AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

[Furuzzolo]

45 minutes ago, Luzgurbel said:

I have an issue regarding the Company.

 

The sprue only has 1 skyhook, but you can equip up to 3. How do people get the other 2? I mean, is quite ridicoulous that you can have 3 per 10 man unit and the sprue only has 1...

 

Yeah, it's sad. I bought 3 box so i can field a MSU with 3 hooks and one with 3 spikes. Now i saved the drills and spikes from the endrinriggers and skywarden, gonna buy two more company and model the spare bits on them....a shame, by the way. (You can find some spare weapon on ebay for 5-6 € + shipping... .... )

[alasdair]

Right folks, I need your help. I am planning on surprising my friends by taking Kharadron Overlords to a 1k tournament we are having between ourselves. They think I am working on something completely different so I am keeping my affiliation with our height-challenged friends on the down low. I have played a few Barak Zon lists back when they first came out but know Kharadron have taken a bit of a hit in AoS2. However some of the point changes intrigue me. I have settled on Barak Thryng, not only because I like the colour scheme but because i think at this points level they have a smashing set of rules. Here are the  lists I am trying to decide between:

List one: Brokk + Gunhauler

Spoiler

 

Skyport: Barak-Thryng
- Additional Footnote: There's No Trading With Some People
Leaders
Brokk Grungsson (260)
- General
Battleline
10 x Arkanaut Company (120)
- 1x Skypikes
- 2x Aethermatic Volley Guns
10 x Arkanaut Company (120)
- 2x Light Skyhooks
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns
Units
6 x Endrinriggers (240)
- 1x Drill Cannons
5 x Grundstok Thunderers (100)
- 5x Aethershot Rifles
War Machines
Grundstok Gunhauler (160)
- Main Gun: Sky Cannon
- Great Endrinworks: The Last Word

 

 

Brokk and the Endrinriggers gun it up the board and get stuck in, the Gunhauler and the Thunderers shoot away and the Arkanauts hold objectives. A pretty simple list. Brokk's point reduction makes him a serious player at this points level in my opinion so was keen to include him. I am aware the Gunhauler may not be wholly efficient, and basing a gunline around it may leave me dissapointed. On the other hand, I love the model, and I feel like a Frigate isn't going to be worth it.

 

 

List two: Ironclad

Spoiler

 

Skyport: Barak-Thryng
- Additional Footnote: Without Our Ships We Are Naught.

Leaders
Endrinmaster (120)
- General
- Trait: Fleetmaster 
- Artefact: Grudgehammer 
Aetheric Navigator (80)

Battleline
10 x Arkanaut Company (120)
- 1x Skypikes
- 2x Aethermatic Volley Guns
10 x Arkanaut Company (120)
- 2x Light Skyhooks
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns

Units
3 x Endrinriggers (120)
- 1x Drill Cannons

War Machines
Arkanaut Ironclad (420)
- Main Gun: Aethermatic Volley Cannon
- Great Endrinworks: Incredible Self-healing Hull

 

This is a fun one. Everything sets up in the Ironclad. However when deployment ends, Fleetmaster allows me to completely change where the Ironclad is, and therefore repositions my entire army. There is also the option of leaving one unit of Arkanauts behind to sit on an objective if needs be. Other than that, it is pretty self explanatory; I feel like very little at this points level can deal with an Ironclad, and with the self healing hull, riggers,  and endrinmaster, as well as without our ships footnote, it will be healing more damage than it is likely to be taking most turns before it is inevitably charged. The navigator neatly brings the points to 100, but the extra d3 and ability to unbind is an added bonus I think. I considered giving the Endrinmaster an autotinkerer instead for extra healing, but I reckon the hammer will prove useful when he inevitably gets out his boat. 

 

 

What do you guys think? Have I gone mad?

Edited December 22, 2018 by alasdair

[Nick907]

KO is stronger at 1000 points I think

[Baron Wastelands]

 

17 hours ago, alasdair said:

 

What do you guys think? Have I gone mad?

The second list, I think, of the two. The gunhauler really isn’t worth it, you’d be better taking a khemist to buff the riggers or the thunderers.

As general advice, I wouldn’t take a variety of special weapons in your arkanauts units, focus on one role with each. You will have spares from the endrinriggers unit.

