AoS 2 - Gloomspite Gitz Discussion

[Malakree]

4 hours ago, froo said:

It's actually because I play aggressively with my Shootas because it doesn't bother me if they get killed. I'm expecting them to die so that they recycle at size 20, that way they still retain the +1 to hit once they come back out of the Loonshrine and with their 16" Shooting attack can still have a non negligible effect on the game. For that reason alone I don't think units of 2x20 is a good idea as they lose the bonus but you're still paying the same points overall.

I guess that's a fair reason. I'm using them in a different role from you so I guess it alters what size they are effective at.

[Lord Panther]

9 hours ago, martinwolf said:

@Lord PantherThey look all really really nice! Can you tell me what colors you use for the grot skin?

The constant such for perfect grot skin! Thanks dude.

The current recipe is:

Black  Spray Undercoat > Castellan Green Base > Warboss Green Layer > Moot Green Layer > Athonian Camoshade Shade > Moot Green Highlight

[PlasticCraic]

Thanks for the write up @froo, I like your thinking on the Squigs.  I had previously been of the thinking that you really needed 6 or 24 (cheap minimum Battleline, or good value unit for an early Hand of Gork to chuck 48 wounds at them to deal with). 

I guess the 12 works well for your role of early game bodyguards and late game objective stealers, in that they have enough bodies to screen a bit early on, and will overwhelm a minimum unit of idiots guarding an Objective late on.

Their innate rerolls to charge is huge for that I think?

A question, how did the Arachnarok fare for you?  He didn't seem feature a whole lot in your write ups?

[froo]

59 minutes ago, PlasticCraic said:

A question, how did the Arachnarok fare for you?  He didn't seem feature a whole lot in your write ups?

I didn't use an Arachnarok, I used a Webspinner Shaman on foot.

He was good for when he was needed. His role was usually throw down a Scuttletide early in the game and then just set up Sneaky Distraction and hold the line elsewhere.

He wasn't game winning but he did play a big role when it was needed.

I've been thinking of changing my Endless Spell loadout to just be Geminids and Balewind Vortex. The Shaman on Vortex would give Sneaky Distraction an effective 20" radius from a central point, given the Balewind Vortex is roughly 4" in diameter. Those huge debuffs mean keeping more models on the table longer and this army lives and breathes on debuffing enemies.

Given this army seems to thrive on being versatile, the Balewind Vortex would also be useful on Skragrott (being able to withdraw a unit from up to 30" with Hand of Gork and redeploy them would be interesting.

Given my thoughts on the Balewind, I think there is some other interesting tech that could come out of this book.

I'm thinking Zarbag on the Balewind Vortex might be interesting as I think making enemies within 9" from him retreat could be useful in missions like Duality of Death where lists like this would struggle. The unit that accompanies him could be used to protect Skragrott and fill the role that the Squigs did for me and having a spare fanatic and netter in my backfield could be useful.

 

[PlasticCraic]

Yeah, I guess you'll have to change something because you are 30 points over now...although let's see what the PDF brings us in a couple of weeks, I guess.

[Malakree]

8 hours ago, froo said:

Zarbag on the Balewind Vortex might be interesting as I think making enemies within 9" from him retreat could be useful in missions like Duality of Death where lists like this would struggle.

Yeah that's filth. I think he's good but just a bit tricky to fit into a list, I view him as an 80 point wizard with a mandatory 80 point unit. Honestly though he just suffers the same problem that standard madcaps suffer, no after save makes him incredibly fragile and he's directly competing with fungoids who are amazing.

[froo]

4 hours ago, Malakree said:

he's directly competing with fungoids who are amazing.

Exactly. If Fungoids go up, it might be a harder choice though.

For my money, a Fungoid only costing more with its command point generation ability is worth the 10 points. It's a little harder to swallow at 20 points and at 30 points, I would be more inclined to purchase an additional guaranteed command point at 50 rather than letting the dice try and give me on average 2 CP's a game.

As for the Zarbag's unit costing me 80 points, I figure they'd replace how I use my squigs, as a screening unit for Skragrott that can cap objectives late game. Given the fanatic still hides inside it, you can do the Hand of Gork 9" away, 3" deploy and going for a 6" charge move. That's better at jumping onto an objective than 9" rerollable for squigs and its useful for light character hunting etc.

I'm not fully convinced, but it's an interesting notion and probably something worth exploring further. I think I'll be ordering my Balewind Vortex this week so I can play around with it in various builds.

[5kaven5lave]

Do you have to buy the full spider kit to get the Webspinner Shaman?

[PlasticCraic]

11 hours ago, 5kaven5lave said:

Do you have to buy the full spider kit to get the Webspinner Shaman?

Yes, if you want the official model you have to buy the Arachnarok Kit, put the Shaman to one side, and make one of the other builds (e.g. Flinga) with the big spider.

Because the Webspinner on A-Rok is the most popular build for the kit, not many people do this in practice.  You end up seeing a lot of "counts as" Webspinner Shamans in the real world. 

