How do you keep it fresh?

[taintedtyphoon]

If you only have one opponent how do you keep your games from geting stale. Im not there yet btw. If your army isnt changing much and their army isnt changing much surely it becomes very repeatitive? almost knowing the result before you play, sucking for both parties

[Enoby]

7 minutes ago, taintedtyphoon said:

If you only have one opponent how do you keep your games from geting stale. Im not there yet btw. If your army isnt changing much and their army isnt changing much surely it becomes very repeatitive? almost knowing the result before you play, sucking for both parties

I'd probably recommend something like Path to Glory, starting smaller and then adding more unusual units to your roster. You can still play it like a matched play game mostly, but the narrative spin can keep it fresh and encourage more unusual warscrolls.

[JackStreicher]

8 minutes ago, taintedtyphoon said:

If you only have one opponent how do you keep your games from geting stale. Im not there yet btw. If your army isnt changing much and their army isnt changing much surely it becomes very repeatitive? almost knowing the result before you play, sucking for both parties

I for one am playing several different armies.

Another option:
Put restrictions on yourselfs lile:
- No gods
- every unit only once

- only two reinforcements

Make up your own scenarios like sieges where the enemy will require other models than usual to breach the walls.

Start a narrative campaign or Path to glory.

[zilberfrid]

Play games on a smaller scale, so you only use parts of your army.

Maybe make it so if you use a unit/hero in one smaller scale game, you can't use it in the next smaller scale game.

Perhaps even use Skirmish or a different game where you just use your AoS models.

Also, maybe switch armies every once in a while.

Edited October 27, 2021 by zilberfrid

[Neverchosen]

Multiplayer games can easily change up your gameplay, if you have multiple people playing the same grand alliances it can make for really fun and themeatic change of pace (of course having mixed armies fighting a mutual enemy is just as thematically rich). Having imbalanced point games or narrative games with reinforcements can be strangely fun, if you are not overly competitive. Like having a game featuring a small force of a 500-1000 points and a 1000-2000 point enemy force setting up on the board edges. Make the objective to have one of the heroes flee from a table edge. 

I like incorporating warcry into my games with certain benefits and losses to succeeding in missions. For example assassination missions that will result in the opposite player not getting access to a certain hero... but still being able to use 2000 points just losing access to that hero. Supply line missions that will prevent a player from using artefacts but still allowing other enhancements. I have also been considering getting into Underworlds, I think having the warbands appear on the tabletop for free would be a fun incentive... for balance sake I would let both players include their warband but have the Underworlds loser have to bring them onto their table edge after turn one to show that they were licking their wounds after their lost battle.  

Also maps make for a lot of fun thematic styles of play. I have made maps for all of my friends armies and my own and we can do conquests of each others territories like in Risk. But we also have to divide our forces and if you want to attack further from an area you control you get access to less points and the enemy gets additional points. This is also where Warcry gets fun as you can have scouting missions and take a bit of territory giving you an addition to your point count in a further region. 

Finally the simplest and often the most fun is to use each other's lists for a game. Let your friend play as your horde army and try out their cavalry list, let them play with your gunline and try out their elite army etc. This becomes even more fun in narrative and path to glory games as you have incentive to win but it results in your opponents army growing. For the sake of fairness let the owner of the army decide on the rewards table as it would be terribly unfair and mean spirited to have their rewards be models they do not have or cannot afford.

Edited October 27, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Noserenda]

I play one opponent a lot more than others but we typically switch up the game enough to keep things fresh. 

Still dooable with one game i guess, try different points values are the broader experience of narrative or open play as they are usually a lot more interesting than matched. 

[taintedtyphoon]

These are all really useful ideas. Thankyou!!

[Neverchosen]

I forgot one of my favourite ways to change things up

Building lists for different subfactions is really fun and a great way to create a different flow. I have worked out lists for my Slaves to Darkness using different marks each paired to a specific subfaction. My full collection is not even that many points over 2000 but just making these changes and mostly swaping out heroes is enough to make them feel like different armies with unique personalities. One day I hope to get some Varanguard to make a knights of the empty throne list but I have my S2D on the back burner as I build and paint some Ogors and SCE. Also if your collection is large enough try building variant lists of your own creation for example primarily cavalry or primarily infantry.  

Edited October 27, 2021 by Neverchosen

[Pyrescribe]

Easy. Just keep buying new armies lol

Back when I was a lad, it was just me and my best friend. We nearly exclusively played each other from 5th-7th edition, and still the vast majority of our games in 8th were against each other. He played nothing but Bretonnians, and when Bretonnians were no longer a part of Warhammer, he quit wargaming entirely. I played Orcs and Goblins 80% of the time, although I would start a new army every couple of years. I'm not entirely sure starting a new army really kept stuff fresh. It was for me, personally, to be painting something other than greenskins. But all those years, what kept my friend and I playing was the story that existed between our armies. The rivalry between Agravain and Morgit was LEGENDARY in our minds, spanning over a decade.

