Who are the Strongest Contenders as of Newest GHB

[Lord Veshnakar]

Kind of curious to poll the community as to who everyone think are the winners and will be the top competitive armies as of the newest GHB. Please only choose a max of 3 choices in the poll. 

[Chumphammer]

NightHonk I think
They can really benefit with the Expert/Booty with Ethereal Battleline that can have 2 units on a 5++

 

[Enoby]

It's hard to say who'll be top dog, but Slaanesh is certainly looking a lot better than before. Painbringers to 130 makes them a very strong option, and Sigvald is bizarrely cheap (not that I'm complaining).

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

Just my perspective on the armies I personally own:

Nurgle seems to be in a very good position to make use of both Conquerors and Bounty Hunters. Probably a top tier army.

Cities have a deep bench and can steal the best stuff from their allies. I would be surprised if they don't have at least one or two viable lists.I am not sure which of their units will truly excell, though. Phoenix Guard? Shadow Warriors? Freeguild Crossbows? I think their biggest problem is that their 25mm base size troops improve less than the larger based troops of other factions.

Soulblight gravelords are in a similar position to Cities re: 25mm infantry. But Zombies and Direwolves seem pretty good as Conquerors and Vargheists are an option, as well. Blood Knights should be good Bounty Hunters. Black Knights and Fell Bats are good cheap non-GV chaff to protect your Conquerers. It looks like Gravelords have the tools to succeed, but I don't think they will be top tier. Pour one out for Skeleton Warriors, though, who arw probably nonviable for the time being.

I just started getting into OBR, but I am worried that their bread-and-butter unit Mortek Guard will have a hard time surviving in a meta with Bounty Hunters. Maybe they will be best off going Bounty Hunter heavy themself by spamming Morghasts and Deathriders instead? OBR were struggling before, and I don't exactly see them getting a lot better under the new rule set.

[readercolin]

Order:

Cities.  Overall, net losers.  The living city got nerfed, and everything else relies on models that are now galletian veterans, which are going to get burned through a lot harder with the double-damage battalions going around.  Everything else that isn't veterans is kind of underpowered, meaning that there isn't something else for the cities to fall back on.  There will likely be a few lists that come out of the cities and perform well in the new book, but I would expect that most armies are going to need to re-tool.

DoK.  Overall, net winners.  They aren't particularly affected by the bounty hunters because anything that was hitting them was killing them anyways - +1 damage isn't going to change that.  However, putting any DoK units into bounty hunters is going to absolutely explode their damage output, or putting them in conquerers is going to help them hold objectives.

Fyreslayers.  Probably net losers.  Fyreslayers build style requires putting wounds on objectives and just having a lot of meat, but doing so requires models that are veterans and are now going to take more damage, negating some of their advantage in wounds.  There are steps fyreslayers can take to avoid that with MSU vulkites and non-battleline hearthguard, or going heavy with lofnir battleline magmadroths, but it is still probably a net loss.

IdK.  Net winners.  The big question here is whether you can give up the battle regiment, but if you can then sticking Sharks or Eels into bounty hunters is going to pay off well.  It is also really easy to build an army that just has some MSU veterans (or none), leaving them fairly un-exposed to weakness's in the new rules.

KO.  Net losers.  They gained basically nothing, and now their infantry can potentially be taking more damage.  Bounty hunters not affecting shooting means nothing for them, and conquerers still requires you to get out of their boats, which is already annoying enough.

Lumineth.  Net Losers.  Bounty Hunters interaction with sunmetal weapons is a bit of a non-bo, while most lumineth models are going to be veterans and therefore weaker to bounty hunters battalion.  If the meta shifts towards big blobs of infantry, then they suffer more because they are great at doing precision damage, but not lots of it.

Seraphon.  Net winners.  Seraphon has a reputation for having a deep bench, and that hasn't really changed.  Now they can just stick some skinks in the counts as 3 battalion for objective sniping, and still rely on all their usual tools that haven't really been affected by any changes and will remain as good now as they were before.

Stormcast.  Net losers.  Stormcast power pieces (longstrikes + dragons) got nerfed, and the next tier down from those was more tier A than tier S.  Expert Conquerers isn't giving them something they didn't have access to before, and clearing things off the table was never stormcast's weakness, so they will likely remain more focused on one-drops, and work on re-tooling after their nerfs.  It will help bring up some underperforming lists, but probably not enough to compensate for the loss of dragons + longstrikes.

Sylvaneth.  Net winners.  They got a new book, and lets be real - the only direction available to go is up.  If they fail to go up... well... then they will need a complete re-write (again).

