Let`s chat: Anvilguard

[Kaleun]

1 hour ago, CommodoreCass said:

Im planning on starting an Anvilgard army.  I want to go with big packs of Corsairs, many Kharibdyss and charriot running around. Fleetmaster and a Sorceress as character. What do you think of this?

someone told me Corsairs were one of the worst line of AoS and I already bought my Start Collecting.

Will I think of this that you are going to have a great themed army. The low wound - count heros can finally be protected by units. That is great. Now from a Scourge Privateer Players persepective I can tell you that the army will look absolutly gorgeous BUT doesnt do damage. 

The main thing about Corsairs and also the chariots and the Kharibdyss is that you get wounds for a cheap price, but thats it. You might want to take as many models as you can, because you will win over objectives (Corsairs). If you want to harm your opponent you need something else. 

We saw a Scourge Privateer army already on a tournament (aos shorts). It had many models, but didnt make it to a winning place or even the top 10 (?). We have a book now, but the problems of the army didnt change. You will want sources of damage for the army. 

[zilberfrid]

Corsairs are perfect units to make old cav into Dark Riders though, a reasonable cheap conversion unit that gives any unit that has a lance and shield a hand crossbow, and a nice cloaked body and elven head.

[Boar]

Corsairs (with both blades) deal 4,17 wounds per unit of 10, so if they are lucky (or opponent is unlucky on saves) they can kill one Throggoth.  Halberdiers f.ex. gets 4,33 (due to bonus to hit at 10 models), and Endrinriggers deal on average 3,33 wounds per standard 3 model unit (and yes both of them have rend and any luck on side of Riggers with damge rolls will be devastating, but still).

And now corsairs get buff to hit starting from 15 models, not 20, have better save against shooting and buff of fleetmaster is also better. And they are pointed the same as before from what I have seen. Could be worse.

 

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

I'm thinking about making a more human-focused army for Anvilguard, with blocks of Freeguild supported by Darkshards and Sorceress magic. What Corsairs I have will be there to grab objectives and tap away with their crossbows. Since it's Anvilguard I'll be able to bring a Kharibdyss or two (what's the plural of Kharibdyss?).

Thoughts?

Edited October 8, 2019 by Thalassic Monstrosity

[Greed]

7 hours ago, Kaleun said:

Will I think of this that you are going to have a great themed army. The low wound - count heros can finally be protected by units. That is great. Now from a Scourge Privateer Players persepective I can tell you that the army will look absolutly gorgeous BUT doesnt do damage. 

The main thing about Corsairs and also the chariots and the Kharibdyss is that you get wounds for a cheap price, but thats it. You might want to take as many models as you can, because you will win over objectives (Corsairs). If you want to harm your opponent you need something else. 

We saw a Scourge Privateer army already on a tournament (aos shorts). It had many models, but didnt make it to a winning place or even the top 10 (?). We have a book now, but the problems of the army didnt change. You will want sources of damage for the army. 

For damage we could pick some Dreadlords on Black Dragon? Maybe 2 with Drakenblood curses and 2 relicts? Or hide an Assassine for Mortal Sound Spam. We could give the Kharibdyss the possibility to reduce bravery by 3! Add some Dark Riders and its -4! 

I think there are some ways for a an Anvilgard army to shine now. 

[CB42]

On 10/4/2019 at 9:37 PM, Ignatius "Nate" T said:

Their shooting is nothing to write home about, but that's not what they are really there for.

WHAT.

Guys.

6 Scourgerunner Chariots, for 300 points, have 8 shots at 3/3/-1/D3, 4 shots at 2/3/-1/D3, 16 shots at 5/4/-/1 and 8 shots at 4/4/-/1. That’s comparable to 24 Freeguild Handgunners standing still plus 9 Freeguild Crossbowmen standing still, and you can do that while moving. So you’re already comparable to or better than other shooting. And you can do that while moving 12”!

But wait, there’s more!

Against monsters while in the battalion, you get +1 to wound, and also 6s to hit deal D3 mortal wounds! This is designed to take down monsters, and on average, 6 Chariots in the battalion shoot down a Keeper of a Secrets in one turn.

