AoS 2 - Sylvaneth Discussion

[Deja vu]

Quote

Yeah that is fine, bring her out she is awesome, Vlad nica is top rated sylvaneth player in the US and she is in all his lists. 

 

I may try that. I always mess with my models. My Durthu has the back branches of all 3 treelords.  Its not that I am trying to get any kind of advantage I just like havving things "over the top".  I am thinking of using the Aethervoid Pendulum as my Durthu weapon. I think it might look cool 

 

[Ching Wing]

Post a picture of it if you end up doing that haha that sounds cool!

19 minutes ago, Deja vu said:

 

I may try that. I always mess with my models. My Durthu has the back branches of all 3 treelords.  Its not that I am trying to get any kind of advantage I just like havving things "over the top".  I am thinking of using the Aethervoid Pendulum as my Durthu weapon. I think it might look cool 

 

 

[Craze]

9 hours ago, IndigoGirls said:

The change is in GBH18, I believe someone posted the exact change wording earlier in the forum. I believe the wording is the same as suffocating gravetide only units can't be the targets of attacks (whereas gravetide counts as cover).

There is a change to the Citadel Wood warscroll...is this also applicable to Wyldwoods?

[ppetford]

I had thought it wouldn’t. Waiting to see if it come up on an FAQ. My thinking is that you only ever use 1 warscroll for a model - not a combination of 2

[tea_wild_owl]

5 hours ago, Ching Wing said:

He was very specific, you can choose each round of battle which one she will use. He has also played against the #1 ranked sylvaneth player in the US who plays it like this. Not to mention the TO for SoCal open and broadside bash(two major tournaments) agree with this as well. 

Either way I’ll be playing it like this haha I just posting this so people don’t limit themselves and on how awesome drycha is. 

her swarm weapon choice is an "either...or", so you have to choose one that will be fixed for the whole fight. the only thing that changes inbetween rounds is her mood, which effects which weapon can refill ones, but she still keeps the same swarm.

[Sigwarus]

Ching wing : It doesn't matter how top ranked your friends are, just read the warscroll. It's clearly a matter of choice and not a two in one. If it matters to you I am also a top ranked Sylvaneth player who would love your friend to be right but he/she isn't. 

[Amradiel]

I have a Drycha who does not have any creatures on her. I have them on separate small round bases next to her to show what I am using. Is this "ok"? Of course the base have no use and never gets in the way or anything. 

[Yoshiya]

47 minutes ago, tea_wild_owl said:

her swarm weapon choice is an "either...or", so you have to choose one that will be fixed for the whole fight. the only thing that changes inbetween rounds is her mood, which effects which weapon can refill ones, but she still keeps the same swarm.

Yea, the wording is exactly the same as pretty much every other unit in the game. Either swarm OR flies. If that allowed you to take both then you'd see people running around with kurnoth hunters shooting arrows from their scythes that have swords attached to the bottom.

[Lanoss]

12 hours ago, Ching Wing said:

Hunters are really good with exception to bow hunters imo which are just okay, Ive played several games with them and was never impressed and with new rules they are even more underwhelming, 

the sycthes are my go to since they have the extra reach as well as -2 rend they can do some major damage.

I went to a tournament last weekend and summoned a free unit of bow hunters... never again will I do that haha. Summon anything other than them. It was the only game I lost and they did absolutely nothing. 

I’m a bit gutted now this edition with 6 bow hunters that just won’t be used...

i also wish now I had built my Drycha with no bugs on her to use her as either 

[ppetford]

Regarding Hunters, I still really like Bow Hunters. I’m planning to use them as objective campers. Able to be fairly tanky, still put out a ranged threat and do some damage without having to move them up the board (I’ve got a Durthu / Drycha for that)

[romhi]

When I first started sylvaneth I read a forum post somewhere that gave me the idea to magnetize/glue the extra unused weapons to the back of the hunters. Now my bow hunters all got a sword or a scythe and my melee hunters have a bow magnetized to their waist or back. My local community does not frown too much on a bit of proxy play so they would not mind anyway but it still looks better this way and no opponent can nag me about it either.

