AoS 2 - Orruk Warclans Discussion

[PlasticCraic]

@Ollie Grimwood Yeah.  I guess the summoning in Bonegrinz is another one (lures more Boyz to the draw of the Waagh!) and I could see something similar here.  

Kinda like Blood Tithes...you can spend it on extra attacks / pile ins etc, or spend it on summoning Boyz (from the board edge would be most thematic).

Edited August 6, 2019 by PlasticCraic

[Ollie Grimwood]

5 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

@Ollie Grimwood Yeah.  I guess the summoning in Bonegrinz is another one (lures more Boyz to the draw of the Waagh!) and I could see something similar here.  

Kinda like Blood Tithes...you can spend it on extra attacks / pile ins etc, or spend it on summoning Boyz (from the board edge would be most thematic).

Summoning you say? Interesting. Has it been mentioned where the Waaagh points come from? It’ll be interesting to see how they do it thematically speaking. Traditionally more boyz equals more Waaagh 

[PlasticCraic]

1 minute ago, Ollie Grimwood said:

Summoning you say? Interesting. Has it been mentioned where the Waaagh points come from? It’ll be interesting to see how they do it thematically speaking. Traditionally more boyz equals more Waaagh 

Yeah I'm not sure.  One thing that could work thematically is completed charges...every completed charge generates a Waaagh! point (just thinking off the top of my head here!)

What do you reckon?

[Ollie Grimwood]

2 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

Yeah I'm not sure.  One thing that could work thematically is completed charges...every completed charge generates a Waaagh! point (just thinking off the top of my head here!)

What do you reckon?

Charges could work well, representing a building tide of Orkiness as they get into the fight.  Of course adds a bit of a weakness as we can be a bit slow getting there but new Ironjawz ability would mitigate that. Thematically it would work  

Edit: could go with units in 3” of the enemy after all Orruks don’t mind how they get into a fight as long as they are there. Might and for an interesting game where you’re enemy needs to choose their charges very well 

Edited August 6, 2019 by Ollie Grimwood

[PlasticCraic]

Yeah that could work!

I guess the problem overall is that it's not very granular... Maybe it could be more like Nurgle, where there are multiple ways to generate this resource? Completed charges could be one of several. 

[kenshin620]

I imagine it is similar to other combat based point generations like getting x units in combat, kill heroes/monsters, etc.

[Ollie Grimwood]

3 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

Yeah that could work!

I guess the problem overall is that it's not very granular... Maybe it could be more like Nurgle, where there are multiple ways to generate this resource? Completed charges could be one of several. 

Yeah it needs to be well defined,  any ambiguity does not go down well

[Dudvig]

I personally think they are gonna bring back the boarboyz and the warboss. Those models look way too good to retire. And I don't mean coolness level, I mean they're not outdatet

[Overread]

The problem is then GW has 3 Orruk boar riding models and 3 warbosses. That was sort of the issue; GW went sideways with an update of models and Orks wound up with 3 arimes at one stage; each of which was basically copy-catting the same core idea and unit types, just with a different sculpting direction. Rather than diversifying and making orks interesting; it actually diluted them

[Dudvig]

33 minutes ago, Overread said:

The problem is then GW has 3 Orruk boar riding models and 3 warbosses. That was sort of the issue; GW went sideways with an update of models and Orks wound up with 3 arimes at one stage; each of which was basically copy-catting the same core idea and unit types, just with a different sculpting direction. Rather than diversifying and making orks interesting; it actually diluted them

This is true. But with the right war scrolls they can all be made unique and have different roles and purposes. As with the warboss, he can be turned in to something brand new imo

[Mogwai Man]

16 hours ago, Dudvig said:

I personally think they are gonna bring back the boarboyz and the warboss. Those models look way too good to retire. And I don't mean coolness level, I mean they're not outdatet

They aren't coming back. Orruk Warclans is three books in one and it doesn't include Greenskins.

