The Rumour Thread

[AquaRegis]

1 hour ago, Son Of Morghur said:

I fear that may be the case.

And I am not even sure, that it would be that much of a problem. Sylvaneth have a lot of potential, just not as anthropomorphized trees. Just look at the new Belthanos model, Belthanos has long braided hair, which looks silly and makes no real sense to me - let the revenants have hair, or not and let the trees keep their fresh growing branches. His insect also makes no sense - from a design point, it feels like they threw every idea they had onto one model. The insect is grasshopper and beetle like with strong cicada elements too. It's mouth got insectoid elements but also has a radula (which is this rolled up tongue with teeth that you can see on the model) which most gasteropods - snails and clams - have.

I also have nothing against a design change, if the models are well thought!

Since AoS, it seems to me, that Sylvaneth do not have a clear classic forest and woods theme anymore. They are lorewise in an area that also includes jungle elements. So if that's the case, I wish that GW would let their designer go absolutely wild!

 

I think this can be applied to a lot of AOS factions, because in first most came from existing old world armies, or were built up from a particular theme within an army eg. Nurgle , seraphon or Slyvaneth. 

Sylvaneth will always be linked to the 8th edition wood elf treemen and Dryads models because they were the foundation, and made up most of the army when they became Thier own faction. Even the newer models are still closely tied to the plastic treemen. If they went in a jungle or palm tree direction for the new sylvaneth they would clash with the existing range. Luckily they are pretty easy to convert anyway. 

 

Nurgle for example still have the Norse aesthetics of the old world, from the end times when they could of done them in a Mongolian, west African, 17th century, Asian or whatever theme. 

[AquaRegis]

5 minutes ago, Son Of Morghur said:

 

And I think that this applies to a lot of armies (fyreslayers, Idoneth, cruelboyz), they have so much potential and end up with sometimes very generic units.

Imo Idoneth and Kharadron were the first truly unique AOS army to be released, that weren't based off a theme from WHFB. 

Fyreslayers are just dwarf slayers with added fire and 'Rune Gold'. 

[Ejecutor]

16 minutes ago, Garrac said:

Perhaps it's both at the same time? The reason im beting on custodes and orks it's because their combat patrols have been deleted from the webstore (i think there were new ones coming?)

Normally those heroes come with a battleforce rather than combat patrols, but it could be a possibility, yes.

[Son Of Morghur]

20 minutes ago, AquaRegis said:

I think this can be applied to a lot of AOS factions, because in first most came from existing old world armies, or were built up from a particular theme within an army eg. Nurgle , seraphon or Slyvaneth. 

You are right!

But on the other hand, the designers who dare to absolutely break these boundaries, make very interesting models a lot of persons here like. The different warcry bands and some underworld warbands would have been more difficult or even impossible to implement in Old World than in AoS (that's why they nuked it in the first place, or at least, that's one of the reasons) ! I kinda feel like this is really one of these moments where they dared to make something truly completely different. Same goes for this asian style themed Vampire Underworld warband that was also really interesting.

I think that there is a certain difficulty or disadvantage for the designers and GW, who try to make something new, but they make something new from these old pieces, and certain expectations are carried over.

But a lot of these unique models just got scrapped which I find still annoying and weird, and we now have a wild mix of everything.

And sometimes it's cool, sometimes it feels out of place. The new warsong revenant for example, is really cool, but  he also has a completely different vibe looking a lot like an anime character with the sword on his back.

I do not mean that these things are 100% bad, I just wonder about the design choices because sometimes they do neither fit the old design of 8th Old World, nor do they feel like a commitment to really trying to redesign an army and look out of place, and sometimes they also feel a bit lazy...

It maybe feels like I am trash-talking, I do not mean to (I think that a LOT of redesign are really well done, especially the whole vampire and ghost range). I am also aware that the whole redesign is complicated and I am also happy that we are still having some clear inspirations directly out of the old world (like lumineth "elyrian" cavalry, spearman and so on).

Just looking at Kragnos, I think he just feels out of place, he has aesthetically speaking, nothing to do with any of the destruction armies and always looked like he belonged to beastmen. It maybe makes a bit sense, if they release the spiritual successor of those under the form of his own army, but time will tell.

Edited April 7 by Son Of Morghur
Make text more clear

[Ejecutor]

20 minutes ago, AquaRegis said:

I think this can be applied to a lot of AOS factions, because in first most came from existing old world armies, or were built up from a particular theme within an army eg. Nurgle , seraphon or Slyvaneth. 