[RaritanAnon]

So I'm attempting to put together a 2k list for whenever my next tourney rolls around. I'm aware I will probably auto-lose to alpha strike lists, but whatever. Anyway, this is what I came up with. I have everything but 4 more Volleyguns for the 3rd arkanaut company. (That's what I get for buying second hand) Hopefully I find those soon.

Allegiance: Kharadron Overlords
Skyport: Barak-Mhornar
- Additional Footnote: There's No Trading With Some People
Aether-Khemist (160)
- General
- Trait: Opportunistic Privateers 
Arkanaut Admiral (120)
- Artefact: Aethersight Loupe 
Aetheric Navigator (80)
20 x Arkanaut Company (240)
- 6x Skypikes
20 x Arkanaut Company (240)
- 6x Light Skyhooks
20 x Arkanaut Company (240)
- 6x Aethermatic Volley Guns
6 x Endrinriggers (240)
6 x Skywardens (240)
- 2x Aethermatic Volley Guns
- 2x Drill Cannons
Arkanaut Ironclad (420)
- Main Gun: Aethermatic Volley Cannon
- Great Endrinworks: Incredible Self-healing Hull

Total: 1980 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 118

 

Navigator, Admiral, and Pike Company hang out on the Ironclad. Riggers join them and disembark when able, probably all at once so they can attack backline heroes while the company handle the frontliners. Ironclad and navigator then either plant their assets on an objective, or harass heroes and monsters from range. Skywardens go off on their own to pew pew heroes and annoyances, while the khemist and the other two company hold the front line and fire at will with Opportunitistic Privateers. 

How's it look? I imagine deployment will have to be very reserved, and if they make me take first turn, I'm probably boned unless that first shooting phase does enough damage. Run and shoot will help, but only so much.

[Dead_Duardin]

Planning on trying out a combat variant of the list Chris Welfare whacked up on the honest wargamer. 

Barak Mhornar

Khemist

Khemist

Brokk

Knight Incantor 

10/10/10 arkanaut

9/9 endrinriggers

Comet..... With Brokks bubble the army can run shoot and charge turn one and can confidently deploy more than 24" away knowing it would stop most opponents from hurting me but nullifies none of my threat range. Its probably the closest thing we have to an eel type build

[Baron Klatz]

Well I like the sounds of those lists. With shooting nerfed for now it seems builds for max mobility and melee advantage like that will be vital going forward. Hopefully the upcoming Kharadron ShadeSpire warband will give a new firepower advantage to help augment that.

 

Also, white dwarf teaser shown on Community site and Kharadron get their own short story.

Haha,  I love his idea of a "master key".

Edited December 27, 2018 by Baron Klatz

[BWG Cannonball]

I came up with a hotfix list for KO after a friend of mine asked me to really think about what could be the army in line with other armies.  Here are my thoughts, let me know what you guys think.

 

KO Hotfixes

·        Admirals drop to 100pts

·        Admiral given 4 attacks

·        Endrinmaster drops to 100 points

·        Endrinmaster gains Command ability “Overcharged Aether-Engines” – Endrinriggers and Skywardens within 18” of the Endrinmaster may run and shoot or run and charge

·        Aether-Khemist drops to 140 points

·        20-40 point drop on all airships

·        Ironclads gain a 3+ save

·        Frigates gain a 4+ save

·        Airships have garrison rules for shooting out of ships

·        Give Arkanaut Cutters 2 attacks

·        Gunhaulers have 2 shots with their cannon/drill cannon at 12” range

·        Skywardens drop back down to 100 points

·        Grundstok Thunderers become battleline when Admiral is General

·        Aethermatic Volleyguns hit on a 4+ for Arkanaut Company

·        Drop cost of battalions by 10 points

·        Extend Navigator’s abilities by 6”

·        Navigator points increase to 100 with inclusion of new Command Ability “Clear Skies, Hard Targets”- Nominate one unit in the shooting phase within 12” of the Navigator.  That unit can ignore negative modifiers to shooting attacks.

[Nick907]

3 hours ago, BWG Cannonball said:

I came up with a hotfix list for KO after a friend of mine asked me to really think about what could be the army in line with other armies.  Here are my thoughts, let me know what you guys think.

Individually some of these are great, but all together you might as well just proclaim victory and spare your opponent. 
Reducing the costs of airships, improving their saves, and allowing models to shoot from embankment are all good ideas that are way too much when added together. 