In truth, things did get stale at times, as far as Warhammer was concerned. But being best friends (an activity at the time, more of a title now), there was plenty else to do. Stuff like reading Black Library novels would often spark inspiration to get a campaign going again.

In such a setup, my only recommendation would be to not force you guys to play Warhammer if one of you isn't feeling it. It's here for fun, to relax and to connect. Your models won't be going anywhere if you lose interest for a bit.

[Popisdead]

Change your armies.  No army has literally one build (ignoring WAAC).  And I'm sure you have enough in your collection to play a different theme.

For example Sylvaneth.  The Alarielle, big guy/gal, gnarlroot min core list is really good.  But,.. try something different.  Play a horde of Dryads, in Winterleaf.  If you have Order consider Cities of Sigmar.  If you have Chaos consider allies/etc/whatever they are called.  If you have destruction try Kragnos, if you have Death I think Nagash is available in most lists.  

Enoby hit the nail on the head with Path to Glory.  

[hot_boy_ronald]

Take a look at the sub-factions for your army and rotate through those. Ally in models as well to get a flavor for something else. Overextend yourself and buy a dozen armies. 

[JackStreicher]

4 hours ago, Pyrescribe said:

But all those years, what kept my friend and I playing was the story that existed between our armies. The rivalry between Agravain and Morgit was LEGENDARY in our minds, spanning over a decade.

This is awesome!

[jjb070707]

I am often in the same situation, with timing and such I play against my wife in games more often than anyone else. I got a printer to continually have new units to use and play different armies with at a fraction of the cost. If you aren't beholden to playing at a GW store (which would imply you have many opponents to choose from) you aren't truly beholden to GW products for playing Age of Sigmar's ruleset. For the price of a single army in ABS plastic you could have 5-6 in acrylate resin to introduce variety.

[readercolin]

There are 3 ways this can go.

Way 1, you only have 1 opponent, but you can't play particularly frequently.  Lets be honest here, if you got to play once a quarter, it isn't going to really matter that you are playing the exact same armies against each other, unless the power imbalance between the two lists is rather extreme (ex. top tier Lumineth list vs stormcast starter sets).  In this case, you can play for years and it still feels fresh, or one or both of you can get a new unit to add to your army and change how it works fairly significantly.  On top of that, you can expect a new book to change things up every 3-5 years.

Way 2, you can only get out occasionally to play, and almost always against the same opponent.  But said opponent can play against other people (ex. I can get to the store at 7pm once a month, and Dave is always up for a game with me).  Here it is more similar to way 1, where each time you play isn't getting particularly stale, but one or both of you can spice things up by choosing a different subfaction, or changing out a unit or two.  Additionally, if you are playing from the GHB, you can make a point of trying each mission out, and even if you play once a week, you are still looking at playing each mission a grand total of 4 times before the next years GHB drops.

Way 3, you have a regular opponent and you are playing 1-3 games a week with them (ex. a partner or roommate that you can play with).  Here is where things can get pretty stale, especially if you have smaller armies.  If I have exactly 2k points of Stormcast, and you have exactly 2k points of Orruks, games are going to start feeling pretty samey, and you can't really change much (especially since changing your stormhost has SUCH a BIG impact 🙄).  Here, I would recommend looking at a variety of ways to change things up.  Do a Path to Glory adventure, with some sort of start and end point.  Take and build an Anvil of Apotheosis character with a "slow grow" framework.  Try out siege battles, or do some sort of narrative thing.  Get the old Open War battleplan cards (or make new ones with the new Open War rules) to randomize things.  Try playing with some handicaps.  Or if games are consistently onesided, start at 1500 points, and then for each win the next game the winner has to play an additional 50 points down while the loser gets to play 50 points up.  Eventually you will settle at a "balanced" game for your respective armies.

All this being said, the BIGGEST way to keep it fresh is to get more models, or after a point, more armies.  Going from 2k points to 2500 points is enough that you can swap 500 points out of your list each time and end up with 3-4 slightly different lists.  Going back to the stormcast example, if I have say, an Imperitant, 15 liberators/vindictors/sequitors for battleline, and then I have Fulminators, Longstrikes, an Ordinator + 3-4 ballista's, and 6 annihilators, I can basically choose 3 of the 4 packages, with the army operating a bit differently depending upon which package I choose to run.  This isn't forcing a huge purchase out of me to be able to field the different packages, but can still produce some variety when they hit the table.  That being said, while the above is fairly easy to do with Stormcast... it isn't going to help you too much if you chose Sons of Behemat as your army choice (if you chose that army though... you did it to yourself).

However, with enough play, even some variety in a single list can lead to staleness, which is where additional armies come in.  Here you can make a drastic change - ex. having stormcast and Tzeentch, where it is a completely different playstyle and you can keep things fresh with something brand new.  Or, you can look to make smaller changes - ex. having stormcast and building Cities of Sigmar.  Here Stormcast can have 1/4 cities units be part of their army in a Stormkeep, and Cities can have 1/4 of their units be Stormcast.  So if for example I decide that I want some Irondrakes, I can bring a squad of 20 of them in a stormkeep to test things out, and then as I expand my cities army instead have my stalwart dwarves get some backup in the form of a block of Fulminators to act as heavy cavalry.

