The Rumour Thread

[The Red King]

2 hours ago, Garrac said:

Completely agree except for the suggestion of Queek being generic, bro had a personality, a narrative arc, a friend (a skaven friend!) and all. All that was explored on his novel, but Im totally 100% ok with him staying dead. His story has already been told, while Ikit Claw has more things to explore now that he's on AoS. (in fact, he's the only skaven in AoS that has actually got some character development on the whole setting, lol)

Queek was amazing "what's a clouds... I bet I can kill it!" On top of him yes having an actual friend (technically a whole friend group if you count his semi psychic trophy rack). I may never get around to my skaven project of shame but if I do it will be to convert a queek verminlord warbringer and a unit of stormvermin "scartails".

[Captaniser]

That Queek comment is a fun little troll meant to bamboozle AoS fans who don't know who Queek is from the world that was, even characters that have returned to AoS aren't carbon copies of their previous incarnations, their designs have been mixed up to some extent. 

[Luperci]

1 hour ago, Hollow said:

Not having enough "AoS-Specific" Characters is a real problem for the game and setting IMO. Each of the factions should have a character of note for each of the 8 realms at least. It would help flesh out each of the realms and it would also be great fodder for more Black Library AoS novels, of which there is a severe lack IMO. I really liked how the CoS touched on each of the realms within their Battletome and would like to see something similar in other faction battletomes, not only detailing significant settlements, but characters making an impact there. 

Semi related? But it'd be nice to make the barrier between realms more important, make it harder for characters and armies to just jump to wherever they need to be at any given moment. Early lore is written like archaon's control of the allpoints is super crucial but it doesn't really feel like that to me at least.

[KingBrodd]

43 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

Man, every time I look at the CoS warhulk or the gorger mawpack I do get excited to see how their glow up turns out. I'm all for the standard base size of an ogor being a 50mm. 🤘

Throw in some lady ogors for good measure. 

If it turns out well I'm here for it. 

Mate dare I say Im more excited for an Ogor refresh than I was for Sons release...the possibilities!!

[Snarff]

11 minutes ago, Luperci said:

Semi related? But it'd be nice to make the barrier between realms more important, make it harder for characters and armies to just jump to wherever they need to be at any given moment. Early lore is written like archaon's control of the allpoints is super crucial but it doesn't really feel like that to me at least.

I don't think they want to make it too limiting. It takes away a lot of freedom in terms of how armies engage with another if they can only travel through a few set locations. While that's nice for lore in some ways (but very limiting in others), it's bad for people who want their own armies to fight one another. AoS is a setting where nearly anything is possible, limit that too much and we'll go back to a WFB situation where some factions have absolutely 0 reason in lore to fight or even ever meet one another which they avoided very well with AoS.

[Garrac]

Seems like today Warcom won't post any teaser for LVO?

[sandlemad]

1 hour ago, Baron Klatz said:

Lmao, that is such a “focused on the tree and missed the forest” strawman(straw-taur?) moment.

”Oh, this new smashy god of Destruction isn’t very fleshed out yet, all warhammer characters have to come out fleshed out & interesting from the get-go with no years of build up.

I’ll just ignore the dozen more interesting characters that sprung up around him like the dragon prince brothers with opposing methods & attitudes but united in saving their lost race or the Mouth of Mork with a very unique skill to speak any language which he uses to manipulate both a confused ancient god with a dead language and his own people acting as a translator so he gains all the power over both.

But nah, smashy destro warhammer god #45, so AoS has no interesting characters. I won’t bother looking further for my judgement.”

I agree but would note that in fairness it does go beyond Kragnos. It took us about almost 3 editions to get Stormcast characters with any personality or interest at all, and there's still plenty of factions with either no characters or no character who are not originally from WHFB.

Don't get me wrong, there's tons of good characters - almost every character in Death and Destruction for one - but for a long time it was not an unreasonable attitude to hold, at least to some degree.

[Tonhel]

4 minutes ago, Snarff said:

I don't think they want to make it too limiting. It takes away a lot of freedom in terms of how armies engage with another if they can only travel through a few set locations. While that's nice for lore in some ways (but very limiting in others), it's bad for people who want their own armies to fight one another. AoS is a setting where nearly anything is possible, limit that too much and we'll go back to a WFB situation where some factions have absolutely 0 reason in lore to fight or even ever meet one another which they avoided very well with AoS.

