The Rumour Thread

[pnkdth]

Nexon? Oof. Not exactly inspiring confidence. They could surprise us but I'm expecting mobile-like P2W hub based multiplayer gatcha game. I'm hope I am wrong but this company (Nexon) are known for their egregious P2W systems and, more worryingly, often go after known franchises and games and exploit their loyalty for their own gain. They usually start out slow (so their reviews won't tank) and then ramp up the P2W nonsense to 11.

 

[CommissarRotke]

1 hour ago, Marcvs said:

To be clear, I am not discussing what I personally want or like, but more like (wild) "predictions". So, I don't disagree with your points but I still see it happening, the pull of the market must be huge. If I had to bet: focus on a single warzone (of continental or planet scale) with some limitation in the roster and in the playable factions. Flying units already exist in TWW so a couple of flyers sprinkled in should be fine. No naval or space combat.

my apologies, i should have specified I wasn't responding directly to you. If it was one planet's ground combat warzone I could see it kind of working, but there's still the entire issue of cover and modern combat not using ranked marching or firing. It would probably be a completely different type of TW game.

58 minutes ago, LordSolarMach said:

In an interview (with Rookery Publications, around the 1:03 mark) Andy Hall was asked "Lore wise, the 40k universe is probably even broader than Warhammer Fantasy, but can the gameplay loop be adapted to Total War, do you reckon?"

His response was "*shrugs* 'dunno... 'dunno."

It was not quite a "no comment", and maybe I'm reading too much into it, but considering that he mostly gave thoughtful answers to other questions it seemed like a dodge.

oof, even if it's him shrugging on a question he gets asked 40 times a week... he says something that gets cut off by laughing, but I could see it being a dodge as his team is the fantasy team (and thus not related but he knows of other projects)

[The Lost Sigmarite]

1 hour ago, MothmanDraws said:

TBH I think a major issue for AOS video games is they all take the graphic style of launch aos, everything's too vibrant and plastic looking, It doesnt help that they also go with hammers of sigmar which I think is the weakest colour scheme, all gold armour looks bad in animation, especially if its shiny and done in a lower fidelity game.  Cities of sigmar would do better as protags for a AOS strategy game I feel.

If they want to attract to the setting using stormcast I legit think going down the "stormcast are basically dark souls undead heroes" and have a 3rd person action game of some stormcast dude being sent to investigate some frontier Cities of sigmar town that has gone dark, when he dies he just reforges and deep strikes back in.

atm a AOS video game has to fight against the still held wider view of "aos is baby setting that they blew old world up for", I dont think bright and vibrant is a good choice.

This. This is 100% pure facts right there.

I looked at the screenshot from Frontier up above in the last page and the first thought that crossed into my mind was "damn it's the launch of 1st edition SCE. Wished they had gone with thunderstrike stormcast instead." And then I read this, I agree with everything on it, and it makes me a bit anxious for the game.
AoS as a tabletop game and hobby has grown leagues ahead of what WHFB ever achieved, but in the derived products genre AoS has a lot of catching up to do. I don't want the AoS RTS to fail. It has to succeed imo. But I feel like the odds are a bit stacked against it. It's Frontier's 1st RTS, so they're not very experienced in that matter (even if they can port elements from management sims which they're much more versed into), the art direction... is AoS 1, the game has the fight against the wider held view of AoS. 

I wouldn't even be surprised if TWW players/WHFB gatekeepers start a smear campaign against it. I really hope it's not gonna happen. But with Frontier and their good track record, I think it's in good hands. If it's a RTS in the image of the tabletop game, fun, accessible, varied and easy to learn but hard to master, it could be great. 

[zilberfrid]

59 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

In an era of Souls-like clones and how common they are from AA/BBB studios I'm shocked we've not seen one set in a Warhammer IP yet. AoS in-particular seems tailor made a setting for one.

A soulsborne game sounds awesome, but building out Soulbound into a Planescape-like party based crpg is my dream (but with free choice of making character).

Edited May 19, 2023 by zilberfrid

[Ferban]

1 hour ago, MothmanDraws said:

atm a AOS video game has to fight against the still held wider view of "aos is baby setting that they blew old world up for", I dont think bright and vibrant is a good choice.

I'm sure there are many people who agree, but I just wanted to provide a quick counterpoint.  In 40k, the tagline is about it being "only war." Its dark and there aren't really any good guys.  I know people for whom that is a big turnoff.  