 My Drycha was put together in a similar fashion. I glued up a few bugs from both variety and painted the to be extra distinguishable.

[Popisdead]

12 hours ago, IndigoGirls said:

In your variant of Dreadwood are you not taking TLA? Or are you taking 6 hunters, Drycha, Durthu, TLA? 9 hunters plus the other two prohibits you from taking TLA.

I have taken a TLA, I only take 6 Hunters.  I think my list was Durthu, 6 hunters, Drycha, TLA, dryads and TRs?

[IndigoGirls]

12 hours ago, Richelieu said:

Well, their eminence within the community notwithstanding, they are all wrong, and if you're playing strict WYSIWYG like most tournaments, she has to be modeled with the correct weapon choice.  

Thank you... it seems fairly obvious that you choose one weapon going into the battle and that's what she is stuck with. Whether or not you can change between tournament rounds I've never considered.

13 hours ago, Richelieu said:

If your opponent had a low wound count and a bunched up army you can send her in and bust out 20 mortals.  Or if a key hero isn't bubble wrapped, send in Durthu to assassinate them.

Out of curiosity, in your Dreadwood experience do you drop the TLA and go all in on the ambush (bunch of kurnoths, durthu, and drycha)? I really want to rock Alarielle in Dreadwood but am starting to think that may not be ideal...

[Richelieu]

1 hour ago, IndigoGirls said:

Out of curiosity, in your Dreadwood experience do you drop the TLA and go all in on the ambush (bunch of kurnoths, durthu, and drycha)? I really want to rock Alarielle in Dreadwood but am starting to think that may not be ideal...

My Sylvaneth experience is list building with a clubmate and then playing against his Sylvaneth, so my perspective is one of "what would I be afraid of?"

I love alarielle in Dreadwood because you aren't as negatively impacted by rolling only a single stratagem as you are with Durthu.  You can move 3 units, two of them to take up strategic positions and Alarielle to bust up an enemy line.

[IndigoGirls]

@Richelieu interesting experience perspective and thank you for the opinion!

To add a different gaming ideology (TCGs) I see Alarielle in Dreadwood as similar an important piece of a midrange deck (same as the new branchwraith). She has to be one of Sylvaneth's most point efficient models, additionally she allows the Dreadwood player flexibility to pick any option from the table. In an all-comers list that flexibility seems key. I'm happy to see that you think she has a place in the battalion, at this point I just need to keep playing my list against different armies and refine it if problems creep up.

[Richelieu]

8 minutes ago, IndigoGirls said:

@Richelieu interesting experience perspective and thank you for the opinion!

To add a different gaming ideology (TCGs) I see Alarielle in Dreadwood as similar an important piece of a midrange deck (same as the new branchwraith). She has to be one of Sylvaneth's most point efficient models, additionally she allows the Dreadwood player flexibility to pick any option from the table. In an all-comers list that flexibility seems key. I'm happy to see that you think she has a place in the battalion, at this point I just need to keep playing my list against different armies and refine it if problems creep up.

Alarielle-goyf.  I was always a tempo player and I am in AoS too.  I play a losing game calculated to last just long enough to win on objectives.  I am frequently nearly tabled in my victories.

[IndigoGirls]

@Lanoss Don't be gutted by your 6 bow hunters! I agree with @ppetford I think they still have legitimate uses! As he already said, they are great for objective holding while applying pressure from range. I already posted thoughts earlier on the new LOS rule combined with their pretty sketchy hit rolls.  I'll re-post my thoughts here.

1. I've got a vital enemy hero low on hp but not dead I'm happy to shoot everything into them with bows to finish the job.

2. They help influence and predict enemy movement. If you have a pure melee army (or very limited shooting) then enemy heroes can (basically) run around and not worry about LOS. With bows, the enemy has to think about the placement of their hero and your 30" snipers.