Either the scuttling dude from the Gobbapalooza (most popular option, since a lot of people bought that kit but don't use it), or maybe something like Zarbag with a bit of spider bling tacked on.

[5kaven5lave]

@PlasticCraic Legend, thanks man. Might just buy the Gobbapalooza and make a Madcap as well then. Those sculpts are boss. 

[PlasticCraic]

Has anyone started looking at Meeting Engagements?

MSU Grot spam would be pretty hard to deal with I think?

[Lord Panther]

On 6/26/2019 at 11:35 PM, 5kaven5lave said:

@PlasticCraic Legend, thanks man. Might just buy the Gobbapalooza and make a Madcap as well then. Those sculpts are boss. 

I bought the kit for this reason too. It's a shame to see such an awesome kit not being used. Here's how I saw them:

 

[soak314]

1 hour ago, Lord Panther said:

I bought the kit for this reason too. It's a shame to see such an awesome kit not being used. Here's how I saw them:

 

Scaremonger makes for a convincing loonboss given his height and native attack output, great if you don't like your grots armored and tall.

brewgit is another easy madcap, maybe even fungoid in a pinch.

The kit seems expensive at first but when you realize its five of your baseline leaders in a box it suddenly becomes way more attractive a purchase!

Hopefully people not bothering ever taking these fellas makes it so GW considers letting us take em piecemeal, that'd make the boggleye in particular an autotake in a lot of my lists.

[froo]

On 6/25/2019 at 10:02 AM, froo said:

I'm thinking Zarbag on the Balewind Vortex might be interesting as I think making enemies within 9" from him retreat could be useful in missions like Duality of Death where lists like this would struggle.

I'm changing my mind on this. I think that Zarbag on Vortex is still a cool thing, but I've got no issue with Duality of Death 2019.

I like that they changed it to Hero or Battleline instead of Behemoth. I run tons of battleline.

[a74xhx]

20 hours ago, Lord Panther said:

I bought the kit for this reason too. It's a shame to see such an awesome kit not being used. Here's how I saw them:

 

Top right guy, replace/modify  the masked guy on top, and you've got yourself a squig hopper / bounder.

[GlitzFan]

I'm undefeated locally with this build and strategy. I have a one drop army. I choose to go first and spend cp  to run onto all of the objectives with my large units. I make sure they're buffed each by loonbosses and have buffed attacks from sporesplatters and sneaky snufflers unit. 

I hold objectives and let them bring the fight to me on the objective. Haven't lost a game yet 7-0 in local competitive meta. Played FEC, skaventide, khorne x2, new sylvaneth, fyreslayers and nighthaunt. 

I have experimented with dropping 20 stabbas and adding geminids and a webspinner shaman for stacking minus to hit but found the extra 20 stabbas more useful. Having the webspinner makes it a two drop army though. (I change one fanatic unit from loonsmashas to sporesplatters to gain the extra 10 points to make it work.)

Unfortunately I have a third artefact wasted.

Ive also tried loonboss general and I have tried fungoid general with boss shaman trait. They seem less superior. It's nice to have skragrott control the moon with the battalion effects of no battleshock for two turns. It saves me cp and I also have a 50% chance to earn more cp. Instead of using the cp for battle shock, I use it for the new reroll hit rolls in late game or run charges in turn one to get onto objectives. 

It would be nice to find 50 points to have the cauldron on my single strong spell caster. I am not willing to not have two loonbosses - especially if they are not the general. E.g. drop 20 stabbas. Add madcap shaman with moonface mommet and add cauldron for skragrott. 

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz

Leaders
Skragrott, The Loonking (220)
- General
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Great Green Spite
Loonboss (70)
- Artefact: Spiteful Prodder 
Loonboss (70)
- Artefact: The Clammy cowl 

Battleline
60 x Stabbas (360)
- Stabbas & Moon Shields
- 9x Barbed Nets
- 2x Moonclan Flag Bearers
- 1x Badmoon Icon Bearers
40 x Stabbas (260)
- Stabbas & Moon Shields
- 6x Barbed Nets
- 1x Moonclan Flag Bearers
- 1x Badmoon Icon Bearers
20 x Stabbas (130)
- Stabbas & Moon Shields
- 3x Barbed Nets
- 1x Moonclan Flag Bearers
20 x Stabbas (130)
- Stabbas & Moon Shields
- 3x Barbed Nets
- 1x Moonclan Flag Bearers

Units
5 x Sporesplatta Fanatics (120)
5 x Loonsmasha Fanatics (140)
5 x Loonsmasha Fanatics (140)
6 x Sneaky Snufflers (70)

Battalions
Skulkmob Horde (160)
Moonclan Skrap (120)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 183
 

Edited June 30, 2019 by GlitzFan

[PlasticCraic]

Any ideas on what should / will change for GG in the pdf?

I'm thinking:

- Grots travelling ok, not expecting much change there

- Fungoid may go up to 100 or 110?