[taintedtyphoon]

14 hours ago, readercolin said:

There are 3 ways this can go.

Way 1, you only have 1 opponent, but you can't play particularly frequently.  Lets be honest here, if you got to play once a quarter, it isn't going to really matter that you are playing the exact same armies against each other, unless the power imbalance between the two lists is rather extreme (ex. top tier Lumineth list vs stormcast starter sets).  In this case, you can play for years and it still feels fresh, or one or both of you can get a new unit to add to your army and change how it works fairly significantly.  On top of that, you can expect a new book to change things up every 3-5 years.

Way 2, you can only get out occasionally to play, and almost always against the same opponent.  But said opponent can play against other people (ex. I can get to the store at 7pm once a month, and Dave is always up for a game with me).  Here it is more similar to way 1, where each time you play isn't getting particularly stale, but one or both of you can spice things up by choosing a different subfaction, or changing out a unit or two.  Additionally, if you are playing from the GHB, you can make a point of trying each mission out, and even if you play once a week, you are still looking at playing each mission a grand total of 4 times before the next years GHB drops.

Way 3, you have a regular opponent and you are playing 1-3 games a week with them (ex. a partner or roommate that you can play with).  Here is where things can get pretty stale, especially if you have smaller armies.  If I have exactly 2k points of Stormcast, and you have exactly 2k points of Orruks, games are going to start feeling pretty samey, and you can't really change much (especially since changing your stormhost has SUCH a BIG impact 🙄).  Here, I would recommend looking at a variety of ways to change things up.  Do a Path to Glory adventure, with some sort of start and end point.  Take and build an Anvil of Apotheosis character with a "slow grow" framework.  Try out siege battles, or do some sort of narrative thing.  Get the old Open War battleplan cards (or make new ones with the new Open War rules) to randomize things.  Try playing with some handicaps.  Or if games are consistently onesided, start at 1500 points, and then for each win the next game the winner has to play an additional 50 points down while the loser gets to play 50 points up.  Eventually you will settle at a "balanced" game for your respective armies.

All this being said, the BIGGEST way to keep it fresh is to get more models, or after a point, more armies.  Going from 2k points to 2500 points is enough that you can swap 500 points out of your list each time and end up with 3-4 slightly different lists.  Going back to the stormcast example, if I have say, an Imperitant, 15 liberators/vindictors/sequitors for battleline, and then I have Fulminators, Longstrikes, an Ordinator + 3-4 ballista's, and 6 annihilators, I can basically choose 3 of the 4 packages, with the army operating a bit differently depending upon which package I choose to run.  This isn't forcing a huge purchase out of me to be able to field the different packages, but can still produce some variety when they hit the table.  That being said, while the above is fairly easy to do with Stormcast... it isn't going to help you too much if you chose Sons of Behemat as your army choice (if you chose that army though... you did it to yourself).

However, with enough play, even some variety in a single list can lead to staleness, which is where additional armies come in.  Here you can make a drastic change - ex. having stormcast and Tzeentch, where it is a completely different playstyle and you can keep things fresh with something brand new.  Or, you can look to make smaller changes - ex. having stormcast and building Cities of Sigmar.  Here Stormcast can have 1/4 cities units be part of their army in a Stormkeep, and Cities can have 1/4 of their units be Stormcast.  So if for example I decide that I want some Irondrakes, I can bring a squad of 20 of them in a stormkeep to test things out, and then as I expand my cities army instead have my stalwart dwarves get some backup in the form of a block of Fulminators to act as heavy cavalry.

Excellent advise and thankyou for such a thorough write up. We get together once a week and either paint or play. We are not yet up to the 2k mark just yet. I have idoneth and sce and he has orruk warclans.

[Skreech Verminking]

I own around 18000 points of skaven.

In other words, I’m currently able to basically play any existing list for the skaven, which allows me to play a different list every time.

 

[greg19190]

On 10/28/2021 at 4:27 PM, Skreech Verminking said:

I own around 18000 points of skaven.

In other words, I’m currently able to basically play any existing list for the skaven, which allows me to play a different list every time.

 

The dream... How many Doomwheels can you field? 

[Skreech Verminking]

1 hour ago, greg19190 said:

The dream... How many Doomwheels can you field? 

Currently only three.

but I’m interested in fielding 13 of them at some point.

hoping for that reason that gw will in some way make it possible for me to field doomwheels as a battleline option

[Jator]

On 10/28/2021 at 5:27 PM, Skreech Verminking said:

I own around 18000 points of skaven.

In other words, I’m currently able to basically play any existing list for the skaven, which allows me to play a different list every time.

 

An army for each Clan, that's the dream.

[Skreech Verminking]

9 minutes ago, Jator said:

An army for each Clan, that's the dream.

Yeah, now if gw could just make doomwheels battle line I could add to my collection another 1300 or more points 

Edited November 5, 2021 by Skreech Verminking