Chaos:

Beasts.  Net Winners, but probably not enough to make them meta relevant.  Expert Conquerers can help them hold objectives, and bounty hunters helps their somewhat anemic damage out, while fighting in 2 ranks is going to help many of their units.  I don't think they will be tearing up the meta in the new GHB, but they will be better placed than last meta.

Khorne.  Net winners, but probably not enough to make them meta relevant.  Getting their battleline infantry to fight in 2 ranks is a big improvement for them, but they still have poor attack profiles, low rend, and will be weak to other bounty hunters.  However, they can get massive bonuses in bounty hunters themselves, especially as they can stack up to +3 extra attacks, which is going to be even more impressive when you are also adding +1 damage on those attacks.  Because that is only against other veteran units though, and not give them the punch to go through opposing monsters, it probably still won't be enough to bring them up to 50%, but it will likely be better than last season.

LotFP.  Net losers.  Legion currently plays with veteran units as objective holders, but those objective holders are now going to be noticably weaker vs bounty hunters.  Meanwhile, their hitting power was generally big monsters, which aren't going to be scoring them extra points.  Overall, they can probably adjust, but current competitive lists are probably going to be less viable than previously.

Nurgle.  Net Winners.  Plaguebearers are losers, as they are just going to be taking double damage and they aren't tanky enough to take that on the chin.  But Blightlords can now count as more on objectives, and blightlords and flies can both go into bounty hunters for extra damage, which is going to allow them to go through bricks faster than previously.  Since the army was already winning competitively, I expect their winrates to just go up, or have them be one of the big counters that people have to prepare specifically to beat.

Skaven.  Net winners.  This is more due to the new book than the GHB though, and I expect many people will need some time to experiment and figure out what is best.

Slaanesh.  Net winners.  This is due to both the points drops, and the battalions.  The points drops gives them more units, while the battalions can help compensate for their lack of bodies and for their anemic damage.

StD.  Net winner.  Knights and Varanguard in bounty hunters is going to give them some damage output, and the thought of trying to go through a brick of Tzeentch Marked chaos warriors in conquerers is enough for me to reach for a drink.  Fighting in 2 ranks is also going to help their battleline out a lot (it doubles the damage of chaos warriors... admittedly double nothing is still nothing, but still).  But for an army that can just go stand on objectives and have their bounty hunters on the hunt, they seem like they are going to work out decently well.

Tzeentch.  Net losers.  Pinks being veterans means they are going to be less survivable vs bounty hunters, and most of their damage comes out of shooting which isn't going to see any big bonuses.

Destruction:

Orruks.  Net winners.  Most lists were pig heavy anyways, and sticking them in bounty hunters is going to be pretty obvious.  That being said, Kruelboyz are probably net losers, while ironjaws and bonesplittaz are winners from this.

Gitz.  Net winners.  There is less focus on monsters, and you can now have troggs and gits in conquerers, or anything as bounty hunters... and they couldn't really go any further down.  Probably still not going to be making waves competitively, but they will be better positioned in the new GHB.

Ogors.  Net winners.  Foot troops fighting in 2 ranks is going to be a big improvement to damage output, while bounty hunters is going to help both their foot troops and their battleline monsters.  Probably not enough to make them meta relevant, but they will be better than before.

Sons.  Net losers.  Now opponents can contest them on objectives, and bounty hunters isn't going to be a big improvement for them.

Death:

Soulblight.  Net winners.  Blood knights look great in bounty hunters, while skeletons and zombies look good in conquerers. Overall, there is enough diversity available that some lists will rise while others will fall, but soulblight has the tools to take advantage of the new GHB.

Nighthaunt.  Net winners.  There are no longer monster incentives for the army without monsters, and instead there are benefits to regular troops, which nighthaunt have in spades.  That being said, differentiating between new book effects and new GHB effects will be hard, as they didn't have much time with the new book and old GHB.

FEC.  Net losers.  Terrorgheists aren't affected, and now your opponents can burn through your chaff faster than they can interact.  They were already a struggling army, and I don't see the changes from the GHB really helping bring them up.

Ossiarch.  Net losers.  Yes, bounty hunters will increase their damage, but mortek aren't getting any bonuses to their tankyness, so they are just going to fall that much faster to opposing bounty hunters.  This was always more of a grindy army, and increasing opponents damage is going to reduce their grindy potential.

[yukishiro1]

Hopnestly the stupid all flies list probably just got even stronger and it was already a top smooth-brain list. Flies go in bounty hunters and absolutely destroy GV, and you can still summon in GV of your own if you really need it. 