[Barkanaut]

There’s an unreliable rumor floating around most of the older existing bt’s will be getting an update with at least 1 model. The rumor person also said this includes ko. Assuming we get only 1 single model as mentioned what would be the most critical to buffing our army? If the rumor is true I think we got a chance for 2 since we sold so we’ll as an army. I personally think we need melee troops more than anything else and would hope to see that the most. 

[Bozly]

1 hour ago, Barkanaut said:

There’s an unreliable rumor floating around most of the older existing bt’s will be getting an update with at least 1 model. The rumor person also said this includes ko. Assuming we get only 1 single model as mentioned what would be the most critical to buffing our army? If the rumor is true I think we got a chance for 2 since we sold so we’ll as an army. I personally think we need melee troops more than anything else and would hope to see that the most. 

Something that makes grundstocks battleline

[Baron Klatz]

4 hours ago, Barkanaut said:

There’s an unreliable rumor floating around most of the older existing bt’s will be getting an update with at least 1 model. The rumor person also said this includes ko. Assuming we get only 1 single model as mentioned what would be the most critical to buffing our army? If the rumor is true I think we got a chance for 2 since we sold so we’ll as an army. I personally think we need melee troops more than anything else and would hope to see that the most. 

The Shieldships mentioned in their lore.

I could see a lot of fun things they could do with a defensive focused ship be it an slow armored hulk meant to float in front of a armada and either act as cover which uses magnetism to pull in enemy ranged attacks towards it or deploys a barrier bubble around it that reduces damage to allies.

[cofaxest]

7 hours ago, Barkanaut said:

There’s an unreliable rumor floating around most of the older existing bt’s will be getting an update with at least 1 model. The rumor person also said this includes ko. Assuming we get only 1 single model as mentioned what would be the most critical to buffing our army? If the rumor is true I think we got a chance for 2 since we sold so we’ll as an army. I personally think we need melee troops more than anything else and would hope to see that the most. 

Aether drones? Shooting drones, drones protectors(give cover and take wound/MW on 5+) and attack drones with melee profile that explodes when they die and deal MW on 4+? 

[cofaxest]

15 hours ago, BWG Cannonball said:

I came up with a hotfix list for KO after a friend of mine asked me to really think about what could be the army in line with other armies.  Here are my thoughts, let me know what you guys think.

 

KO Hotfixes

 

·        Admirals drop to 100pts

 

·        Admiral given 4 attacks

 

·        Endrinmaster drops to 100 points

 

·        Endrinmaster gains Command ability “Overcharged Aether-Engines” – Endrinriggers and Skywardens within 18” of the Endrinmaster may run and shoot or run and charge

 

·        Aether-Khemist drops to 140 points

 

·        20-40 point drop on all airships

 

·        Ironclads gain a 3+ save

 

·        Frigates gain a 4+ save

 

·        Airships have garrison rules for shooting out of ships

 

·        Give Arkanaut Cutters 2 attacks

 

·        Gunhaulers have 2 shots with their cannon/drill cannon at 12” range

 

·        Skywardens drop back down to 100 points

 

·        Grundstok Thunderers become battleline when Admiral is General

 

·        Aethermatic Volleyguns hit on a 4+ for Arkanaut Company

 

·        Drop cost of battalions by 10 points

 

·        Extend Navigator’s abilities by 6”

 

·        Navigator points increase to 100 with the inclusion of new Command Ability “Clear Skies, Hard Targets”- Nominate one unit in the shooting phase within 12” of the Navigator.  That unit can ignore negative modifiers to shooting attacks.

 

Nice work! And this is my way of balance)

Endrinmaster - 120pts

+one ship can equip 2 artefacts

Admiral - 100pts

Aethekhemist - target unit can attack twice with the buffed weapon

Navigator - 100 pts

+2 to unbind if within 18".