Sylvaneth will always be linked to the 8th edition wood elf treemen and Dryads models because they were the foundation, and made up most of the army when they became Thier own faction. Even the newer models are still closely tied to the plastic treemen. If they went in a jungle or palm tree direction for the new sylvaneth they would clash with the existing range. Luckily they are pretty easy to convert anyway. 

 

Nurgle for example still have the Norse aesthetics of the old world, from the end times when they could of done them in a Mongolian, west African, 17th century, Asian or whatever theme. 

I agree many armies are continuous from their TOW range, but I think that's mainly because they had to keep part of the range during the transitional period (which IMO we are still on), but there's going to be a point where, if you look at both versions of the "same armie", in some cases you, won't know it is their equivalent from AoS. And I think Sylvaneth, if you are not a big Warhammer fan, would be one of those armies.

You could see treemen in both armies, but the lack of elves would make you doubt if it was its predecessor.

[KingBrodd]

Perhaps the lack of a full blown Insect glow up is to not treat on the claws of another Insect like race in the pipeline...

[Matrindur]

49 minutes ago, Ejecutor said:

Normally those heroes come with a battleforce rather than combat patrols, but it could be a possibility, yes.

Correct the two new heroes are coming in battleforces, but every faction also gets a new Combat Patrol with their book. And since they aren't getting an army set but a battleforce instead everything should drop at the same time. So a Battleforce, Codex and CP each.

Which doesn't necessarily mean both Orks and Custodes are getting released at the same time. They where revealed together but they could be released with a few weeks between them

[EonChao]

38 minutes ago, Son Of Morghur said:

You are right!

But on the other hand, the designers who dare to absolutely break these boundaries, make very interesting models a lot of persons here like. The different warcry bands and some underworld warbands would have been more difficult or even impossible to implement in Old World than in AoS (that's why they nuked it in the first place, or at least, that's one of the reasons) ! I kinda feel like this is really one of these moments where they dared to make something truly completely different. Same goes for this asian style themed Vampire Underworld warband that was also really interesting.

I think that there is a certain difficulty or disadvantage for the designers and GW, who try to make something new, but they make something new from these old pieces, and certain expectations are carried over.

But a lot of these unique models just got scrapped which I find still annoying and weird, and we now have a wild mix of everything.

And sometimes it's cool, sometimes it feels out of place. The new warsong revenant for example, is really cool, but  he also has a completely different vibe looking a lot like an anime character with the sword on his back.

I do not mean that these things are 100% bad, I just wonder about the design choices because sometimes they do neither fit the old design of 8th Old World, nor do they feel like a commitment to really trying to redesign an army and look out of place, and sometimes they also feel a bit lazy...

It maybe feels like I am trash-talking, I do not mean to (I think that a LOT of redesign are really well done, especially the whole vampire and ghost range). I am also aware that the whole redesign is complicated and I am also happy that we are still having some clear inspirations directly out of the old world (like lumineth "elyrian" cavalry, spearman and so on).

Just looking at Kragnos, I think he just feels out of place, he has aesthetically speaking, nothing to do with any of the destruction armies and always looked like he belonged to beastmen. It maybe makes a bit sense, if they release the spiritual successor of those under the form of his own army, but time will tell.

Something to be clear on, it's not a few designers daring to break the boundaries of older stuff, it's all of them.

All of the studio staff, in each studio, are fans of Warhammer through and through. They both want to shape it with new creations as well as capture their vision of older existing things and so you get some things that are very strikingly different from what's come before, like the Warsong Revenant, Shadowstalkers, Ossiarch-Bone Reapers and Corpse-Rippa Vulcha, as well as stuff that plays it very safe like the Boingrot Bounders, Grimghasts and Fyreslayers. But either way you'll often find that someone who worked on one think doesn't fit the feel of that faction was done by someone who has had their hand in other models for the faction that you love.

 

[Luperci]

8 hours ago, Someravella said:

I guess the krule with the flail of the new KB band will end up being a new unit too (with a more agressive role than gutrippaz).

I hope not, we already have monsta killaz for a killier foot unit

[Vasshpit]

54 minutes ago, Luperci said:

I hope not, we already have monsta killaz for a killier foot unit

Opposite here. I felt the mosta-killaz were super lackluster and REALLY hope that's not our "other" foot unit to choose from this edition. 

The unit would have been a lot better with all howlaz (the monkeys) imo.

[Luperci]

4 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

Opposite here. I felt the mosta-killaz were super lackluster and REALLY hope that's not our "other" foot unit to choose from this edition. 