But AoS is more hopeful.  Yes, most lands have been blighted by chaos and there are many, many bad guys (even much of the Order pantheon is filled with what should be considered bad guys).  But the Stormcast have thrown off some of the tyranny of Chaos and the Cities are actually attempting to expand.  It's far more hopeful.  It's blood and war now, but the fight is to secure prosperity and peace.  I think rising to a nobler ideal is going to call out to some gamers more than grimdarkness will.  

[DinoJon]

2 hours ago, Matrindur said:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/19/from-savages-to-spacefarers-who-are-the-slann-starmasters/

Just a Slann fluff article but that could mean we may still get the Seraphon release before 40k 10th?

More than likely yes? There are not many releases left on the calendar that could be before 10th and I think this article and also Artis Opis oopsidoodling 2 Seraphon painting tutorials that were supposed to be published the 28th is a good indicator. 

[CommissarRotke]

40 minutes ago, The Lost Sigmarite said:

But I feel like the odds are a bit stacked against it

if people stop jumping on the "game's dead" bandwagon before new games (who are usually trying something new) are even released then this wouldn't really be a problem? but look what's happening: we barely know anything, we have one screenshot, and already even people here are maligning the game. because it... has colors? IDK about you, but I hate when it hurts my eyes trying to parse a game/movie/show due to desaturated colors and bad lighting. You need to be able to see all of the units distinctly and quickly in an RTS game. It needs to have proper lighting and colorations to parse all of the information. Especially if you have competitive modes! DOW1 did this slightly (proper lightning for the grimness), but the 2nd was far better about it.

Frontier could easily have Thunderstrike alongside Liberators. There could easily be darker maps. The story can still be grim.

Like I get it has been a while, but DOW's 3d models absolutely felt and looked like plastic! That was actually kind of the point, since it included an army painter! And we all loved the game for it. So what's different now?

[Asbestress]

4 minutes ago, CommissarRotke said:

if people stop jumping on the "game's dead" bandwagon before new games (who are usually trying something new) are even released then this wouldn't really be a problem? but look what's happening: we barely know anything, we have one screenshot, and already even people here are maligning the game. because it... has colors? IDK about you, but I hate when it hurts my eyes trying to parse a game/movie/show due to desaturated colors and bad lighting. You need to be able to see all of the units distinctly and quickly in an RTS game. It needs to have proper lighting and colorations to parse all of the information. Especially if you have competitive modes! DOW1 did this slightly (proper lightning for the grimness), but the 2nd was far better about it.

Frontier could easily have Thunderstrike alongside Liberators. There could easily be darker maps. The story can still be grim.

Like I get it has been a while, but DOW's 3d models absolutely felt and looked like plastic! That was actually kind of the point, since it included an army painter! And we all loved the game for it. So what's different now?

Yeah, I don't see how this
 

Spoiler

Is somehow more plasticy/bad looking than this

Spoiler

Or this
 

Spoiler

 

Yes, the metal is shinier (could be because it's "perfect" Stormcast armour), but I don't think the colours look any more cartoony/plastic than DOW or TWW, especially for a location that most likely looks to be a swamp in Ghyran/Ghur. Perhaps a map in Shyish or a volcano interior in Aqshy could be darker?

Also, not to get my hopes up, but how often does Frontier release DLCs for their games? I'd love to get more than 3-4 factions in an AoS game for once (maybe even Cities 😛?)

[Snarff]

49 minutes ago, Ferban said:

I'm sure there are many people who agree, but I just wanted to provide a quick counterpoint.  In 40k, the tagline is about it being "only war." Its dark and there aren't really any good guys.  I know people for whom that is a big turnoff.  

That's not how it's presented in the games though. Even though they're literally fascists that commit genocide on pretty much anything non-human, the Empire are nearly always portrayed as the de facto good guys.

[Gitzdee]

This really looks like the Warhammer Quest Silver Tower mobile game. 

[Neverchosen]

2 hours ago, Twisted Firaun said:

Oh man a Soulsborne Warhammer game would be awesome.... Though I won't lie I'd only play it if we could play as a chaos faction. 

Honestly I think that the first edition of Warcry is such a simple narrative to make this work. Hero from an unnamed Chaos Tribe enters the Eight Points in serach of glory and makes their way to the Varanspire. Upon reaching it you are faced by duelling a Varanguard and if you succeed you ride alongside Archaon through the mortal realms. It is also a location with all the factions present with their own motivations. 

[CommissarRotke]

41 minutes ago, Asbestress said:

Also, not to get my hopes up, but how often does Frontier release DLCs for their games? I'd love to get more than 3-4 factions in an AoS game for once (maybe even Cities 😛?)