This was always the case in any wargame and certainly in the historical wargaming scene. These things are seperated. You have the 1) lore / history of the setting -- 2) Lore / background of your army -- And than you have the 3) battle. Which you can link through scenario's / campaign or just play a battle without overthinking it. 😉 

There are a couple of options:

• Replay a battle (historical) or battle described in fluff of the wargame fantasy / sf universe. Fixed OOB.
• Write a whole background story why the armies are fighting. The most engaging part.
• You only care about the battle and you can seperate 1 and 2 from 3. 

Saying that GW did the fluff from AoS that way because otherwise players would get confused why their armies are fighting seems a bit far stretched. 😉 GW or any company doesn't limit anything it is the player who limits.

[Snarff]

16 minutes ago, sandlemad said:

I agree but would note that in fairness it does go beyond Kragnos. It took us about almost 3 editions to get Stormcast characters with any personality or interest at all, and there's still plenty of factions with either no characters or no character who are not originally from WHFB.

Don't get me wrong, there's tons of good characters - almost every character in Death and Destruction for one - but for a long time it was not an unreasonable attitude to hold, at least to some degree.

Neave Blacktalon, Hamilcar Bear-Eater, Gardus Steel Soul and Tornus the Redeemed have existed for a long time now.

3rd edition gave us some more great characters like Yndrasta, but its not like Stormcast never had good characters. People just focused on the generic stormcast soldier descriptions in the early novels and based their entire judgement off of that.

I also don't agree that there are no characters in most factions. It's that GW has chosen to actively ignore them in favor of reviving or giving glory to (old world) characters for no particular reason.

Examples include:

KO had Brokk Grungsson, who never really got to do anything big. Instead of him leading the big united Kharadron Assault like he's been shown to be capable of, he was completely absent from Broken Realms and Grombrindal did it instead.

Fyreslayers have Bael-Grimnir who was in the Realmgate wars who has only now, 5 years after his last big appearance, finally returned in Dawnbringers (only to be severely wounded and maybe killed in a short story). His and all FS story is in limbo now that Gotrek holds the biggest and most powerful piece of Grimnir.

Sigvald kind of completely overshadowed Glutos Orscullion who has not really done anything since his introduction.

Gordrakk got sidelined in favor of Gobsprakk and Kragnos, and didn't get to do anything since his big waagh was taken from him.

Other characters like Callis and Toll (who finally seem to be getting models), Maleneth Witchblade, Hamilcar Bear-Eater, etc. who have really cool novels never get made into actual models (which is a great help for making people excited about characters).

It's just a ton of wasted potential overall, but luckily Dawnbringers is incorporating a lot of these characters again, which makes me hopeful for their future.

[Vasshpit]

12 minutes ago, Snarff said:

Gordrakk got sidelined

Hopefully he does something meaningful about it. 

Can't be the megboss of megabosses and let this slide. 😡

[Goatforce]

59 minutes ago, Snarff said:

Neave Blacktalon, Hamilcar Bear-Eater, Gardus Steel Soul and Tornus the Redeemed have existed for a long time now.

3rd edition gave us some more great characters like Yndrasta, but its not like Stormcast never had good characters. People just focused on the generic stormcast soldier descriptions in the early novels and based their entire judgement off of that.

I also don't agree that there are no characters in most factions. It's that GW has chosen to actively ignore them in favor of reviving or giving glory to (old world) characters for no particular reason.

Examples include:

KO had Brokk Grungsson, who never really got to do anything big. Instead of him leading the big united Kharadron Assault like he's been shown to be capable of, he was completely absent from Broken Realms and Grombrindal did it instead.

Fyreslayers have Bael-Grimnir who was in the Realmgate wars who has only now, 5 years after his last big appearance, finally returned in Dawnbringers (only to be severely wounded and maybe killed in a short story). His and all FS story is in limbo now that Gotrek holds the biggest and most powerful piece of Grimnir.

Sigvald kind of completely overshadowed Glutos Orscullion who has not really done anything since his introduction.

Gordrakk got sidelined in favor of Gobsprakk and Kragnos, and didn't get to do anything since his big waagh was taken from him.

Other characters like Callis and Toll (who finally seem to be getting models), Maleneth Witchblade, Hamilcar Bear-Eater, etc. who have really cool novels never get made into actual models (which is a great help for making people excited about characters).

It's just a ton of wasted potential overall, but luckily Dawnbringers is incorporating a lot of these characters again, which makes me hopeful for their future.