Company - 140 pts

+MW on 6 to hit for volleygun

+3+ to wound on skypikes and -2 rend after charge

+2 attacks with cutters

 Skywardens - 120

+ volleyguns hit on 5+ on 6+ deal mw

+ skypikes 4+/4+/-1/d3, 4+/3+/-2/d3 if chared

+ 12" range on pistol and -2 rend

Endrinriggers - 120

+ Volleyguns (look skywards)

+ aethersaw - 2 attacks 4+/2+/-2/d3

Grundstock thunderers - 100 (battleline if admiral - general)

+ 5 shots with a sweeper

+ 18" d3 shots (with reroll if deal wound with a sweeper)4+/3+/-1/1 with mortar

Grundstock gunhauler - 120 pts

+ unit of 1-3 models

Frigate - 180-200 pts

Embarking rule - each unit can embark and disembark ones per turn. The unit can embark/disembark at the END of ANY phase. 

Edited December 28, 2018 by cofaxest

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, cofaxest said:

Aether drones? Shooting drones, drones protectors(give cover and take wound/MW on 5+) and attack drones with melee profile that explodes when they die and deal MW on 4+? 

I always wanted to play Tau but nobody liked 40K in my area when growing up, this would fix two things  

[Furuzzolo]

You going hard on the damage, hit, wound buffs! Are damage the KO problem?

I would work on the ships stats and on the durability of the army, the garrison rule look on point... The objectives game is hard fielding paper-duardins!

Add: imho it's best to buff allegiance and interaction within the faction. Messing with the scrolls and points end up in the Beastclaw-raiders-land of "better as allies then as faction".

Edited December 28, 2018 by Furuzzolo

[Nick907]

19 hours ago, Furuzzolo said:

You going hard on the damage, hit, wound buffs! Are damage the KO problem?

I would work on the ships stats and on the durability of the army, the garrison rule look on point... The objectives game is hard fielding paper-duardins!

Add: imho it's best to buff allegiance and interaction within the faction. Messing with the scrolls and points end up in the Beastclaw-raiders-land of "better as allies then as faction".

I tend to agree, our points are okay but the skyships could use mechanical updates

[cofaxest]

6 hours ago, Nick907 said:

I tend to agree, our points are okay but the skyships could use mechanical updates

Plus i truly think that alchemists should give +1 full round of attack instead of just +1 to attack characteristic, it will buff our pikes, volleyguns and even heroes. 2 alchemists with 6d6 attacks... 

Edited December 29, 2018 by cofaxest

[Izikail]

Our battalions are super expensive, and not that good, how do you get around this now bettalions are so important

[Izikail]

I think the ships are the lynch pin of the army but iffy at what they do. My fix would not try and fix the ships though as there are to many moving parts for my tiny mind and insted would be simply more battleine effeciancy in the form of "when X ish the general X is a battleline" im atempting thematic but rules are considerd

Navigator -> gun haulers

Cheepiest option for general balancies the expensive battlelines. Theme reason is they can help navigate larger fleets to the raid/battle

Endrinmaster -> endrin riggers

Dangerous as they are both considerd one of the better options, but they have no internal synergy so dont be om more powerful inatly, theme reason, well hes the master and they are the workers

Aether khemist -> thunderers

The khemist is expensive and the thunderers are cheeper to help balance, the khemist may be our best hero but he dosnt work to well with thunderers as basic rifle buffs are mearly avaerage compared to othere options and mixed wepons dont benifit from the khemist buff to much extent, this antisynergy will help balance the acces to cheeper bl and a good hero. Theme wise, as the thunderers are gun nuts they want the buffs for more daka

Admiral -> skywardens (skywardens also go to 100 to me but this isnt crucial)

The admiral is an average hero and tye skywardens are an average unit, so this balance seems fair, i also wanted to pair an admiral with a melee unit for his charge buff. Theme wise dont realy have one.

The reason i see this improveing KO is this increased flexability will:

remove the same core 360 everyone has and has to work around giving better list diversity

Make battalions more practical as the extra gubbins your forced to take become more than pts sinks (e.g. grundstock escort wing has three bl baked in now, the iron comand can have two already in it)

As i said the weeker than ideal ships are an issue, but by diverting pts into other units and freeing up som BL tax you can afford the overpriced ships better and see more divers lists.

Unrelated but i would also like to see about 4 more battalion options, smaller combos such as 1 friget, 1 componey, 1 aether khemist (the componey gets both wepon profiles buffed insted of one). This gives flexability and diversity again. They could be named after some of the famous ships and crew writen about in the shoet stories of the book.

[cofaxest]

Guys, did Valahia die during EoT, when Nagash drain her powers?