All of their management sim games have a bunch of DLC, with Jurassic Park's being the weakest. Planet Zoo DLC adds new/unique animals every pack, with their own animations and behaviors, as well as new building props. These usually coincide with free patches to major systems as well. I wouldn't be surprised if GW picked Frontier because of their solid post-launch content support.

[Twisted Firaun]

14 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

Honestly I think that the first edition of Warcry is such a simple narrative to make this work. Hero from an unnamed Chaos Tribe enters the Eight Points in serach of glory and makes their way to the Varanspire. Upon reaching it you are faced by duelling a Varanguard and if you succeed you ride alongside Archaon through the mortal realms. It is also a location with all the factions present with their own motivations. 

Plus the Chaos Warrior experience fulfills all four typical SoulsBorne ending narratives.

Ascend to a Higher Form of Existence at the cost of Humanity: Daemon Prince

Chose to stay human: Chaos Lord/Death

Utterly damn yourself and the world: Chaos Spawn

"Third" Option that almost everyone chooses: Varanguard.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Twisted Firaun

[Infernalslayer]

I would love to see an AOS/Fantasy RTS video game in the style of the old Dawn of War games, or Battle for Middle Earth 2 which is my favorite RTS game of all time.

[Neverchosen]

20 minutes ago, Twisted Firaun said:

Plus the Chaos Warrior experience fulfills all four typical SoulsBorne ending narratives.

Ascend to a Higher Form of Existence at the cost of Humanity: Daemon Prince

Chose to stay human: Chaos Lord/Death

Utterly damn yourself and the world: Chaos Spawn

"Third" Option that almost everyone chooses: Varanguard.

That is a great point! I am also realizing how it would also be fun to have RPG classes represented through the Warcry Warbands like Untammed Beasts for Lightly armoured Warrior, Iron Golem as heavily armoured Knight and Corvus Cabal as the best archetype bizarre bird person.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Neverchosen

[Jagged Red Lines]

3 hours ago, pnkdth said:

Nexon? Oof. Not exactly inspiring confidence. They could surprise us but I'm expecting mobile-like P2W hub based multiplayer gatcha game. I'm hope I am wrong but this company (Nexon) are known for their egregious P2W systems and, more worryingly, often go after known franchises and games and exploit their loyalty for their own gain. They usually start out slow (so their reviews won't tank) and then ramp up the P2W nonsense to 11.

 

I played one of their mobile games - Darkness Rises - for a few years, before they shut it down.

Could be just rose-tinted glasses, but it was a fantastic game. Certainly a bit pay to win in places, but you weren't locked out of content if you were F2P.

I'm pretty excited by the idea. I played  Warhammer Odyssey for a while, and it was fun to be able to play a warhammer MMO on the privy.

[RileyArlic]

7 hours ago, CommissarRotke said:

is it the problems of the gameplay or the setting itself? my non-Warhammer partner LOVES the gameplay, but for every voice line we laugh at there's 1 or 2 that we're silently cringing at. People can overlook bugs and jank more if they vibe with the game, and I can't imagine a realistic Imperium has mass appeal in the way that the dysfunctional Ubersreik 5 do.

More the gameplay, I think. Setting is gorgeous, maps are incredible, but when you sit down for a game and get DC'ed because of some bug that FatShark has yet to fix, that's frustrating. They also have been dragging their feet on introducing new classes and maps, but that's just FatShark being FatShark. That stuff will come, and the game will expand, but it's going to take another year. 

[Overread]

4 hours ago, Infernalslayer said:

I would love to see an AOS/Fantasy RTS video game in the style of the old Dawn of War games, or Battle for Middle Earth 2 which is my favorite RTS game of all time.

I also miss base-building fantasy games. Sadly since Warcraft 3 we haven't really had any big names take up the mantel and RTS needs a fairly big company to work because its quite complex. A lot of smaller firms that try often just burn out or produce something that's "ok" but really has issues. 

That said we do have Total War Warhammer and whilst you don't have the base building (although Warhammer 3 has some of that in a limited form in sieges now); you do have a huge number of super unique looking races and it looks utterly fantastic and you can face off huge armies against each other in epic battles! 

[Infernalslayer]

42 minutes ago, Overread said:

I also miss base-building fantasy games. Sadly since Warcraft 3 we haven't really had any big names take up the mantel and RTS needs a fairly big company to work because its quite complex. A lot of smaller firms that try often just burn out or produce something that's "ok" but really has issues. 

