SentinelGuy

Finally getting around to looking at the new cities and my gut feeling is that they put 5 minutes of effort into the entire CoS section. Those narcotics are weak, no spells, only 1 useful option for the general and only 3 magic items. Even the errata is a joke, just an extra useless narcotic. The only thing this city has going for it is the ability to drop a hydra or kharibdis up close. I suppose you could try 10 drakespawn knights but they're doing nothing but blocking. I'm torn as to which is worse, this or Phoenicium.

Has anyone tried the new stormkeep rules? I was wondering if getting access to slightly cheaper battle line would help out. Perhaps freeguild guard could act as better chaff/blockers than liberators? What are peoples opinions on the following list? I have a friend who really dislikes facing named characters so I'm trying to make a list without Kroak I popped in the protectors as a little extra protection for the slann. I've never used them before so not sure how effective they are really. Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals Mortal Realm: Chamon Leaders Lord-Celestant on Stardrake (500) - General - Celestine Hammer - Command Trait: Staunch Defender - Artefact: Plate of Perfect Protection - Mount Trait: Storm-winged Drakesworn Templar (420) - Tempest Axe Lord-Castellant (120) Lord-Exorcist (90) - Spell: Chain Lightning Slann Starmaster (260) - Allies Battleline 5 x Liberators (90) - Warblade & Shield 5 x Liberators (90) - Warblade & Shield 10 x Freeguild Guard (80) - Swords and Shields Units 5 x Protectors (170) - 2x Starsoul Maces 5 x Tree-Revenants (80) - Allies Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs Everblaze Comet (100) Total: 2000 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 340 / 400 Wounds: 100

Executioners are fine. The points drop makes them worth it now in my opinion. Even when you look at their damage it's not that bad.

I really like that list. If I was having a go at something similar I would probably do this - Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar - City: Hammerhal Mortal Realm: Ghyran Freeguild General on Griffon (320) - General - Shield & Runesword - Command Trait: Blood of the Twelve - Artefact: Armour of Mallus Luminark of Hysh with White Battlemage (270) - Artefact: The Twinstone - Lore of Cinder: Cindercloud Sorceress (90) - Lore of Cinder: Wings of Fire 3 x Demigryph Knights (180) 3 x Demigryph Knights (180) 3 x Demigryph Knights (180) 10 x Dreadspears (90) 10 x Dreadspears (90) 30 x Executioners (300) 10 x Shadow Warriors (110) Hammerhalian Lancers (140) Emerald Lifeswarm (50) Total: 2000 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 1 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 125 It's an extra drop but the sorceress and executioner block can get those long-range charges off which makes them more threatening than the greatswords early on. I swapped the gunners out for shadow warriors for objective games, and upgraded the guard to dreadspears for the bonus save and magic sacrifice ability. That left me just enough for lifeswarm to keep everything topped up.

Removing keywords from at least some of the command abilities would have been a good start. So many times I've wanted to take this awesome looking black dragon but he only buffs a chariot or knight unit and I don't want either of those. They made them far too specific. Black dragon lord, nomad prince, anointed, sorceress, and freeguild griffon at least could have had their commands apply to all CoS.

They really are. I've got 5 boxes and a dragon that I bought ready for CoS. That was right before we all found out they were dropped. I'm going to say something that people will probably disagree with - Dark Aelves shouldn't be in CoS. Or rather, they should be restricted to Anvilgard like how Sylvaneth can only appear in Living City. Instead they should have been rolled into the same book as all the Morathi stuff (especially now that the fluff is basically leading to it anyway). GW should have kept dragon princes, dragon mage, dragon lord, elf general/standard, loremaster and skycutter/hero in CoS.

Step 1 - GW need to rerelease the Dragon Princes and High Elf General/Standard Bearer plastic kits. Rewrite their fluff so that they are elves with a drop of dark dragon's blood. They see themselves as tainted by it and strive to become heroes so that they can be reborn/cleansed as phoenix guard. Step 2 - take the existing city theme and sprinkle in the idea of wandering knights and nobles flocking to the city to prove their honour, courage and skill at arms. The most elite of the warriors who have proven themselves become the phoenix guard. Step 3 - modify city rules to buff knights as well. Step 4 - this becomes the city for people that want to field Brets/Empire knights/Elf knights/elite good guys backed up by peasants/followers/worshippers.