[Ointagru]

8 hours ago, Izikail said:

I think the ships are the lynch pin of the army but iffy at what they do. My fix would not try and fix the ships though as there are to many moving parts for my tiny mind and insted would be simply more battleine effeciancy in the form of "when X ish the general X is a battleline" im atempting thematic but rules are considerd

Navigator -> gun haulers

Cheepiest option for general balancies the expensive battlelines. Theme reason is they can help navigate larger fleets to the raid/battle

Endrinmaster -> endrin riggers

Dangerous as they are both considerd one of the better options, but they have no internal synergy so dont be om more powerful inatly, theme reason, well hes the master and they are the workers

Aether khemist -> thunderers

The khemist is expensive and the thunderers are cheeper to help balance, the khemist may be our best hero but he dosnt work to well with thunderers as basic rifle buffs are mearly avaerage compared to othere options and mixed wepons dont benifit from the khemist buff to much extent, this antisynergy will help balance the acces to cheeper bl and a good hero. Theme wise, as the thunderers are gun nuts they want the buffs for more daka

Admiral -> skywardens (skywardens also go to 100 to me but this isnt crucial)

The admiral is an average hero and tye skywardens are an average unit, so this balance seems fair, i also wanted to pair an admiral with a melee unit for his charge buff. Theme wise dont realy have one.

The reason i see this improveing KO is this increased flexability will:

remove the same core 360 everyone has and has to work around giving better list diversity

Make battalions more practical as the extra gubbins your forced to take become more than pts sinks (e.g. grundstock escort wing has three bl baked in now, the iron comand can have two already in it)

As i said the weeker than ideal ships are an issue, but by diverting pts into other units and freeing up som BL tax you can afford the overpriced ships better and see more divers lists.

Unrelated but i would also like to see about 4 more battalion options, smaller combos such as 1 friget, 1 componey, 1 aether khemist (the componey gets both wepon profiles buffed insted of one). This gives flexability and diversity again. They could be named after some of the famous ships and crew writen about in the shoet stories of the book.

If the ships are the lynchpin of the army, then the arkanauts are also the lynchpin, given they man those ships - logically, they go together, and it wouldn't be thematic to field ships without their crew. I'd rather like to see new heroes that would enhance units and ships (an arkanaut  lieutenant or an artillery officer for example). Also some new units: mechanical birds (a bigger versions of the thunderer's Drillbill) as a cheap screen and a fast objective taker and a melee oriented version of thunderers, with some staying power. And a Khrundhal-class battleship...

[Izikail]

Ointagru, i was trying to make what we have work rather than add new stuff, the ships have there crew outside of the componey as shown from the minis on the ship model, and you can still take componeys, infact i definatly think 1 or two may still be a good idea, but atm every list starts with 3*10 componeys and its just so linier

[Nick907]

41 minutes ago, Ointagru said:

If the ships are the lynchpin of the army, then the arkanauts are also the lynchpin, given they man those ships - logically, they go together, and it wouldn't be thematic to field ships without their crew. I'd rather like to see new heroes that would enhance units and ships (an arkanaut  lieutenant or an artillery officer for example). Also some new units: mechanical birds (a bigger versions of the thunderer's Drillbill) as a cheap screen and a fast objective taker and a melee oriented version of thunderers, with some staying power. And a Khrundhal-class battleship...

Somebody had the idea of Grunkstock Thunderers with flamethrowers, a short range shooting unit intended for melee could be a fun mechanic.  I don't think we need a bigger battleship so much as a war scroll tweak for the current ones.  I would like to see battleplans using larger Airships as special terrain though. A hero to buff the ship's shooting could be fun, I use the Endrinmaster as my primary hero for his repair. 

[Arkanaut Admiral]

I've said this a few times before, but I think that the best way to fix the KO (after simple points adjustments) is to use the garrison rules for the ships, adjust the stats of the ships (better saves, longer ranged weapons, automatic tireless endrinrigger), give Thunderers better special type  guns, and make the Aether Khemist's buff a flat bonus.  Oh, and let Navigators outflank the ship they're embarked upon, like that Deepkin Navigator type.

Those are my simple suggestions.  More complicated suggestion...advances in their technology has allowed Navigators to progress to the level of full wizards.  Now there's a real use for them.  However, I don't know if the lore can allow this idea, so I file it in my 'mad idea' suggestion box.