Let's not forget the Slaanesh twins who were meant to be a huge chunk of Slaanesh + a bit of Morathi as I recall. Who's emergence was hyped up as something massive then proceeded to get slapped by a couple of witch hunters and Stormcast as an aside in Kragnos, then have Belakor appear to tell them what disappointing failures they are. Oh and these incarnations of a literal chaos god are ~200 point characters in game, one of which isn't even good at its role.

[Noserenda]

I don't think we need a character for every realm, for every faction, because let's be honest, adding that many means half of them will be phoned in and forgotten.

Whst would be awesome is every battletome spending half a page or more (plus art!) On each realm letting us know how that faction exists there, you can be a bit flexible, as some factions aren't in every realm but might have an eight points entry or something instead.

Ill bet that would generate ideas and discussions for not just us, but the writers too!

[KingBrodd]

59 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

Hopefully he does something meaningful about it. 

Can't be the megboss of megabosses and let this slide. 😡

Itll never sit right with me that Gordrakk finally had his time to shine and was used as a Red Shirt to show how tough Kragnos is.

 

[Big Kim Woof-Woof]

1 hour ago, Goatforce said:

Let's not forget the Slaanesh twins who were meant to be a huge chunk of Slaanesh + a bit of Morathi as I recall. Who's emergence was hyped up as something massive then proceeded to get slapped by a couple of witch hunters and Stormcast as an aside in Kragnos, then have Belakor appear to tell them what disappointing failures they are. Oh and these incarnations of a literal chaos god are ~200 point characters in game, one of which isn't even good at its role.

Shhhh. Us true devotees of Slaanesh don't talk about that...

Seriously, though, the twins have been a total disappointment since Day One. They should be absolute monsters, but they're mediocre at best. A terrible shame. And such gorgeous models too (in my opinion). 

[Vasshpit]

I really do think the pandemic messed with the plans of 3rd edition more than us civilians will ever know... Annnd of course it had to be during destros "edition". 😒

[Vasshpit]

3 minutes ago, Big Kim Woof-Woof said:

And such gorgeous models

Minus the "wings" and I agree!! 

I've always wanted to make a demon prince, er, princess... it's Slaanesh,  out that kit.

[Zagnog]

On 12/1/2024 at 14:46, Someravella said:

Más KB por favor, pero diferente a más gutrippaz u orruks tocando bocina, por favor.

I need more swamp boys too 🙏🏻

[Stormy1486]

Kinda curious as to what we may see at LVO, specifically AoS, not warcry/underworlds.

If I remember correctly, Kruelboyz were announced at the end of May 2021 and released months later in the Dominion box.

Seems unlikely we will see anything related to the 4th edition starter set, so doubt we will see skaven or stormcast.

Maybe GW will attempt to cram in some battletomes with single foot figure releases before June/July.

Maggotkin is one of the oldest, along with stormcast, fyreslayers, idoneth, nighthaunt, DK.

Maybe some of these will get redone.

[Hollow]

3 hours ago, Noserenda said:

I don't think we need a character for every realm, for every faction, because let's be honest, adding that many means half of them will be phoned in and forgotten.

There is absolutly no need for that to be the case. There are only really 8 realms. Each with a mountion of thematic potential. If you can have 18 different Space Marine factions with characters in both 40k and 30k, I think the prospect of having a few pages in a Battletome detailing the adventures of a specific faction within each realm isn't that big of a deal. 

Most of the Battletomes in AoS are barely 100 pages long, each could easily accomodate a section of 8 parts with realm specific characters, settlements and POI's. I am a big advocate for making the Mortal Realms a truly deep, dynamic and multi-layered fantasy setting. It's something that AoS (whilst improving upon) needs to do a lot more work around. 

The Characters themselves would not all need to be major warriors or leaders. Infact, I would like to see more politicians and civilian characters that could bring a bit of grounded relatability to the setting. A great way to incorporate character depth would be to explore lineages, marriages and family trees. (ASOIAF has 1000/2000 "named characters" in it's relatively miniscule setting over half a dozen books from a single author) you're telling me the design studio of a multi-billion pound market cap company doesn't have the creative wherewithal to have a single new faction character for each of the 8 realms? Come on! 

3 hours ago, Noserenda said:

Whst would be awesome is every battletome spending half a page or more (plus art!) On each realm letting us know how that faction exists there, you can be a bit flexible, as some factions aren't in every realm but might have an eight points entry or something instead.

This is not how I view the Mortal Realms at all. I see each faction represented on the table top as "factions of note" (out of hundreds) with a significant presence in each of the realms, with huge swathes of territory, cities, townships and hierarchys.