But wait, there’s more!

You also get 36 wounds for 300 points - better than the 30 wounds for 300 points that Handgunners get.

But wait, there’s more!

You get 36 melee attacks at 4/4 or 4/5, much better than, say, Freeguild crossbowmen - who get 30 melee attacks at 5/5.

Scourgerunner Chariots are so much better at shooting, melee, tanking, and mobility than most other Free Cities shooting - and we get a battalion that buffs them even more! Please, guys, get excited over this! I’m obviously super pumped already.

[Ignatius "Nate" T]

1 minute ago, CB42 said:

WHAT.

Guys.

6 Scourgerunner Chariots, for 300 points, have 8 shots at 3/3/-1/D3, 4 shots at 2/3/-1/D3, 16 shots at 5/4/-/1 and 8 shots at 4/4/-/1. That’s comparable to 24 Freeguild Handgunners standing still plus 9 Freeguild Crossbowmen standing still, and you can do that while moving. So you’re already comparable to or better than other shooting. And you can do that while moving 12”!

But wait, there’s more!

Against monsters while in the battalion, you get +1 to wound, and also 6s to hit deal D3 mortal wounds! This is designed to take down monsters, and on average, 6 Chariots in the battalion shoot down a Keeper of a Secrets in one turn.

But wait, there’s more!

You also get 36 wounds for 300 points - better than the 30 wounds for 300 points that Handgunners get.

But wait, there’s more!

You get 36 melee attacks at 4/4 or 4/5, much better than, say, Freeguild crossbowmen - who get 30 melee attacks at 5/5.

Scourgerunner Chariots are so much better at shooting, melee, tanking, and mobility than most other Free Cities shooting - and we get a battalion that buffs them even more! Please, guys, get excited over this! I’m obviously super pumped already.

I retract my previous statement. I’ve since given it more thought and I couldn’t agree more. They are fantastic shooters. They are fast. They are large models for area denial. And they are cheap. 

 

Scourgerunners will be featured heavily in not only anvilguard but also many other cities I imagine. 

[zilberfrid]

Just now, Ignatius "Nate" T said:

I retract my previous statement. I’ve since given it more thought and I couldn’t agree more. They are fantastic shooters. They are fast. They are large models for area denial. And they are cheap. 

 

Scourgerunners will be featured heavily in not only anvilguard but also many other cities I imagine. 

Except for the real-world cost. For UKers, get Overread's high elf chariots, they'll be a perfect stand in.

[CB42]

I’ve decided to convert most of mine. I’m normally a Chaos player and I want to keep that theme. I’m picking up:

* Tzaangor Skyfire and Black Guard as the driver / passenger

* 3 Seeker Chariots of Slaanesh (replacing the demons with the Tzaangor and Black Guard)

* 3 Khorne Bloodthrones (replacing, etc, etc, you get it)

* 3 Burning Chariots

* 3 Tuskgor Chariots

* And 3 start collecting Anvilgard will give me 3 regular Chariots.

My Hurricanum with Battlemage will be a Nighthaunt Black Coach with the ghost driver replaced by a Gaunt summoner, and on top of the carriage will be a Vortex from a Mutalith Vortex Beast.

By doing them in groups of 3, it’ll be easy to identify which unit of 3 is which. I figure with a similar paint scheme tying them all together and maybe airbrushing some Anvilgard symbols on everything, it’ll come together as a cohesive chaos anvilgard scheme.

Edited October 8, 2019 by CB42

[Ignatius "Nate" T]

13 minutes ago, CB42 said:

I’ve decided to convert most of mine. I’m normally a Chaos player and I want to keep that theme. I’m picking up:

* Tzaangor Skyfire and Black Guard as the driver / passenger

* 3 Seeker Chariots of Slaanesh (replacing the demons with the Tzaangor and Black Guard)

* 3 Khorne Bloodthrones (replacing, etc, etc, you get it)

* 3 Burning Chariots

* 3 Tuskgor Chariots

* And 3 start collecting Anvilgard will give me 3 regular Chariots.

