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Everything posted by Malakree

  1. @VonSmall I'm torn, the doppelganger is obviously important for trying to face down the gristlgheist but the fact it doesn't work in the opponents turn (he activates before you can trigger it) makes it way weaker with the same issue for the talisman of the watcher, they don't work in the activation wars. On the other hand you could go for hysh grabing the classic aetherquartz broach, it massively increases your threat potential and you could still spend a command point to get the mystic shield anyway. It also opens up the mirrored curiass option for your cabbage to give him some mw protection.
  2. Yeah that's filth. I think he's good but just a bit tricky to fit into a list, I view him as an 80 point wizard with a mandatory 80 point unit. Honestly though he just suffers the same problem that standard madcaps suffer, no after save makes him incredibly fragile and he's directly competing with fungoids who are amazing.
  3. The spearhead doesn't actually always start on the board R1, it's dependent on battleplan. Personally I'm looking at this My experience tells me Rockguts are just worse than Fellwaters in 3s but a unit of 6 Rockguts is horrific to deal with. Spearhead Being only 220 points means I can sink points elsewhere Fungoid as a cheap hand of Gork and CP generator 20 Stabbas to gain board control/position Gives a cheap solid spearhead which is useful at any point in the game Main Body Huge points investment at 620 points making it almost 2/3rds of my points. A unit of 6 Rockguts is a massive hammer even in 2k games. 6 is the optimal unit size for Rockguts which is only avaliable in the main body. I want the Troggboss to pair up with the Rockguts for maximum effectiveness. Troggboss has the hammer setup aswell. A giant hammer which is a threat to basically everything Rearguard Only 160 points so again I can invest elsewhere. 3 is the optimal unit size for Fellwaters 3 Fellwaters are a dominant force at their points value. So yeah, I've gone with a massive hammer block that necessitates my other 2 blocks being very tight on points. To compensate for that I've gone for 2 setups focusing on efficiency around the points values which can tie down and stall my opponent until I can bring down the hammer. Both my spearhead and rearguard have -1 to hit in combat, the fellwaters are 12 wounds which regenerate while the grots are at 20 wounds. No matter what happens this force isn't going to go up in points cost unless GW has the most epic brainfart of all time. The Troggboss should be coming down at least 20 points which would counteract the Fungoid going up to 110 (or 100 if we're lucky). Honestly I'm expecting that Troggs might go down to 150 and the Troggboss to ~220. Though my wishful thinking hopes it's 140 for Troggs and 200 for the Troggboss 🤞 Altogether those changes would drop this list by 70-150 points depending on just how generous GW is feeling!
  4. I guess that's a fair reason. I'm using them in a different role from you so I guess it alters what size they are effective at.
  5. Weirdfist explicitly states "foot of Gork, green puke and arcane bolt" so no.
  6. Aye, I had 2 blocks of 20 at heat 3 and they pulled their weight. With the removal of my spear chukkas I think 60 stabbas and 20x20 shootas would be my base setup. Not sure why you would run blocks of 40 still but eh, personal preference I guess. Would love to know what Ian Spink was running to go 3-2 with only 430 kill points haha.
  7. So uh, bloodtoofs requires a max sized ironfist, did they change it in the latest gbh? Combined with the mandatory cabbage you're at ~1360 points before you even start on the ardfist.
  8. Those are being released in an errata 2 weeks from now.
  9. Bit of a necro but no. It's to do with keyword bold. If something is printed in keyword bold, so Ironjawz, then its refering to any unit which has that keyword on the bottom of the warscroll. If it's not keyword bold then it's referring to only the warscroll with that exact name. So for bloodtoofs it's not in keyword bold therefore it can only be the normal cabbage.
  10. No. It's an allegiance ability and allies can't benefit from allegiance abilities.
  11. Ironjawz would never join a gitz army in the lore. The loss of the arti is a bit of a blow but 240 points makes my block of stabbas a 60 and leaves me 10 spare so not to bad.
  12. Ardboy base damage output is garbage, the real damage for ironjawz comes from the waaagh! bomb. Inside the bomb not only do numbers matter quite heavily, 5 extra ardboys can be 60+ extra attacks, but again the ardboys aren't your damage source, that's your mawkrusha and brutes. So the role of the ardboys isn't to kill your opponent, its to pin and grind while you setup the bomb. In that role what matters is how much you can pin and for how long. Ideally you want at least 2 turns to build cps, get into position and then bomb the enemy.