[Dudvig]

2 hours ago, Mogwai Man said:

They aren't coming back. Orruk Warclans is three books in one and it doesn't include Greenskins

I meant that they might repurpose the models like when they turned black orcs into ardboyz

[PlasticCraic]

On 8/8/2019 at 1:40 AM, Overread said:

The problem is then GW has 3 Orruk boar riding models and 3 warbosses. That was sort of the issue; GW went sideways with an update of models and Orks wound up with 3 arimes at one stage; each of which was basically copy-catting the same core idea and unit types, just with a different sculpting direction. Rather than diversifying and making orks interesting; it actually diluted them

It's fair to say that there is currently no equivalent of the Warboss.  There is no Megaboss on Gore Grunta in Ironjawz, nor Big Boss on Boar in Bonesplitterz.  He's actually in quite an interesting spot as a mobile "combat" Hero whose main purpose is actually buff auras.  

Hopefully that gets fixed up with a Megaboss on Gore Grunta in a Carrion Empire style release.

The chariot is unique to Greenskinz and not replicated in either range.  BOC kept theirs so there's no reason why it couldn't have stayed.

The Orruks themselves are actually a decent plastic kit, and way less generic than something like Skeletons or Zombies.  They could have been cheap Battleline bodies (Ardboyz and Savage Orruks are cheap wounds, but not cheap bodies...sometimes you just need some 80 point goobers to stand in a line 9" from a board edge, or wear a Terrorgheist to the face).  They easily could have had a role as true chaff.

Agreed that the Boarboys are definitely a triple-up and they would have to go whatever happened for my money.  Best thing to with them if you already have some is to count them as Savage Boarboys, maybe with some Bonesplitterz bling on them.  The whole lore of Bonesplitterz is that they are Greenskinz who have felt the Call of the Savage Waaagh! and left their tribes...these could easily just be New 'Unz.  

So out of the 4 Greenskinz kits, it's only the Boarboys that are truly redundant in my opinion.  The other 3 could have had a meaningful role, although I wouldn't have been too sad if they go on to make the Warboss redundant by bringing out a Megaboss on Gore Grunta.

Edited August 8, 2019 by PlasticCraic

[Gothmaug]

I’d love a single gore grunta kit that had a big naked muscled orruk on it as the base would be great. Toss in some megaboss armor and wierdnob attire that attaches over the naked base orruk model, a few head options for variety,  and we could have the ultimate megaboss, wierdnob and savage orruk big boss all in one kit.  

Then everyone’s happy

[PlasticCraic]

Great shout!

[Ollie Grimwood]

For me the problem with the Chariot and Orruk Boys is that they are “old” Orcs with the gorilla gait physiology that is absent in the upright Ironjawz and Bonesplitterz. Of course so do Ard Boys but they don’t fit very well to my eye.  I feel they provide an aesthetic problem. 

Boarboys however don’t as they are mounted and also possess commonality of design with the Bonesplitter sets. I was far more surprised they went. 

There’s quite a large narrative point to be addressed as Bonesplitterz and Ard Boyz do both start there lives as “ordinary” Orruks so that’ll need to be addressed in Warclans. 

I  am of course praying to Gorkamorka that a new set will be produced and added along with a return of Boarboys.  I’m not hugely hopeful though. 

[Floom]

It is odd they didn't outright squat Greenskinz entirely, like Gitmob. The warboss is still popular internally as a totem or cross-orruck-faction synergy I guess. Orrucks were great objective holders at 80pts and an impossible to shift anvil with 40 for 280pts. 5+, re-rolling failed saves, maybe stacking with the generic command trait for re-rolling 1s as well. Pretty tanky. 

It was always a goal of mine to spam the board with Greenskinz orrucks and stacking waaghs. 120+ and lots of wishful dice rolls. It's a shame they're pretty much dead in the water at this point. 