The unit would have been a lot better with all howlaz (the monkeys) imo.

I really liked them idk, in terms of foot units we have hobgrots, gutrippaz, monsta killaz and boltboyz so I'd prefer to get cavalry or non hero monsters first. If we do get another foot unit I would also not want them to be just shirtless orruks with flails, give us something with big armour instead at least

[Dragon-knight77]

15 hours ago, Baron Klatz said:

(Like Kurnothi may have been their answer for AoS unique Asrai but now they’re gonna double down on plant people because another system answers that design niche)

what make you seem like their double down on plant people? Like yeah Kurnothi didn't a warcy team but there still around the narrative and lore. Like they gave Balthanos the leader of the wild hunt and had WD & DB story of the stag elves with the sylvaneth so i highly doubt they just  drop it when it only somewhat tangential to the Asrai (if that the case then gitz and Chaos warrior should just get drop completely). I think people are over emphasizing the whole divided between AOS and TOW it doesn't mean AOS can't create a wood elf because TOW has a wood elf it more they can create the same wood elf TOW

4 hours ago, Son Of Morghur said:

Just look at the new Belthanos model, Belthanos has long braided hair, which looks silly and makes no real sense to me

He the avatar of Kurnoth so he suppose to take the image of his god hence the hair. He the new Orion so to speak 

Quote

 His insect also makes no sense

It a big lanternfly with some fangs

[Azamar]

2 hours ago, AquaRegis said:

Imo Idoneth and Kharadron were the first truly unique AOS army to be released, that weren't based off a theme from WHFB. 

Fyreslayers are just dwarf slayers with added fire and 'Rune Gold'. 

It’s probably splitting hairs but I always saw Kharadron as expanded from the dwarf Gyrocopter concept. They certainly share a lot of design cues from the gyrocopter/ bomber kit. 

[Vasshpit]

9 minutes ago, Luperci said:

I really liked them idk, in terms of foot units we have hobgrots, gutrippaz, monsta killaz and boltboyz so I'd prefer to get cavalry or non hero monsters first. If we do get another foot unit I would also not want them to be just shirtless orruks with flails, give us something with big armour instead at least

Calvary first, yes. I did like the concept of the beast killaz just not the composition. I'd love a duel option kit like them with mid range bows and a two hander option (idk if it'll even matter in this edition) 

If I had to guess though I'd say calvary (please be gnashtoof and not something goofy) and a boltboy foot hero is what I'm expecting. Anything more would just be awesome!

[Merlyn]

Long time lurker, occasional poster....

My sympathy and condolences to the gamers and collectors affected by the range removals. As someone who collected the majority of the Sacrosanct models range via the Mortal Realms magazine I partially feel your pain, though it is somewhat reduced by my being a collector rather than gamer these days.

Sometimes gallows humour helps (aka if you didn't laugh, you'd cry). In that spirit, I find it ironic GW have destroyed the Sacrosanct range given the dictionary definition of the word....

[Luperci]

5 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

Calvary first, yes. I did like the concept of the beast killaz just not the composition. I'd love a duel option kit like them with mid range bows and a two hander option (idk if it'll even matter in this edition) 

If I had to guess though I'd say calvary (please be gnashtoof and not something goofy) and a boltboy foot hero is what I'm expecting. Anything more would just be awesome!

Oh I can get behind that for sure, I'd like a priest hero too maybe, not sure if lorewise that role is already filled by the swampcalla though 

[Son Of Morghur]

45 minutes ago, Dragon-knight77 said:

It a big lanternfly with some fangs

Good ctach!!! I didn't knew this insect!!!

 

 

45 minutes ago, Dragon-knight77 said:

He the avatar of Kurnoth so he suppose to take the image of his god hence the hair. He the new Orion so to speak 

I don't think so, from what I know of the lore so far, Alarielle ist still searching for the broken parts of Kurnoth and some Sylvaneth are waiting for the return of ther Horned Deity! Some enclaves seemed to have formed, but they are not spoken much about in the Sylvaneth society (as far as the battletome goes).

We never got a confirmation that Belthanos was in fact the incarnation of Kurnoth, he has his spear, but he seems to be more a part of Alarielle herself, and not her long lost lover!

I didn't read Dawnbringers, so I might not be up to date on his lore, tell me if there is more written about him there!

Edited April 7 by Son Of Morghur

[Vaellas]

If I recall he is not the incarnation of him, but more like a harbinger and I believe he does hint that Kurnoth is not gone before he leaves on his own mission which is why he did not continue with the crusade. It's part of why the Kurnoth followers in general work alongside Allarielle rather than for her and have a bit for freedom over the other Sylvaneth in what they do.