  13. 4 shields, a drummer, a banner and an icon is 8 shields per 10. Personally I'm of the opinion that 20-29 shields is optimal, the unit is a there to soak damage/pin the enemy not kill them and shields scale with each other. This is slightly awkward to explain but if you take 6 on shields then you generate 1 "extra" wound for 7 effective wounds instead of 6. If you take 36 hits on shields there you generate 6 "extra" wounds which then also generate an "extra" wound for a total of 43(.17) effective wounds rather than 36. The first is a minor increase the second one is massive. The reason for 29 is simple, your unit boss gets +1 to hit so you have to roll him separately anyway. I use the 2h weapon him to make use of it 😉
  14. Imo a good ardfist is now a 3/4 win army, it's probably the strongest list we've got. Play for the objectives and force your opponent to fight for every inch.
  15. Just fyi the bravery 10 with bloodtoofs is without the extra bonuses for large units. It's +2 for bloodtoofs and +2 for the banner, point there is that attacks which specifically target bravery are basically useless against them. For battleshock you would start bravery 12. Also on the plaguemonk thing, one of those extra attacks is gained by them charging which you've denied so it's only 3 each against a 4+ rr1s with a 6++ after save. Oh and you need to kill 6 before I even have the potential to battle shock. Even then you get the 6+ icon roll to not flee. I think you're massively underestimating just how tanky 30 ardboys is. I had a unit of fully buffed wych aelves slam into them at last year's BOBO (Just after 2018 dropped) and still left ~10 standing. Realistically even a double activation terrorgheist is still going to leave a couple locked in combat pinning stuff with an IP.
  16. @Andrew G @Rock Lobster some of the key parts are killing off your opponents chaff screen, forcing the shooting to go into your ardboys and giving you time to get the rest of your army in position. You use the first turn to stop any deepstrike shenanigans etc and pin your opponent while you move up. Most armies aren't going to entirely wipe put 30 ardboys in 1 round of combat with the bloodtoofs buff putting them at bravery 10, so immune to things like screams and mindrazor. This means if they double you then you should at least have some of their key pieces/units locked down and unable to advance. Then your turn 2 your ardboys will be mostly dead and you still control the objectives, now however you are in a far better position to engage with the rest of your army AND your opponents chaff has been demolished. You then go with the rest of your army AND waaagh! Bomb knowing that you're not getting stuck on the 20 grots etc. It's basically attempting to remove the things which really ****** with ironjawz. Screens, spread out armies and failed charges.
  17. @Andrew G If you give up priority on turn 1 then the whole strategy falls apart. Your opponent will be across and tanked up on objectives already thus defeating the purpose of the tactic. The idea is to tag in your opponents screen and ring them with a wall of ardboys so that your opponent spends their turn 1 getting through the ardboys rather than getting board position. If you do it correctly you can actually pin them in such a way as to make it hard for them to fully engage. You then position for your turn 2 to engage favourably with the enemy screen dead and you holding the objectives.
  18. @Dingar the max unit ironfist is mandatory in both mega battalions.
  19. Wait are we talking about giving up priority turn 1 or taking it? Honestly in that situation I'd give up the double turn in favour of getting the counter punch off at the bottom of turn 2 with the Waaagh! bomb. The 30 Ardboys are 100% expendable. If they're going around your Ardboys on Turn 2 then you've done something wrong haha.
  20. The point of the list is less to actually Waaagh! bomb your opponent and more to control the entire board and win on objectives. If you stop all sorts of teleport shenanigans then it cripples a whole ton of armies. Eh tbh I view Ironjawz offensive potential as garbage. If you're going to win you need to do it outside of the combat phase because basically all combat armies will eat you. This is especially true since none of our buffs apply during a hero phase activation so you're just flailing uselessly or getting dominated by the activation wars... If you're trying to Waaagh! bomb my Gloomspite army I'd just laugh as you sink it all into grots...
  21. Honestly this is the only strategy I think can be used to actually win games. You don't need cogs etc. Hand of gork a block of 30, Ironfist for an extra d6" movement and you have a minimum 8" charge on +3, use it with bloodtoofs/Ironsunz, take first turn and pin him into his deployment zone with 60 wounds on a 4+ save. Aim being to just erect a 9" bubble across the entire board and stop your opponent doing any sort of deepstriking/teleporting to get out of his deployment zone then win on objectives. Especially since you can now spend a CP to RR1's to save on a unit.
  22. This has almost always been the case, it doesn't help that their profile hasn't aged well but that singular drawback hacks like 60+ points off their value on it's own.
  23. I think it's more that Ironjawz themselves are broken rather than the broach, without it they drop back down into garbage tier. It's because we now have the two best CP sinks in the game.
  24. Take Mirrored Cuirass on the Cabbage and Grab the Broach, with the new changes I'd say it's mandatory. Drop the Footboss to a second weirdnob and the points difference will cover the fungoid increase, with MSU both the Gattling Cannon of the Waaagh! and the RRF wounds are really solid, the second one is a massive boost for both the cabbage and the brutes.
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