My Hurricanum with Battlemage will be a Nighthaunt Black Coach with the ghost driver replaced by a Gaunt summoner, and on top of the carriage will be a Vortex from a Mutalith Vortex Beast.

By doing them in groups of 3, it’ll be easy to identify which unit of 3 is which. I figure with a similar paint scheme tying them all together and maybe airbrushing some Anvilgard symbols on everything, it’ll come together as a cohesive chaos anvilgard scheme.

All I’ll say is you better post pictures. 

[Lou_Cypher]

So uh.... potentially a very powerful combination but what do people think of this?

Sorceress for sacrificial duties.

Umbral Spellportal. Empowered by Ulgu so it can be placed anywhere.

+

Vitriolic Spray to strip anything of its armor save.

 

An unlimited range save negation that can be used by anything with a lot of weak attacks. Or better yet, fine long range low-quality shooting. Dark shards with run and shoot maybe?

[CB42]

59 minutes ago, Lou_Cypher said:

So uh.... potentially a very powerful combination but what do people think of this?

Sorceress for sacrificial duties.

Umbral Spellportal. Empowered by Ulgu so it can be placed anywhere.

+

Vitriolic Spray to strip anything of its armor save.

 

An unlimited range save negation that can be used by anything with a lot of weak attacks. Or better yet, fine long range low-quality shooting. Dark shards with run and shoot maybe?

Yeah, I’m planning on using a Celestial Hurricanum with battlemage to cast Spellportal, and sorceress plus 10 dark elf infantry to cast vitriolic spray anywhere on the board 70% of the time to go with my 14-15 scourgerunner Chariots (who can then take advantage of that lack of rend).

[Frowny]

Scourge runner chariots do seem incredible. While there are many other strong shooting options in the book, they are unique in being both very mobile and not really requiring much support, but still benefiting some if you can offer it. Hurricanum means they hit characters on 2s.... Anvilguard may be the weakest for them ironically compared to healing 1w/ turn in living city or +1 wound in tempest eye.

Their only major downside is the number of drops they add to your list. They also have quite big bases which can be a strength but might also be a weakness in some situations.

I'm wondering if chariot spam is in fact very strong. I'm going to convert myself 5 and see if I like them...

[JackStreicher]

I‘ve tested AG today (again) and Imo it‘s one of the two worst armies in the book (and the game as a whole), the only one being worse is Phoenicium.

why? No synergies, no artefacts or spells directly supporting your units. 
the battallion is the worst and Corsairs are worst than ghouls in every way. Even the Command Traits don‘t buff the army. 
they tried to make this army pirate and monster focused at which it failed: other armies have better Corsairs and Monsters since they can actually buff them! Though all this army has is only to the benefit of the person carrying it it still doesn‘t buff enough to make any choice apart from Dtormcasts worthwhile since this entire City lacks synergy, damage, tankiness and THOUGHT. You can use this army for alphastrike shooting with the spell mirrors and the „you have no armor no more“ spell - And that‘s it!

So goodbye Anvilgard, I‘ll rather stick to tempest‘s eye where all my units can receive actual buffs & agility with a battallion that does not force me to pick 5/6 rubbish units.

so long.

Edited October 11, 2019 by JackStreicher

[Furuzzolo]

I mean, that's some bold statement 15 days into the book without tournament data behind but ok... See ya in tempest eye, @JackStreicher !🤗

To me the city looks good, gonna try with a human-centric build: hurricanum, a couple of mages, some guard, some handgunner, the spellportal+"nosave" combo and 6 demigryph + Griffon General to turn1 charge the unit with no save.

The magic should flow kinda like this:

Spell portal, "debuff spell", wildform on demigryph.

Depending on starting distance and scenario that should be a crippling opening against every list that rely on a single, big, unit.