- Madcap should really come down a little in points too, but I think they'll focus on kicking the Fungoid rather than helping out the Madcap

- Gobbapalooza might come down, still not sure I'd use them myself because their keywords are too restrictive, but a lot of people bought this kit and are itching to use them

- Spiderfang need points drops, the Spider Riders in particular could do with a drop to 80 or 90 points 

- The Spiderfang Heroes are probably spot on imo.  The non-Wizard A-Roks need to come way down, but I predict a minor tweak, and you will still never see anything but the Wizard variant

- Basic Troggoths of both kinds are decent, a pure Troggoth army is not as competitive as it would be if you put some Gits in there, but that really is your choice

- The Dankhold and Trogboss are crazy overcosted and both need a savage decrease.  Predict they will get a moderate decrease that leaves them still looking pretty on the display shelf more than wrecking face on the table

- The Troggoth batallion needs to come way down too, it gives precious little beyond reduced drops, CP and artefact.  If those three are worth 100 points on their own, the Batallion should be maybe 110 

What do other people think?

[PlasticCraic]

And if I had one FAQ wish, it would be for all Battleline to be recyclable through the shrine.  Currently the only thing you can recycle is the most powerful and least fun.  Would love to see that rectified.

[GlitzFan]

Is a FAQ coming out as well as the points changes or are we just being hopeful? @PlasticCraic

Bringing back a unit of fanatics would be fun. I think that they underperform greatly at 5 for 140 points. And taking anymore than 10 in a unit is wasteful in my experience because they can't fight in ranks of 2 and getting 10 models to attack is hard enough.

[Malakree]

6 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

And if I had one FAQ wish, it would be for all Battleline to be recyclable through the shrine.  Currently the only thing you can recycle is the most powerful and least fun.  Would love to see that rectified.

Aye this would be amazing. Especially as it not only supports thematic armies but makes the choice of general a really interesting on as it alters which units can be brought back.

6 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

Basic Troggoths of both kinds are decent, a pure Troggoth army is not as competitive as it would be if you put some Gits in there, but that really is your choice

The more I think about it the more I favour them going down to 150. They are only 12 wounds making them very expensive in points per wound and their 5+ armour save is also a huge weakness. For most armies it would either offset the fungoid cost increase or at most let you include an extra madcap. It's a QoL change for one of the weaker themes.

6 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

The Dankhold and Trogboss are crazy overcosted and both need a savage decrease.  Predict they will get a moderate decrease that leaves them still looking pretty on the display shelf more than wrecking face on the table

I agree. I personally would want the troggboss to drop to 240 to make him a reasonable general choice or 200/220 to make me consider adding a second to my list.

The dankhold needs to drop to whatever the battletroggs drop to. Ideally 150 but at least 160. It has 2 less wounds than battletroggs with similar output and a 4+ save instead of the 5++/-1 to hit. It's the utility option of the three trogg choices. (also wouldn't mine him getting battleline with troggboss general but that's wishlisting 😋)

6 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

Grots travelling ok, not expecting much change there

I'd hope shootas drop by 10 points to make them more comparable to stabbas. Reducing the max unit size to 40 and giving a regiment discount would also massively improve them. 120/220.

6 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

Madcap should really come down a little in points too, but I think they'll focus on kicking the Fungoid rather than helping out the Madcap

Madcaps should be 70, they are simply to squishy with all their secondcast/unique spell both being horrendous.

6 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

Gobbapalooza might come down, still not sure I'd use them myself because their keywords are too restrictive, but a lot of people bought this kit and are itching to use them

I think most importantly the combination of them AND the battalion needs to drop a ton. Even at ~120 points they play keyword bingo and add a ridiculous FIVE drops without the battalion. The gobbapalooza alone is more drops than some entire armies.

Being able to grab both for ~240 would make them an attractive choice for Grot lists and even an option for grot+ lists.

[TheWilddog]

Trying to decide between these two color schemes for my grots. I like the contrast of the yellow skin tone with the blue robes but I also love the brightness of the orange. What do you all think.

Edited July 1, 2019 by TheWilddog

[Foe-Hammer]

1 hour ago, TheWilddog said:

Trying to decide between these two color schemes for my grots. I like the contrast of the yellow skin tone with the blue robes but I also love the brightness of the orange. What do you all think.

I like the orange robe grot, personally.  It stands out more, and has a more "looney" aesthetic.  🤪

[Malakree]

2 hours ago, TheWilddog said:

Trying to decide between these two color schemes for my grots. I like the contrast of the yellow skin tone with the blue robes but I also love the brightness of the orange. What do you all think.

So uh, can't you just use both over different units? As long as you do the bases correctly it will look ok since they contrast each other so well. Honestly though both look good.

[TheWilddog]

Thx for the feedback all. After a bit more painting I am leaning on the blue and doing my squigs in the orange/yellow.

[TheWilddog]

Also big shout out to Louise Sugden for inspiration and a kickass color scheme!