I thought he was part of the Lethisian Defenders list so would get the extra prayer. I don't have my copy of forbidden power with me at the moment to check.

Yeah, you're probably right, was just trying to fit in a model I never use. Figured with 2 healing prayers he might be worth trying. I'll more than likely drop him for something else. Maybe cut him and the gravetide and use the points for a heraldor. Or ditch the CP as well and take a castellant. That would also give me points to upgrade the judicators to Morsarr guard.

This has made for a fascinating read. I've always been interested in stardrakes but they just seemed a bit rubbish, now I think I'll proxy them for a few games and see how they run. Has anyone thought about trying them in a Lethisian Defenders army? I know their rules are considered weak, but they get access to some pretty useful prayers. Something like this as a starting point - Allegiance: Lethisian DefendersMortal Realm: ShyishLeadersEidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Sea (380)- General- Command Trait: Raven Priest - Morrda's Embrace- Artefact: Crown of Raven FeathersExcelsior Warpriest (80)- Prayer: Morrda's ResurrectionKnight-Incantor (120)Drakesworn Templar (420)- Tempest AxeDrakesworn Templar (420)- Tempest AxeBattleline5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (90)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x GrandhammersUnits5 x Judicators (140)- Skybolt Bows- 1x Shockbolt BowsEndless Spells / Terrain / CPsExtra Command Point (50)Suffocating Gravetide (20)Everblaze Comet (100)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 94 The Eidolon has excellent support spells and when making him a priest with the trait he can chuck out a re-roll 1s for saves aura with good range. The artefact keeps him alive a little longer and he can heal himself. Plus his shooting attack is reasonable and he's ok in combat. As a support piece for the drakes he seems ideal, if a little expensive, but he brings a lot of tools to the field. The Warpriest is cheap, can resurrect, heal, deal mortal wounds, and has a hound for added backfield protection. Even the weak Liberators get a buff from the Lethisian Defenders rules. What do you think? Worth a go?

The aelves still have raiding ships. They feature quite a bit in the Callis and Toll novel and appear to be like triremes mixed with the old arks.

GW has basically driven AoS to the same place they took Fantasy - cookie cutter lists, spamming the few good units, hordes being best etc. The average AoS army is now the same size as a Fantasy force and costs as much, if not more. The only difference is that there are fewer unit choices for some of the armies like Fyreslayers and the new elves. I find that quite sad really as I do enjoy a lot of the AoS lore. Just wish the game wasn't so rock/paper/scissors now

Interesting list. Is the Runeson on Magmadroth there as a cheapish beatstick?

Is it ever worth running MSU Fyreslayer armies instead of the 20 man HB spam? I kind of want to try it but not if it's a total waste of time.

In that case I'd suggest Tempest's Eye as the city and consider taking them as pistoliers. The Tempest's Eye thread would be a good place to look for discussion on army ideas. There's a lot of chat about pistoliers and their various merits. That city is also good for lots of the slower infantry units like longbeards, which make excellent battleline objective holders.

Use them as vampire blood knights in a death army. That way you don't wreck the knightly aesthetic by sticking pistols on them. Sad truth is that GW sucks at writing good cavalry rules. Dark riders are ok as a fast objective grabber that can throw out shots at longer range than pistoliers. The bravery debuff can be useful in an Anvilgard army though.

Treelord really does need toughening up a bit. When I take him it's usually for the stomp and because some people think he's more dangerous than he really is.