3. They help cripple certain behemoths. Example, shooting into a maw'krusha to bring down its move characteristic is a good use of their time. Shooting into a thundertusk to reduce its mortal wound output is a good use of time. The list goes on.

4. They can clear objectives/units that are otherwise a pain to close out on. Lets say it's a mirror match and the enemy is holding an objective with 5 spite revs. I'm happy to take my bows and try to shoot them off to stop scoring on that point.  Or if I'm playing against a Slann who can teleport around the board, I like the thought of being able to hit him almost wherever he runs.

I could continue this list but I think my point is clear. Are they the small hero killers they used to be? Probably not. Do they still fulfill some situationally vital roles? I'd like to think that they do. Generally, I don't think I'll include the bows in my list (my list simply needs more damage than they can provide) but I can see myself bringing in 3 with Alarielle in certain match ups. Kurnoth bow hunters were the model that made me fall in love with Sylvaneth (not Scythes or Swords) so maybe I'm biased but those are my thoughts

P.S. IF your bows aren't painted up, it is very easy to remove just their arms and swap out for a melee weapon. Pick up some debonder (I prefer bob smith industries), apply a solid amount to the army joint, wait ~5-10 minutes, take your exacto knife working it into the armpit groove, and give it a good wiggle. If they don't pop the first time repeat the steps and eventually they will come off. Worked like a charm for me but three of mine were only primed (I still have some kurnoths with bows).

[Lanoss]

I totally agree with you! Thanks for your input

i suppose I’d just regret having 6(!) bow Hunters now instead of the more effective scythe or sword hunters...

[Craze]

I would like to ask the question about Wyldwoods again: Has there been any change on how they work and if yes, where can I find the rulings?

[Kaylethia]

7 hours ago, Craze said:

I would like to ask the question about Wyldwoods again: Has there been any change on how they work and if yes, where can I find the rulings?

The change was that Citadel Woods now have a warscroll, where you don't have line of sight if it goes over 1" of the Wood. I've been playing the Wyldwood warscroll without extra abilites, since the wording has Citadel Wood models without keyword bold, while the Wyldwood warscroll itself hasn't been changed.

[Thughab]

I run a similar list but have 30 dryads, 10 dryads, 10 tree revs and  geminids of uhl-gysh. I then summon hunters with bows to snipe characters.

[AWFall]

I have a bunch of trees in a cupboard from a few years ago that I'm going to renovate for 2nd edition. Planning to try a monster-mash style Gnarlroot list, something along these lines:

Alarielle

Spirit of Durthu

Treelord Ancient

Branchwych

Branchwraith

3x 5 Tree Revenants

Household

Gnarlroot Wargrove

90 points left over for Endless Spells/other stuff. May end up dropping the Durthu for 2x 3 Kurnoth Hunters, or at least trying it that way at some point.

What I'd like to talk about, mostly, is the customisation choices on the two treelords. More specifically, if you're doing something like this - where the basic plan is to have the three behemoths working together - is it worth using your artefacts to make them as tough as possible to mundane damage (Gnarled Warrior+Oaken Armour on one, Ethereal Amulet on the other for example), to try and get as much damage as possible (Ghyrstrike on the Durthu), or try to hedge against the army's obvious massive weakness by running some kind of spell/mortal wound protection (Ignax's Scales, Lens of Refraction or Spellmirror)?

I think all of them are valid in one way or another, but curious what opinions people have.

Edited July 19, 2018 by AWFall

[Darkundo]

16 minutes ago, AWFall said:

. More specifically, if you're doing something like this - where the basic plan is to have the three behemoths working together - is it worth using your artefacts to make them as tough as possible to mundane damage (Gnarled Warrior+Oaken Armour on one, Ethereal Amulet on the other for example), to try and get as much damage as possible (Ghyrstrike on the Durthu), or try to hedge against the army's obvious massive weakness by running some kind of spell/mortal wound protection (Ignax's Scales, Lens of Refraction or Spellmirror)?