That said we do have Total War Warhammer and whilst you don't have the base building (although Warhammer 3 has some of that in a limited form in sieges now); you do have a huge number of super unique looking races and it looks utterly fantastic and you can face off huge armies against each other in epic battles! 

I gave the first 2 Total War Warhammer games a try, around a dozen hours each, but couldn't stay invested in the gameplay. The turn-based "Risk" style which is the main focus of the games is not my cup of tea. I prefer the RTS games that feature a Skirmish game option, where you can load up a map and explore it and fight on it in real time for the whole duration of the session.

At the time i get my RTS fix by playing the "Battle for Middle Earth 2" with community mods installed that add new factions and features to keep it fresh, but would love it if a Warhammer AOS RTS game was made in that style.

[Vasshpit]

1 hour ago, Infernalslayer said:

fight on it in real time

👆

This. 

[Baron Klatz]

8 hours ago, Ferban said:

But AoS is more hopeful.  Yes, most lands have been blighted by chaos and there are many, many bad guys (even much of the Order pantheon is filled with what should be considered bad guys).  But the Stormcast have thrown off some of the tyranny of Chaos and the Cities are actually attempting to expand.  It's far more hopeful.  It's blood and war now, but the fight is to secure prosperity and peace.  I think rising to a nobler ideal is going to call out to some gamers more than grimdarkness will.

Yeah, to me AoS should have a very bright art style to reflect the more upbeat “Order is actually gaining ground even at cost” setting like the main art & Soulbound art like to show:

To me this helps show that but also enhances when things do get darker either by more sinister stages(fighting in chaos tainted lands or darker realms like Shyish) the vibrant style having to go against that darkness stands out more as they clash.

Blacktalon has a great two piece scene that shows that off:

 

You don’t get that feeling in games that start gray and dark because they started that way. Even Dark Souls games like to start off in pretty bright places so that contrast is felt and when you venture into dark catacombs you long for the green fields and vibrant sunlight again.

Speaking of which, I would absolutely love that style of game. Both a Stormcast focused one using the Reforging system and a Chaos path to glory one would do wonders.

Now I probably wouldn’t actually play the Chaos one because I can’t stand that kind of evil narrative(closest I got was Overlord and the goofy minions) But I would love to see Stormcast Eternals pop up as boss-level adversaries and show their badassery in that light.

Guy took a picture of Vindictors like this and Dark Souls music immediately jumped to my ears as a phalanx bossfight that can trick you even as the 9-foot tall warriors fall because they explode in a close quarters chamber to hold off your Chaos advance:

7 hours ago, CommissarRotke said:

if people stop jumping on the "game's dead" bandwagon before new games (who are usually trying something new) are even released then this wouldn't really be a problem? but look what's happening: we barely know anything, we have one screenshot, and already even people here are maligning the game. because it... has colors?

Haha, welcome to the Zelda:Wind Waker and Final Fantasy 9 fandoms.  

Getting bashed for being the most colorful and “childish” in their respective series even though the actual stories inside them get super bleak(Wind Waker is destroyed and flooded Hyrule & FF9 is a mix of protag finding out they’re artificial beings with a short lifespan as kids alongside multiple cities being nuked) before years later they become beloved for that very aesthetic. 😄

 

[Skreech Verminking]

4 hours ago, Overread said:

I also miss base-building fantasy games. Sadly since Warcraft 3 we haven't really had any big names take up the mantel and RTS needs a fairly big company to work because its quite complex. A lot of smaller firms that try often just burn out or produce something that's "ok" but really has issues. 

That said we do have Total War Warhammer and whilst you don't have the base building (although Warhammer 3 has some of that in a limited form in sieges now); you do have a huge number of super unique looking races and it looks utterly fantastic and you can face off huge armies against each other in epic battles! 

Mmmh, it would be interesting if they went that route.

although, I do hope they don’t stop with stormcast.

 

[Skreech Verminking]

Ps: any rumors about anything skaven related goung the rounds?

[Togetak]

10 hours ago, Gitzdee said:

This really looks like the Warhammer Quest Silver Tower mobile game. 

I think maybe that's purely because it's got an ogroid and stormcast in focus, rather than anything looking like that game at all? The silver tower game looked pretty different. To me it looks more like dawn of war to me from the screenshot, which i figure it'll take a lot of inspiration from

[KingBrodd]

41 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Ps: any rumors about anything skaven related goung the rounds?

Nothing yet mate. Once Harbingers releases I think we will get a good idea about the possibilties of releases going forward in the narrative.

I want Skaven, Beasts of Chaos, Ogor Mawtribes and Fyreslayers to take centre stage in the narrative for once!!