I read it as they're now invalid and no longer playable in matched games without permission

I didn't mean as an alpha strike on their own, they'd be the supporting piece working in tandem with other units. As a deployed unit they act as an anchor to more important units that you want off the board at the start. In my case that's usually a mix of something like Wildwood Rangers, Drycha, Durthu, Treelord, Dragon etc. Paired with an Aquilor (another anchor) they can jump multiple times throughout the game to take objectives, avoid charges, and pick off supporters and chaff. Their footprint is much smaller than 30 Darkshards or Crossbowmen which makes them easier to deploy, hide behind terrain and avoid charges. That's what I meant by survivable. They also work well with the birds and can get them to move out of turn. Are they the best option? In most lists I very much doubt it. But then I've seen plenty of games where the hordes of Darkshards and Crossbowmen get deleted by Gyrocopters. I don't see the point in playing what is essentially a static gunline with Living City, Tempest's Eye does it much better. For me personally, I'd rather have ninja troops popping up all over. The hordes just don't fit how I play.

The vanguard raptors can also make use of the aquilor command which allows them to redeploy up the board. It means that you get a full alpha strike with pretty much the entire force on turn 1. 6 of them chuck out 54 ranged shots (essentially darkshard stats) but are more survivable and have a smaller footprint.

Is it better to run 2x3 Morsarr or 1x6 as a hammer?

My excitement for the return of proper elves has diminished slightly after reading the book. The lore isn't bad at all really, it's just the lack of units which seems a bit silly when they mention them and they don't get an entry. I honestly wouldn't bet money on there being a future release any time soon which covers them. Cities didn't get cannons and every novel that features them mentions cannons, skellies still don't have archers even though Neferata's forces are described as having bows. In the old days I'd have said it was just GW being GW - that a new book and kits would drop a year from now, because why sell one army book when you can milk fans for two? Now I think they've just been focusing more on 40k and have dropped the ball with AoS on some of the last few releases. Lots of cool looking minis, some of their best ever, but the rules are all over the place and feel a tad incomplete. I'm keen to get the Lumineth on the table and try them out, I think there's the basis of a cool faction here and I'm definitely in the pro-helmet crowd. Just kind of wish there was an un-named choppy hero and a chariot or artillery piece. There's not exactly much meat on the bones and I think playing them is going to get stale pretty quickly. I'll be keeping them as a second army I think.

My problem with this is that for some stupid reason all my humans forgot how to use bows and horses and my dwarfs, masters of technology that they are, can't operate crossbows etc. I think all of the differences for the races should have been removed and replaced with a generic stat line. Then the flavour should have been added back to the units with their abilities and hero buffs.

What about this? Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar- City: Living CityMortal Realm: GhyranLeadersNomad Prince (120)- General- Command Trait: Druid of the Everspring - Ironoak Skin- Artefact: Spear of the HuntSorceress (90)- Artefact: Deepmire Cloak- Lore of Leaves: Cage of Thorns- City Role: General's AdjutantCelestial Hurricanum With Celestial Battlemage (280)- Lore of Leaves: LifesurgeLord-Aquilor (170)Battleline20 x Wildwood Rangers (260)10 x Wildwood Rangers (130)- City Role: Honoured Retinue (Must be 5-20 models)10 x Wildwood Rangers (130)10 x Darkshards (100)Units10 x Shadow Warriors (110)1 x Gyrocopters (70)6 x Vanguard-Raptors with Hurricane Crossbows (280)3 x Aetherwings (40)BattalionsViridian Pathfinders (140)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsChronomantic Cogs (80)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 110 I dropped the sisters of the Thorn and upgraded to the wizard on the hurricanum. Used the last points to pick up a gyrocopter for more blocking and objective play.

Well one thing is for certain - I need a hurricanum in the list. That +1 to hit is too good to give up. But it's where to shave the list back to get the points. The treelord could go I suppose. His stomp is useful and he can take a few blows but he isn't critical to the list and the mortal wounds from the hurricanum will make up for some of the lost damage. Cutting back the aetherwings to 3 would then provide the rest I require. There's a part of me that doesn't want to run the hurricanum without a wizard Only problem with that is it would mean swapping out the sorceress for the wizard rider and with a force that can be so spread out, I don't really have the option to leave the hurricanum back to babysit the cogs. And I can't use our city deployment with the hurricanum and get cogs out on turn 1, which is probably when they will be needed most. Hmm