 

I am wondering about the same matter.  Seriously can' t figure if it better to equip Durthu with a Ghyrstrike or use the Aethereal Amulet to make my trees even more resistant.  I will play them soon and will try both the solutions 

Edit: does some known the sizes of our wildwoods? I wanna try to make theme by myown,  but need the sizes. 

Edited July 19, 2018 by Darkundo

[IndigoGirls]

@Kaylethia I've been playing it with the citadel wood rules as the wyldwood warscroll say a wyldwood consists of 1-3 citadel woods. I  see it going either way I've just taken it as a wyldwood is a combination of citadel woods. Not sure if there is an official rule to help clarify this. Pulling info from another scroll feels wrong.

[Aezeal]

Played my gnarlroot list which I posted above (gnarlroot, alarielle, 3 hunters and 30 dryads and gemenids, pendulum and balewind) against stormcast: a mix of shooty (with that new artillery thing 5 judicators and 3 of the new shooty guys )and the new mage on gryphthing and 2x 5 retributors and also 5 liberators, castellant and relictor.

It was an easy gameprimarily due to me rolling above average and him rolling FAR below average so it's not easy to draw conclusions from it but I'll try. We also played the first battleplan which is about causing wounds and no location based objectives which would make a pretty big difference too I guess.

- I think in general this list was a very favorable match up for sylvaneth: he had some shooters doing damage first turn - which I healed he also has an army which - like us has high saves (and pays for that of course) so with less damage output than say bloodbound. But since I had the ability to deal quite some damage with spell ignoring his armor and he couldnt'do that the other way around I had a clear advantage. And while both armies are about as tough the amount of healing gnarlroot + alarielle has really meant that I could heal about every wound he put in anything non battleline in the first turns and even resurrect a few revenants (he kill 3 of 5 in 2 turns which I healed back right away). My experience is that bloodbound dies faster but does more damage too and they kill units before I can heal them and his damage was quite a bit short of doing that (especially with these bad dice he had but I think in an average game it would be about the same).

- Alarielle is as strong as she was and her rend 2 is golden against these guys (while it would be way less needed against say those blood bound). The summon of the treelord is strong (well I actually didn't use him at all due to my opponents terrible dice rolls... but he'd have certainly helped if that wasn't the case. When I played Alarielle last year I alsway though she wasn't THAT bad but maybe slightly overpriced... now with 240 extra points she is just very good. She was the MVP by far... with my ace rolls she could have done about 40 damage in combat in 2 combat phases (but more than half of it was overkill). In addition to that her spell was a great start in sniping characters (doing 3-5 MW means 1-2 other spells finish characters).

- The branchwraith is ofc also an autoinclude in every army. It's nice that her summon is a spell so you can't abuse it, no use in spamming your wraiths which means it's just one of those things which slightly increase the competetiveness of our army (which was subpar last year) but not too much. 

- Especially in a gnarlroot list I look favorably at the endless spells. As I mentioned before start 2017 I played gnarlroot where I could cast 7 spells and OFTEN ended up not even casting 4.. now I have 9 possible casts and used 6-7 nearly every turn due to the option of casting these spells too. Also they punish an enemy for bunching up troops: He got his reserves on one of my flanks (first rode the wind with his mage on gryphbeast towards my line and teleported the 2x5 retributors and the relictor at 9"of my lines all together). while the somewhat limited movement and space didnt'allow me to hit 3 units but spells could easily be aimed at a character and an adjecent unit I often ended up saying the geminids would make a small U-turn over the front of the base of his units and then end up right in front of them. Using these spells for character sniping worked well - cover = I don't care / look out sir = I don't care.. ofcourse range is a bit limited so backline buffers might still be a problem but on the other hand Alarielle or a gnarled warrior oaken armor TLA should in general (depending on enemy units) not be that afraid to get closer to enemy lines. The fact he only had one caster which he lost in turn 2 helped my magic game ofcourse.. but not all armies are magic heavy so I think it's not really a rare matchup to face only 1.