Edited October 11, 2019 by Furuzzolo

[SwampHeart]

13 hours ago, JackStreicher said:

I‘ve tested AG today (again) and Imo it‘s one of the two worst armies in the book (and the game as a whole), the only one being worse is Phoenicium.

why? No synergies, no artefacts or spells directly supporting your units. 
the battallion is the worst and Corsairs are worst than ghouls in every way. Even the Command Traits don‘t buff the army. 
they tried to make this army pirate and monster focused at which it failed: other armies have better Corsairs and Monsters since they can actually buff them! Though all this army has is only to the benefit of the person carrying it it still doesn‘t buff enough to make any choice apart from Dtormcasts worthwhile since this entire City lacks synergy, damage, tankiness and THOUGHT. You can use this army for alphastrike shooting with the spell mirrors and the „you have no armor no more“ spell - And that‘s it!

So goodbye Anvilgard, I‘ll rather stick to tempest‘s eye where all my units can receive actual buffs & agility with a battallion that does not force me to pick 5/6 rubbish units.

so long.

Oh heyyyy! You're that dude in the WhatsApp who plays at 1850 and makes proclamations on army viability after one game. 

[Myrdin]

On 10/3/2019 at 2:27 AM, Kaleun said:

Anvilguard from Aqshy has the following artefacts from Malign Portents:

Aqshy

• Weapons

1. Ruby Ring. In your hero phase, you can pick the nearest enemy unit within 18" and a die. On a 5+, you do D3 mortal wounds. If two units are equally close, pick one.

2. Magmaforged Blade. Pick one melee weapon. If the wound roll for that weapon is 6+, that attack inflicts 1 mortal wound in addition to its normal damage.

3. Magmadroth Blood Vials. In your shooting phase, pick an enemy unit within 8" and roll a die. 4+ do 1 mortal wound.

4. Purefire Brazier. In your shooting phase, roll a die for each enemy unit within 9". On a 5+ do 1 mortal wound to that unit.

5. Onyx Blade. Pick one melee weapon. It gets +1 to-wound.

6. Exile Torch. At the start of the combat phase, pick an enemy hero within 3" and roll a die. On a 6+, that hero takes a mortal wound and may not fight or be chosen as the target of an attack.

• Relics

1. Essence of Vulcatrix. Once per battle, at the start of your hero phase. Roll a die. On a 1, take D3 mortal wounds. On a 2+, get +1 to hit and wound until next hero phase.

2. Thermalrider Cloak. +4" Movement and can fly.

3. Smouldering Helm. During the combat phase, each save of 6+ deals 1 mortal wound to the attacker.

4. Ignax's Scales. Negate mortal wounds on a 4+.

5. Crown of Flames. +1 Bravery to allies wholly within 9".

6. Cleansing Brooch. Once per battle, at the start of the hero phase, you can heal D3.

 

 

-> Also Assassines could be a thing to boost the Damage output of certain units if needed. There are some nice artefacts for the assassin like the Ghyrstrike (Pick a melee weapon to be: +1 to hit and wound), if you make the Assassins origin from city compatible with Ghyran. This would result in 6 attacks hit and wound on 2+ with -1 rend and D3 mortal wounds per 6 on hit. 

Wait...I am a little confused here, are you not limited to only those pitiful 3 artifacts and 3 trait each of the Cities have ? Where did you get the list of these items from ? I thought each realm offered only a single artifact for you to pick from so I tend to skip them completely (since our group does tend to ignore playing the Realms for casual games).

 

@CB42 Love the way you described the chariots ! If you would be a salesman good Sir, consider me Sold on this idea !   

No really though, I too think those chariots are pretty darn nice. fast, durable shooty platform that can easily capture and hold objectives. And the price is fantastic as well. I found myself shimming one almost in every list I drafted simply because there is no other unit in the entire book that costs 60pts ! (and they DO things for those 60 pts unlike filler units in some other armies).

Edited October 11, 2019 by Myrdin

[SwampHeart]

16 minutes ago, Myrdin said:

Wait...I am a little confused here, are you not limited to only those pitiful 3 artifacts and 3 trait each of the Cities have ? Where did you get the list of these items from ? I thought each realm offered only a single artifact for you to pick from so I tend to skip them completely (since our group does tend to ignore playing the Realms for casual games).

You are allowed to choose a realm your army is from and there is a list of relics in Malign Sorcery for each realm - you get to choose from that list of relics regardless of what realm your game is being played in. Most tournaments use these rules even if they don't use any other realm rules (realm features, spells, etc.). These are technically optional rules but the vast majority of organized AoS allows Realm Artifacts even though they don't use other realm rules.  