[The Lost Sigmarite]

12 hours ago, Gitzdee said:

Sometimes i really wonder how well some kits sell. Because i could be hyped about something that seems to sell so bad they need to be removed from the game.

Me too. Maybe sometimes GW is overambitious with AoS ? Or maybe the WFB grognards are right and "nobody wants to play Age of S**tmar" ? Maybe the game isn't selling as well as we think ? I mean, for what I've seen at my local gaming club, AoS is popular, but is it popular enough to warrant releases on the scale GW has done ? Maybe not, since they're retiring some kits.

[Luperci]

6 minutes ago, Vaellas said:

If I recall he is not the incarnation of him, but more like a harbinger and I believe he does hint that Kurnoth is not gone before he leaves on his own mission which is why he did not continue with the crusade. It's part of why the Kurnoth followers in general work alongside Allarielle rather than for her and have a bit for freedom over the other Sylvaneth in what they do.

I thought it was that belthanos holds the last remnant/ember of kurnoth within him and seeks to reignite it by carrying out the hunt or something like that, maybe there are other parts of kurnoth out there he's looking for?

[Baz]

13 minutes ago, Son Of Morghur said:

Good ctach!!! I didn't knew this insect!!!

 

 

I don't think so, from what I know of the lore so far, Alarielle ist still searching for the broken parts of Kurnoth and some Sylvaneth are waiting for the return of ther Horned Deity! Some enclaves seemed to have formed, but they are not spoken much about in the Sylvaneth society (as far as the battletome goes).

We never got a confirmation that Belthanos was in fact the incarnation of Kurnoth, he has his spear, but he seems to be more a part of Alarielle herself, and not her long lost lover!

I didn't read Dawnbringers, so I might not be up to date on his lore, tell me if there is more written about him there!

Yes in Dawnbringers Lord Kroak tells Alarielle that Kurnoth is not lost. 

It's interesting that in the background since AoS began Kurnoth was described as a dead god but since the release of Belthanos Kurnoth is described as a dormant god. 

[Harioch]

1 minute ago, Baz said:

Yes in Dawnbringers Lord Kroak tells Alarielle that Kurnoth is not lost. 

It's interesting that in the background since AoS began Kurnoth was described as a dead god but since the release of Belthanos Kurnoth is described as a dormant god. 

Well for gods in all fantasy/scifi universe...death is more of a temporarily state than a true ending....Kurnoth is no exception. Also he's like a nature god of some sort...so death-revive-seasons.

I can't for when he will be introduce. He always was my favorite elven god with Morai-Heg. And I hope Kurnothi are not an abandonned release. 

[Aleser]

8 minutes ago, Baz said:

Yes in Dawnbringers Lord Kroak tells Alarielle that Kurnoth is not lost. 

It's interesting that in the background since AoS began Kurnoth was described as a dead god but since the release of Belthanos Kurnoth is described as a dormant god. 

I feel like that was his interpretation of what he saw like look Kurnoth is not dead he is living through his followers

[Luperci]

11 minutes ago, Baz said:

Yes in Dawnbringers Lord Kroak tells Alarielle that Kurnoth is not lost. 

It's interesting that in the background since AoS began Kurnoth was described as a dead god but since the release of Belthanos Kurnoth is described as a dormant god. 

well all of the old aelven were eaten/killed by slaanesh essentially. Even before morathi siphoned off extra souls in broken realms, morai heg had an amount of power to guide krethusa to one of her abandoned temples, and then there's also mathlann who is "dead" and eaten but the idoneth still harness his power to some degree. I don't know about lumineth lore, do they have any connection to the remnants of Asuryan, Vaul, Hoeth etc. ? Either way it'd be fun to see followers of some of the gods for aelf factions as subfactions or one off units/characters. Bring back Hukon and have them fight Kragnos to see who's the true god of earthquakes

[KingBrodd]

1 hour ago, The Lost Sigmarite said:

Me too. Maybe sometimes GW is overambitious with AoS ? Or maybe the WFB grognards are right and "nobody wants to play Age of S**tmar" ? Maybe the game isn't selling as well as we think ? I mean, for what I've seen at my local gaming club, AoS is popular, but is it popular enough to warrant releases on the scale GW has done ? Maybe not, since they're retiring some kits.

Age of Sigmar is doing far far better than WHFB ever did in terms of sales. Was it Dominion or another box that was their biggest seller for any of their Fantasy ranges?