Each of the realms are massive. I would love for the AoS design studio take a note out of ToW book and have a "living" interactive map similar to that on the Old World Website (x8 for each realm) adding new and interesting aspects of each faction as/when their Battletome is released. 

Ultimately it comes down to resources and what GamesWorkshop wants from it's flagship fantasy setting. The handful of maps they have (which are merely dusted over in photoshop and copy-pasted across their publications) smacks of minimal effort.  

I've said it before (and I'll keep saying it to hopefully manifest it into being) AoS needs to have a series of weighty leather bound tombs (several hundred pages each) detailing each of the 8 Mortal realms with a swathe of newly commisioned art work, fiction and cartography. They need to invest as much time, effort and energy detailing the setting as they do their miniatures.

Edited January 16 by Hollow

[flying_dutchman]

49 minutes ago, Stormy1486 said:

Kinda curious as to what we may see at LVO, specifically AoS, not warcry/underworlds.

If I remember correctly, Kruelboyz were announced at the end of May 2021 and released months later in the Dominion box.

Seems unlikely we will see anything related to the 4th edition starter set, so doubt we will see skaven or stormcast.

Maybe GW will attempt to cram in some battletomes with single foot figure releases before June/July.

Maggotkin is one of the oldest, along with stormcast, fyreslayers, idoneth, nighthaunt, DK.

Maybe some of these will get redone.

I really hope not.  I rather 2 more dawnbringers over redoing battletomes twice in an edition.  It's fine when it's a one time thing for a battletome that just doesn't work.  But just because you have a few months left in an edition is terrible.

[Big Kim Woof-Woof]

1 hour ago, Hollow said:

They need to invest as much time, effort and energy detailing the setting as they do their miniatures.

 I wholeheartedly agree... but is there really as much profit to be made in exploring the background as there is in the models? I can't see there being so much clamour to buy a dedicated book of lore compared to a really swish new miniature. 

I might be wrong. In fact, I'd love to be wrong. 

[Stormy1486]

42 minutes ago, flying_dutchman said:

I really hope not.  I rather 2 more dawnbringers over redoing battletomes twice in an edition.  It's fine when it's a one time thing for a battletome that just doesn't work.  But just because you have a few months left in an edition is terrible.

Look it is possible two 2 dawnbringers, including the SBG's release is and the rest of FeC is what we are getting, but they released four battletomes in 2021 right up until 3rd edition was released, including SBG's massive release and a sizeable LRL 2nd wave (probably delayed by covid).

Also FeC was a substantial release, so might be quiet for a few months, but it feels some battletomes may still be crammed in there.

I would love a second IDK or Kharsdon wave, since they have only recieved limited hero releases and could use a little fleshing out like the latest sylvaneth wave.

Still if i remember LvO 2023 was sneaky and we saw like...half of the seraphon release (saurus warriors, slan, raptadons). The rest came later in the year. But the seraphon updates were amazing and truly carried them wholly into AoS, like...if skaven are getting that treatment soon, exciting stuff!

2022 was only the arena of shades, so a NH and DoK foot hero, the ghosts with crossbows i think? Not not exciting at all (although NH did get that amazing dude in the boat).

So 2023 LvO was pretty solid, 2022 a bit meh for AoS releases.

Guess all we can do is wait!

 

 

[Garrac]

1 hour ago, Stormy1486 said:

.

Still if i remember LvO 2023 was sneaky and we saw like...half of the seraphon release (saurus warriors, slan, raptadons). The rest came later in the year. But the seraphon updates were amazing and truly carried them wholly into AoS, like...if skaven are getting that treatment soon, exciting stuff!

 

 

Dont hold your breath. For new rats you should wait adepticon, where new editions tend to be anounced.

id say we perhaps get a warcry Eshin band anouncement, but I dont expect them, tbh.

[The Lost Sigmarite]

Only WFB characters I want to see redone for AoS are obviously Tyrion and Malekith/Malerion, maybe the End Times Mortarchs in the mid/long term future, and Morghur as a ascended minor Chaos deity.

[Chikout]

6 minutes ago, Garrac said:

Dont hold your breath. For new rats you should wait adepticon, where new editions tend to be anounced.

id say we perhaps get a warcry Eshin band anouncement, but I don't expect them, tbh.

Second edition didn't get revealed until Warhammer fest. Third got caught up in COVID, so a new AoS edition has never been shown at Adepticon. I wouldn't be surprised if there isn't anything of 4th edition shown at Adepticon. It has always felt like a 40k centric show. It  depends on whether there is anything coming for AoS 3rd after Dawnbringers 5.