[JackStreicher]

3 hours ago, SwampHeart said:

Oh heyyyy! You're that dude in the WhatsApp who plays at 1850 and makes proclamations on army viability after one game. 

Oh hey you are the guy that didn‘t read that it wasn‘t the first game 😉

[SwampHeart]

Just now, JackStreicher said:

Oh hey you are the guy that didn‘t read that it wasn‘t the first game 😉

No but I did read the army list and that's about all I need to read  

[JackStreicher]

Just now, SwampHeart said:

No but I did read the army list and that's about all I need to read  

😂🤣 sure, a friendly game army speaks tomes of knowledge 🤣😂

you were also that guy who suggested that AG would work with a one-trick pony which relies on too many spells actually succeeding. That‘s all I need to know beardling 😉

[SwampHeart]

13 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

😂🤣 sure, a friendly game army speaks tomes of knowledge 🤣😂

you were also that guy who suggested that AG would work with a one-trick pony which relies on too many spells actually succeeding. That‘s all I need to know beardling 😉

I didn't even respond in the WhatsApp (I haven't typed in WA since I joined). But I do think its fair to go ahead and show everyone the list you were running:

-Assassin
-Fleetmaster - General, Asyphixa Censer, Dabblings in Sorcery
-Dreadlord on Blackdragon - Venomfang Blade, Jutting Bones, Exile Blade
-Sorceress - Sap Strength
-Sorceress - Vitriolic Spray 
-20 Corsairs
-20 Darkshards
-20 Dreadspears
-1 Scourge Runner
-1 War hydra
-10 Black Guard
-10 Black Guard
-10 Shadow Warriors
-Malevolent Maelstrom
-Quicksilver Swords

I'll let everyone else be the judge on if the above list actually constitutes the kind of list you'd actually play if you wanted to play Anvilguard. 

Oh and I'd suggest taking a 2nd look at the portal combo and on how to set it up. Against any non Seraphon army it basically requires you to roll 2 results of a 6+ on 2 casting rolls - not exactly an unreliable set up. 

[RuneBrush]

+++ MOD HAT +++

Not particularly impressed with the attitude of some of the posts in this thread - please check what you've typed before posting folks.

[CB42]

Taking a step back from all the anger, I think writing off Anvilgard the city as uncompetitive after using a very, very uncompetitive list is probably wrong - you can make an uncompetitive Slaanesh list or an uncompetitive Skaven or Daughters of khaine list, and that wouldn’t mean that the factions are bad - it means your list doesn’t utilize the strengths of those factions.

 

The two main power points we get out of Anvilgard are Vitriolic Spray through spell portal and Scourgerunner Chariots in the battalion. The posted list had neither of those. There are other things that are good to have, but those two things are what you build around when you want to take down a tournament.

 

 

And I do think Anvilgard has the potential to build tournament winning lists. I’m planning on switching from slaanesh to anvilgard once my Chariots, Hurricanum, Corsairs, and heroes are assembled because I believe in the strength of Anvilgard.

 

Edited October 11, 2019 by CB42

[Myrdin]

6 minutes ago, CB42 said:

Uncompetitive  Daughters of khaine list, and that wouldn’t mean that the factions are bad - it means your list was bad.

And I do think Anvilgard has the potential to build tournament winning lists. I’m planning on switching from slaanesh to anvilgard once my Chariots, Hurricanum, Corsairs, and heroes are assembled because I believe in the strength of Anvilgard.

 

Would that list include lots of Melusai Stalkers and Khinerai Lifetakers, with 400pts points of allied Drakespawn cavalry in the mix ?

(I love all 3 of the mentioned units, but darn they are not good haha. Especially the Lifetakers are just painful, despite how cool they look)

On another note > I really wish you best of luck on getting that crazy Tomb King.... errr Anvilgard chariots army up and ready. Make sure to play Mad Max Fury Road music whenever you roll out onto the field

Edited October 11, 2019 by Myrdin