Imperial.

 

When i first step into the Games Workshop store in Plymouth 3 years ago i fell in love with the Orks. But more i read and more models i checked i noticed how abandoned the were by GW. Many armies in WH40k needs TLC big time.

That was one of the reasons i decide do go for AoS.... but if they adopt the same politics here that will be disaster.

On the bright side, death was in a much worse position than any faction, and now look at them xD. That's hopeful to me at least.

Hopefully they update factions soon. There's plenty of models already, at this point if each faction got a battletome I would be happy already. People can convert the rest.

[Baron Klatz]

4 hours ago, J.Z. said:

If Sisters of Battle are returning there is a chance :D:D:D:D:D

But they are still Imperial.

 

When i first step into the Games Workshop store in Plymouth 3 years ago i fell in love with the Orks. But more i read and more models i checked i noticed how abandoned the were by GW. Many armies in WH40k needs TLC big time.

That was one of the reasons i decide do go for AoS.... but if they adopt the same politics here that will be disaster.

This year we got Nurgle, Daughters of Khaine, Idoneth Deepkin, NightHaunt with Stormcasts as a side army that doesn't plug up any other releases and rumors are pointing to Moonclan, Slaves of Darkness and Slaanesh to end the year.

I think we're good on avoiding total imperium syndrome.

[mikethefish]

The wonky unit sizes are REALLY irksome to me.  I'm not getting a Starter flat out.  I might buy the Stormcast half of the set off of someone local, but I won't pay more than 30-40 US bucks for it, since I will no doubt have to get two of them, just to get the extra models necessary to fill out the units

[J.Z.]

Just now, Kugane said:

On the bright side, death was in a much worse position than any faction, and now look at them xD. That's hopeful to me at least.

Hopefully they update factions soon. There's plenty of models already, at this point if each faction got a battletome I would be happy already. People can convert the rest.

Yeah. Death is looking pretty impressive right now.

Just now, Baron Klatz said:

This year we got Nurgle, Daughters of Khaine, Idoneth Deepkin, NightHaunt with Stormcasts as a side army that doesn't plug up any other releases and rumors are pointing to Moonclan, Slaves of Darkness and Slaanesh to end the year.

I think we're good on avoiding total imperium syndrome.

True, true. But look on how many units have Stormcast and how many ID or DoK? 

I HOPE that things will balance in the end.

 

By the way... Slaanesh you say?       

[Vanger]

The announcement of AoS2 finally tipped me over to try this game. Because I do like the idea of SCE and love everything Khorne Related, I quickly bought some starter boxes to build up some armies on the cheap(er) side SO here is my opinion on them:

Big AoS starter set with Golden boys and Khorne Flakes:
Considering the miniatures you get in this box, it's very good value, but... that's all. It feels very bare bones. You only get miniatures a fluff book, rulers and some dice (which are different to the dice used so far for other WHFB starter sets!).

Thunder & Blood:
Maybe best value for starting your army. It still has the fluff book, but you also get a gaming mat, warscroll cards (!) and you can use the box as a terrain piece. Also plastic is colored. Out of the 3 it's the most starter set-y. Still not newcomer friendly because miniatures are not push fit.

Storm of Sigmar:
I don't really get the point of this box.  The miniatures are the "easy to build" sets, but they are not (the WH40K easy to build minis are push fit).  It could've been better marketed as a skirmish starter set or something.  I only got it, because it was on a sale and needed the 2 retributors to round out my units.

But let's have a look at the new AoS starter set:

Soul Wars:
Considering ALL starter sets GW ever published this is the best and the only "real" starter set IMO. It looks very newcomer friendly: warscroll cards, push fit miniatures,  everything that is needed to get into the game fast and enjoy it. Only negative is that the plastic is not colored. But aside from that GW really learned their lessons and outdone themselves.

[J.Z.]

20 hours ago, Vanger said:

The announcement of AoS2 finally tipped me over to try this game. Because I do like the idea of SCE and love everything Khorne Related, I quickly bought some starter boxes to build up some armies on the cheap(er) side SO here is my opinion on them:

Big AoS starter set with Golden boys and Khorne Flakes:
Considering the miniatures you get in this box, it's very good value, but... that's all. It feels very bare bones. You only get miniatures a fluff book, rulers and some dice (which are different to the dice used so far for other WHFB starter sets!).

Thunder & Blood:
Maybe best value for starting your army. It still has the fluff book, but you also get a gaming mat, warscroll cards (!) and you can use the box as a terrain piece. Also plastic is colored. Out of the 3 it's the most starter set-y. Still not newcomer friendly because miniatures are not push fit.

Storm of Sigmar:
I don't really get the point of this box.  The miniatures are the "easy to build" sets, but they are not (the WH40K easy to build minis are push fit).  It could've been better marketed as a skirmish starter set or something.  I only got it, because it was on a sale and needed the 2 retributors to round out my units.

But let's have a look at the new AoS starter set:

Soul Wars:
Considering ALL starter sets GW ever published this is the best and the only "real" starter set IMO. It looks very newcomer friendly: warscroll cards, push fit miniatures,  everything that is needed to get into the game fast and enjoy it. Only negative is that the plastic is not colored. But aside from that GW really learned their lessons and outdone themselves.

Basically a agree with everything you wrote.

Storm of Sigmar really should be labelled like Skirmish Starter with Skirmish rules.

And yeah- despite my objections on Soul Wars - as a starter for newcomers it is great.

I hope they will release something like Forge Bane - two - not so poster armies - with a interesting narrative.

Or a new Thunder & Blood style box!

[flemingmma]

I'm hoping theres a "first strike" and "know no fear" to go with our "dark imperium"-esque soul wars