[Lord Veshnakar]

I think people are really sleeping on IDK but time will tell. Sylvaneth too, they are a whole different beast now. Some of the teleport and charge and retreat tricks they can do give an absurd amount of board control. I bet they are going to rock the new edition. 

[Dingding123]

Gitz wizards getting +1 to cast and Troggs +1 to save is a really big deal.  Also not needing monsters to score extra from BT's is a nice perk.  The faction might not be amazing now, but they are at least in the running for Most Improved.

Edited June 23, 2022 by Dingding123

[Chikout]

5 hours ago, yukishiro1 said:

Hopnestly the stupid all flies list probably just got even stronger and it was already a top smooth-brain list. Flies go in bounty hunters and absolutely destroy GV, and you can still summon in GV of your own if you really need it. 

I think flies will do very well but they are the number one target for a nerf in the autumn update. 

This season will be very interesting. It's a classic rock, paper scissors scenario. Shooting is good against bounty hunters who are good against gvs who are good against shooting. With Lumineth about to get a new book, I wouldn't be surprised to see them make a comeback. 

[Wordy9th]

DoK, Nurgle, Nighthaunt, Seraphon. 

DoK and Nighthaunt can shut off the extra bounty hunter damage, the same with Seraphon. Nurgle can utilize bounty hunters extremely well with Pusgoyles, and Blightkings seem ready made to take full advantage of being GV.

As for my armies:

Soulblight: has great potential. Their battleline has the ability to play the GV game effectively. You can summon them from gravesites to avoid bouty hunters, and they'd die in one hit usually anyway if you take them as minimum. Bloodknights are fantastic BH candidates, and other than that you can more or less play the same game as you did before. (RIP Skellies I love you guys. I can still see taking them as 10 though). I firmly see them as remaining mid tier.

Slaanesh: Seem in a much better place objectively now with their points drops, there's so many new variables because of this I can't make any big predictions: But blissbarbs died in one hit anyway so their weakness to BHs doesn't mean much. Twinsouls are a good BH contender but I'm looking at faster cavalry options for potential 'hard hitters' (if you can call them that). Maybe they'll be lower mid tier now? Who knows.

OBR: I think they're really not in a good place despite their changes. Mortek guard are so vulnerable to monsters, and I don't think their new battleline options have a big place in the new meta. There's too many factors in the army that feel punitive, or the lord gives and he takes, if you'll pardon the expression. I'm more than up for being surprised though. Purple sun and crawlers, or reinforced stalkers might have play.

 

[Maddpainting]

19 hours ago, Enoby said:

It's hard to say who'll be top dog, but Slaanesh is certainly looking a lot better than before. Painbringers to 130 makes them a very strong option, and Sigvald is bizarrely cheap (not that I'm complaining).

And yet Slaangors are still 35pts over costed lol. I was 100% for sure they would be brought in line with Enlighten (bc its basically the same unit) but nope....

But as for what I think are best? NH, DoK, and Nurgle. 

Edited June 24, 2022 by Maddpainting

[zilberfrid]

I just chose factions with pretty models 😁

[Cambot1231]

Word is that Daughters are positioned well out the gate since they have many/ extra scoring battle tactics in their book

[Gailon]

Seraphon Saurus lists are far more interesting. It's interesting that Seraphon stayed at the top of the meta with 3.0 by completely switching factions and lists, and it could happen again. Saurus Warriors can count as 3 on objectives and reduce damage from bounty hunters, and saurus knights have a tone of 1 damage attacks, so seem primed to take advantage of being in Bounty. Combine that with board wide unbinds from the Slann and dramatically increased power of endless spells, which seraphon can control beyond 30" and they have the tools to remain at the top, but maybe with Koatl's Claw rather than Thunder Lizard. 

[mojojojo101]

From the armies I play

Stormcast: I think will stay a top army but they are probably trending downwards now, power pieces are nerfed and little else brought up to compensate or change your list building. Also, Stormkeep seems so irrelevant now.

DoK: Net good and will probably come into the meta very hot. The one thing that they are punished for is having lots of their units be GV's, however I don't think that really makes a difference to how you play. You want to dictate combat and blow everything up as quickly as possible or you will die. GV hasn't really changed that.

Nurgle: Already one of the better army's and the all fly list will just get better. Still has plenty of play outside that though if you want to do something else.

FEC: A struggling army that is just going to struggle more when every single model gets blown to shreds at even the slightest hint of incoming damage. They need a book.

Nighthaunt/Sylvaneth: Grouped up because I'm not sure about either. I think both will depend on how easily they can exert their own playstyle over the game rather than playing directly into the meta if that makes sense.