[tom_gore]

8 hours ago, Floom said:

It is odd they didn't outright squat Greenskinz entirely, like Gitmob. The warboss is still popular internally as a totem or cross-orruck-faction synergy I guess. Orrucks were great objective holders at 80pts and an impossible to shift anvil with 40 for 280pts. 5+, re-rolling failed saves, maybe stacking with the generic command trait for re-rolling 1s as well. Pretty tanky. 

It was always a goal of mine to spam the board with Greenskinz orrucks and stacking waaghs. 120+ and lots of wishful dice rolls. It's a shame they're pretty much dead in the water at this point. 

What do you mean stacking? You can't stack save rolls because you only ever get one reroll for each roll, period.

This also applies to forced rerolls. So for example if you have a rule that says you can reroll hit rolls of 1 and your enemy has a rule that says you have to reroll hit rolls of 6, you reroll all 1s and 6s just once, regardless of how they turn up after the reroll. (I.e. if you first roll 6 and then are forced to reroll, rolling a 1, you don't get to reroll that anymore).

 

[Floom]

4 minutes ago, tom_gore said:

What do you mean stacking? You can't stack save rolls because you only ever get one reroll for each roll, period.

This also applies to forced rerolls. So for example if you have a rule that says you can reroll hit rolls of 1 and your enemy has a rule that says you have to reroll hit rolls of 6, you reroll all 1s and 6s just once, regardless of how they turn up after the reroll. (I.e. if you first roll 6 and then are forced to reroll, rolling a 1, you don't get to reroll that anymore).

 

Ahh, my bad. I meant using the warbosses command ability multiple times, for +N attacks. The megabosses have a similar command ability, but you're dealing with smaller mobs. I think Greenskinz really rewarded positioning and the threat of having 2+x 40 blobs with 5+ attacks each is game changing. With a totem boss and double choppas they're 4+/4+ re-rolling 1s in both too. 

[tom_gore]

3 hours ago, Floom said:

Ahh, my bad. I meant using the warbosses command ability multiple times, for +N attacks. The megabosses have a similar command ability, but you're dealing with smaller mobs. I think Greenskinz really rewarded positioning and the threat of having 2+x 40 blobs with 5+ attacks each is game changing. With a totem boss and double choppas they're 4+/4+ re-rolling 1s in both too. 

Yeah they can put out a decent amount of attacks, but with 32mm base and 1" melee range it's difficult to capitalize on that. 

For their price, they sure are killy. 

 

[Floom]

1 hour ago, tom_gore said:

Yeah they can put out a decent amount of attacks, but with 32mm base and 1" melee range it's difficult to capitalize on that. 

For their price, they sure are killy. 

 

For sure, especially with spears. You lose re-rolling 1s to hit for 2", but the new generic command ability covers that. Less CP, but it would be worth it. I just focus on positioning and the threat of having the enemy engaged in combat with however many get in for a few rounds given killing the backline. 

[gedrekt]

Having Orruk summoning bring in more Orruks from the board edge has been mentioned, and I think it's a cool idea.

Something else I've been thinking about is if Orruk summoning was a way to bring in their Endless Spells separate from having to cast them. I think that could be cool. On the other hand it could be seen as a way to force Orruk players to buy the spells and about half the time the Endless Spells are bad looking IMO.

[5kaven5lave]

So... Orktober?

[PlayerJ]

Hopefully we'll get some info from nova on Wednesday 

[Malakree]

So I'm thinking that it will hit prerelease in the next couple of weeks. I have a few reasons behind that.

First is the fact that they announced it at the open day so we know it's coming soon.
Second is that it I'm guessing it will be out before the War of Bones box with gutbusters vs deathrattle.
Third is based on release schedule, we've just had a month of snooze marines followed up by the 40k fighters the game.
Fourth is that with the announcement coming in the middle of the week they are building a massive hype train for AoS.

So it's then down to their marketing strategy. They can announce Deathrattle on wed then lead into some Free Clans spoilers, including the new Free Clans heroes, with the release three weeks from now, 15th of sept.  If not then we should have it before mid Oct?

Hopefully sooner rather than later, although it's irrelevant for me since I'm away till the 25th of Sept 😆